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Thread: Tricked - a documentary about prostitution !

  1. #1
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    Tricked - a documentary about prostitution !

    There is a thread opened " Movies about prostitutes" and I was going to post the link to this movie there, that being said I felt it was inappropriate to post a documentary about the ills of prostitution in a thread that seemed to me to glorify being an SP. I also thought that posting this thread might open a discussion (especially from our female contributors ) as to their experiences in the business. I for one had my eyes opened WIDE by this well presented film. I hope some of you will take the time to watch it and comment. Those of you who might have already seen the film, I welcome your views, please let's make this a discussion of some social value.
    " You actually get to choose your friends, family.........well..."

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    Quote Originally Posted by TinaMtl View Post
    These things are way more common than people think... just like domestic violence, we do not talk about it but these things are happening widely behind closed doors.
    There are only very few people that would deny abuse happens. That's the point; it's just like a form of domestic violence. The problem is ''documentaries'' trying to convince people that this is inherent to the job and unavoidable. I didn't see that specific movie, but from what I've heard it's the usual abolitionist propaganda pushing from criminalization.
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by TinaMtl View Post
    I felt like this movie targeted mostly typical "pimps"... more than clients and the whole business.
    It portrays these worse cases as the norm and claim that they import and brainwash thousands of immigrants into the country every year (most of them of course less then 12 years old). It's like doing a movie on the Shafia family and making up fake statistics to make it sound like a documentary on Mariage.
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

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    In general, I think the best thing to do is to decrease the stigma so that they feel more confident to go get help without being judged. It's bad to have an abusive relationship, but when they are in a life that is seen as shameful and criminal, it's even more difficult for them to escape it. I'm not talking about glorifying sex work, but simply treating it as a neutral with the same rights as any other worker.

    Movies like that think they are doing good by bringing more attention to some real problems. But they are really doing a lot more harm that way. A good documentary will present all aspects of the subject, or if they focus on a specific situation they will place it in the proper context.
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

  5. #5
    As far as how this documentary relates to this MERB community, and what Tina is saying:
    We want to tell ourselves that the SPs we contact here aren't in this kind of position. And the pimps and women in the documentary at some point told themselves the same thing. And people will deceive themselves, and emotions can easily blind us to the true nature of any relationship. But mostly as clients we can only hope we're not stepping into that, and appreciate the services we get and the people who provide them.

    Also, abusive, coercive or exploitative relationships are not unique to men abusing women, and certainly not to prostitution. For many other industries difficult battles are fought by workers for regulation and protection, and yet exploitation still exists in so many corners...but for this industry, the law and stigma don't seem to even be on the side of helping workers. And I don't feel this documentary did well on that front either, agree with siocnarf there.

  6. #6
    Le probleme de la plupart des films ou reportages sur la prostitution c'est qu'ils condamnent de facto la prostitution dans son ensemble au lieu d'essayer de différencier ce qui est correct et acceptable
    dans cette activité et ce qui ne l'est pas.
    Je donne mon humble avis:Pour moi,aucune prostitution ne devrait etre permise avant l'age de 25 ans de facon a ce que la décision de pratiquer ce métier soit prise de facon réfléchie.C'est évident que toutes personnes mineures ou FORCÉES, de se prostituer est innacceptable mais l'ensemble de l'''industrie'' est tellement opaque que c'est difficile ,dans certains cas,de savoir s'il y a exploitation ou pas.
    Par exemple une fille qui travaille dans une agence(ou un salon) respectueux au niveau humain et monétaire,qu'on m'explique ou est le probleme...Et pour avoir parlé avec beaucoup de filles,
    beaucoup aiment la job qu'elle font,le seul probleme qu'elles ont,c'est l'image négative que la société leur renvoie de ce métier.Et malheureusement, socialement,on est loins du jour ou ce beau métier sera
    accepté.
    Mais tant qu'on ne fera pas de distinction entre la ''bonne''(femme(ou homme)mature,responsable,organisée...) et la ''mauvaise''( femmes dépendantes,exploitées,immatures...) prostitution on ne s'en va nulle part avec ce débat.
    Pour beaucoup de gens ,vendre et acheter du sexe,sera toujours immoral et innacceptable,mais j'espere qu'un jour,(n'est-ce pas ,dit-on, le plus vieux métier du monde?),la société acceptera qu'il n'y a RIEN de mal avec la prostitution,a condition qu'elle soit pratiquée par des adultes matures,consentants,respectueux et responsables.
    On a bien le droit de rever...

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    Quote Originally Posted by wxlancer View Post
    But mostly as clients we can only hope we're not stepping into that, and appreciate the services we get and the people who provide them.
    I would add that for most clients, this is always something we think about on some level. Abolitionist think the law will ''responsibilize'' clients to the problems, but we are already hyper-aware of this. Many client will avoid providers that have the smallest details that can be interpretted in terms of possible abuse. For exemple some people won't see any asians just in case, or anyone who doesn't speak fluent english/french. However, when we buy food we rarely stop to wonder whether people on the farm were trafficked immigrants sexually abused by their employers. This happens just as often, but it's usually put in proper context because there is no anti-food groups.
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by mariol View Post
    Je donne mon humble avis:Pour moi,aucune prostitution ne devrait etre permise avant l'age de 25 ans de facon a ce que la décision de pratiquer ce métier soit prise de facon réfléchie....
    C'est sur que ce n'est pas un métier à commencer trop jeune. Idéalement il faut que la personne soit expérimentée et à l'aise. Mais juste parce que quelque chose n'est pas une bonne idée, ça ne veut pas dire que ça devrait être illégal. Soyons réaliste: si l'age légal était de 25 ans (ou même 21) pensez-vous vraiment que les 18-20 s'abstiendraient? Ce serait le même problème qu'avec la criminalisation. Et selon toute logique il faudrait aussi augmenter l'âge du mariage à 25 pour éviter les jeunes qui se marient de façon irréfléchie.

    D'une manière plus générale, je pense que les gens développent de la maturité justement quand ont leur laisse prendre leurs décisions et responsabilités. Il n'y a pas un age magique auquel les jeunes deviennent matures..
    “Truth, Justice, Freedom, Reasonably Priced Love.”

  9. #9
    Its on netflix. Rough. I'm glad I'm not on that side of the industry

  10. #10
    I would love to see the media report on how law enforcement in the United States has made this problem far worse in recent years. It would be a good lesson for Canada as to how not to enforce c-36.

    A quick read of the many posts on one of our "lesser" boards, usasexguide.info (Jackson's U.S. sister to his good internationaksexguide.info), reveals a stunning number of low-priced US providers with drug addictions and/or pimps. Plenty of guys see these providers, encounter pimps, violence, theft, and drug use, but keep going back because the $100 - $250 an hour price is so much less than the $350- $600 an hour price most often seen on TER.

    Law enforcement in the U.S. in the past five years or so has been almost entirely focused on agencies, on low-priced (and low-paying) providers and customers using Backpage, and of course on the oldest area - street action. Agencies are a popular target because it generates media publicity and law enforcement gets to keep lots of seized assets, namely cash.

    The plus side is that lots of ladies have learned to become businesswomen. They get websites, use screening services, focus on customer service, and keep a larger portion of the $350 - $600 an hour fee than they would have gotten to keep had they worked for an agency. U.S. law enforcement entirely leaves these high-end providers alone, and leaves their customers alone.

    But we rarely look at the darker side of the equation. Agencies often add a bit of professionalism and work discipline needed by providers who cannot become successful independent escorts. I used a lot of agencies when more were around. Almost all of these agencies charged $300 - $400 an hour. They did not tolerate significant drug use by the providers, so it simply did not occur.

    Now for every girl who would have worked at an agency but instead becomes an escort success story by earning more than she otherwise would have, I fear there are two or three that fare worse. They use drugs more heavily because nothing stops them from doing so. They do not have the resources to do proper screening. They advertise on Backpage and are in a constant price war with other low-end providers. They feel a need to get a "pimp" for protection and for bail because they work in venues attacked by law enforcement, and they encounter "lower-end" johns who are relatively more likely to be violent criminals.

    An agency with work rules, screening of customers, and a fixed price for customers would have eliminated the need for pimps and would have reduced the drug use for these providers.

    I realize that Montreal has plenty of tremendous independents who do not need an agency, but I suspect that the existence of a strong agency system ultimately provides a better life for many of the sex workers in a Montreal than they would have if the agencies did not exist. Hopefully, Canadian law enforcement will do a better job of realizing the benefits of a strong agency system than US law enforcement did.

    I do not really deal much with the lower-end of the US market, but I realize that if the lower-end gets out of control, lawmakers and law enforcement will get public support to erode the avenues (TER reviews, provider webpages, privacy of cell phones / email communications, etc.) that allow the higher-end market to be unaffected by law enforcement. So the things discussed in these documentaries cannot be completely ignored as being irrelevant.

  11. #11
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    Good post, Patron. Agencies have their place in the ecosystem.

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    Et bien j'ai hâté de voir un film sur la prostitution qui en fais une profession plein d'avenir , de bénéfices et d'accomplissement personnelles ! Ce n'est pas toujours la fête pour nos courtisanes. Elles se tapent souvent des mecs touts croches , marginaux baisant d'une façon plus ou moins agréable ( je mis inclus , aucunes sp m'a rappelé pour me dire que j'étais la baise de leurs vie! ) .
    C'est une profession encore amorale sinon le gouvernement l'aurais déjà surtaxé !
    Et alors ....
    Ou est la libertés entre deux adultes qui décident d'échanger un service pour un autre .
    Qu'est-ce qu'un , qu'une adulte ... Quand une fille devient adulte et peut décider qu'elle peut faire à 18 ans ... Je ne crois pas qu'une jeune femme qui vient d'avoir 18 ans à minuit à toute l'expérience de vie pour décider de cela ... On devrait plutôt augmenter l'âge d'accès au travail du sexe à 20 ans ou plus ! Elles ont déjà a du vécue et due négocier avec la vie !!!

    Il y a des campagnes sur la violence faites aux femmes et elle devrait faites aussi pour sensibiliser les jeunes filles de 14/16 à toutes les violences que peut leurs faire un ado / adulte mâle peuvent leurs faires ! Plutôt on leurs enseignent a se sortir d'une situation abusante le mieux ! Amour n'est pas violence ni physique ni mentale .

    Nous en tant que clients, notre argent est notre plus grand pouvoir démocratique ! Alors nous nous devons de choisir ce qui nous parais le plus étique ..... Dans un monde qui nous vend le rêves ça peux paraître impossible mais nous devons quand même d'essayer !

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    In the United States the appearance of justice is more important than the "social justice " ! You get elected because you busted a couple of pimps sp , drug trafficking, blacks and marginals... That's how you stay in your comfortable office ! So nobody questions if it is a good measure to resolve the problem! You put them in jail an that's it ! You get to keep your job because you look good !
    Appearances of justice is not justice!

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    A couple of things struck me in this film. One of the most disturbing to me was the fact that currently there are almost 21,000,000 girls,boys and women enslaved worldwide. This total is more than the number of people enslaved at any other time in the history of the world !!! I would hope that in the cases where I see an SP that she is NOT working for a pimp and or giving all of her money to a pimp or boyfriend, that being said I think we convince ourselves of that fact to alleviate any guilt. Let's be honest a majority of these young women would rather be anywhere than in a motel fucking some fat, balding sweaty guy for a hundred bucks. To think that a 20 year old girl is turned on at the thought of that type of client is naive on our part. Are there women in this business for themselves and the income, probably but are they all level headed women trying to build a future through the avails of prostitution, I doubt it. I read Tinamtl's comments with interest as I do feel that only someone on the SP side of this story really knows the truth. We would all like to think we are studs and with us these girls are crazy for us.....not the other sleazy clients they might see during a shift. Yes this movie is about pimps and how they target and enslave young women to do their bidding and yes it is only one view. It disturbed me to see young women telling their stories about how they were treated, a lot ! Should there be another story told from the perspective of the John, yes I do believe that this is only scratching the surface. I believe that it also speaks to how we as men do dehumanize women and objectify them. These are human beings with the same hopes as any other women we know, wifes, daughters mothers and sisters, and we would not nor would we accept someone treating those we love the way some of us treat women in this industry. This is not about whether or not the justice system is doing it's job effectively and using a few examples to remain in office, this is about respect and doing your part to ensure that the respect that is due to another human being is maintained. We all have a social responsibility to respect ALL of our fellow human beings, no matter the gender, race or religion.
    " You actually get to choose your friends, family.........well..."

  15. #15
    Doggielover, the problem with numbers like that is that they are probably made up. Every year, the abolitionists come up with a set number of sex trafficked children working the Super Bowl. It is complete bullshit. Many scholarly articles point out that there would simply not physically be enough space in the city to accommodate that many transient sex workers, let alone child sex workers. In fact, most police departments that have really studied the issue report that fewer sex workers work in the city during Super Bowl week than any other given week, for the simple and obvious reason that hotel and motel rooms are too expensive for incall. Never underestimate the capacity of the general populace to believe made-up numbers. We are conditioned as children to learn by accepting as truth everything in the textbook, and it carries over to adult life.

    Of course, these numbers do not just involve just sex. They love to declare that any worker is enslaved who is unable to leave the workplace at any given time and do exactly what he/she wants to do. A film can be made by workers who can live that way. Most workplaces and jobs simply cannot function like that. If you have a heart attack in the next hour, would you want to find out that no ambulance drivers are available and no one knows where they are, of that no doctors are present at the hospital they might take you to?

    If the workers at the Chinese factory, who chose $1 an hour manufacturing work over $0.10 an hour farm work are slaves because they cannot leave the factory at will, are the ambulance drivers and doctors enslaved? I get sick and tired of bullshit documentaries with made-up numbers written and produced by free-spirit kids, probably from rich families, who have never had to work a regular job or given thought to his the world would collapse if everyone were exactly like them.

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