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Thread: Why so much moderation on MERB?

  1. #1

    Why so much moderation on MERB?

    In the past two weeks or so, I've seen a few arguments between some members which tured into insults and resulted in various suspensions/warnings/re-instatements and what have you.

    In light of these events, we learned that the best way to go when another poster annoys you is to use the ignore function. We didn't learn however. how a banned poster was able to pm the mod from a suspended account but I digress.

    Why could the same logic not be applied for insults or even for when members are slightly deviating from the original thread? Why not just ignore it. I personally don't take part in these "fights" but I often find them entertaining and when a thread deviates a bit from the original post, it doesn't bother me one bit, in fact, the information shared can often be useful.

    So my question is why? Why so much moderation? IMO, Mods should not intervene all the time for what I consider to be petty things.

    And as an alternative solution, why not create a "free-for-all" thread where anything goes, similar to what's in the sport section?

    My therory is that having people entertained and distracted from the ad sections cannot be so good for "impulsive" booking... and therefore the administrator(s) represented by the Mods prefer to keep it to a strict minimum.

    P.S. On a side note, one of my post I made in the WH RIP thread got deleted without explanation. I was merely supporting a post that was made by Ricky Bonds outlining the fact that a member got suspended after reacting from an attack from another member and it didn't seem fair.

  2. #2
    I also had few posts cancelled without explanation. One in particular from a massage place, for which the owner told me they donot want reviews, especially negative as mine, and therefore the owner told me they just contacted merb and my post, hop, vanished and disappeared like snow in spring ;-)
    I have to admit this is not the first time and i found not acceptable. There are posts that are EVIDENT that they were wrote in consensus with the agency ... I underlined that to mods but no answer. Hopefully, most of us know who is trustable or not ;-)

  3. #3
    The best part of all is the fact that Lovemaker got banned the longest for just raising questions about the initial ban against Bigboyeddie. Is this a third world board?

  4. #4
    Point by point reply:


    We didn't learn however. how a banned poster was able to pm the mod from a suspended account but I digress.
    You are the second person to bring this up. If you actually took the time to read the thread you are referring to, you would see that I answered that question. The member contacted me by email, my address is in my signature and very difficult to miss, and I lifted his ban so that he could forward me the PMs in question. I see no mystery there.

    Why could the same logic not be applied for insults or even for when members are slightly deviating from the original thread? Why not just ignore it. I personally don't take part in these "fights" but I often find them entertaining and when a thread deviates a bit from the original post, it doesn't bother me one bit, in fact, the information shared can often be useful.
    MERB has rules. In fact we have them all listed where they are very easy to find. It is a shame that so few members actually appear to have bothered to take the time to read them. One rule that we take very seriously is regarding respect to all other members when writing a post. When this rule is broken, a suspension will certainly follow. While you may find it entertaining to see members insult each other, such flame wars soon spill over into other threads and then it is an all out flame war on the board. We will not permit this to happen here.

    So my question is why? Why so much moderation? IMO, Mods should not intervene all the time for what I consider to be petty things.
    If we allowed such behavior, soon all threads would become cluttered with off topic posts and become completely useless as it would be impossible to follow the topic or find information.

    And as an alternative solution, why not create a "free-for-all" thread where anything goes, similar to what's in the sport section?
    That will never happen. Allowing such a section will only result in spillover into other threads. We have enough to manage at the moment without such problems.
    My therory is that having people entertained and distracted from the ad sections cannot be so good for "impulsive" booking... and therefore the administrator(s) represented by the Mods prefer to keep it to a strict minimum.
    Once again, moderators are not paid and do not receive any sort of compensation from any source. As that is the case, what would our motives be for such behavior? We are here to keep MERB running as smoothly as possible for all members, advertiser or not. We are not here to promote any agency or provider. We are not here to involve ourselves in their business in any way, shape or form. We are here to enforce MERB rules. When they are broken, suspensions will be handed out. We suspend advertisers just as we suspend regular members when the rules are broken.

    P.S. On a side note, one of my post I made in the WH RIP thread got deleted without explanation. I was merely supporting a post that was made by Ricky Bonds outlining the fact that a member got suspended after reacting from an attack from another member and it didn't seem fair.
    Your post was removed along with a few others as they were off topic to the thread. They were also made after my post which stated a 2 month suspension would be handed out for any further off topic posts in that thread. A warning that you obviously did not read. You should consider yourself fortunate that only your post was removed and that you did not receive a suspension for making it.

    I hope I have answered your questions to your satisfaction.

    Mod 8

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by DM.Goya View Post
    I also had few posts cancelled without explanation. One in particular from a massage place, for which the owner told me they donot want reviews, especially negative as mine, and therefore the owner told me they just contacted merb and my post, hop, vanished and disappeared like snow in spring ;-)
    I have to admit this is not the first time and i found not acceptable. There are posts that are EVIDENT that they were wrote in consensus with the agency ... I underlined that to mods but no answer. Hopefully, most of us know who is trustable or not ;-)
    I wouldn't be surprised, a lot of things seem questionable now.

  6. #6
    To put it bluntly, the massage place is full of shit. We do not remove or edit posts at the request of any advertiser or provider. In the case of a massage provider, the only possible reason for the removal of a post would be if they requested a NRP, in which case all posts and reviews are removed, or if the post contained information regarding certain services that are prohibited from discussion in a massage thread. In the latter case, you would have been informed by PM as to the reason for the removal of your post.

    As for your second point, which I believe is an accusation that we allow shills to post freely on MERB, we require proof that someone is a shill before banning them for that. A member's suspicion or feeling is not proof. When we cannot prove it, we cannot ban someone for it. We are quite certain that members are more than able to discern that when a post is 'overly enthusiastic' and the poster never posts again, that it can be certain the post is not reliable.

    Quote Originally Posted by DM.Goya View Post
    I also had few posts cancelled without explanation. One in particular from a massage place, for which the owner told me they donot want reviews, especially negative as mine, and therefore the owner told me they just contacted merb and my post, hop, vanished and disappeared like snow in spring ;-)
    I have to admit this is not the first time and i found not acceptable. There are posts that are EVIDENT that they were wrote in consensus with the agency ... I underlined that to mods but no answer. Hopefully, most of us know who is trustable or not ;-)
    Last edited by Mod 8; 02-12-2012 at 06:54 PM.

  7. #7
    Lovemaker was banned for being a general shit disturber and not following the rules, including a warning I posted in an obituary thread of all things, and insisted on continuing his feud with a moderator. Mods do not post warnings just for the typing practice. When a warning not to continue posting off topic in any thread is posted, it is to be followed. For some reason some members lately like to think that MERB is their personal playground where they can go around insulting and attacking other members and not pay the price for it.

    MERB is a board for adults and we expect our members to behave as such.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tilt View Post
    The best part of all is the fact that Lovemaker got banned the longest for just raising questions about the initial ban against Bigboyeddie. Is this a third world board?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Mod 8 View Post

    MERB is a board for adults and we expect our members to behave as such.
    Stop belittling the members. If anything, you're not acting like the adult. Who runs this board, you or the hobbyists? So then why are the hobbyists, who acturally run this site, getting banned for questioning your irrational decisions? This is Canada, not Russia, maybe you weren't aware of this.

    Seems like a lot of emotions are going into these decisions as opposed to objectivity.

  9. #9
    Could you tell me what member was banned for questioning my decisions? I would be very interested in knowing.

    If you mean Lovemaker, he was banned for being a shit disturber and for violating MERB rules as well as a direct warning posted in his previous suspension. He also violated a posted warning in the WH RIP thread.

    If you mean Bigboyeddie, he was banned for an extended series of personal insults and attacks directed at other members of MERB. Those posts have been removed as they were off topic and against MERB rules of respectful posting.

    Finally, I hate to inform you but the hobbyists do not "run this site". They are guests of Fred Zed who pays the bills so that they all have a place to post and share information, have some interesting discussions and have some fun. When a guest starts to misbehave he is shown the door until he learns to behave according to the rules that are in place on this board.

    M8

  10. #10
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    Thank you Sergejean for this thread.

    I am in total agreement.

    I also read the WH thread and I was amazed how it turned bad. Well, it was entertaining as you said until Mod start their banning. Which, imho, is totally unfair and over-reacting especially for a lounge section.
    I thought the lounge was a bit more free talking than the other sections.

    Banning especially in the lounge section should be used as a very last resort.

    A Sticky free-for-all thread? Excellent! Why not a Free-For-All Section? Well, I guess the moderated Lounge would become desert :P (Free-For-All or NO MODS LAND :P )


    PS: I erased 3/4 of my post after re-read in the fear of being banned.


    Uncle Bob

  11. #11
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    To moderate or not to modrate, that is the question

    I will say this because the member who started this thread posted related things on another board today.

    Quote Originally Posted by sergejean somewhere else
    I wonder why Mods on Mer b are so sensitive about a bit of trash talking or even letting a thread move on to different topics. If someone doesn't like it, he has the option to simply ignore it.

    I'm suspecting that the advertisers on this board have a lot to say about how it's managed. After all, having people entertained and distracted from the ad section cannot be so good for "impulsive" booking... .
    • Talking about MERB moderation on that board is silly: fall out of line with the main posters there (crazy or not) and you find yourself silently (and permanently) banned. Then after that your name is mud, because the posters can say anything about you without fear of rebuttal (or moderation)
    • MERB has rules of conduct that are easy to follow and that the moderators enforce uniformly. Show me a rule that hasn't been broken on the board where you raised a MERB issue...
    • This whole ruckus was over a R.I.P. thread. The utmost respect should have been observed and was not. I applaud the moderators for removing any inappropriate post. Funny how that bunch once raised questions about another R.I.P. thread, and now seem to be favouring turning this one into a Showdown at the OK Corral

    I have had my share of animated discussions with the moderators here but in the end reason has always prevailed. If you have something to say about the moderation here, do it here.
    Une vie sans folie, c'est une vie sans goût / Life without craziness, is life without taste


  12. #12
    UncleBob,

    Let`s be clear here. If there is one kind of thread that should remain respectful, it is an obituary thread. What is supposed to be `entertaining` about the news that someone has died? Maybe you can tell me?

    The Lounge is subject to the same rules of respect as any other thread or section of the board. The only section that gets leeway is the Sports Forum due to the nature of sports discussions in general.

    We have dozens of members who post on MERB each and every day and it is always a small handful who cause the majority of the problems. The majority of members of MERB have never been suspended or warned for any post they have made, other than 411 violations in some cases. For some reason, certain members like to believe they are above the rules and can behave in any fashion they wish. I am sorry to say that no one is above the rules and extreme behavior will always result in a suspension. These are not new rules, nor is the enforcement of these rules anything new. For some reason it is always the same members getting banned for the same reasons and they are always complaining about it. Some people never seem to learn and love to ignore moderator warnings. Then when the warning is enforced they cry that they are being suspended unjustly.

    And you still blame the moderation? Perhaps everyone need a refresher course on the rules: https://merb.cc/vbulletin/announcement.php?f=5

    M8

  13. #13
    Some people from the outside of high moral standards can also contest that having an obituary thread of a public figure on a prostitution board is higly disrespectful and in bad taste to the deceased.

    I lurk mostly on this board and as DM Goya states, you get an idea who to trust and who not to trust and that inlcudes members, moderators, agencies and independents.

    The question here is about moderation. It's ok to enforce rules about respect but then members are banned, posts are censored and ALL EVIDENCE is deleted. Only the mods know why the ban was justified.

    Banning people for 2 months for asking questions is OVERMODERATION without a doubt. Eventually, you will start turning people off. Even the largest of corporations go bankrupt if they start disrespecting their clients and partners.

    Posts should be deleted if ABSOLUTELY necessary but the moderators should send warnings by to members asking them to retract before taking drastic action.

    Anyhow not one board has the monopoly on the industry. There are other options if people feel they are being censored or banned unfairly. Freedom of speech applies to post anywhere as long as it's factual. Moderators have no right to control people's opinions.

  14. #14
    To mods - for the most part I agree with your actions, I only asked once for a clarification. But one thing I observed and it annoys the hell out of me is the tone you choose to communicate with members. Tilt is totally right when he says that you are belittling members. The way you sometimes write things comes across as "you people are idiots for not reading the rules, posting in the wrong section, etc". It's OK to explain what you did and why you did it, but then it is often followed by an unnecessary threat written the same way a daycare teacher would threaten little kids. Sometimes I see what a mod wrote and I go - another one that seems to get off on enforcing the rules. For those of us who have been around and are established professionally, it's really hard to take and now you have people noticing and reacting to that.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by sergejean View Post
    In the past two weeks or so, I've seen a few arguments between some members which tured into insults and resulted in various suspensions/warnings/re-instatements and what have you.

    In light of these events, we learned that the best way to go when another poster annoys you is to use the ignore function. We didn't learn however. how a banned poster was able to pm the mod from a suspended account but I digress.

    Why could the same logic not be applied for insults or even for when members are slightly deviating from the original thread? Why not just ignore it. I personally don't take part in these "fights" but I often find them entertaining and when a thread deviates a bit from the original post, it doesn't bother me one bit, in fact, the information shared can often be useful.

    So my question is why? Why so much moderation? IMO, Mods should not intervene all the time for what I consider to be petty things.

    And as an alternative solution, why not create a "free-for-all" thread where anything goes, similar to what's in the sport section?

    My therory is that having people entertained and distracted from the ad sections cannot be so good for "impulsive" booking... and therefore the administrator(s) represented by the Mods prefer to keep it to a strict minimum.

    P.S. On a side note, one of my post I made in the WH RIP thread got deleted without explanation. I was merely supporting a post that was made by Ricky Bonds outlining the fact that a member got suspended after reacting from an attack from another member and it didn't seem fair.
    Hello Sergejean,

    The ignore function is 100% useless in any part of the board where anyone can see posts without logging in.

    I see no problem with slight deviations from the thread originators intent. No subject can be so narrowly focused that it does not create some expanded thought, and no two people think in exactly the same patterns anyway.

    "Fights" create resentments, feuds, etc. Having been in many of them I know the antipathies created spill over everywhere and go on for a long time, often intensifying beyond anything rational. The insults and bitterness that goes on in the Free-For-All thread never stays contained there since the slack of moderation only magnifies the anger which always spills over throughout the board.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tilt View Post
    The best part of all is the fact that Lovemaker got banned the longest for just raising questions about the initial ban against Bigboyeddie. Is this a third world board?
    Not so at all. I was in contact by PM with Lovemaker during the heat of the posting. I agreed almost completely with his points, but I thought he was going too far in his approach. This on top of the FKG BS thread I thought this was just too much. There are ways to do things right and there are wrong ways. Trying to make a point that includes unnecessary and harsh insults, along with a running battle with another member, only hurt the point being attempted. As one who has been banned twice in three months I agree Lovemaker should not back down from pressing a point. But his harsh approach and running battle with the other member practically demanded a ban. I asked him to stop after the firm warning since he was too heated to communicate effectively. The result is obvious.

    As for Bigboyeddie, whether joking or not he was helping to fan the flames and not for the first time this week. Also, in my opinion he was playing the surrogate troll for the other board. After several years as a member here he has only 200 posts compared to almost 1200 there where he has made plenty of Merb bashing posts, and is currently sucking up to the chief trolls....again.

    I still support Lovemakers points, and I have spoke up against some of the Mods moves lately. Yes, some of the mod decisions do seem unbalanced, especially since the first shot at a member yesterday wasn't by Lovemaker or Bigboyeddie and that person got nothing. But both L and B handled their approach much more poorly, then failed to cool off. It's not tough to post very firmly without getting too carried away, and that is where they made their mistake.

    It was a memorial thread after all and using it that way way awful.

    However, Lovemaker was absolutely right when he said, "it takes two to tango" and DOC got away was tangoing right along with the others...no matter how much more gently.

    Quote Originally Posted by sapman99 View Post
    [*]Talking about MERB moderation on that board is silly: fall out of line with the main posters there (crazy or not) and you find yourself silently (and permanently) banned. Then after that your name is mud, because the posters can say anything about you without fear of rebuttal (or moderation)
    Actually Sapman, because the owner and their shill moderator is one of a kind with the trolls, they get away with saying anything whether you are a member or not.

    If you ever wonder what a Free-For-All board is like the blue is the perfect example.

    Cheers,

    Merlot

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