OK you are a baseball fan and you have pro ball in your city. In Montréal we have none, and I don't like the submissive position of waiting for the MLB like they own the game.
Baseball's New Commissioner: "A return to Montreal is possible."
- Thread starter rumpleforeskiin
- Start date
Well, you have choices. You can drive to Burlington VT (1hour40) and watch the short season Lake Monsters, formerly the Vermont Expos. You can drive to Quebec and take in the independent league Capitales. There are plenty of amateur games in Montreal. I've seen games close to my home at the field at the east end of Parc Lafontaine. You like Little League? Then you should be happy with the plethora of high school and college games that are played all over the area.
Here's another thing you might want to get a handle on. The DO own the game.
MLB owns all licensing as well. In fact there are companies that make small fortunes as licensees of MLB. One is the company that sells sweatproof cups. I forget their name but they have a license from MLB to sell drinks in those cups and can slap logos on the cups.
The Yankees beer distributor ran afoul of MLB recently. They developed a beer foam with the image of Aaron Judge in it. Not allowed. MLB told the Yankees to tell the distributor to cease and desist immediately. Aaron Judge doesn’t own his image in a Yankees cap. MLB does. And tiga if the Expos come back, you make the team as a relief pitcher after a tryout and popping a few 97 mph fastballs on the radar guns, MLB will own your visage in an Expos cap. In fact, even tiga as a fan in a Expos baseball cap, to the extent that image is worth anything, it’s commercial value is owned by MLB.
Tiga see the below:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndic...stanton-beer-foam-art-violates-rules.amp.html
The Yankees beer distributor ran afoul of MLB recently. They developed a beer foam with the image of Aaron Judge in it. Not allowed. MLB told the Yankees to tell the distributor to cease and desist immediately. Aaron Judge doesn’t own his image in a Yankees cap. MLB does. And tiga if the Expos come back, you make the team as a relief pitcher after a tryout and popping a few 97 mph fastballs on the radar guns, MLB will own your visage in an Expos cap. In fact, even tiga as a fan in a Expos baseball cap, to the extent that image is worth anything, it’s commercial value is owned by MLB.
Tiga see the below:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndic...stanton-beer-foam-art-violates-rules.amp.html
Well that is just great EB... They are such a fun monopoly!! We should bend over more, because MLB and Jeffrey Loria didn't fuck us up enough. The last ten years of the Expos in this city left a mark...
Do i have to comment on the Olympic stadium saga...
What do you say here: "the DO own the game" did you miss print: the MLB owns the game?
Well they don't own the Capitals in Québec.
The CanAm league is independent and the stadium in Q Is 75 years old, Heck i even played there.
I go to many games in Québec city and love it but that is 300 km down the 20... I even posted on this board about going to games.
Do i have to comment on the Olympic stadium saga...
What do you say here: "the DO own the game" did you miss print: the MLB owns the game?
Well they don't own the Capitals in Québec.
The CanAm league is independent and the stadium in Q Is 75 years old, Heck i even played there.
I go to many games in Québec city and love it but that is 300 km down the 20... I even posted on this board about going to games.
Hey I am not against baseball in Mtl
If Bronfman and his buddies want to spend money and bring back MLB I may be on board because of what convinced Valérie Plante, the new Mtl mairesse.
They presented a project that went much further than baseball, and was a creative undertaking in the Bassin Peel.
Something that is socialy beneficial to the whole community.
https://ici.radio-canada.ca/sports/...e-baseball-montreal-valerie-plante-vieux-port
If Bronfman and his buddies want to spend money and bring back MLB I may be on board because of what convinced Valérie Plante, the new Mtl mairesse.
They presented a project that went much further than baseball, and was a creative undertaking in the Bassin Peel.
Something that is socialy beneficial to the whole community.
https://ici.radio-canada.ca/sports/...e-baseball-montreal-valerie-plante-vieux-port
If you have a better located stadium, and solid/stable team ownership in it for the long haul, baseball would definitely work in Montreal. There just seems to be a lot of obstacles to the first part of it- the Stadium. The time to do it was 20 years ago and that ship seems to have sailed in terms of available real estate.
Rumples, what do you call the Montreal Royals? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montreal_Royals
The Montreal Royals were a minor league professional baseball team in Montreal, Quebec, from 1897–1917 and 1928–60. A member of the International League, the Royals were the top farm club (Class AAA) of the Brooklyn Dodgers from 1939; pioneering African-American player Jackie Robinson was a member for the 1946 season. The 1946 Royals were recognized as one of the 100 greatest minor league teams of all time.[SUP][3][/SUP]
Louis, having grown up a Brooklyn Dodger fan, I am quite familiar with the Royals of Delorimier Stadium. In fact, when I cross the Pont Jacques-Cartier and the site of the yard, I genuflect.
Times have changed. Back when there were 16 major league teams, minor league ball was appropriate for our fair city. The problem now is that if we were to accept a minor league team, we would be stuck with it forever.
There are two kinds of cities in North America: major league cities and not-major league cities. Montreal is a major league city. Here's a little quiz for you. What is the larges city in Ohio? No, it's not Cleveland, home of the Indians. No, it's not Cincinnati, home of the Reds. It's Columbus, a minor league town that no one thinks of because they don't have a team.
Rumples, we've discussed this before and you know that I whole-heartedly agree that, all things being equal, it would be better for Montreal to get a major league team than to settle for a minor league team. I would absolutely love to go to an Expos game on a midsummer night at a nice new stadium within easy reach of downtown.
My suggestion of settling for a minor league team is based on my belief that there are too many financial, political and practical problems to overcome in order for the Expos to return. When I think about all the factors that conspire against the return of major league baseball to Montreal, it seems impossible.
However, as the French say, Impossible n'est pas français! Furthermore, like my good friend Rick Blaine, under my cynical shell, I am at heart a sentimentalist.
So let's briefly review the key challenges to overcome in order to bring back the Expos.
First you need a team owner or ownership group with the financial means, business acumen and desire to bring back major league baseball. Montreal might have such a group, i.e. the group of potential investors led by Stephen Bronfman. Bronfman has the famous name but he doesn't have as much of a track record as the more famous members of his Montreal family. Still the Bronfman group is the one seemingly serious group of investors who are committed to the cause of bringing back the Expos. So they probably deserve our support.
Second, you need money, lots of it. Bringing back the Expos would require two huge investments: 1) the cost of acquiring a franchise (either by buying an existing one such as Oakland or Tampa Bay or by paying an expansion fee); and 2) the cost of building a stadium. Either cost by itself is very significant. Combine them and you are talking about a US $1-2B investment. How much money can the potential Bronfman group put together? I have no idea but they give the impression that the money is or will be there. On verra.
Third, you need the support of both fans and businesses. I think the fan support is there though no one knows how deep it is. Is it deep enough to pay the very high ticket prices typically charged by major league teams these days? Is it deep enough to make the fans show up to support a losing team over the course of a long season? Is it deep enough to make some fans show up when the weather sucks for baseball, the way it often does until June rolls around? The modern economics of baseball also demand that businesses support a team by buying season tickets and renting luxury boxes. Would Montreal businesses do their part to support the team? Peut-être, je ne sais pas.
Fourth, you need political support. The city government, led by the mayor, and probably the provincial and federal governments must be on board too. I don't mean they must provide direct financial support for purchasing a team and/or building a stadium. Direct financial support is out of the question. However government officials, starting with the mayor, need to be willing to commit to paying some infrastructure costs (roads, public transport, land, utilities) associated with acquiring a site for and building a stadium. Government officials also need to be willing to battle NIMBY (Not in my back yard) opponents of stadium construction. It's inevitable that such NIMBY opposition will arise as soon an actual site is chosen.
Fifth, you need an appropriate site for a new stadium. The much discussed "Peel Basin" site is not perfect, but as Voltaire said "Le mieux est l'enemmi du bien." When I look at maps of the city and Google street views and review proposed plans, I agree that the Peel Basin is sill a possibility for a new stadium. Here are some interesting drawings of how a stadium could fit into this location: https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/montreal-new-baseball-stadium.20117/page-2
There are other obstacles to bringing back the Expos besides the well-known ones that I have reviewed. All the major challenges have been the same for the last several years and yet no real progress seems to have been made in overcoming them. That's why I would not bet on the return of major league baseball and the Expos to Montreal and I would personally settle for the return of minor league baseball to Montreal.
Nevertheless I would prefer to see the return of major league baseball and the Expos and I hope that it does happen...at least before you, Rumples, and I are no longer of this world.
Pas de problème. Bronfman, Mitch Garber, Larry Rossy, Bell Media and even, yes, Pedro Martinez wants a piece of the action.
These peeps are loaded. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitch_Garber Larry Rossy is worth over a billion. He founded Dollarama and cashed it out to Bain Capital. And Bell is dealing with the fact that their arch rival, Rogers, has the national NHL contract and also owns the Blue Jays. Bell, of course, has their own RSN and very badly needs the programming that the Expos would give them.
They had it before when Bronfman Sr. owned the team. However, simply owning a MLB team is a profit-making proposition. The value of franchises is exploding. Teams are profitable before even putting an ass in the seats. Take a look at how many teams are no longer even trying to win. (Rays, Marlins, Tigers, Orioles, others.) They don't even need to sell tickets. They make money from revenue sharing (which the big market teams are starting to resent seeing the small markets pocket the dough), local and national broadcasting, and licensing. The Rays just signed an $83 million annual TV deal.
Seems that Ms. Plante has realized that it is politically beneficial to be a supporter of the Expos and was photographed this week wearing an Expo hat. She's totally on board with helping with land acquisition and tax abatement, but not with ballpark funding, which should come from the province anyway since they'll be the primary beneficiary of the income tax paid by the players. (Provincial income tax in Canada is higher than federal.)
Everyone seems to be on board with the Peel Basin. Ms. Mayor has been hipped to the fact that the area is close enough to downtown to be walked and also is ripe for much other development. The new light rail line to the south shore also has a planned stop at the ballpark site. I believe you linked to an article on this just above.
That group of potential owners became known in fall 2014. They do have money but they are also good businessmen who would need to be convinced that buying a team like the Rays for US$900m (the current value) and building a stadium for $500M is a good business proposition.
Of course all talk of the costs of acquiring a team and building a stadium is theoretical since there is no team available to acquire either through a purchase or expansion. The most frequently mentioned teams that need new stadiums and might be for sale and that could be moved to Montreal are the Rays and the A's. It's still very possible that both those teams will solve their stadium problems and stay where they are (Oakland might move to Portland).
As for expansion, the commissioner is on record as favoring it but there is no timetable. It's a very complicated issue because expansion would probably require a major rearrangement of divisions and/or leagues. There are currently 30 teams with two leagues of 3 divisions each with five teams. If you expand to 32 teams then you can have either 4 divisions of 4 teams in each league or 2 divisions of 8 teams. You could also do away with the leagues and completely rearrange MLB into 4 divisions of 8 teams each. All of those are interesting possibilities but good luck getting all the owners to agree on a major realignment of the divisions and/or leagues. It was hard enough to move one team, Houston, from one league to another.
That's a good argument for the Rays to stay right where they are.
I've have heard you make the argument that the province would get back money spent on a stadium through income tax receipts. I don't think the Quebec government and people will buy that argument.
That site seems to be the best possible one for a location close to downtown. I like the site and I do think a stadium could help spur development in an area close to downtown that is currently somewhat unattractive and underdeveloped. The article in French linked to by Tiga compared this location to the area around the new Giants stadium in SF. I think it's a valid comparison.
But we can't wait forever for a stadium project to get started there. The more time that goes by, the more possible it is that something else will happen in that area. I'm glad that the mayor was willing to meet with the potential owners and listen to their pitch. However until a team actually becomes available nothing can happen. A stadium will never get built before Montreal actually acquires a team by purchase or expansion.
Also, even if Montreal acquires a team and begins planning to develop a stadium in the Peel Basin area, the NIMBY forces will almost automatically oppose it. Guy Laliberté once proposed a good plan to build a new Cirque du Soleil venue and casino somewhere southwest of downtown. It seemed like a good plan that would create some decent jobs and enhance the tourism industry. NIMBY forces were so vehemently opposed to the plan that he quickly dropped it.
The baseball commissioner once again mentioned Montreal as a favored candidate for an expansion franchise. But, as the article states:
"Whatever Manfred wants to happen, any actual expansion is still likely far down the road. Selecting expansion cities, finding an ownership group for the team, setting up an expansion draft, figuring out Minor League affiliates, building stadiums and everything else would take years, so don’t expect to be rooting for (or against) a new MLB team in the near future."
Commissioner Rob Manfred says Major League Baseball 'would like to be a 32-team league'
sports.yahoo.com
May 4, 2018
[FONT=&]Since adding the Tampa Bay Rays and Arizona Diamondbacks in 1998, Major League Baseball has held steady at 30 teams. It appears league commissioner Rob Manfred is very interested in changing that.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Manfred was in Monterrey, Mexico on Friday for the Dodgers-Padres series and took time to visit the broadcast booths of both teams during the game. A common topic of conversation for both interviews? Making Major League Baseball a 32-team league.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Talk of expanding MLB to 32 teams has been around for a while now. Several cities have been thought to make sense for expansion, like Montreal, Charlotte, New Orleans, Las Vegas or Portland. It’s also likely not a coincidence that Manfred chose to discuss this topic during the Mexico Series, as Mexico City has been mentioned as one of Manfred’s favorite possibilities for a new MLB team.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Adding two more teams to MLB would make some mathematical sense, namely that an even number of teams in both the American and National League would do away with constant interleague play during the season. Manfred also hinted at 32 teams making scheduling easier and change the playoff format, likely thanks to a divisional realignment.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]MLB currently sits with the NBA at 30 teams. The NFL has been at 32 teams since adding the Texans in 2002 and the NHL is nearing 32 thanks to the addition of the Las Vegas Golden Knights and a Seattle team expected close behind it. MLB is doing just fine in the revenue department, but adding the benefits of another two teams and matching the reach of other leagues is clearly on the commissioner’s radar.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Whatever Manfred wants to happen, any actual expansion is still likely far down the road. Selecting expansion cities, finding an ownership group for the team, setting up an expansion draft, figuring out Minor League affiliates, building stadiums and everything else would take years, so don’t expect to be rooting for (or against) a new MLB team in the near future.[/FONT]
"Whatever Manfred wants to happen, any actual expansion is still likely far down the road. Selecting expansion cities, finding an ownership group for the team, setting up an expansion draft, figuring out Minor League affiliates, building stadiums and everything else would take years, so don’t expect to be rooting for (or against) a new MLB team in the near future."
Commissioner Rob Manfred says Major League Baseball 'would like to be a 32-team league'
sports.yahoo.com
May 4, 2018
[FONT=&]Since adding the Tampa Bay Rays and Arizona Diamondbacks in 1998, Major League Baseball has held steady at 30 teams. It appears league commissioner Rob Manfred is very interested in changing that.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Manfred was in Monterrey, Mexico on Friday for the Dodgers-Padres series and took time to visit the broadcast booths of both teams during the game. A common topic of conversation for both interviews? Making Major League Baseball a 32-team league.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Talk of expanding MLB to 32 teams has been around for a while now. Several cities have been thought to make sense for expansion, like Montreal, Charlotte, New Orleans, Las Vegas or Portland. It’s also likely not a coincidence that Manfred chose to discuss this topic during the Mexico Series, as Mexico City has been mentioned as one of Manfred’s favorite possibilities for a new MLB team.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Adding two more teams to MLB would make some mathematical sense, namely that an even number of teams in both the American and National League would do away with constant interleague play during the season. Manfred also hinted at 32 teams making scheduling easier and change the playoff format, likely thanks to a divisional realignment.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]MLB currently sits with the NBA at 30 teams. The NFL has been at 32 teams since adding the Texans in 2002 and the NHL is nearing 32 thanks to the addition of the Las Vegas Golden Knights and a Seattle team expected close behind it. MLB is doing just fine in the revenue department, but adding the benefits of another two teams and matching the reach of other leagues is clearly on the commissioner’s radar.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Whatever Manfred wants to happen, any actual expansion is still likely far down the road. Selecting expansion cities, finding an ownership group for the team, setting up an expansion draft, figuring out Minor League affiliates, building stadiums and everything else would take years, so don’t expect to be rooting for (or against) a new MLB team in the near future.[/FONT]
I'm thinking 2021-2022.
What you posted is really nothing new. The only thing that has changed in the last year is the huge TV deal in Tampa, making it quite unrealistic for them to move anywhere. Manfred has been steady throughout that expansion will not happen until the As and Rays have their stadium situations resolved. (Of course, that could take almost forever. C'est la vie.)
What you posted is really nothing new. The only thing that has changed in the last year is the huge TV deal in Tampa, making it quite unrealistic for them to move anywhere. Manfred has been steady throughout that expansion will not happen until the As and Rays have their stadium situations resolved. (Of course, that could take almost forever. C'est la vie.)
I know and that’s the problem. We have been reading the same kind of hopeful stories for the last few years and yet we are really no closer to actually getting a team in Montreal.
I think expansion seems like a better possibility than a move by the Rays. But as noted before, though expansion makes sense for a lot of reasons, it will be very difficult to get the owners to agree on a major realignment of divisions and maybe leagues. In the meantime the best location for a (sorta) downtown stadium could be put to other uses.
While Montreal waits and hopes for a team, the baseball season just got started for Les Capitales de Québec.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-capitales-20th-anniversary-season-1.4668745
I saw the Yankees play out in Oakland a few years back and Oakland has badly needed a new stadium for a long time. It’s probably the least memorable baseball stadium I have ever visited. It’s got an old feeling to it but not “old school” or throwback, just plain old, as in decrepit and shot.
The Stephen Bronfman group seems serious about bringing major league baseball back to Montreal and they are saying and doing all the right things to make it happen. But I think it has to happen sooner rather than later. An appropriate (sorta) downtown location is available now but will not be available forever.
'This is absolutely happening': Expos fans weigh in on pro baseball's return to Montreal
CTVNews.ca
Published Wednesday, May 23, 2018
The investment group behind the bid to bring a major-league baseball team back to Montreal is reaching out to fans to find out what will bring them out to games.
Focus groups, being held in Montreal for the second day Wednesday, are asking fans what they want in a future stadium, how much they are willing to pay for tickets, and what food should be offered. More than 1,400 people registered to take part.
Baseball fans have been hopeful for years about a return of a big-league team, but Major League Baseball has given no indication when or if it will approve a team in Montreal. Instead, Commissioner Rob Manfred has said he is concentrating on turning around the fate of struggling franchises in Tampa Bay and Oakland before looking at expansion...
The Montreal investment group is led by multi-millionaire businessmen Stephen Bronfman and Mitch Garber, who have assured city officials that they will not be looking for public money to build a new stadium or land a team.
CTV News heard from fans taking part in the focus groups who said the stadium needs to be downtown and offer an experience affordable for families. Many said they expect a team within five to 10 years.
The investment group says it plans to present the results of its fan outreach to the league.
Matthew Ross of TSN 990 and founder of Expos Nation, says the investors are targeting everyone from the diehard fan who would buy seasons tickets to the casual fan who would take in a few games here and there.
The investment group has been very clear they will not build a stadium and then hope to get MLB’s approval. They will only build a stadium once a franchise is awarded. That could mean a new team might have to play at Olympic Stadium for a year, says Ross.
He says the provincial taxes generated on a team’s payroll – the league median is about USD$130 million – could be a yearly payment on a stadium...
'This is absolutely happening': Expos fans weigh in on pro baseball's return to Montreal
CTVNews.ca
Published Wednesday, May 23, 2018
The investment group behind the bid to bring a major-league baseball team back to Montreal is reaching out to fans to find out what will bring them out to games.
Focus groups, being held in Montreal for the second day Wednesday, are asking fans what they want in a future stadium, how much they are willing to pay for tickets, and what food should be offered. More than 1,400 people registered to take part.
Baseball fans have been hopeful for years about a return of a big-league team, but Major League Baseball has given no indication when or if it will approve a team in Montreal. Instead, Commissioner Rob Manfred has said he is concentrating on turning around the fate of struggling franchises in Tampa Bay and Oakland before looking at expansion...
The Montreal investment group is led by multi-millionaire businessmen Stephen Bronfman and Mitch Garber, who have assured city officials that they will not be looking for public money to build a new stadium or land a team.
CTV News heard from fans taking part in the focus groups who said the stadium needs to be downtown and offer an experience affordable for families. Many said they expect a team within five to 10 years.
The investment group says it plans to present the results of its fan outreach to the league.
Matthew Ross of TSN 990 and founder of Expos Nation, says the investors are targeting everyone from the diehard fan who would buy seasons tickets to the casual fan who would take in a few games here and there.
The investment group has been very clear they will not build a stadium and then hope to get MLB’s approval. They will only build a stadium once a franchise is awarded. That could mean a new team might have to play at Olympic Stadium for a year, says Ross.
He says the provincial taxes generated on a team’s payroll – the league median is about USD$130 million – could be a yearly payment on a stadium...
Trivia Question!
Who is the only currently active Major League Baseball Player who played for the Montreal Expos?
Who is the only currently active Major League Baseball Player who played for the Montreal Expos?
Correctamundo! And let's all wish Bartolo a happy 45th birthday!
http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/23575757/mlb-45-things-know-bartolo-colon-45th-birthday
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