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SPs and personal relationships

General Gonad

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This thread is to explore the difficulties of being an SP while being in a relationship with someone. Some of you have expressed no problems at handling this type of arrangement (Ronnie, Zaphyr), while others have expressed concerns with such an arrangement (Anik, Karma).

How difficult is it to enjoy a 'regular' relationship while you're working as an SP? Please share some of your thoughts.

GG
 

naughtylady

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Don't get me wrong, sometimes it isn't easy being in a relationship and being an SP. Vince and I have worked it out, but it still takes work to keep the relationship going.

I know he worries about me when I go to work (so you guys better behave or he will hunt you, and your family down :p )


Ronnie,
Naughtylady
 

spin

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Hey Ronnie,

Vince sounds like quite a guy (I mean that sincerely) good for you!

I was once involved with a "part time" SP, we met at a club threw a mutual friend and she was very upfront with me about what she did on this side (she was in school at the time). I thought I could handle it, being Mr.Cool open minded man about town, BUT after about 2 months it was just too much for me.

It was too bad, I really liked her but I just wasn't strong enough to handle the situation.
 

ChloeMontreal

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I prefer not to be dating when I hobby (yeah I'm an sp but that's my hobby!). I find it too hard, and I don't know too many guys deeply in love that are ready to "share" if I can say. Way too complicated. Last time I was involved with someone , and that I had strong feeling for him, I took a long break form hobbying. I know everybody is different, but it is just not for me.

And I am a way better sp when I'm single, trust me! ;)

Guys, I'm single!! :D
 

General Gonad

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ChloeMontreal said:
And I am a way better sp when I'm single, trust me! ;)

Guys, I'm single!! :D

It's really too bad that I am not because I would do everything in my power to sweep you off your feet.;) Chloe, we have spoken before and I can tell that you wouldn't be able to handle a serious relationship and SPing. When you meet Mr. Lucky, you'll fall in love and I guarantee you won't miss SPing. But for now, enjoy being single!:D

>>Ronnie, I wouldn't want Vince breathing down my neck but then again, I am a gentleman with just a little naughty streak!:p

GG
 

naughtylady

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GG>>> I can see the headlines:

"Naughtylady meets a gentleman with just a little naughty streak!"

Ronnie,
Naughtylady
 

EagerBeaver

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Karma,

I have had the opposite occur to me, namely, sometimes when I am with an SP I have thoughts about a girlfriend, ex-girlfriend or even a platonic female friend whom I am attracted to. Many times with certain SPs I envision women I had crushes on in high school/college. I think if you accept this as a somewhat common phenomenon, it will make it easier to deal with.
 

General Gonad

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SL,

I have to somewhat agree with you on this one. I just cannot fathom a relationship with an SP who continues to work. A 'normal' one is hard enough. I think we like to claim that you need to be strong to have these 'open relationships,' but I suspect that it is part of a defense mechanism where we fear losing a partner so we say, hey go for it, you're free to do as you wish. Also, it would bother a lot me not to have bareback sex with an SP/partner. My primary relationship needs to be a lot deeper than that on all levels.

BTW, how many of you go to swingers' clubs? Here is another dumb concept that we have created to feed our insatiable need for something new and exciting.:rolleyes:

GG
 
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EagerBeaver

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Karma said:
Maybe we are ashamed cause we've been told again and again we are not supposed, by the rules of our society (religion ?), to have sex with someone else when we are commited.

Karma,

Because I had a Catholic upbringing and schooling and was taught that premarital/extramarital sex was wrong, and I am generally someone who tries to do "the right thing" when faced with a moral choice, I did struggle with this when I first started hobbying. But eventually I got past it and realized that maybe everything I was taught growing up isn't necessarily right. Ultimately, I "personalized" my own sense of religious and cultural values. I also came to the realization, when I was in my late 20s or so, that I am simply not a monogamous man. Once I arrived at all of these realizations, I was never further troubled.

I sense you are a younger person so your feelings are not unusual in this regard. Over the course of time you will either develop a comfort level, or not. I hope that you do.:)
 

naughtylady

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SL>> Are you implying that a hobbiest is mishandling his relationship with his wife by hobbying?

Ronnie,
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General Gonad

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naughtylady said:
SL>> Are you implying that a hobbiest is mishandling his relationship with his wife by hobbying?

Ronnie,
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Ronnie,

I have a question for you: do you think your relationship would be better or worse if you both decided to commit to it exclusively? Think about it carefully.

Now, I know I am mishandling my relationship by hobbying, avoiding constant confrontation and just not willing to deal with core issues that are really bothering me. It's not just about the lack of sex; I would be lying to myself and to all of you if I just focus on sex. The lack of sex to me is like dealing with constant rejection from the woman I love and it's emblematic of larger issues which I will not discuss here.

I will respectfully disagree with Regnad's approach where he states that his marriage "would have ended long ago were it not for my hobbying." In that case, he should have done himself and his wife a favor and called it off long ago. But while it's easy to state the obvious, when you're living it, you want to do everything possible to avoid this route. I have gone through divorce once as a teenager seeing my parents go through it and I know it isn't easy.

These days, I feel exasperated, frustrated and just generally down. It's not just my relationship, there are a lot of other issues. Like EB, I had a strong moral and religious upbringing and I get overwhelmed with feelings of profound shame and guilt. It's hard to look at myself in the mirror without asking myself: "Buddy, do you know where you're heading in life? What do you value the most? What would your parents think of your hobbying? Do you know you would be killing them? What do YOU really think of all this?"

I have been lucky lately to meet some exceptional ladies - they are the type of women that I need to meet right now. But I do see a finality to my inner turmoil. In the end, we all have values that define us. I want to come back to those values and I get stronger and rebuild myself.

Hobbying was something that I chose to do to deal with my crisis. I do not regret it but I am realizing that this cannot be my life choice to continue forever trying to find the "next gem". The only real gem in life is the one that one that you hold dear to your heart.;)

Your searching for inner peace Merbite,

GG
 

General Gonad

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Relationships: Too Easy To Leave

regnad said:
You're oversimplifying a complex issue that includes more than just the two of us, my friend. The relationship while quite far from perfect, as you know, but we continue to work on it. As you also know, I've been quite ready to bail on it a number of times over the past few weeks.

Whether we'll weather this and grow into something fulfilling that will take us into our old ages together I still don't know. What I do know is that without the release that I find in Montreal, the situation would have come to a head long ago, leaving an unattractive wake. (And, of course, the fun involved, which, I must confess, I enjoy utterly without guilt or second thoughts.)

Regnad,

I wasn't implying it's simple; I know it's a lot harder to leave when kids are in the way. As far as my moments of profound guilt and shame, they do not consume or cripple me. I also enjoy my encounters and take them as a way to take a break from life. I have been carefully selecting ladies that will offer me more than just sex. I just do not want this to be a permanent staple of my life.

Now, I don't know if you'll "weather the storm," but give it a chance. I read this article this morning and it made me think a lot about my relationship, maybe it will help you as well:

Relationships: Too Easy To Leave
by: Margaret Paul, Ph.D.


Katheryn and Mathew, both in their 50’s, have been together for two years. Both have been previously married and divorced. When they met, they fell madly in love, which lasted for a few months. Then the conflicts started.

Both Katheryn and Mathew left their marriages because they were with partners who were completely unwilling to open to learning regarding the conflicts. Both Katheryn and Mathew wanted to find a partner who would learn and grow with them. They found each other at a personal growth seminar.

However, each time a conflict occurs, which is often at this point in their relationship, they both threaten to leave. Katheryn is consistently yelling, “I’m had it! I’m leaving!” while Mathew yells, “Why don’t you just leave!” They each have a foot out the door.

Katheryn and Mathew are stuck in a typical control-resist relationship system. Katheryn wants to leave because she is so frustrated by Mathew’s constant withdrawal and resistance, while Mathew wants to leave because he can’t stand Katheryn’s constant attempts to control him and make him responsible for her feelings.

Leaving is a waste of time for Katheryn and Mathew. Actually, these two people have exactly what they asked for – someone to learn and grow with. Both Katheryn and Mathew are willing to learn and explore at some point after the conflict. Each are slowly becoming more aware of their end of their dysfunctional relationship system. If they leave, they have no one to come up against, no one who triggers their issues, so their issues will not be addressed until they are in another relationship. Then the same issues will surface.

The people I work with often believe that it would be easier to start over with someone else, or easier to be alone. I assure them that, in my experience, all learning and growing relationships are very challenging – that all couples who desire to create a really wonderful and loving relationship have to go through the trenches of healing their woundedness within the relationship. It may be easier to be alone, but it’s lonely and the major relationship issues never get healed.

If you are a person who deeply desires to continue your emotional and spiritual growth, and you are with a partner who also desires this, than DON’T LEAVE. No matter how bad the fights get or the distance gets – except if there is continued physical violence - keep at it. It’s too easy to leave, to easy to blame the other person, too easy to miss the incredible opportunity that relationships provide for healing and growth.

It’s especially important to hang in there when children are involved. I’m not saying to stay just for the children. If you are with a physically violent partner, or a partner who has no desire to take any personal responsibility, or a substance abuser who has no desire to heal from his or her addiction, then you may need to leave. But if you have a partner who is on a growth path, who is willing to explore with you, who is willing to have counseling with you, who is willing to learn to take responsibility for him or herself, then leaving is not the answer. No matter how difficult things get at times, you have a responsibility to yourself, your partner, your family, as well as to the whole of humanity to do the learning you came to this planet to do.

If you are fortunate enough to be with a partner who is, at least at some of the time, opens to learning with you, you are fortunate indeed. The relationship will take you to the depths of your dark side and to the heights of your ability to love. It will take you where you need to go, so don’t give up just because it’s so hard. The challenge is to be doing a daily Inner Bonding practice of going within, connecting with yourself and with Spirit, and learning what it means to move beyond control, beyond resistance, beyond punishing the other, beyond threats and bullying, beyond blame, beyond being victim, beyond compliance, and beyond fear. The challenge is to be healing your wounded self and developing your loving adult, which occurs in growing relationships when both people are devoted to becoming loving adults. The challenge is to be guided more and more by your spiritual Guidance and less and less by your ego/wounded self.

Even if you think that you are open and your partner isn’t, it would be in your highest good to stay in the relationship until you are able to remain loving to yourself and your partner no matter what your partner is doing. As long as you are triggered by your partner’s behavior, your healing is not complete and there is no point in leaving. If you reach a point where you are no longer triggered by your partner’s behavior, you might discover that your partner has also changed, even though you believed he or she was not open to learning and growing. If your partner remains closed and there is really nothing more for you to learn, then it might be time for you to leave.

Get both feet in there and do your inner work before even thinking about leaving. Don’t let your wounded self decide your relationship for you. Don’t leave until you know that you are fully guided to do so from a spiritual source of wisdom and truth. Don’t waste this opportunity to evolve your soul in love.
 

General Gonad

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Zaphyr said:
I really think that our relationship would be a lot worse if we committed to each other. One of the main reasons why so many couples break is that they don’t feel free to do anything with their sexual drives toward other persons. Whether they choose to have an affair, or to meet escorts, and feel guilty about that, or they feel oppressed with their loved one. In both cases it’s very hard to deal with those feelings.
Zaphyr

Zaphyr,

Thanks for sharing but I am not convinced that these open relationships are more solid than the ones most of us clients have. Let me explain. I wonder about a man's character when he knows that his primary partner is sleeping with others and is perfectly fine with it. By the same token, I also question a married man that hobbies and never experiences a shred of guilt. Both behaviors are pathological to me.

Unlike Ronnie who is dating a much younger man, which has its own complications (anyone seen the movie Prime?), you are both quite young and still discovering yourselves. I wonder if your husband has the self-confidence to actually deal with this line of work you have chosen. Is it slowly killing him but he is too scared to lose you, so he lies and tells you it's perfectly fine with him? Perhaps you're doing the same thing? Because those lies are even worse then a married man lying to his wife to get sex on the side. Those lies are like an incurable, malignant cancer that sooner or later will destroy you.

I am not here to criticize you or anyone in an open relationship but I just find it very, very difficult to believe that all is fine most of the times because "we are brutally honest with each other." Sometimes you're better off not knowing the whole truth.

GG
 

Just-ass-weet

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I don't want a guy who doesn't mind if I sleep with other guys

For money, or for fun! I have never been an open person in that way. I had a boyfriend who once suggested we have a 3-some (either a guy or a gal - he didn't mind either way) and I told him truthfully, that I could never handle that. Although I have truly enjoyed three-somes, doing something like that with someone that I am EMOTIONALLY involved with, would be impossible for me. I am not sure if open-relationships are bad, but I know that they are not for me.

xoxox
Anik
 

General Gonad

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Zaphyr said:
as I said before our relationship is based on honesty and a few other rules, not lies. We cannot live with lies. Not only we are both very self confident, but also very mature for our age. We have been together for more than six years now, so it's not like if it was a very new relationship. I know it's difficult to believe, but this is the plain truth!

Zaphyr

Zaphyr,

I am sure you're self-confident and mature; you're among the SPs that I would meet in a second. I just feel that you're just kidding yourself when you say that your openess and honesty brings you both closer together. I have a hard time believing that you share all intimate details of your encounters with your husband. I have an even harder time believing that it doesn't bother him to find out you're in Paris having multiple orgasms with some guy. "Oh, it's all in a day's work!"

Maybe I am too "closed minded" but I believe humans NEED to lie sometimes to survive and to protect their loved ones. This concept of 'totally open relationships', for me at least, is for people who are never willing to risk it all to fall in deep love. If you're afraid to commit exclusively to someone - or at least try - then you should ask yourself if that is the right person for you.

That's just my two cents, please do not take it personally.

GG
 

General Gonad

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Just-ass-weet said:
Although I have truly enjoyed three-somes, doing something like that with someone that I am EMOTIONALLY involved with, would be impossible for me. I am not sure if open-relationships are bad, but I know that they are not for me.

xoxox
Anik

Anik,

Exactly, if you're emotionally involved with someone, you would find it impossible to continue SPing as a living. I think this is healthy and dare I say a very normal attitude towards a primary partner who you love.

GG
 

General Gonad

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Zaphyr said:
We don’t commit exclusively to each other, but that doesn’t mean that we use often this freedom. Freedom is part of love, not the contrary… In fact, I very rarely sleep with someone else without money involved (it only happened 4 times, and twice of them were threesomes with him), and he has only slept we one other woman since we are together (more than 6 years). The importance is put on the fact that we feel free to do it. And yes, we are deeply in love…
Zaphyr

Zaphyr,

In my case, lying to my wife has absolutely nothing to do with lack of self-confidence. It has everything to do with protecting her feelings because she doesn't deserve to get hurt.

As far as your relationship, I am glad you're "deeply in love" but reading the above, I noticed that your husband is pretty faithful to you, sleeping with only one other woman in the last six years. If this is accurate, it may be you who is unable to commit exclusively to the relationship, not him. He may just be too scared of losing you so he lets you be "free" telling you he is "glad you love your work". If it were me, I would look you straight in the eye and say: "That's enough, it's either this relationship or nothing; I want you to commit, to show me by your actions (not 'honest' words) that I am the most important man in your life."

Again, while I am sure you're both mature, you're still relatively young and still in your experimental phase of life. You'll see that you'll change a lot in the next ten years. Think hard about your relationship and where you want it to evolve. Critically examine how your choice of SPing is impacting your relationship. He may be too scared of telling you his true feelings for fear of losing you and you may be too scared of losing a man that puts up with your livelihood.

GG

P.S. I am glad you enjoyed Samy too. The hallmark of a great lady is not just my first impression, it's how difficult it is to part and how often I think of her long after our encounter.:)
 
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Just-ass-weet

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Zaphyr,

I do believe that you can have a lasting and enduring love with someone you have an open relationship with, I was just saying that I couldn't. I certainly would never attack you or anyone else about their lifestyle choices. :) Thank goodness not everyone is the same... otherwise, life would be darned boring!!

xoxox
Anik
 

General Gonad

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Zaphyr said:
I have some questions for you. You don't need to tell me the answers. Just think about them. Please.

How do you feel about lies? How would you react if your wife was lying to you?

How do you feel about happy couples?

What is the most important thing for you in life?

Are you happy?

Good reflection,

Zaphyr xxx

Zaphyr,

Wow! I was hoping to get you to open up with me on a one on one basis but now you spilled the beans on Merb!:D

First, I do respect you, it's just that I respectfully disagree with you. I see a couple that is in love but for some reason unwilling to be exclusive to each other. Of course sex and love are two different things. The former is mechanistic and devoid of emotions while the latter is based on a deep emotional bond.

Zaphyr, you admitted that you were afraid to lose your husband. You were only 18 years old and probably madly in love. You say you went through an existential crisis but then saw the light and embraced cultures that think it's normal to have multiple partners.

I am not quite sure that you really believe this but I will give you the benefit of the doubt. I think I need to meet you so I can look in your eyes and ask you some tough questions. You're rationalizing a lot, taking a Cartesian approach to your love life. Don't be a slave to rationality, let your emotions flow and have the courage to give yourself up entirely - physically and emotionally - to one person. If he doesn't accept this, then move on.

Anyways, back to your questions:

How do you feel about lies?
>> If they are based on evil intentions, I do not like them.

How would you react if your wife was lying to you?
>>It depends on the surprise I get when I open up my credit card bill.:D Seriously, I wouldn't be happy if she had an affair or met a male SP.

How do you feel about happy couples?
>>Truly happy couples are rare. I see many facades out there.

What is the most important thing for you in life?
>>My health and the ones I love.

Are you happy?
>>No I am not happy because I am dealing with some extremely tough issues right now but I am strong and I know that I will persevere.

Remember Nietzsche's statement:" what doesn't kill you makes you stronger."

GG
 
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