What do you find truly unfair ??

[cloudsurf]

On another thread I mentioned that the provincial government insures medicine that effects a cure but doesn`t insure medicine that prevents the illness.
Not logical and not cost friendly.

More unfair is the fact that when executives of large publicly listed corporations break the law or take stupid risks, the only ones who suffer are the shareholders.
Take Wells Fargo for example. Senior executives encouraged their subordinates to partake in illegal and suspect activity. The government fines the company tens of millions of dollars. The executives don`t pay a penny and the innocent stock holders take the hit. Something is very wrong here.

 

[westwoody]

They don't always get away, see the Tyco fiasco.
The prep school boy getting six months for sexual assault because of a blatantly biased judge made me sick.
Vic Toews makes me sick, social cripple and paranoid but gets appointed judge as payoff for loyalty to Tory party.

 

[PopeDover]

Not logical and not cost friendly

as far as rules & regulations in the USA, they make a hell of a lot more logical sense when looked at from perspective of deep-pocketed special interests

Preventive medicine is quackery according to the gatekeepers..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linus_Pauling
New Scientist called him one of the 20 greatest scientists of all time, and as of 2000, he was rated the 16th most important scientist in history.....
In his later years he promoted nuclear disarmament, as well as orthomolecular medicine, megavitamin therapy, and dietary supplements. None of the latter have gained acceptance in the mainstream scientific community

 

[cloudsurf]

Hey Pope let me ask your hippy side.
Is medical mary jane healing or preventive.

 

[PopeDover]

IMO it can be both, and most frequently, neither.

Surely preventive as a stress reliever, and apparently cures Glaucoma and symptoms of many diseases. Smu is prob an encyclopedia on this.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Cloudsurf,

The law provides that shareholders can bring a shareholders derivative action against Wells Fargo and this may be coming. In effect its a claim by shareholders that the corporate entity or board of directors violated their fiduciary duties to shareholders.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Cloudsurf,

Many years ago between college and graduate school I worked as a telemarketer for a publicly traded company that has since gone out of business. We were inbound telemarketers essentially trying to convince people not to cancel services they had paid for on their credit cards. Our job performance was measured based on "saves", which was not as well defined as saves in hockey but was essentially a measure for how many customers you prevented from canceling. The saves numbers the managers were looking for was totally unreasonable. Our calls were monitored and we were trained to say no 3 times before allowing a customer to cancel the service and get a credit card refund. It was a horrible job but all of us inflated our saves stats. My save percentage looked like Carey Price's but in reality I was horrible at this job. I eventually quit and went to graduate school. After managing a pizzeria and then this suck-ass job, I was very motivated to do better in life at that point.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Also read this, Wells Fargo's "sandbagger in chief" gets away with $125 million while the shareholders lick their wounds:

http://fortune.com/2016/09/12/wells-fargo-cfpb-carrie-tolstedt/

 

[cloudsurf]

Cloudsurf,

The law provides that shareholders can bring a shareholders derivative action against Wells Fargo and this may be coming. In effect its a claim by shareholders that the corporate entity or board of directors violated their fiduciary duties to shareholders.

In most publically traded corporations the directors and executives are protected from financial loss with liability insurance paid for by the company.....ie shareholders.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Cloudsurf see the attached:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derivative_suit

 

[EagerBeaver]

In most publically traded corporations the directors and executives are protected from financial loss with liability insurance paid for by the company.....ie shareholders.

Not correct if there was intentional misconduct. Liability insurance policies insure negligence and not intentional misconduct or criminal misconduct. The layperson may assume it insures everything and it's simply not the case. This is why the Enron execs all ended up in bankruptcy court or jail or both.

I am not here to give a seminar but these are fundamental and well established legal principles.

 

[cloudsurf]

It would be difficult to prove that the directors or even some senior officers knew that there was illegal activity going on.

 

[EagerBeaver]

It would be difficult to prove that the directors or even some senior officers knew that there was illegal activity going on.

The shareholders derivative suit doesn't necessarily have to prove that. They merely need to prove the fiduciary duties to shareholders were breached. The directors have a fiduciary duty that goes beyond merely having knowledge or not. It's the same as the duty of an Executor of an Estate or a Trustee. If the assets of the Estate are being squandered it matters not if the Executor knew because he has a duty to preserve the assets in the first place.

So the legal analysis is far different than what you have suggested and possible insurance coverage issues are complex and fact intensive.

It reminds me of some Probate litigation I was involved in, in which the Fiduciary of an Estate failed to either improve or market or rent unoccupied property that was a tax liability of the Estate. We filed motions with the Court claiming the Estate was being wasted, on behalf of the beneficiaries. He who has fiduciary duties may not fall asleep at the switch.

 

[fastmike]

They don't always get away, see the Tyco fiasco.
The prep school boy getting six months for sexual assault because of a blatantly biased judge made me sick.
Vic Toews makes me sick, social cripple and paranoid but gets appointed judge as payoff for loyalty to Tory party.

Are you talking about that swimmer that was found to be raping an unconscious girl?

 

[BookerL]

I am not here to give a seminar but these are fundamental and well established legal principles.

Hello all


In Canada it does work differently then in the USA .
Totally two different banking systems http://www.osfi-bsif.gc.ca/eng/pages/default.aspx.
I do not deal with American Banks in the USA .
A the Provincial base in Quebec surveillance is done by L'Autorité des marchés financiers | AMF
But very scary story happened https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norbourg_scandal.

The safest bet is to be closer to your investment ,I prefer real estate ,safety of the bricks !

 

[EagerBeaver]

BookerL,

Cloudsurf complained about Wells Fargo which is a US Bank.

Wells Fargo was a very large culprit in the subprime mortgage lending crisis of 2007-08........giving mortgages to people who should not have been loaned money, in order to generate sales and commissions for mortgage originators and brokers, real estate brokers and attorneys. After the smoke cleared on millions of foreclosures, there is now regulation of both mortgage brokers and attorneys that did not exist previously. Connecticut even went so far as to require that attorneys participating in short sales give an "affidavit of due diligence" essentially guaranteeing that the seller and buyer were engaged in an arms length transaction. This produced a large rebellion from the legal community and the law was swiftly repealed after I and many other attorneys refused to participate in short sale transactions for banks like WF. As an attorney there is no way to know whether your clients have told you everything 100% as it is, and it should not be be your problem if they haven't. So that law got repealed faster than anything I have ever seen get repealed. Obviously the state legislator who passed it never worked as a real estate attorney in his or her life.

The bottom line is there is a little more regulation than there was, but our banking industry is probably far less regulated than Canada's is.

Regarding Wells Fargo, I must have defended at lease 20 of their foreclosures in 2008-2011 or so, and many of the files I got I realized probably after 5 minutes of reviewing them that the client never should have been loaned money, but they got the loan because somebody wanted a commission or needed to achieve a sales goal. Do I agree with Cloudsurf that Wells Fargo sucks? Of course I do. Every one of their customers should close up their accounts immediately. I thought that long before this scandal broke. I would never do business with them in a million years.

I highly recommend you see the movie "The Big Short." It is not fiction, it is a real story based on real historical figures and facts and tells the story behind the subprime mortgage lending crisis of which WF was a big part.

 

[BookerL]

Hello all

On another thread I mentioned that the provincial government insures medicine that effects a cure but doesn`t insure medicine that prevents the illness.
Not logical and not cost friendly.

More unfair is the fact that when executives of large publicly listed corporations break the law or take stupid risks, the only ones who suffer are the shareholders.

Corporations also take risk in other countries then the USA & break laws

Take Wells Fargo for example. Senior executives encouraged their subordinates to partake in illegal and suspect activity. The government fines the company tens of millions of dollars. The executives don`t pay a penny and the innocent stock holders take the hit. Something is very wrong here.

My comments where not about Wells ,obviously, but the other part of the unfairness

BookerL,

Cloudsurf complained about Wells Fargo which is a US Bank.

I am fully aware that Wells Fargo is a USA Bank and Provincial Governments does not exist in USA ,but they do in Canada



Cheers



Booker

 

[smuler]

IMO it can be both, and most frequently, neither.

Surely preventive as a stress reliever, and apparently cures Glaucoma and symptoms of many diseases. Smu is prob an encyclopedia on this.

The benefits of the compounds found in MJ are proven by pharma companies..yet because of the Federal Government's view of MJ, big pharma is reluctant to get it to market
Benefits have been proven in anxiety/ pain/ neorological disorders such as seizures/ promising studies in dementia/alzheimer's

Two years ago, we actually hired a young Research fellow strictly dedicated to do THC/CBD studies...

Shit, even my stoner buddies have introduced a psoriasis soap that they are distributing among their stoner collective in the Midwest..:hippie:
Doesn't cure it, but alleviates the horrible itching supposedly

Best Regards
Smuler

 

[Doc Holliday]

Shit, even my stoner buddies have introduced a psoriasis soap that they are distributing among their stoner collective in the Midwest..:hippie:
Doesn't cure it, but alleviates the horrible itching supposedly.

About 6-7 years ago i began to suffer from psoriasis. Mostly in my fingers and armpits. My personal physician told me i had eczema, while the dermatologist confirmed my problem as being psoriasis. My fingers were covered...i could barely do anything with my hands without cutting myself. It came to a point that all my fingers were covered with bandaids. As for my armpits, they didn't really bother me other than freaking people out when i wasn't wearing a shirt and i'd raise my arms.

Well, i was prescribed some ointment and it helped a bit, mostly my armpits. But the problem wasn't going away. One day, i read an article which discussed a research at John Hopkins Hospital in regards to skin disorders. If i remember correctly, between 40-60% of skin disorders could be attributed to a chemical found in regular beer. I had been trying out other stuff (such as avoiding soaps and other beauty products which contained sodium lauryl sulfate) to mild success. But once i replaced regular beer with light beer, my skin disorder drastically changed within 3 months. A few months later, i was psoriasis free!!!!

I've continued to avoid regular beer and now stick to light beer and a bit of red wine. Knock on wood, but not once has my skin disorder (psoriasis) returned!

I had been told orginally that since i had several psoriasis sufferers in my family, that the problem was likely a chronic one and i could simply control it. But since i've stopped drinking regular beer 6-7 years ago, i haven't had a single relapse even once.

Of course, it doesn't mean that this will work for everyone. But it's worth a try. I truly believe that this is why i no longer suffer from psoriasis and it saved my life!

 

[BookerL]

Doesn't cure it, but alleviates the horrible itching supposedly

The worst about psoriasis is definitely not the itching.
My first wife had
Psoriatic arthritis which started with regular psoriasis
http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/psoriatic-arthritis/basics/definition/con-20015006

About 6-7 years ago i began to suffer from psoriasis. Mostly in my fingers and armpits. My personal physician told me i had eczema, while the dermatologist confirmed my problem as being psoriasis. My fingers were covered...i could barely do anything with my hands without cutting myself.

My step mom had eczema way different then psoriasis in the long run







Cheers



Booker