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Thread: Open discussion: Questions on unreviewed SPs

  1. #1

    Open discussion: Questions on unreviewed SPs

    We have been implementing the rule of no questions on unreviewed providers. Statistically, we get about 3 questions per day about a provider on any website, craigslist, annonces123, kijiji (not anymore), and some new websites.
    We were quick to remove them and send a standard PM about rule 2. vi which states:

    2) Posting


    vi) Refrain from asking questions, on New, Un-reviewed and Non-advertising Agencies, SPs, or MPs, as well as posting website links, addresses, telephone numbers, or any contact information on the aforementioned. Do your homework ("Search Function" above). This is a review board, and reviews should come first. We do not welcome shilling attempts.


    Members have answered back with a confused reply as to why such questions cannot be asked. So I am letting members debate on this so that we can have a closure.

    Here are the arguments for removing those posts:
    1. MERB is not a reference site. At this rate, MERB will contain all the URLs and copies of newspaper ads out there. Craigslist is the most reference site lately and it is growing. Our opinion is that most ads are fakes, but any new irregular ads are mentioned in Escort 411.

    2. Reviews come first.

    3. We cannot differentiate shilling and questions. Questions can be innocently asked but then bumped up because the member wasn’t satisfied with the no answer thread. Is that bumping/shilling or desperation for answers?

    4. Unfairness to advertisers. Some SPs choose to advertise for free on other sites. And yet MERB can only exist because of SPs advertising here. Many SPs who have started on craigslist and annonces123, have finally come and advertise here on MERB (Ally, Amelie, Athana, Cathy123456789 to name a few). MERB has the leverage of making or breaking a new business (SP). Members want to find the gem and pour in money and yet that SP on craigslist, for example, has returned nothing to the community.

    5. Member not willing to take financial risk. Lately, "taking one for the team" has not been mentioned anymore. We prefer the safe agencies or ask the question hoping another member has lost his bet.

    6. The amount of posts. We are already having a hard time monitoring all posts, and shilling requires a lot of follow-up.

    Do understand that craigslist and annonces123 will always have ads that you wish were detailed in a review. If it is not reviewed, simply accept that fact.
    Last edited by Mod 6; 12-11-2007 at 07:18 PM.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by unclebobby16
    hi guys
    would anyone have any info on this girl. can`t find anything on her, since she doesn`t mention her name. i called and she quoted $ 200. per hour. she receives in a motel somewhere on the south shore. i`d like to know whether the pics are real and any details if possible.
    thanks bob

    related:http://www.annonces123.com/ann-thats...789&cat_id=133 -
    To mod 6:
    You see mod6, That was my point about inquiring on some adds we see in the papers and on the net.

    Now what is wrong with that. Just because someone asked if someone knew something about her we have a freakin review.

    good thing you didn`t delete the thread before someone offered a review.

    So to me this rule should be altered
    vi) Refrain from asking questions, on New, Un-reviewed and Non-advertising Agencies, SPs, or MPs, as well as posting website links, addresses, telephone numbers, or any contact information on the aforementioned. Do your homework ("Search Function" above). This is a review board, and reviews should come first. We do not welcome shilling attempts.
    Why should we take one for the team if someone already took one but didn`t mentione it. But then decides to after someone inquires about it.

    You guys are good at finding shills posts but shouldn`t the long time posters have the right to inquire without being accused of being shills. Because that was implied when you sent me the rule. That I was a shill because I posted adds from craiglist and annonces2123.

    This post just saved me a trip to see a girl that seems to be more concentrate at emptying your pockets instead of your balls.

    thank you Lesser Informer for the review but did you go see that girl because of the post in this thread or you found the add yourself and took one for the team.

    Split from ouverte d`esprit annonces123 thread.
    Last edited by Mod 6; 12-11-2007 at 07:19 PM.
    Escorts are like a box of chocolate, you never know what you gonna get! Especially with a repeat!!!!

  3. #3
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    AOHer, thx for the kind word. I actually found her before anybody posted on the internet. I initiated contact and spoke to her at lenght on MSN.

    I do agree with you. I don't see how not asking a question can generate more information, which is the basis of the forum... more info! It was my lazziness that stopped me from taking 2 minutes to post my review. But since no one had said anything on her (surprising since many look at annonce123 ads), I figured... no one was interested why post. If a user or for that manner many users ask questions about an SP... it should generate more posts.

    My humble opinion.

    LI

  4. #4

    Its good to discuss this

    Quote Originally Posted by Mod 6
    Here are the arguments for removing those posts:
    1. MERB is not a reference site. At this rate, MERB will contain all the URLs and copies of newspaper ads out there. Craigslist is the most reference site lately and it is growing. Our opinion is that most ads are fakes, but any new irregular ads are mentioned in Escort 411.

    2. Reviews come first.

    3. We cannot differentiate shilling and questions. Questions can be innocently asked but then bumped up because the member wasn’t satisfied with the no answer thread. Is that bumping/shilling or desperation for answers?
    I agree reviews are the salt of this board and this is what drives MERB. But this board should not limit itself either. Finding out about a new SP-MP-etc through a question is not unheard (as well examplified by the frist posts in this thread) of and I don't think this should be prevented. It is hard to make the difference between a shill and a question when asked once, but if it is only asked once, maybe repeated a second time, is that all so terrible? I think you could limit the number of times a question can be repeated if there is no answer (allow once?).

    4. Unfairness to advertisers. Some SPs choose to advertise for free on other sites. And yet MERB can only exist because of SPs advertising here. Many SPs who have started on craigslist and annonces123, have finally come and advertise here on MERB (Ally, Amelie, Athana, Cathy123456789 to name a few). MERB has the leverage of making or breaking a new business (SP). Members want to find the gem and pour in money and yet that SP on craigslist, for example, has returned nothing to the community.
    Is it possible that some SPs advertising here came here after they got noticed on MERB through a question and then a review, etc. So which is the chicken and the egg? Would we not be short changed by dis-allowing questions then?

    As you say, if MERB is able to make or break a business, restricting questions seems akin to media conglomerates: we will only talk about enterprises in our own family of business (Quebecor...). This is a dangerous tendancy in our media. And to be fair, we are exposed way more to adverts by our paying members than to questions.

    5. Member not willing to take financial risk. Lately, "taking one for the team" has not been mentioned anymore. We prefer the safe agencies or ask the question hoping another member has lost his bet.
    I also get a feeling there is not a lot of "new blood" around recently. Maybe it is because I know more about the scene than 2 years ago when I first started reading MERB. But again, if we restrict questions, won't this re-enforce the feeling of always reading about the same agencies and SPs here (that I get sometimes)?

    You Mods have a great deal of work, I applaud you for your commitment and perseverance in finding out shills. But I don't think we should restrict to only "tested and true" (or paying and true SPs)... When I read this:

    vi) Refrain from asking questions, on New, Un-reviewed and Non-advertising Agencies, SPs,
    it really sounds wrong (and worrisome) to me...

    Respectfully
    Hormone

  5. #5
    I think the forum needs to be open to questions. I don't feel the need for protection from links to unreviewed providers. Perhaps if no one can provide an answer to the question within several days, the posts should be deleted. It really seems like the forum is being bogged down with needless rules that have not improved the quality or usefulness of the board. I always thought the internet was a place where information should be freely shared, and links freely given.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoingittoDeath
    Very good point - tedious and uninteresting and does not provide any value to the common good. Not to mention, we often find these posted in the Escort Review area as opposed to 411, where it should be but will attract fewer eyeballs.
    My main aargument is not about newbies posting but serious and long time posters that are not shills. I mean we all know who are the bullshitters on this site and who are the serious one.

    So ask me why wouldn't you want to find out about a sp that you liked in an add right here on merb. What is so wrong in asking a member to remember an encounter that he did not review? Why take one for the team if someone can give you the 411.
    Escorts are like a box of chocolate, you never know what you gonna get! Especially with a repeat!!!!

  7. #7
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    dont know about him yet ! could be a shill could be serious, hell he can even be you !

    One thing for sure he didn't prove himself on merb yet with his small contribution. Doesn't mean he's a shill.

    Maxima, would you trust a new employee with the keys of your business on his first day at work? No for me, but I will give him a chance to show me how he works and eventually if I feel that I can trust him I would give him the keys of my business, let him make orders, etc. But I'll always monitor him and keep track of my business day to day activities.

    So le him evolve on merb and be someone we can trust in the futur. Then we will see how it goes and even then, you know there's no guarantee.........

    Don't forget it's just a hobby and I like to get more information on my hobby.

    Just trying to find a way to make it easier on us the hobbiests.

    that might be my new signature:
    Why empty pockets when you can empty balls
    Escorts are like a box of chocolate, you never know what you gonna get! Especially with a repeat!!!!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoingittoDeath
    Because it's stupid? I mean, let's face it, there is a ton of information here about reliable agencies and wonderful women so who cares about a classified ad? To save $20? Honestly, maybe the best answer is to create a sub-section to 411 or something along those lines. So long as we don't have to read about them in the Escort Review section most of us won't care.
    You asking me if it's stupid? Not for me. If you like to waste your time and encounter a bad experience when you could have been informed about it. Make sure you let us know about it.

    So there's no room for new talent? We have all we need on merb?
    To bring another subject, FredZ (merb owner) doesn't need new advertizers? He has all what he needs here with this group ? I thought that agencies close, Independants retire. thus loosing $$$$$$. He doesn't want new clients ?
    Last edited by AllOverHer; 12-14-2007 at 02:46 PM.
    Escorts are like a box of chocolate, you never know what you gonna get! Especially with a repeat!!!!

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by AllOverHer
    To bring another subject, FredZ (merb owner) doesn't need new advertizers. He has all what he needs here with this group. I thought that agencies close, Independants retire. thus loosing $$$$$$. He doesn't want new clients ?
    Wait a sec AllOverHer, what makes you say that. Fred always has to upgrade servers due to new membership and adding bandwith heavy usage of MERB.

    On the censorship issue, we censor questions not, reviews. There is a good number of reviews from Craigslist/annonces123 sites, and we have not censor nor blocked the link.

    Mods have to deal with the amount of questions that come everyday. If one question pops up for every ads on Craigslist, we would just be a site having links to CL. Then why not copy the ad over, why link to free ads on CL? Again, we can all read CL and cross-reference here and see that there are not reviews. The maybe someone met her, well maybe most members did not review as they should.

    On another note, we ask members to be respectful. I'll do some clean up later.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mod 6
    Wait a sec AllOverHer, what makes you say that. Fred always has to upgrade servers due to new membership and adding bandwith heavy usage of MERB.
    Missing a question mark on the end of my sentence. I was answering the thread before mine.

    On the censorship issue, we censor questions not, reviews. There is a good number of reviews from Craigslist/annonces123 sites, and we have not censor nor blocked the link.
    that's not what I'm debating.

    Mods have to deal with the amount of questions that come everyday. If one question pops up for every ads on Craigslist, we would just be a site having links to CL. Then why not copy the ad over, why link to free ads on CL? Again, we can all read CL and cross-reference here and see that there are not reviews. The maybe someone met her, well maybe most members did not review as they should.
    If you read what I'm trying to express. I understand very well your situation. Just saying why serious reviewers and long time posters can't ask 411 on unrevewd questions.

    On another note, we ask members to be respectful. I'll do some clean up later.


    But hey, nice to finally have a conversation with you mod6.

    I'll add the ? at the end of my sentences.
    Escorts are like a box of chocolate, you never know what you gonna get! Especially with a repeat!!!!

  11. #11
    AllOverHer,
    The censorship was a reply to hormone.

    chowhound,
    What is a few days? And that would require a contribution form 3M for post-it notes. That's a lot of Moderation work.

    members,
    We will not discriminate senior and junior members. We have discussed that in the past and it has been a failure (the debate was over the permission of new members to start new threads). It intimidated new members and discouraged them to post sometimes very good reviews.
    For arguments sake, since you are now a senior member, you can post all the new ads you see on Craigslist and Mods would censor questions from new members?

    I need to read arguments as to how this is beneficial to members by asking a question. Remember, we are not censoring reviews.

    If it hurts your wallet, that's because you have not read the review or try the search feature. What if she is unreviewed? Choose the risk or play with a reviewed SP.

    Mod 6

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Mod 6
    AllOverHer,
    The censorship was a reply to hormone.

    chowhound,
    What is a few days? And that would require a contribution form 3M for post-it notes. That's a lot of Moderation work.

    members,
    We will not discriminate senior and junior members. We have discussed that in the past and it has been a failure (the debate was over the permission of new members to start new threads). It intimidated new members and discouraged them to post sometimes very good reviews.
    For arguments sake, since you are now a senior member, you can post all the new ads you see on Craigslist and Mods would censor questions from new members?

    I need to read arguments as to how this is beneficial to members by asking a question. Remember, we are not censoring reviews.

    If it hurts your wallet, that's because you have not read the review or try the search feature. What if she is unreviewed? Choose the risk or play with a reviewed SP.

    Mod 6

    I see your points. Thanks for the clarification on the censorship of questions vs reviews. But I still feel unconfortable with the principle. For example, if no one has posted a review on "jezbel" the new girl from paying advertiser X, it is OK to ask a question--and this may generate a review. But one can't generate questions on non paying agency Y...
    I totally understand the advertising effect and priviliges associated with such advertisements... Actually I could not care less about CL's... I don't look at it, I usually don't look at the questions on unknown SPs from outside of my usual agencies. But it is simply what seems to be a side-effect of a democratic principle (freedom of exchange of info--and sometimes the info can come from a question). Otherwise, I find it oligarchic... And a bit of the hygrade principle (actually called publication bias): only go with reviewed SPs because only reviewed SPs get reviews posted... (in general...).
    I have no idea of the true task it represents for the mods. But also I am not sure of the real shill danger iit represents. It seems to me to be mostly unwanted bandwith usage... I must say if the majority of members are siding with the mods, I will respect the majority opinion.

    I would like some other members to voice opinions, as very few of us have spoken out here...

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