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Thread: How can Canada stay ahead of China and India ?

  1. #1

    How can Canada stay ahead of China and India ?

    Hello my Canadians,

    With China and India rising so fast so soon, how can Canada stay ahead and remain a world power ?

    I worry we will be left behind as a third rate power if we don't wake up and catch up soon enough.

  2. #2
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    All big companies, and even small ones are now looking to minimize fabrication costs and maximize profits. So, manufacturing is sent to these countries, with no regards to workers here.

    I was reading in the paper the other day a well-known company making ladies underwear have all his production transferred to Hondura and asian countries. His production costs went down from paying peoples $12/hr to paying them as little as a few dollars per day. He kindly admit transport costs are representing less than 3% of his production costs! This make the manufacturing cost of your "run of the mill" panties drop by a HUGE amount! Did the sale price of the panties went down at retailers? No way! All went in profits.

    As long as us, as consumers, will only look at immediate price tag, without thinking about the long term, and as long as manufacturers will only think in terms of immediate profits, these countries will slowly gain on us. After a while, probably a long while, the cost will become equivalent because costs in these countries will also go up along with these countries starting to look like here.

    Bombardier is, in Quebec, the biggest example of companies looking only for profits and not giving a shit about peoples: they survived because of subventions and tax break and now, they transfer as much as they can to Mexico. They drained us and now that they make money, they ensure as much possible goes back in their pocket instead of within society who kept them alive. Will they ever reimburse these subventions? Never!

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by New York
    I worry we will be left behind as a third rate power if we don't wake up and catch up soon enough.
    LOL as if Canada is a power house. We are what we are because it fits USA's agenda. Honestly how can a country bigger then USA with less population then California call itself a power house. How exactly can we protect our borders? Why do you think we have no army (ok small army), what's the point of having one when there is no conceivable way of protecting our borders?

    I've recently read a great article about the next big war and it talks about China invading Canada. Sounds funny but I tell you the arguments are there.

    China needs land to keep expanding...we have lots of land
    China needs natural resources...pretty much all we have
    China needs to control USA...hey we're neighbors
    China has a serious lack of Girls (by 2012 china population with 60-40 Male/Female)...Montreal by itself will fix that

    He goes on and talks about a bunch of reasons why Canada is a prime target for China and I have to tell you he made a believer out of me.

    20-30 years from now, Canada will be known as Western Republic of China.
    Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something.
    Plato

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by metoo4
    ....

    As long as us, as consumers, will only look at immediate price tag, without thinking about the long term, and as long as manufacturers will only think in terms of immediate profits, these countries will slowly gain on us. After a while, probably a long while, the cost will become equivalent because costs in these countries will also go up along with these countries starting to look like here

    ....
    It's called Capitalism and I for one LOVE it. The employees are there for the company, the company is not there for the employees. You want money you do your job, you don't do your job go home sit down and shutup. Why shouldn't a company want to reduce its costs and generate higher return for the shareholders. It's the reason the company open its doors in the first place. Would you rather the company close its doors cause it can't compete? Of course in our socialist tree hugging weed smoking society, the government would get in and give them money to help them out. Yes and I really enjoy %50 income taxes + %14 Sales taxes + Housing taxes. Yes I love having $0.33 spending power on my dollar

    What Bombardier is doing is absolutely ok and the only way they could ever survive in there vertical. That said I think management is crap and has missed the boat. I will be very impressed if they're able to survive the next 10 years with out refocusing themselves as a niche player. They simply couldn't adapt and are now scrambling to survive.

    Now for all you anti-china, anti-profit tree huggers, relax get your panties untangled and let the global economy mature. It is a matter of time before cost of living increases in those areas and renders $1 a day employee obsolete. Wages will go up and the world will stabilize. What we're seeing is very normal, remember less then 100 years ago the average salary was $2 a day in the states.

    Fed up of working to pay my taxes!!!!
    Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something.
    Plato

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by dirtierasigetolder
    What Bombardier is doing is absolutely ok and the only way they could ever survive in there vertical. That said I think management is crap and has missed the boat. I will be very impressed if they're able to survive the next 10 years with out refocusing themselves as a niche player. They simply couldn't adapt and are now scrambling to survive.
    Bombardier has benefitted from corporate welfare for years given the family's political connections. They've got one hell of an uphill struggle to survive. They need to get rid of paternalism and introduce true meritocracy in there.

    GG

  6. #6
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    Problem is, this type of capitalism is a one way street that mostly allow rich peoples to get richer and poor peoples to get poorer. How can you explain that the majority of the money belongs to a minuscule minority? Unless you're totally poor, the more money you make, the more tax break you can get. The middle to low upper class pays most of the income taxes.
    -How many millionaires, just in Canada, haven't paid any income taxes in years?
    -How many companies haven't paid taxes in years?
    -How many companies are doing massive layoff and at same time, give upper management huge bonus on top of insanely high salaries?

    All these can invest in tax shelters, lawyers, accountants, all allowing them to find any hole in order not to pay taxes. What about these "féducies" (trust?) that were just blocked? They were legal buy in no way fair to society. Problem with capitalism the US way is me, myself and I, who cares about anybody else or anything else. This is the same with pollution laws. Why be strict, it would slow down rich peoples from getting richer faster.

    As long as the mentality is "this is the way it is and it can't be changed", nothing will change and middle class will vanish, as it's already the case in some neighbourhood in the USA. There's some rich peoples and some poor like crasy, nothing in the middle.

    I'm no tree hugger, only realistic.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtierasigetolder
    I've recently read a great article about the next big war and it talks about China invading Canada. Sounds funny but I tell you the arguments are there.

    China needs land to keep expanding...we have lots of land
    China needs natural resources...pretty much all we have
    China needs to control USA...hey we're neighbors
    China has a serious lack of Girls (by 2012 china population with 60-40 Male/Female)...Montreal by itself will fix that

    He goes on and talks about a bunch of reasons why Canada is a prime target for China and I have to tell you he made a believer out of me.

    20-30 years from now, Canada will be known as Western Republic of China.
    It's already happening and it's called our refugee and immigration system. The Chinese own almost all of Vancouver to the point where Chinese is being pushed to become a must have language in order just to find a job. In BC they are now the majority and they are fast colonizing Toronto as well. As matter of fact there are now at least 6 Chinatowns within the Greater Toronto area with some larger than the entire city of Ville St Laurent. They colonize entire areas, rent only to their own people so that more of their own move into these areas, hire only their own so that their people have the best and sometimes the only chance of getting jobs. Open your eyes as it's already happening.

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtierasigetolder
    It's called Capitalism and I for one LOVE it. The employees are there for the company, the company is not there for the employees. You want money you do your job, you don't do your job go home sit down and shutup. Why shouldn't a company want to reduce its costs and generate higher return for the shareholders. It's the reason the company open its doors in the first place. Would you rather the company close its doors cause it can't compete? Of course in our socialist tree hugging weed smoking society, the government would get in and give them money to help them out. Yes and I really enjoy %50 income taxes + %14 Sales taxes + Housing taxes. Yes I love having $0.33 spending power on my dollar.

    Fed up of working to pay my taxes!!!!
    Well said brother. Well said. Our shipping industry in Montreal East end is a great example. It use to be a thriving industry until greedy leftist unions kept wanting more and more insane salaries to the point that most of the companies got fed up and put the ship under foreign flags. Why? Long strikes hurting the companies financially, employees wanting insane salaries even though most were lucky to have a job paying more than most jobs offered to people with their education level and high income taxes designed to punished those who became richer through smart investments and hard work, while these taxes were used to feed a growing number of carrier welfare who's too lazy to put in their fair share of the work load of society.

    Now GG makes a good point about corporate welfare. If you can't compete in the economic market than you don't deserve to survive. If anything, corporate welfare goes against the true spirit of capitalism where everyone is suppose to have an even playing field.

    For me the following are solutions that I have in mind:
    1- No more corporate welfare.
    2- No more loop holes for the rich and big business.
    3- An even tax system so everyone pay their fair share of the nations bills. For example every one would pay 15% of their total salaries. So if you make $10,000/yr you would pay $1,500/yr in taxes. On the other hand if you make $1,000,000/yr you would pay $150,000/yr in taxes.
    4- Not counting the physically and mentally disabled, you must work a minimum amount of hours or years before you can collect your first welfare check.
    5- You can't collect welfare for more than 2yrs in a row and not more than 8yrs in your life time.
    6- Worker unions would have limitations on what they can do.
    7- More government contracting to privet companies. For example, public transportation would be the property of the government, but contracted out to the private industry resulting in reasonable wages instead of $23/hr for a cleaner that's worth only $10/hr maximum.

    It's time the nation was fairer towards all members of its society and not the welfare class or the super rich class while Middle class Harry forks up most of the nations bills.
    All hail Emperor BDC aka Napoliano Peter Greatzetski Czaro.

  8. #8
    What are you talking about?

    Just take a stroll down any major town Canada, you will see plenty of chinese and indian immigrants fleeing their shithole countries (pardon my french)..

    The day when there will be canucks living in Beijing and Mombay, is the day that your statement becomes accurate.

  9. #9

    Beat them at their own game!

    Work for $0.43 cents if they can do it for $0.50 cents an hour!

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Daddy Cool
    It's already happening and it's called our refugee and immigration system. The Chinese own almost all of Vancouver to the point where Chinese is being pushed to become a must have language in order just to find a job. In BC they are now the majority and they are fast colonizing Toronto as well. As matter of fact there are now at least 6 Chinatowns within the Greater Toronto area with some larger than the entire city of Ville St Laurent. They colonize entire areas, rent only to their own people so that more of their own move into these areas, hire only their own so that their people have the best and sometimes the only chance of getting jobs. Open your eyes as it's already happening.
    Oh my... so much anger towards the chinese people in Vancouver....

    But I don't see what's wrong with chinese people preferring to hire chinese people opposed to a white guy or a black guy.... I mean.. if you're at chinatown, and 98% of the people going there to eat/shop are chinese... I would hope the person i'm hiring knows how to speak the language of that section/area.... Just like many other places are the same thing... go down Little Italy here... do you think you'll see more chinese people working on that street or more Italians? So please... don't make it sound like chinese people are racist and don't want to give jobs to other people other than chinese people.....

    As for saying that Canada will be overrun by china shortly... thats hard to say.. there's 1.3billion people in china... the odds of some of them leaving china to go to other countires is pretty high... but the only reason it seems like they are "overflowing" into canada or whatever is because again... their population is 1.3billion... so if you really calculate how many chinese people came to canada compared to the % of the population in china... i don't think they are planning to "conquer" canada... i'm sure the United States, UK, and many other countries have a large immigration of Chinese people..... so are you technically saying because there are so many chinese ppl immigrating into canada/other countries that china is planning to take over the world soon......? NICEEE....

    *takes out his China flag and puts it on his car and drives down little italy honking as if china just won the world cup.... * i'm just messing around btw.

    My 2 cent.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by MontrealAsian
    But I don't see what's wrong with chinese people preferring to hire chinese people opposed to a white guy or a black guy.... I mean.. if you're at chinatown, and 98% of the people going there to eat/shop are chinese... I would hope the person i'm hiring knows how to speak the language of that section/area.... Just like many other places are the same thing... go down Little Italy here... do you think you'll see more chinese people working on that street or more Italians? So please... don't make it sound like chinese people are racist and don't want to give jobs to other people other than chinese people..... :
    This is extremely racist and Chinatown is no longer a small corner it's half the city now. If it's wrong to hire only whites than the same rules applies to them as well. As for language, this is Canada so learn the local language. China would never accept the world purring into their nation, carving up entire neighborhoods and changing the face of its nation so it's not ok to do it here. As far as I'm concern there should be no Chinatowns or Little Italys as this is Canada. Is it too much to ask for people to integrate and adapt to our culture instead of pushing their way on us? Every time a group moves into a neighborhood and buy homes, rent only to their people, plaster their language all over the place they are pretty much colonizing the place, not integrating. Only Canada puts up with this at the rate we do. For someone like myself who's a mix heritage, I would never fight for this nation as we no longer have a culture or identity of our own. What's worse is that the left has allowed and encourage this to happen. Unless you are a mix heritage you have no idea to be lost in a sea of multiculturalism where you don't fit into any ethnic group. In many ways I'd rather be an American or an ethnic so I can have more of an identity, because as a Canadian, that's been stolen from me. What's worse is that Native culture just gets more and more over shadowed by all these other cultures which is wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by MontrealAsian
    so are you technically saying because there are so many chinese ppl immigrating into canada/other countries that china is planning to take over the world soon......? NICEEE....
    That's exactly what's happening. Vancouver use to be a Canadian city and so was Toronto at one time. Now it looks more like Hong Kong than Vancouver or Toronto. People who are not taking over integrate into the society they are migrating to, not change it's culture and its face while sticking only to their own. People who integrate don't change the MacLean’s paper into the language of their old country, but gracefully accept the language of their new country. People who integrate have friends outside their group and not stay only with their own. It's so bad now that Chinese is on pace to surpass French as the second most spoken language in Canada by 2015. That's wrong. If you come to a new nation you either come as new members of that society or invaders. New members adapt the norms of that country; invaders change the new country to look like their old one. But I don't blame the Chinese, but I blame Canadians for tolerating it and the racists here who'd rather push new comers into an ethnic ghetto rather than help them learn the ways of their new home.
    All hail Emperor BDC aka Napoliano Peter Greatzetski Czaro.

  12. #12
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    World without boundries

    Lets face it.........our world is becoming one big country with no boundries.
    You would be surprised what we can learn from each other. Every race has it's good and it's bad. We always tend to remember the bad rather then the good. If I use the automobile as an example.........the japenese have reliability, the Germans have technology and the Italians have design. Yet these countries had their bad share of publicity.......Pearl Harbour, Hitler and Moussolini. Should we condem an entire race for the actions of a few?

    P.S. "Do as you wish as long as it does not affect others!!!"

  13. #13

    Big Daddy Cool

    Wow... there's so much anger in you bro.

    First of all, Canada is such a great country because it is so mixed and diverse. From my point of view, i've always thought Canada as probably being one of the least racist countries in the world as they are so diversed and have so many different races. You are saying the Chinese and the other ethnic groups are coming in to "invade" Canada... but what the hell? What are you? A native indian where your great grand father owned the land before it was conquered by the Europeans? Jeeze... seriously...

    Also, what is wrong about having small communities of your own ethnic group? I see nothing wrong in that whatsoever. It allows those people that first arrive to Canada to at least be able to go to a place/section where they can communicate with their own people since chances are they might not know English yet. What's wrong with them being able to have a small community where they can go there and eat the food they are used to, talk the language they are used to? You expect to throw an immigrant into a country and just say, "hey, now you live, learn, eat, talk, like us!! or else....!"

    I don't know what % of "Real Canadians" are actual "real Canadians"... but i'm quite certain a large % of the current population in Canada is due to people having immigrated to Canada. Whether themselves, or their parents, or their grand parents etc etc etc.... Can you be mad at them because when they first got here they probably didn't speak english as well. But over time they learned english and lucky for their children/grand children etc etc they now know how to speak english and have become "white-washed" and all of a sudden think they own Canada and makes them more "Canadian" than me? Just because they have whiter skin than others and they speak English fluently doesn't make you a "real canadian". What's up with that?

    And saying Chinese people not hiring other races to work in chinese restaurants is racist..... is totally whack. In a chinese restaurant, most clients are chinese... hence the speaking chinese pretty much is a necessity... if the chinese restaurants are to refuse someone from eating at their resto because of their ethnic race.... that's racism... hiring a chinese person to work in a chinese restaurant is not racist, but he meets the "qualifications", one of them which is to speak chinese. In chinese restaurants also, there's LOTSSSS of Indian ppl i know that work in there as dishwashers as well. Are you going to say the chinese and Indian ppl have a conspiracy going on? People are hired based on their qualifications, not based on their colour. To work in the public view chinatown, you are expected to speak chinese. Just like to work as a doctor, you have to meet the qualifications and need to have a degree, etc.

    The world as a whole is becoming more mixed everyday. People are moving around everywhere to live but I don't think anyone's planning for their race to "invade" another country... you just see more chinese and indian ppl here because they have a HUGE population so if even only .001% of their population decides to move to a certain country... that's a HUGEEE number... but if a bigger % like .1% of Canada decided to move into China... you wouldn't even notice it because of their smaller population.... So you're pretty much just mad because there are more Chinese/Indian in the world than there are of Canadians... jeeze.

    Stop being mad and just get along.
    Last edited by MontrealAsian; 02-13-2007 at 04:27 PM.

  14. #14
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    MontrealAsian:
    I don't think you understand my posts at all. If the situations were reverse you would be ticked of about it, but because it's Canada it's ok. It's not. People should integrate, not change their new society and sorry but those who you talk about are raciest to the core. It has nothing to do with white skin so please get off it and get that out of your head. When home owners only advertise their homes for rent only in their ethnic paper, the racist attitudes that lead to that is obvious.

    Now to change this around a bit, this is about cultural survival and the further marginalization of Native peoples through multiculturalism. This is a cultural thing, not a race thing so your arguments don't hold since you are not even admitting the racisms coming from the many ethnic communities. For example, my good friend In Toronto was born in Hong Kong, but came to Canada when he was 2yrs old and he seen himself as Canadian, not Chinese since he was raised here and most of his friends were Canadian or from different ethnic groups. He mostly spoke English even with a couple other Chinese people who like him were raised in Canada and he and people like him were treated like shit by those within his community who seen him as a traitor. He told me many times how he was told that he should not be dating white girls (blondes were his favorite) and only his own kind by members his community. Of course he told to piss off. It's was wrong for him to be treated like this simply because he chose to integrate into Canadian society, rather than see himself as separate from it. In addition, he's more Canadian than many white people who wave every other flag, but Canada's.
    All hail Emperor BDC aka Napoliano Peter Greatzetski Czaro.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Daddy Cool
    Unless you are a mix heritage you have no idea to be lost in a sea of multiculturalism where you don't fit into any ethnic group. In many ways I'd rather be an American or an ethnic so I can have more of an identity.
    There's the problem right there. And no offense, but the problem isn't Canada, the problem is YOU. You feel alienated because you don't fit in any ethnic group so you blame your failure to integrate on Canada and multiculturalism. Ironically, this is the same failure that you accuse ethnic groups of... There is such a thing as a Canadian identity and culture, so ethnic groups aside, why haven't YOU integrated? And please don't tell me that it's because "pure white" Canadians are racists... Now because of said failure, you'd like the culture and history of ethnic groups to magically disappear into some form of uniform, nondescript, lowest common denominator "Canadian culture" where all individuals will have forgetten their history and share identical values, principles and "culture". However, considering you can't integrate now, what makes you think you'd be able to integrate into that bland utopian culture?

    Eliminating diversity would lead to the most boring "culture" you can think of, and thankfully, it's a pipedream that will never happen. It's perfectly normal human behavior for different ethnic groups to stick together and share common values and culture outside of their "Canadianness". Diversity, different cultures and ideas is what makes a country interesting to live in, and often fuels innovation and progress. And this is certainly not specific to Canada. Whether it's New York, or San Francisco, or pretty much every big city on the planet, you'll find your Chinatown, or your little Italy, etc...

    This might sound harsh but I think you need to stop blaming your problems on Canada and multiculturalism, take a good look at yourself, and try to figure what YOU can do to fit in. I'm quite convinced that you are not the only person of mixed heritage living in Canada, and as far as I can remember, I have never seen any articles or studies pointing the finger at Canada and/or multiculturalism for failing to integrate such people.

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