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Thread: How can the law not protect the renters at all?

  1. #1
    Original Dude
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    How can the law not protect the renters at all?

    Ok ill explain the situation, i live in an appartement, wich is located in a "duplex" , dunno if its same word in english, and lately the owner has decided to sell the house. I got to hold my word here cause i don't wanna get suspended, but lets just say he did it in the worst way possible, without any thinking about us. He waited for us to sign for another year, and when it was done, bam, decided to do that. Now if we knew he was gonna sell, we would had move from here on july 1st... because this put us in a bad situation, the worst being that the new owner could decide to kick us out with only a 3 months notice from what i heard. So we could end up having to move in the winter, a period where its shit to move because of the snow, cold factor etc, but also because good appartement are all taken already.

    The other problem is the one that currently is grudging all my juice and could potentially do me psychological damages... the visits. They are mandatory, as we can't do shit about it, no matter if we can be there or not, or what time they are. Now i understand an owner living in his house could decide to refuse a visit by the agent because he is the owner, he engage him/her. Us, we are just renter and so far its been a nightmare of this whole situation.

    Personally i don't want people in my home without me being there... obviously. But it seem by law standards they could do that? Thats bullshit if you ask me. Thanksfully i make my own schedule working in the familly compagny, so i can adjust, but what if i could not? Also i am sometimes living on a more night schedules, what about that? I mean there must be people working the night that are stuck in these situation, what happen with them? Lets say they program a visit for 1 pm, but the person work til 8 am and go to sleep around 9 am, to wake up around 6 pm for his night shift? What about that?

    I wish there was a legal way i could get some rest from this shit.. i know some of you guys work in the laws departement, maybe you know stuff i don't know? This whole issue is really giving me stress and moral damage and im not sure i can tolerate it during 6 months...

    Im at the point i rather have them sell it very fast, even if it mean moving in the winter, cause i feel im not home anymore. My private bubble is being invade and i can't stand it. How the law can be so careless about protecting the people that rent...? At the very least we should get a discount on our monthly payment for all this shit...
    Life is a party ! Death is the Hangover.. 70-49-6

  2. #2
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    You can always make sure the visit is as unpleasant as possible. It doesn't solve your problem, but if the owner refuses to be nice, you don't have to be nice either. Tell the visitors how bad the building and the neighborhood are. Leave porn magazines and used hankies all over the place. It's your home and you don't have to tidy up if you don't want to. Better yet, make sure you have ''company'' while they are doing the visit (while it's still not illegal for you). ''Oh yeah, there are always prostitutes in this building. The owner did not tell you?''
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

  3. #3
    i'm landlord and i feel laws in quebec are waited in favour of tenants in most cases not like ontario. also dont want to be suspended so i will bite my tongue in check.

    for halloween mike, the new owner can only kick you out for certain reasons like if he wants to move a close famly member to take over your place. landlords cant kick out tenants even though the landlord changes. there has to be a valid reason and only certain reasons are valid. sometimes even close family member is not valid reason to kick tenant out.

    in quebec landlord can't go into tenants house without premission unless emergency. showing house/room to new buyer is not emergency. if you leave water running and your drain is clogged and water is leaking into apartment/house downstairs. landlord can go into your place without permissions but must make sure he tries to get permission. for exampel, you having sex with someone and left water running in clogged drain and it is overflowing and landlord can't just open your door unannounced. he must ring doorbell and or call you. if you don't answer then he can go in without your permission.

    now when person is buying place i think he can look at the other apartment in duplex and triplex but must get permission and i think that a scheduel must be set up. tenant can't refuse all visits but can set schedule i think.

    i am not lawyer so take what i say with grain of salt but i'm a landlord and when i bought my place, i got to visit upper duplex but i think it was due to mutual agreement shcedule with tenant there and landlord.

    for emergency entrance into place, landlord doesn't need permission but it must be emergency for him to enter without permission. he has to minimize his damage/losses in an emergency.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siocnarf View Post
    You can always make sure the visit is as unpleasant as possible. It doesn't solve your problem, but if the owner refuses to be nice, you don't have to be nice either. Tell the visitors how bad the building and the neighborhood are. Leave porn magazines and used hankies all over the place. It's your home and you don't have to tidy up if you don't want to. Better yet, make sure you have ''company'' while they are doing the visit.
    Bad recommandation Sionarf!
    First of alll the agreement follows the building not he owner !Civil Code of Quebec article
    1936. Every lessee has a personal right to maintain occupancy; he may not be evicted from the leased dwelling, except in the cases provided for by law.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1936
    And your obligations under the law
    1930. Where a lessee gives notice of non-renewal or resiliation of the lease to the lessor, he is bound to allow the dwelling to be visited and signs to be posted from the time he gives the notice.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1930 .


    FR
     s. 1930 – (6)
    1931. The lessor is bound, except in case of emergency, to give the lessee a prior notice of 24 hours of his intention to ascertain the condition of the dwelling, to carry out work in the dwelling or to have it visited by a prospective acquirer.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1931 .


    FR
     s. 1931 – (27)
    1932. The lessee may, except in case of emergency, refuse to allow the dwelling to be visited by a prospective lessee or acquirer before 9 a.m. or after 9 p.m.; the same rule applies where the lessor wishes to ascertain the condition of the dwelling.

    The lessee may, in any case, refuse to allow the dwelling to be visited if the lessor is unable to be present.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1932 .


    FR
     s. 1932 – (4)
    1933. The lessee may not refuse to allow the lessor to have access to the dwelling to carry out work.

    He may deny him access before 7 a.m. and after 7 p.m., however, unless the work is urgent.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1933 .


    FR
     s. 1933 – (6)
    1934. No lock or other device restricting access to a dwelling may be installed or changed without the consent of the lessor and the lessee.

    If either party fails to comply with his obligation, the court may order him to allow the other party to have access to the dwelling.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1934 .


    FR
     s. 1934 – (7)
    1935. The lessor may not prohibit a candidate in a provincial, federal, municipal or school election, an official delegate appointed by a national committee or the authorized representative of either from having access to the immovable or dwelling for the purposes of an election campaign or a legally constituted referendum.

    1991, c. 64, a. 1935 .
    If you need more infos HM
    PM me
    I have over 1,200 Quebec Regie du logement cases done in my career and other Courts
    Good luck but you are protected by law you just need to know it !
    Further more la Regie as a Web site accessible 24/7
    And you can verify the laws governing relationships between landlords and tenants on the mandatory lease you have signed in the back of it !
    BookerL

  5. #5
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    My suggestion was more a joke, in fact!
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

  6. #6
    Original Dude
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    Well thats the thing...

    What booker talked about is what i found so far... I mean i wish Siocnarf's version would had been the right one, but sadly its not. Between 9 and 9, they can force visits on us, wich is my biggest complain of this whole thing. Like i said what if i would work a nightshift? This piss me off badly because we can't say "no 9 am is too early, make it 1 pm" or if one day none of us would be home, we can't refuse it as well and that is why i say the law does not protect us enough in those case. Having your privacy invaded is a huge deal for me. I never had to experience this. I once quit an appartement and there was no visits at all when i did... maybe i was lucky, but the thing is, at least if you know your leaving in a few months, you can start to pack and all.

    In our case, we don't know if we are gonna have to move or not... Sio when i say the owner can kick us out, i meant it as "if he want to move in himself". Thats only a 2 appartement house, and we rent the bottom appartement, wich is 90% of the case the one the people want to move in beause of the basement and such... its also bigger. I know they can't kick us for the fun of it, but we would be lucky if the new owner is also a guy that just buy it to make money out of it like the last one. Most people buy a 2 appartement house to take the biggest, rent the smallest... and this is where we are fucked...

    Honestly i tough about making the visits unpleasant, cause i could, but actually i rather make sure he sell fast so this shit is done with. But one thing for sure, next morning visit, ill remain asleep. I don't care if they see me in my bed, fuck it, i won't break my sleeping schedule for that shit...

    Another thing that suck is the owner knew how the appartement was. It was clean, but full packed because we still had my grand mother's stuff(she died last year). He decide to sell and instead of letting us know 2-3 weeks prior, bam 2 days later the agent is here and she make shitty remarks and complaints about how there is too much stuff, and this should go, that should go... Thanksfully for this i called the regie and they said to me we can have what we want in our appartement, so that was quickly fixed... but she was so unpleasant and all.

    For exemple 3 months ago we sold my grand mother's bedroom set, the "big garbages" day was july 3th... so i was gonna put my old "matelas" (sorry english word escape me) and takes the one of my grand mother, wich are way newer. But the old one where on the wall in my grand mother's room wich is now a "storage room" and she complained and said this had to go... Ok they indeed where going on july 3, but what IF it was a good set and we wanted to keep it? Not her freaking business...

    Anyway this whole deal really annoy me so badly guys, you had no idea, i was glad GG4 made me forget about it and i was able to have one fun day because since it started, this whole thing sucks.
    Life is a party ! Death is the Hangover.. 70-49-6

  7. #7
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    This is called the right to tenure.UNDER CIVIL CODE OF QUEBEC?

    This is called the right to tenure.
    The staff of the Régie du logement can inform you about the possible remedies to challenge a decision, applicable to the Board and the time to do procedure. It can not inquire about the procedure in force in other courts. If you need assistance, contact an attorney or a notary.


    In Quebec, the law states that a tenant can stay in the unit as long as he wants, if it meets all the conditions of the lease. This is called the right to tenure.

    However, there are exceptions to this rule, and the housing recovery is one.

    Who can take a home?

    The landlord owns a building, can take one of his homes.

    An owner of a property in joint 1 can also repossess a dwelling, but on condition that there is only one other owner, and the other co-owner or his spouse 2 .

    In case of sale of the property, it is the new owner will return the task to take steps to obtain the recovery once the sale of the building completed and not merely a promise to purchase signed .

    For which the owner may repossess a home?

    To accommodate itself;
    To accommodate his father, mother, son or daughter;
    To accommodate any relative or ally 3 , which is the main support (material or moral).
    To accommodate an ex-spouse which he remains the main support (material or moral) after their separation (for judgment), divorce or the dissolution of their civil union 4 .


    Mandatory Review

    The landlord must send the tenant a written notice informing him of his intention to return home. The following information must be included:

    the expected date of recovery (which usually corresponds to the end of the lease);
    the name and surname of the person who live in the dwelling;
    the degree of relationship or connection with that person (son, mother, etc.).


    A period of notice required

    The notice of repossession must be sent to the tenant within the following 5 :
    Stages of repossession and notice periods
    Lease of more than six months
    STEP 1:
    Owner Reviews STEP 2:
    Response tenant STEP 3:
    Ask the Régie du logement by owner
    6 months before the end of the lease Within one month of receipt of the opinion of the owner. If the tenant does not respond, it is deemed to have refused to vacate. In the month of refusal or expiry of time limit the tenant.

    Lease of 6 months or less
    STEP 1:
    Owner Reviews STEP 2:
    Response tenant STEP 3:
    Ask the Régie du logement by owner
    1 month before the end of the lease Within one month of receipt of the opinion of the owner. If the tenant does not respond, it is deemed to have refused to vacate. In the month of refusal or expiry of time limit the tenant.

    Lease for an indefinite period
    STEP 1:
    Owner Reviews STEP 2:
    Response tenant STEP 3:
    Ask the Régie du logement by owner
    6 months before the date on which it intends to repossess the dwelling Within one month of receipt of the opinion of the owner. If the tenant does not respond, it is deemed to have refused to vacate. In the month of refusal or expiry of time limit the tenant.



    The response of the tenant

    Upon receiving the notice of repossession, the tenant has a month to respond. It can accept or refuse to move out.

    It is best to provide a response to this notice in writing.

    In terms of recovery, the tenant does not respond to the notice given by the owner within a month is deemed to have refused to leave the property and the owner must itself ask the court permission to resume housing. Otherwise, the tenant may remain in the housing.

    The deadline for filing the request for recovery to the Régie du logement

    If the tenant has indicated a refusal by a written response, the owner's request must be submitted to the Régie du logement in the month of receipt of the refusal response.
    If the tenant does not respond, the request must be filed within one month after the end of the time limit of the tenant.


    The hearing and the evidence

    Court, the landlord has the burden of proving that he really intends to repossess the dwelling for the reason mentioned in the notice, and it is not a pretext for other purposes.

    If the owner does not take the housing to accommodate himself, the person that the owner wishes to stay there should generally testify at the hearing.

    The court's decision

    Approves a housing recovery, the court may impose such conditions as it deems just and reasonable, including the payment of compensation equivalent to the cost of moving. If the tenant's request, the court may also allow the resumption at a later date.

    If the court denies the request to return to the owner's home, it was one month after the final decision to request the fixing of rent.

    What happens if ...

    Another ... the owner's home is released?

    It can happen after a notice of repossession, another housing becomes vacant or owner available for rent on the due date for the resumption.

    If this property is similar, equivalent rent and it is around that requested by the owner, it will occupy rather than pursue them, unless otherwise agreed with the tenant.

    ... The owner no longer wants to repossess the dwelling?

    If the accommodation is not included on the scheduled date for the return, and if the tenant continues to occupy with the consent of the owner, the lease is renewed automatically. The owner then has one month of the date for which recovery was requested to ask the Board to fix the rent.

    The owner wants ... rent the unit after repeated?

    If the owner wants to rent the unit or use for any purpose other than that which led to the recovery, no matter how many months or years, they must ask permission from the court, which if allowed this relocation, will set the new rent.

    Recovery ... seems to have been made in bad faith?

    After his departure, the tenant finds that the housing is not used in accordance with what had been requested by the owner and is able to prove that the approach of the latter was in bad faith in this case, the tenant may claim damages for material and moral damage he suffers as well as punitive damages.

    Recovery of housing and condominium (condo)

    The owner intends to convert his condominium building, commonly called "condominium" to subsequently sell the homes to third parties, shall, before taking any action, give each tenant a notice referred to intends to convert the building.

    Once the notice of intent is given, or the current owner or a subsequent purchaser of the unit after its conversion to condominiums will not repeat it except in rare exceptions. Thus, any lessee or transferee in place at the time of dispatch of the notice of intent, or new tenant whose lease begins before the date of the decision of the Régie du logement authorizing the conversion, has the right to remain in places as long as he wants, if it meets the conditions of the lease.

    The building owned by joint owners

    A building is said to be "undivided interest" when it belongs to two or more persons who are each owners of an undivided share (undefined) throughout the building.

    For example, Claire, Sidon and Carol-Ann are each own 1/3 undivided of the building, but they have no particular apartment. As mentioned at the beginning of this brochure as a co-owner may repossess a dwelling unless it is co-owner with only one other person who is the spouse 6 or whether he has acquired rights (see the next section).

  8. #8
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    You are still safe for more years as request for taking your Dwelling must sent to you by the new owner up December 31st
    By registered mail or bailiff or acknowledgement of receipt!
    As for the visiting schedule the law states only to be reasonable so if you work night shift day visits ,when you are sleeping are unreasonable ,the best way is to negotiate a respectable schedule with the owner !!
    Good luck
    BookerL

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siocnarf View Post
    My suggestion was more a joke, in fact!
    Are all your suggestions jokes ????
    Cuz this one was not really funny !!!!
    Best Regards
    BookerL

  10. #10
    Original Dude
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    Wait Booker, sorry my english is not very good when it enters thecnical stuff, but did you say that he can't for exemple buy in august, then decide to take possession november? Are we most likely gonna be able to finish the year of the bail we currently have? Some people said to us he was supose to give us only 3 months and then we would have to move...

    In other words can you explain this part a bit more in common words, ou encore mieu en francais lol
    Life is a party ! Death is the Hangover.. 70-49-6

  11. #11
    the lease you signed is a binding contract which new landlord inherits. this means that all conditions agreed to in the old lease apply to the new owner and the new owner/landlord can't do anything about it. this applys to start date, end date, monthly rent cost, use of garage/lawn/pool/etc.

    in a case such as yours where the old owner doesn't live in the buidling but is selling the building to a new owner/landlord that wants to stay in the building, most new owners who dont want headaches will wait until the end of your lease and just tell you 3 months before end of your lease that they are moving in and won't be renewing your lease. once the lease is renewed, the new landlord is stuck with it and has to go through a major process to kick tenant out. it saves them the headaches of going for a long fight at the rentel board. if you dont want to move at the end of your lease, you can still fight it but it would be in most cases a loosing cause.

    peopel think that the lease can be broken with 3 months notice by landlord or tenant. this is not true. it is a 1 year contract with very strict terms for both partys. easiest time to kick out tenent by new landlord who is trying to move into place is at the notification period (i think it is march) for july 1st standard moving date and standard end date of lease by saying that lease won't be renewed because landlord is moving in.

  12. #12
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    Ouais... HM il y a just la regie du logement qui peut invalider ton bail ..... la meilleur chose serait de les appeller pour t'informer sur tes droit et recours..
    Et je l'écoute (Joël Bouchard) toujours jusqu'à la fin de son laïus parce que je suis convaincu qu'un jour, il va terminer en nous offrant des voitures usagées à des prix INCROYABLES!

    -Ronald King

  13. #13
    Original Dude
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    Oh damn but at least thats great to know... it remove a part of the burden. We are gonna leave in july next year, thats almost a positive, no matter if the new owner want to keep renting or not... Actually we even tough about moving this year, but it was a little bit too short, we had too much to do to clean the basement. (looking into boxes, selling the stuff we can etc) but if only we can finish the year. We taugh we would had to move in winter...

    Now please can there just be a buyer soon so the visits stop...

    Ezekiel : ouais je me suis renseigner une fois sur certain truc, mais le probleme ces que ces pas mon nom sur le bail, ces un peu plus dur d'aller au recours direct. Faudrais je passe par ma mère. Mais deja avec ce que les gens on dit ici je commence a en savoir un peu plus sa aide.
    Life is a party ! Death is the Hangover.. 70-49-6

  14. #14
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    Oui HM avec plaisirs
    La reprise de possession d'un logement est très bien encadre par le C.C.Q
    Le nouveau propriétaire aura des demarches a suivre afin de reprendre ton logement !
    Il lui est inaccessible pour ton bail en cours qui ce terminera je présume le 1er Juillet 2015 .
    Ça demande doit être faite par écrit le ou avant le 31 Décembre de cette année pour reprise de possession au 1 er Juillet 2015 .La lettre doit être par courrier recommandée ,huissier,ou tu peu signée un accusée de réception.
    La prochaine étape si tu refuse le proprietaire a 30 jours pour inscrire une demande en reprise de possession,si tu ne répond pas la loi prévoit que c'est un refus donc le proprietaire dois s'adresser a la Regie afin d'obtenir le droit d'occuper son logement et il devra faire la preuve que ca demande est légitime et en règles avec les loi qui si applique !
    Une compensation raisonnable peut être demande pour couvrir tes frais de re localisation ,déménageur,débranchement et rebranche ment de tes services .
    Tu n'a pas a t'inquiète la loi te protège.
    Les baux de location on a leur verso la réglementation concernant les obligation du propriétaire place devant cette situation et tes droit et recours !!

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halloween Mike View Post

    Ezekiel : ouais je me suis renseigner une fois sur certain truc, mais le probleme ces que ces pas mon nom sur le bail, ces un peu plus dur d'aller au recours direct. Faudrais je passe par ma mère. Mais deja avec ce que les gens on dit ici je commence a en savoir un peu plus sa aide.
    Ce n'est pas vraiment un problème le droit au maintien dans les s'applique a tout les occupants même ceux ou leur nom n'est pas au bail .
    Pour t'évincer présentement il devra y avoir défaut de paiement ou paiement fréquemment en retard et je dois dire que la régie est très souple dans l'application de cette lois elle des ordonnance de paiement donc pour cette année tu est en voiture
    Il y a plusieurs loi et règles tu en perd ton latin a moins de plaider régulièrement!!!!LoL
    Aux plaisirs
    BookerL

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