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Thread: Those crazy Americans...

  1. #1

    Those crazy Americans...

    http://www.local6.com/news/7043931/detail.html

    SPOTSYLVANIA, Va. -- Undercover sex is getting the OK from a Virginia sheriff.

    Spotsylvania County Sheriff Howard Smith said he stands by the practice of allowing detectives to receive sexual services in the course of their investigations so they can catch suspects in the act.

    Court documents show that four times last month, county detectives allowed women at a massage parlor to perform sex acts on them. In one case, a lawman left a $350 tip. Smith acknowledged the practice is not new.

    Smith told The Washington Post that only unmarried detectives are allowed to do the under-the-covers work.

    He said actual sex acts are needed to help win prostitution convictions.

    "If I thought we could get the conviction without that, we wouldn't allow it," Smith told the newspaper. "If you want to make them, this has to be done."

    He said most prostitutes are careful not to say anything incriminating, which makes sexual contact necessary

    Several police officials and legal observers say the practice has been tried by other agencies across the country, but they knew of none that still permit sexual contact with suspects as part of prostitution investigations. But many police agencies across the country have banned sexual contact between investigators and suspects.

    When police used similar tactics in the past in Montgomery County, Md., the charges ended up being dropped.
    You have to love how instead of trying to address the root issue they just use it as an excuse to spend taxpaper money on prostitution.

    If it really is necessary to have intercourse to get a conviction, at what point is there "enough evidence"? I'm guessing it's after the cops have their orgasms.
    Last edited by lovin spoonful; 02-17-2006 at 08:35 PM.

  2. #2
    If the cop comes twice, the girl has her sentence doubled. If he comes quickly, she gets a suspended sentence.

  3. #3
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    It's a wonder I don't like most cops

    I wonder if these encounters are recorded. Can't you just see a bunch of cops sitting around the station viewing the 'evidence'? I bet these guys are all Bush voters, too.
    If they're not recorded, these women should file a countersuit saying the cops raped them.

  4. #4
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    I don't buy what Sheriff Smith says that in order to win a conviction you need to have a sexual contact between masseuse and cop. That's ludicrous. I also question his statement that most masseuse are discreet enough not to be caught mentionning anything that would appear compromising. It has not been my experience. Maybe at first the lady will wish to hold back something she'd like to say, but when the critical moment ''cums'', most will say enough to get caught in the act. And who do you think the court is more likely to believe, a cop or a masseuse? Especially if the same charge can be made by more than one cop against any one person. That Smith guy appears to me to be using this little conviction stunt more as a way to get his best officers a good hj

    fml

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by femaleluver2
    I don't buy what Sheriff Smith says that in order to win a conviction you need to have a sexual contact between masseuse and cop. That's ludicrous. I also question his statement that most masseuse are discreet enough not to be caught mentionning anything that would appear compromising. It has not been my experience. Maybe at first the lady will wish to hold back something she'd like to say, but when the critical moment ''cums'', most will say enough to get caught in the act. And who do you think the court is more likely to believe, a cop or a masseuse? Especially if the same charge can be made by more than one cop against any one person. That Smith guy appears to me to be using this little conviction stunt more as a way to get his best officers a good hj

    fml
    WHat I read was that the women were from China and knew very little English to begin with. So they would say nothing and just waited for the guy to initiate the action.

  6. #6
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    FML,

    American incall ops and outcall ops typically are much more attuned to deflecting successful LE than they are in Canada. It's true as Daydreamer says that there is a steady stream of imported Asian women, many of whom speak almost no English, working at the MPs. The ones that do know English are trained as to what they should or should not say.

    Years ago I saw an SP in Boston who asked me to touch her breast the moment she walked through my hotel door, before any business got transacted. It was the first thing she did after saying hello - "Touch me here." The purpose was she knew Boston LE COULD NOT touch her. I was being screened. So LE has gotten wise. Rather than have unsuccessful prosecutions that are a waste of time and money and embarass the State's Attorney's office, they are taking the next step and allowing undercovers to get BJs.

    Daydreamer is right though about the language factor in the MPs. In Connecticut the MPs are staffed mainly by Korean girls who are smuggled into this country, and barely can speak any English at all. They work 3-6 months, make big money, then go back to Korea and are replaced by a new group of young debutantes.
    Last edited by EagerBeaver; 02-18-2006 at 01:42 PM.

  7. #7
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    Very interesting, EB. But apart from LE getting wiser and allowing some of its officers to get bjs on the job by sps, aren't they breaking the law themselves? Do you think the police dep must seek a judge's approval before going ahead with such daring tactics? I would think that there's quite a gap between allowing an officer to grope a girl on the job so as to pass off as a john and going all the way with letting yourself get blown

    fml

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by EagerBeaver
    So LE has gotten wise. Rather than have unsuccessful prosecutions that are a waste of time and money and embarass the State's Attorney's office, they are taking the next step and allowing undercovers to get BJs.
    Wise? As it turns out, this has proven to be far more embarassing than whatever they were doing previously.

    and 350+entrance fee for a BJ? That must be one hell of a blowjob.
    Last edited by lovin spoonful; 02-19-2006 at 01:28 PM.

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    State laws in the US regarding prostitution vary widely from state to state. There are states which have laws where all the law needs to do is prove intent to commit prostitution. This law is tied to loitering. There are other states where actual solicitation must be made. However, I seriously doubt that Virginia requires that the actual act must be performed, just the offering of money for services, or acceptance of money for services.

    In this case, since these girls did not communicate at it was difficult for LE to get a conviction and the police chief thought the only way he could get evidence was to send his boys off on a "mission?"

    In a normal sting, the cop would ask the girl how much a bj would be, etc. When the girl answered, the cop would arrest her.

    Here the "Korean" girl just off the boat, just smiled and would say nothing. It forced the cop to do all of the communicating, presenting of money, etc. and the cop would not know that she understood until she actually did the deed.

    If I was a constituent of this town, I would be upset. They shouldn't waste money like that.

    Rogue police like in NYC vice many years ago have been known to take services in leiu of bribes. An active Police Chief more recently in a small NJ town was convicted of running a bawdy house and escort service.

    But I think that this police chief was thinking way out of the box.

  10. #10

    They've stopped ... for now

    Spotsylvania County Sheriff Smith has announced that they will suspend the use of this tactic (cops getting happy endings):

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...021701982.html

    Here's a lovely quote from County Prosecutor Neely:

    Thus, we are left with the fundamental moral question of all criminal justice enforcement -- what is worse for our community: Organized prostitution and all of the crime which is proven to arise from it -- or a few police officers engaging in illicit sex acts in order to ultimately drive such crime from their jurisdiction & to better protect their community??
    Puh-leaze. I am soooooo sick of this soccer mom paranoia and puritanism we have in the USA.

    Here's another zinger from Neely:

    How is a prosecutor supposed to prove a case against the massage parlor madam and its owners if the police officer arrests the hooker before the marked money paid to her for sex can move into the madam's hands??
    Hey, how about legalizing and/or regulating it? And not wasting valuable police resources on consensual activity between adults?

    That way, the madam could register as a legit business, and be subject to inspections for diseases and legal work permits. And the MPAs could go to police without fear of prosecution, if they feel they are being enslaved.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by bond_james_bond
    Puh-leaze. I am soooooo sick of this soccer mom paranoia and puritanism we have in the USA.

    Here's another zinger from Neely:



    Hey, how about legalizing and/or regulating it? And not wasting valuable police resources on consensual activity between adults?

    That way, the madam could register as a legit business, and be subject to inspections for diseases and legal work permits. And the MPAs could go to police without fear of prosecution, if they feel they are being enslaved.
    Legalizing prostitution and drugs would go along way toward solving our fiscal problems. Think about it: we could stop throwing away taxpayers money hiring cops to A) investigate and arrest these people, B) hire prosecutors and judges to try them, and C) prisons and guards to incarcerate.

    And, we could tax these industries (well, drugs anyway). SPs and at least some recreational drug users could become working, tax paying, productive members of society, instead of deadweights that we have to support.

    This puritanical need to persecute and prosecute every one who commits a victimless crime is destructive to all. Nearly one percent of America is in jail. Throw on top of that the number of lawyers, cops, judges, prison guards, parole officers, etc...none of these people are actually contributing to our economy. They are a drain on the rest of us. Think about how much it hurts us economically to be carrying all that 'dead weight'. It's a staggering cost to carry.
    It's not worth it for us to keep locking up harmless adults based on our judgments of their lifestyle.

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