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Thread: Craig's list under fire

  1. #1

    Craig's list under fire

    Craigslist founder rendered speechless by CNN's sex trafficking questions

    http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/yahoocana...king_questions

    Mmm... I'm gonna stick to Merb

  2. #2
    They were under fire a couple of years ago when the SP was killed in Boston. They changed the erotic section to the adult section to fool the public.

  3. #3
    Okay, I viewed the CNN report. The reporter appears to lack objectivity, as she comes off as though she thinks something is wrong with prostitution. I find this amusing coming from this particular reporter because just look at her! How does someone her age land a gig with CNN? Would she seriously deny that her above average appearance, toned body, perky breasts, and fake blond hair didn't influence the people who hired her? Come on, she is far from being the most refined, objective reporter I've ever seen with her college girl speech mannerisms and backpack slung across her shoulder. She couldn't have gotten the job because she was the most qualified in this competitive job market, where a lot of talented people are scrambling for a handful of open jobs. She used her body to land the job she has, and she's hoping to prevent other women from also using their bodies to make a living? Seems very hypocritical and self-rightous to me.

  4. #4
    A poor corrupt official
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    I am SHOCKED, SHOCKED to find that prostitutes are using Craigslist to advertise!

    BTW, has anyone tried this girl from CL?
    Strasser: By the way, the murder of the couriers, what has been done?
    Renault: Realizing the importance of the case, my men are rounding up twice the usual number of suspects.
    Heinze: We already know who the murderer is.
    Strasser: Good. Is he in custody?
    Renault: Oh, there's no hurry. Tonight he'll be at Rick's. Everybody comes to Rick's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cronkite View Post
    They were under fire a couple of years ago when the SP was killed in Boston. They changed the erotic section to the adult section to fool the public.
    This is for the US only, but I think they changed the Erotic Services name to Adult Services after several prosecutors from various US cities threatened to sue Craigslist in Federal court for aiding prostitution. The case was dismissed but the owner of Craigslist agreed to rename the Erotic Services section and require posters to pay $5 per ad. They have to pay by credit card and agree to a statement that they are not promoting illegal services, etc. This was before the Craigslist murder.

    The reason why Craigslist started an Erotic Services section in the first place was that they would post in every section for Escort Services. He wanted to keep it all in one place. He was interviewed on 60 Minutes and he explained to the Interviewer that he does not condone or promote the advertisements posted, but his website's concept is that it is self-service. He has a small staff and he could not justify policing using his staff.

    But because of the charge, there are some who advertise in the Personal section and in the Casual relationship section. It is free there, but they do get flagged quickly.

    In Montreal and other locations outside of the US, they still have the Erotic Services Section.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by JH Fan View Post
    Craigslist founder rendered speechless by CNN's sex trafficking questions

    http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/yahoocana...king_questions

    Mmm... I'm gonna stick to Merb
    Yup, and just wait until her next expose' (pun not intended) on this board's content and income. No this board does not condone or sponsor human trafficing!!! But, it seems this JSP (Journalist Service Provider) wants to widen the definition of "human trafficing"

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeolus View Post
    Okay, I viewed the CNN report. The reporter appears to lack objectivity, as she comes off as though she thinks something is wrong with prostitution. I find this amusing coming from this particular reporter because just look at her! How does someone her age land a gig with CNN? Would she seriously deny that her above average appearance, toned body, perky breasts, and fake blond hair didn't influence the people who hired her? Come on, she is far from being the most refined, objective reporter I've ever seen with her college girl speech mannerisms and backpack slung across her shoulder. She couldn't have gotten the job because she was the most qualified in this competitive job market, where a lot of talented people are scrambling for a handful of open jobs. She used her body to land the job she has, and she's hoping to prevent other women from also using their bodies to make a living? Seems very hypocritical and self-rightous to me.
    Aeolus,

    The founder of Craig's List can't even find an idea to defend himself for the sex trafficking on his website, which he pledged to keep out and is illegal in the U.S., and you want to blame the reporter for her looks and mannerisms. ISH!!! Is that really more to the point than the gross exploitation of women and girls? You may have some sort of rosy vision of prostitution, but don't forget many of the "women" are not fully self-responsible adults making a free willing career choice here.

    Craig reminds me of those tobacco barons. "I know nothing...NOTHING" (sergeant Schultz).

    Quote Originally Posted by CS Martin View Post
    Yup, and just wait until her next expose' (pun not intended) on this board's content and income. No this board does not condone or sponsor human trafficing!!! But, it seems this JSP (Journalist Service Provider) wants to widen the definition of "human trafficing"
    Yes, we all participate here, but that doesn't mean we should totally lose all scruples just to avoid the hypocrisy.

    C'mon,

    Merlot
    Last edited by Merlot; 08-05-2010 at 12:29 AM.

  8. #8
    You may have some sort of rosy vision of prostitution, but don't forget many of the "women" are not fully self-responsible adults making a free willing career choice here.
    Merlot, no, actually I don't have a rosy vision of prostitution, but I do accept its reality in so far as it pertains to untrafficked, unpimped adult providers. I don't like it when people try to impose their biblical versions of morality on the rest of us. If no one is getting hurt, everyone is an adult, and the actions are consensual, then people should be able to buy, sell, and use whatever they please. Your body, your money, your choice.

    Of all the sex ads, what percentage of them do you honestly think are posted by independent providers versus pimps who hawk exploited women and girls? I personally don't know the answer because I've never used Craig's list for this purpose, but I'd guess that most are probably independent adult providers ... or vice officers looking for a collar. Yet the journalist sensationalizes things by playing-up the "helpless underage victims" card in order to outrage viewers. Where was the interview with an independent provider who would probably represent the majority of advertisers? Reports are supposed to be balanced. Hers was not.

    Craig provides a service. I'm not going to fault the man for what others do with his product, any more than I would fault a gun manufacturer for producing a rifle that was ultimately used in a homicide. Perhaps Craig didn't have an answer for not purging underage ads because many, if not most of them, are posted by police departments in an attempt to ensnare scumbag pedophiles.

  9. #9
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    I have to agree with Aeolus on this one. The majority of the ads on CL, if not 99.999 percent, do not involve Human trafficking. Human trafficking has to be very rare in the US or Canada. It involves keeping several women enslaved without the ability of escaping or calling for help. The only setup that could keep a woman from calling for help would be a brothel where the women would be kept captured 24/7 with people there at all times to ensure they would not leave. And these women would probably not know the local language either. These women could not be Escorts doing outcall. They could not be a single woman at an Incall apartment or hotel. And at a brothel type of establishment, it would take only one woman to call police to break up the entire operation.

    I have read about women from China or Korea being held tricked into SP work in a MP. I am sure there is a percentage of underaged run aways who fall victim to pimps and are enslaved by fear. It happens, but not in the percentages that some of the women rights groups will have you believe.
    Last edited by daydreamer41; 08-05-2010 at 02:26 AM.

  10. #10
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    Hello all,

    Quote Originally Posted by Aeolus View Post
    Merlot, no, actually I don't have a rosy vision of prostitution, but I do accept its reality in so far as it pertains to untrafficked, unpimped adult providers. I don't like it when people try to impose their biblical versions of morality on the rest of us. If no one is getting hurt, everyone is an adult, and the actions are consensual, then people should be able to buy, sell, and use whatever they please. Your body, your money, your choice.

    Of all the sex ads, what percentage of them do you honestly think are posted by independent providers versus pimps who hawk exploited women and girls? I personally don't know the answer because I've never used Craig's list for this purpose, but I'd guess that most are probably independent adult providers ... or vice officers looking for a collar. Yet the journalist sensationalizes things by playing-up the "helpless underage victims" card in order to outrage viewers. Where was the interview with an independent provider who would probably represent the majority of advertisers? Reports are supposed to be balanced. Hers was not.

    Craig provides a service. I'm not going to fault the man for what others do with his product, any more than I would fault a gun manufacturer for producing a rifle that was ultimately used in a homicide. Perhaps Craig didn't have an answer for not purging underage ads because many, if not most of them, are posted by police departments in an attempt to ensnare scumbag pedophiles.
    I've used Craig's List to sell a car and other items, and I've also used it to find items. So I know it's value and I never disputed that. I have never done business with any prostitute or escort through this website, though I have taken a long look to see what it's like there. We all know there is far far more to Craig's List than the erotic or adult element. But calling attention to the escorting, prostitution, or human trafficking element is hard sensationalizing it more than that element is inherently sensationalistic. It's there and everybody knows that, so there are no surprises for anyone. But bringing focus on the sex trade in Craig's List might get something positive done, and no matter how that is handled it will be inherently sensational and no reporter no matter how professional can avoid it being so.

    In all honesty, whatever your view of the character of prostitution is, I find it extremely questionable that Craig would allow any link to the sex trade to be part of his website no matter how anyone uses it. Why is it necessary at all except as some very seedy publicity tactic to draw in more business. The very presence of the sex trade on the website is a sensationalistic magnet and in my opinion that's why Craig allows it.

    As for your analogy, a machine gun or rifle obviously is not a human being and therefor this rationalization has no relevance. But it really doesn't matter what percentage of the sex trade ads are seedy or police traps. The fact is Craig allows this element to exist on his site. Does Ebay allow this? Not to my knowledge. So if the sex trade element can be blocked why isn't it? Any sensationalism lies within the nature of Craig's choices and the looks, mannerisms, or level of professionalism of a reporter had nothing to do with those choices.

    Quote Originally Posted by daydreamer41 View Post
    I have to agree with Aeolus on this one. The majority of the ads on CL, if not 99.999 percent, do not involve Human trafficking. Human trafficking has to be very rare in the US or Canada. It involves keeping several women enslaved without the ability of escaping or calling for help. The only setup that could keep a woman from calling for help would be a brothel where the women would be kept captured 24/7 with people there at all times to ensure they would not leave. And these women would probably not know the local language either. These women could not be Escorts doing outcall. They could not be a single woman at an Incall apartment or hotel. And at a brothel type of establishment, it would take only one woman to call police to break up the entire operation.
    Uh, NO! Instill real fear of retribution into someone who feels alone and/or has emotional and confidence issues, or create a physical or emotional dependency that creates the perception of a lack of options and a 24-hour watch and constrain system as you infer isn't necessary. Control can be imposed on people through various emotional, mental, or dependency issues who feel they have no other choices.

    Reading some of these posts I wonder how many hobbyists have constructed neat "feel better" rationalizations to sooth their consciences by mentally cleaning up their ethical or moral misgivings with being in the hobby to make it feel like they are not assisting the the seedier side in the sex trade. Maybe many here just have no qualms at all about the hobby. But the idea that there are evil all-controlling sex trade boogey men and their slaves we can easily avoid is far more about rationalized convenience than reality.

    Cheers,

    Merlot
    Last edited by Merlot; 08-05-2010 at 05:25 PM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Merlot View Post
    As for your analogy, a machine gun or rifle obviously is not a human being and therefor this rationalization has no relevance.
    yes it does. criagslist.org is not a human being either. "guns don't kill people. people do."..."craigslist.org doesn't cause human trafficking. humans do."

    Quote Originally Posted by Merlot View Post
    The fact is Craig allows this element to exist on his site. Does Ebay allow this? Not to my knowledge. So if the sex trade element can be blocked why isn't it?
    now that is a poor analogy. companies are founded on different principles.

  12. #12
    Nadya of Nadya's VIPs SexyNadya's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Craig Newmart

    Hello guy's !

    Well I just did some research of my own. Craigslist CEO Jim Buckmaster told
    Wallstreet analysts that Craigslist has little interest in maximizing profit which a lie .
    Craigslist annual revenue since 2007 is ranging from $150 million to $250 million
    dollars a year with a grand total of """ 32 employes """
    Just how can 32 employees overlook their daily postings """ Its impossible ""

    Remember four years ago the owners of Kijiji "" e.Bay "" withdrew their erotic section;
    and since 2004 e.Bay is also a share older of Craisglist, they purchased a 25% stake
    in the company .But in typical Newmart style of conducting business both parties
    are in turmoil !!!!
    From Wikipedia :
    In April 2008, eBay announced it was suing Craigslist to "safeguard its four-year financial investment." eBay claimed that in January 2008, Craigslist executives took actions that "unfairly diluted eBay's economic interest by more than 10%." In response, Craigslist filed a countersuit against eBay in May 2008 "to remedy the substantial and ongoing harm to fair competition" that Craigslist claims is constituted by eBay's actions as Craigslist shareholders.

    I like this interview !


  13. #13
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    I actually kind of like Amber Lyon. She's bright, she's cute....and she's correct.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnmbot View Post
    yes it does. criagslist.org is not a human being either. "guns don't kill people. people do."..."craigslist.org doesn't cause human trafficking. humans do."
    Hello JMB,

    Ish...I was referring to the fact that a gun (of any kind) is purely a soulless product...a commodity...a thing: unlike a human being. If you are saying the analogy between between a gun and a human being is relevant based on my reply then you are saying a person is purely a soulless product...a commodity...a thing that can be owned. I know you didn't mean that.... I also hope the standard issue NRA handbook reply was intended as a joke. Funny as usual.

    Craig's List is being used to sell sex. No surprises here. But whether the owner intended it or not it's his responsibility to deal with it regardless of what anyone else does to display the situation.

    Cheers,

    Merlot

  15. #15
    If you are saying the analogy between between a gun and a human being is relevant...
    Not that it matters because I don't come here to obsess over trivialities, but I was not comparing guns to people. I was comparing two products: the Craig's list advertising medium to guns to illustrate that both products can be misused by consumers. The point being that a manufacturer, whether its Craig or Colt, should not be held liable for how its products are misused.

    Personal responsibility, it's a beautiful thing. If only there were more of it...

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