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Thread: BJ in massage parlors: obviously illegal?

  1. #1

    BJ in massage parlors: obviously illegal?

    In a now famous jugement of the Ontario Court of Justice in the case against Valeri Ponomarv, the juge has ruled that the act of masturbation was not of a necessary sexual nature, at least not enough to declare it an act of prostitution. He wrote a clear, short and well remembered paragraphe because of his reference the Bill Clinton, that sums it up :

    « The payment of money as I have found it was for a full body massage. The act of masturbation was optional, at no additional fee. Indeed, I wonder, and am left in a doubt as to whether or not the community might consider the act of masturbation in all situations to be sexual. One only needs to look to the conduct of a certain president of the United States and the response to activity that he participated in to wonder whether or not the act of masturbation is indeed in all circumstances a sexual act. Given that the act was done in private, as part of a massage, participated in voluntarily by all individuals, and a fee was paid regardless of whether or not the act took place, I am not satisfied that the Crown has met its onus and that the conduct constituted prostitution." »

    The context is important :

    1 It occurs in a massage parlor. An independent mp may offer the complete act, it would be, in my opinion, just as legal as for an independent sp.

    2 the act was optional but at no extra fee. Suppose that there could be some tipping, but for the general appreciation of the massage.

    My question: in the exact same situation, would there be a base argument to consider a blow-job much differently from a masturbation?

    In my knowledge, such a case was never put before a Canadian court. But in regards of the Ponomary case, is it so obvious that a bj in a massage parlor makes that parlor a bawdy house?

    PLEASE REFRAIN FROM TALKING ABOUT SPECIFIC PLACES OR MP'S THAT oFFER BJ. The question deals only with the legality of the act in a massage parlour in the given conditions.

  2. #2
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    Always keep in mind that this Ontario judgement was in Superior court(low level),and is the only one supporting the HJ in massage.I am not so sure that it would have the same result next time, in Ontario ,Quebec or elsewhere...I think that the next massage parlour or therapist basing his defense on this single jurisprudence would be in for a bad surprise...So now for BJ...All this goes into "definition of prostitution"and evolution of what the general public thinks is wrong...I am convinced that even the judgment in "Tremblay",(remember the Pussycat?)could have gone the other way,and in fact did for a while, if "la couronne" had been different...But we are in 2010 and society morality is not static,what was terrible a decade ago is now accepted,what was okay then might be really bad now.Think alcool consumption for one,driving under the influence was common when i was young,and considered current social behavior...in the 60s,70s..then it changed,same for everything else.

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    And more,: remember that judge only statute on HJ during a complete body massage with no $$ exchange for it...not during a manucure or a dance...and not as an option for $20. $40 or any amount...

  4. #4
    With this judgment, the masseuse can do a legal massage even if it includes HJ, but this has to be done with a one price includes HJ deal. So the price has to be higher for the masseuse not to break the law. Or, if she expects to make it on tips for a fine HJ she may get STIFFED by the client.

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