Has the VIP label gotten out of control with some agencies.
It seems that a lot of the agencies are labeling there girls VIP as a way of getting $200 + per hour instead of the $160. to $180. per hour that some of the top agencies charge. The truth is many of these so called VIP girls are average in both looks and service when compared to the competition. Some of the VIPS are even recycled sp's who were fired from other agencies or shifted agencies because they were no longer getting enough calls but the new agency still labels them VIP even though they are clearly not. The absolute best agencies in montreal in my opinion would have no more then a couple of sp's on there roster if that who would be truly worthy of the label VIP. When i think of what a vip girl should be, it should be a lady who stands out over the competition in both looks and service. A couple of examples of what a true VIP is, would be Jessie of xxxtase and Gianna ex eleganza. When you open the door girls like this get your attention when compared to the average sp and girls like this are few and far between in this biz, kind of like looking for a needle in a haystack Yes it seems to me that the term VIP is used these days just to jack up prices and make you think that you are getting something that you are not, for the most part it is just a cash grab.
As you are well aware of, i agree with you 100% on this. There are some ladies currently in the $200 range that i wouldn't even have considered to see for lesser money at their previous agencies. Even if an agency would have offered me a huge discount, it still would have been a flat NO!
And they wind up moving on & the next thing you know, they're rewarded (for their incompetence) with a raise (or bribe?) at their new agencies by having their rates jacked up. Why? To basically fool the unsuspecting hobbyists? To basically tell them that you think they're a bunch of saps?
What irritates me is how much some of those agencies abuse the term GFE & PSE. They also greatly abuse the services an sp might offer. How often have i seen at least half a dozen services listed when in fact the sp might only perform a certain service on maybe 5 out of 10 guys, max. How many times have i heard a hobbyist say that when asked about a service that she was listed to offer, an sp would look very surprise & reply that she had never done this type of service with a client, and wouldn't even consider it unless she receive a considerable 'bonus' to do so?
Why are agencies that are trying their best to appear legit put up with sps that basically 'take the money & run?' What i mean by this term is that we still have sp's hurrying towards the shower after the guy blew his load & this happens often when there is still plenty of time left on the clock. If she doesn't feel like getting pumped anymore, what about some simple TLC & lie in bed with the guy? Why run to the bathroom to get ready for your next call with 20-30 minutes left to go? I thought the days of 'Sweet Montreal' and 'Miss Montreal' were a thing of the past. Apparently, i was wrong. If i'm an agency trying to make a name for myself, i sit down with the sp or sp's i've had this complaint(s) about & tell her that either she stays with the client for the amount of time he paid for, or tell her to go work elsewhere if she won't cooperate. Of course, money talks & it's easy for agencies to ignore such problems if the sp in question is a good $$ maker, but sooner or later, it'll come back & bite them in the ass. As the old saying goes: "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."
Very few ladies today merit the honor to be referred to as a VIP. More often than not, someone getting VIP status is usually the sp who gets the most bookings at an agency. The one who usually gets fully booked as soon as her schedule comes out. Or, it could be someone with a good track record over a certain period of time. Someone with almost no negative reviews during the time that she's been an sp. Someone who's obviously very popular among the hobbyists. Often, she may be someone who doesn't work much, but will only work under VIP rates & is still very popular as an sp. You can't blame an sp for trying to maximize her earnings if she deserves the honor of being referred to as a VIP. Often, she's someone who could make good money working as an independent, getting to chose on her own who she'll see. There are some out there today who could, but not that many.
And finally, i can't understand agencies for jacking up their rates as many have been doing over the past year or two. Aren't they aware that our economy sucks? Aren't they aware that hobbyists have less money to spend today than they did a few years ago? Don't they realize that Americans contribute a lot of $$ to the hobby, but that their economy is even worse than Canada's, and that their dollar is now at par (or lower) than Canada's? That it's not 2004 anymore where the Canadian dollar was worth shit as compared to the US dollar? Don't they realize that their former American 'big spenders' might not even have a job today? What's the incentive for middle-class American hobbyists to come to Mtl if the rates are always climbing?
Personally, i'll usually pay up to $180. I don't mind paying an extra $20 or move if the 'lady' is worth it. Usually if i pay such an amount, it'll be to someone i've seen before or if she has a 'proven' great track record among the hobbying community. But to be absolutely honest, i can count on one hand the number of 'ladies' i've met over the years that i would consider true VIP's. Gianna was definitely one. It's very unfortunate for me that i only met her at the end of her 'career'. She immediately would have moved up at the top of my list had i met her earlier. Emmanuelle & Kareena (Eleganza) were two others. I don't agree with JJ's choice of Jessie, but just because our tastes differ doesn't mean any one of us is wrong. Marie-Eve of Asservissante can be described as the true VIP type. Incredibly popular, fully booked as soon as her schedule would come out, and fantastic in bed. One Asservissante girl i saw only once (she had come back for just one night) named Evelyn would easily have been a VIP girl had she chose to remain an sp. She was absolutely gorgeous, intelligent, very friendly, and very good in the sack. How many times does a hobbyist get to make love to a beautiful chartered accountant for $140? Extremely rare. Oh, how i would also have wanted to meet her sister, who had also worked in the biz at the time. One an only wish!
However, let's not despair. There are still a few legit VIP-priced ladies working today. I consider them to be true VIP's. I wouldn't (or don't) hesitate to pay them what they believe they're worth everytime i may be in town. They might even be on my regular TDL. If they're reading this, they know who they are. Whether or not they're VIP's in everyone eyes, who knows. But to my eyes, they are & that's what counts. I feel very privileged that they allow me to spend time with them, and i appreciate my good fortune.
p.s. My text deals mostly with agency girls. As far as independents go, they can charge whatever amount they want since they're the ones who decide how busy they want to be & how much money they need in order to make a living. Whatever they want to charge is none of my business.
Originally Posted by Doc Holliday
Not only do some agencies exaggerate the services there sp's offer but they are way overhyped in the looks department. They are regularly described as drop dead gorgeous, a bombshell, very, very attractive, extremely beautiful and so on and now for the most part i take the ads with a grain of salt and i often yawn when i see these descriptions. If the agencies just listed the ladies who are working with there stats and saved terms such as DDG for the occasional girl who stood out from the rest then these terms would have a bit of meaning but i guess to be fair to the agency describing the girl as drop dead average would not be all that great for business
Il s'agit juste d'une simple question de marketing, les amis. Les produits qui marchent n'ont pas besoin d'être très publicités. Ceux qui se vendent plus difficilement (les sp moins vip dans ce cas-ci) sont celles qui feront la différence entre les bons mois et les mauvais mois niveau Chiffre d'Affaire de ces agences (puisque les vraies VIP feront toujours le plein ou presque). Ces très charmants 2ème choix, sont donc celles qui nécessitent le plus d'être survendues.
Certes, cela ne fonctionne pas avec les consommateurs avertis voire experts que nous sommes globalement ici. Mais nous ne sommes pas leurs seuls clients...
I totally agree with you guys. This reminds me of when the GFE label started making its way to the description list of a lady. That's why this board is helpful to separate the wheat from the chaff. To me, I think the epitome of VIP is Jasmine of Candyshop. When she went to 220, I didnt hear too many complaints, since it was money well spent.
Probablement pas, mais certains d'entre-nous sont possiblement le type de client qu'ils recherchent et qu'ils veulent garder. En plus, on est un atout pour le marketing.
Originally Posted by man77777
Je dois avouer que peu d'agences realisent cela ou veulent l'avouer. Cependant, il y a en quand meme qui le realisent. Par exemple, il y a quelques annees, une agence connue m'avait fait savoir qu'ils me consideraient parmi une poignee de clients VIP qu'ils voulaient faire affaire avec. Pour nous encourager a voir leur filles, ils nous offraient un tout petit escompte pour nous garder comme client. Bref, meme si l'escompte n'etait pas considerable du tout, je dois avouer que je me sentais apprecie. Notez bien que j'aimais une seule fois que je m'ai fait demander de faire une revue sur une de leur fille(s), et je crois meme que j'en ai jamais faits. C'est ca, du bon marketing!
The agencies always try some kind of ploy to increase rates. It is a way to make a fast buck, but in the long run they lose. Eventually, they will get less volume.
One of the agencies started out low, like $150/hr. or $160 hr when they started. Now most of the girls are either $180, $200 or even $220 an hour.
The economy certainly does not support these rates. Bless the guy who can afford it and is willing to spend it, but I think most won't, especially when the stock market is on such shakey grounds. I have to agree with everyones post.
I couldn't agree with you more. There's also the fact that the higher rates discourage multi-hour dates. I used to do 2-hour dates when the girl was worth it. It usually cost me around $320-340. At times, an agency charging $160/hr would offer a special of $300 for two hours. I loved this!
Originally Posted by daydreamer41
However, with some of the rates now climbing to the $200-220 level, i can't see myself wanting to pay $400 or more to spend 2 hours with an sp, no matter how good she is. It's all about economics. Some agencies might claim that the gas prices & possibly the lower sp demand caused the prices to go up, but they seem to forget that the economy has been devastating to a large volume of its clientele & that same clientele either considerably reduced their number of trips to Mtl or simply see less sps & for less hours. You want an example? Yours truly. As for the hobbyists that haven't needed to make changes in their hobbying ways.....well, they should consider themselves very fortunate.
Why i have feeling it is mostly just pointing to one agency that we all probably know but don't want to name :P
The only way to stop this 200 and + for majority of their girl labeled or not VIP and recycled SP is to stop paying and booking them. If we client don't stop to book them the agencies will continue to take advantage, because at the end what is there goal ? get most of the money from us.
Lets us the senior member here at least boycott them and refrain to use and book these fake VIP's. That is the only way to bring it down.
Also about the service mentioned and not getting of them is another serious issue. The big problem is even we don't get all listed or promised on phone we have some good time with the SP and we end up making a positive review, so why Agency will change there attitude ? because even with lying they are getting positive reviews and so more customers. Only way to stop this is to stop giving the girl a positive review. More negative review they will get because of them being lying, most probably they will start to be honest on listing the service and give correct information on phone.
My posts concern EVERY single agency that regularly charges $200 or more for their sps. Not just any sp, but regular sps who have as many bad reviews as good ones. I'm even including good ol' FKS among my agencies targeted. Charging $700 for a Mtl sp is equal to highway robbery, in my book! I don't care if the $700 is for two hours.....the poor sap renting her still has to see her for a minimum of two hours, correct? He doesn't even have the option of seeing her for just one hour. All i can add to this is: UN-F#### BELIEVABLE!!!!
Originally Posted by netone
Note that i don't have a problem with an agency charging $200/hr for a popular sp with a good track record. In that case, my feeling is that she deserves the extra $$ she's earned due to her good reputation. Also note that those agencies also have less popular girls in the $180 (or less) range. There's nothing wrong with rewarding their 'stars' in order to keep them. It's good business sense.
If an agency feels that i'm specifically targeting them, well the only thing that i have to say to them is that they dug their own hole & they still have time to stop trying to take advantage of the hand that feeds them. Also stop taking the community for fools by promoting those girls as the next Playboy Playmate-of-the-Year. There's a fine line between the truth & grossly exaggerating, as far as i'm concerned.
I'll repeat: "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me." This is the motto that all merbites should have when dealing with certain agencies.
I agree with Doc, this is not about one agency and when i started this thread i did not mean it to be about just one agency. This is about all agencies who want to overprice and over hype there ladies. There is more then just one but there are certainly some agencies that have taken it to another level. I also agree with what Doc wrote in another thread, as agencies overprice there ladies more and more savvy Johns are just going to make deals on the side. The contact info is not that difficult to obtain.
Last edited by Mod 11; 08-15-2011 at 08:23 PM.
>>> Édité par Mod 11: Ca va faire les histoires de langues. Les gens peuvent écrire en anglais of français, au choix. Le prochain qui apporte ce sujet est suspendu pour 1 mois. Assez est assez. <<<
Effectivement, Doc, tu es un client important. Mais de par ta consommation de SP, tu restes un client acquis quoique tu en dises. En terme de marketing, il suffit de maintenir la qualité des filles et surtout du service pour te garder, le tout en te gratifiant. C'est la procédure classique que j'utilise avec les clients fidèles dans mon business.
Mais pour les autres, tout le challenge et le gain potentiel en terme de Chiffre d'Affaire, se situe chez des filles moins prestigieuses, qu'il faut donc surévaluer pour les "vendre".
Je ne défends pas cette technique, je souligne juste le fait que l'escorting est un business comme un autre, avec les mêmes règles.
Quant aux prix, je pense que les principaux responsables, ce sont nous. Un business adapte son prix à ce que sa clientèle est prête à mettre. Et j'avoue que pour moi comme pour beaucoup, 200$ pour passer une heure avec une bombe qui se conduit comme ma GF et que je peux me faire 2fois, c'est vraiment rien, surtout si je compare aux prix que l'on rencontre en Europe de l'Ouest (même l'Europe de l'est devient chère, et les filles restent robotiques bien que sublimes).
Last edited by Mod 11; 08-15-2011 at 08:26 PM.
Je suis entierement d'accord avec toi. Cependant, ce 'thread' concerne plutot les filles ordinaires et exaggerement vantees qui sont offertes a des primes de $200 et plus. Comme souvent le cas recemment, ces memes filles ont ete renvoyees partout ou elles ont travaillees auparavant car elle ne voulaient pas rendre la marchandise. En plus, elle travaillaient a des taux inferieurs a $200. Pourquoi donc l'augmentation sans qu'elles ont fair leur preuves? Pourquoi pas pour une fois, etre franc avec le consommateur au lieu de leur constamment compter des mensonges au sujet des filles offertes? Il va falloir que les agences realisent qu'on est presentement dans une crise economique mondiale et que le futur n'est pas rose.
Originally Posted by man77777
Originally Posted by man77777
Oui, dans le monde de l'entreprise le profit signifie toutes les promotions sont bonnes. Je ne pense pas qu'il est éthique, mais quand le seul objectif est la vente, puis la déception est inévitable. Ainsi, le acroyms sont maltraités, et dévalorisés, et dès qu'un nouveau label ou d'une catégorie de séparer les médiocres de la spéciale est découvert, les affaires vont l'utiliser et d'en abuser.
La meilleure solution pour cet abus de l' argumentaire de vente générale est communiquée expérience de première main au moyen de commentaires critiques. Une grande partie du problème est la faute des membres. Nous aidons les agences dans leurs tromperies lorsque nous écrivons des critiques qui sont excessivement positifs, ou ne parviennent pas à écrire des critiques et laisser leurs tromperies se poursuivre.
Faire les agences plus responsables avec plus critiques équilibrée. Arrêter de jouer dans leur dévalorisation et leur tromperie avec acronymes. Une critique honnête et respectueux est légitime, et il aidera contre une dévaluation des acronymes.
Very good man77777. Yes, in the world of business profits means all the promotions are good. I do not think it's ethical. When the only objective is the sale, then deception is inevitable. Thus, the acroyms are abused, devalued, and when a new label or category to separate the mediocre from the special is discovered, business will use and abuse it.
The best solution to this abuse of the sales pitch is the first-hand experience with critical comments. Much of the problem is the fault of the members. We help agencies in their deceptions when we write reviews that are excessively positive, or fail to write reviews and let their deceptions continue.
Make agencies more accountable with more balanced criticism. Stop playing into their devaluation and deceit with acronyms. Honest and respectful criticism is legitimate, and it will help against devaluation of acronyms.
English only/Anglais seulement
No I'm not say all agencies are generally or intentionally deceptive, but in business competition the tendency to exaggerate more and misuse descriptive labels is inevitable, especially when few are making them accountable.
Bringing language issues into this thread will accomplish nothing other than getting yourself banned. MERB is a bilingual board and you are free to start threads or to post in the language of your choice, French or English. It is, however, a sign of respect to respond to a thread in the language of the majority of the posters in that thread. If you are not happy with the language that the majority of members here choose to post in, there is nothing forcing you to partake in the discussion.
Originally Posted by man77777