Best Bond?

[urquell]

I actually agree with that.

There's really no point in going forward with Bond ... except for the money. Not much new they can do with him.

They were already trying reinvention in the late '80s ... having a chaste Bond, a rogue Bond with Dalton. And with Craig (also frequently rogue) they literally killed him off.

Bond was always a servant of the state, the British state. That was Fleming, Connery, Moore .... for whom he was an uncomplicated figure of patriotism. But it was always a problematic idea, too, especially for anyone with a brain, including the second generation of producers who continually sought ways to reinvent him.

Craig was a mostly successful, if somewhat subversive experiment in creating a character who was almost an anti-Bond figure. But that's a one & done kind of thing. I don't see how they can repeat that formula and still keep the vestiges of Bond

And they certainly aren't going back to the Bond of old.

Rather than any further betrayal of the character

I'd rather they just no longer made any new films.

It depends a bit on which character you refer to. Craig was probably closest to the book Bond. In the books Bond was largely a dour and humourless character and of all the movie Bonds Craig comes closest to that. The public, however, has come to associate Bond with the movie Bond, being mostly a suave, genial and breezy character. The movie persona is usually totally at odds with the book character. So, whether Craig is an anti-Bond figure depends on whether you refer to the movie legacy or the literary arc. I honestly believe that the movie Bond is much more interesting than the book Bond..I find the book Bond to be bland, excepting Fleming's ability to flawlessly describe a scene and convey atmosphere. He didn't have anywhere near that ability with people.

Anyway, at this point name recognition, longevity and branding have made Bond a product with a somewhat guaranteed minimum return on investment, and since movie studios are so risk averse these days no doubt they'll continue making them. I'd stll like to see other notable and IMHO more interesting literary characters brought to the screen, even though I live the Bond movies.. It's an uphill slog to get there though.

 

[EastWind]

I want a Pauly Shore James Bond.

Or Rob Schneider.

 

[urquell]

Well, it looks like Amazon may be getting ready to fuck it all up, as previously suspected. Apparently the list of frontrunners to be the next Bond has come out somewhere, and the leading three candidates are Jacob Elordi, Harris Dickinson and Tom Holland. I think there will be a palpable lack of enthusiasm for any of the three in this role, but we'll see.

 

[Meta not Meta]

It depends a bit on which character you refer to. Craig was probably closest to the book Bond. In the books Bond was largely a dour and humourless character and of all the movie Bonds Craig comes closest to that. The public, however, has come to associate Bond with the movie Bond, being mostly a suave, genial and breezy character. The movie persona is usually totally at odds with the book character. So, whether Craig is an anti-Bond figure depends on whether you refer to the movie legacy or the literary arc. I honestly believe that the movie Bond is much more interesting than the book Bond..I find the book Bond to be bland, excepting Fleming's ability to flawlessly describe a scene and convey atmosphere. He didn't have anywhere near that ability with people.

Anyway, at this point name recognition, longevity and branding have made Bond a product with a somewhat guaranteed minimum return on investment, and since movie studios are so risk averse these days no doubt they'll continue making them. I'd stll like to see other notable and IMHO more interesting literary characters brought to the screen, even though I live the Bond movies.. It's an uphill slog to get there though.

You make a lot of great points. But arguably Dalton was even closer than Craig to Fleming Bond.

The Craig years took "the bitch is dead" origin story from the book CR and turned it into an overarching narrative of emotional vulnerability [maybe even trauma] that runs through all of Craig's five films - and that just isn't present, or very rarely, in the Fleming books subsequent to CR. Hence my "anti-Bond" comment. He's just not that guy aside from the occasional bout of melancholy and introspection that we find in Fleming Bond.

Don't get me wrong, I really enjoyed the Craig years [in fact, they revived my Bond fandom]; but in making his Bond so human it only makes sense that they would kill him in the end. And I wish they'd just leave it at that ....

Dalton was just as serious, more aloof (with women), even as dark as Craig, at times--but arguably also more charming if no better at humour. I think Craig tried for the charm & humour; he just wasn't great at it. But the key difference being that in his emotional vulnerability Craig makes his Bond more recognizably human.

That also makes his Bond a tragic figure to some extent. Not able to trust Madeleine, after his experience of supposed betrayal with Vesper, he destroys his chance for a family life and ends up alone in retirement. All a bit soapy and "anti-Bond," however interesting and successful as a departure from formula.

There are other aspects ...

The over-emphasis on "going rogue" to a much a greater extent than ever before in both movies [LTK notwithstanding] & Fleming books.

Also, the Bond of the books, as with Dalton and the other movies is of an indeterminate middle age, or meant to be [whatever we may think of the somewhat cringe late Moore period].

But with Craig we go straight from a young Bond in CR & QOS to an aging Bond in SF. They dial that back a bit with SP, but then five years later (in fictional story time) he's retired at the beginning of NTTD. All to underscore that he has the frailties of being human whereas in the books I don't think he ages at all.

 

[gaby]

After watching BALLERINA.....would stongly recommend DENIS VILLENEUVE ANA DE ARMAS as the next JAMES BOND.....lolllll.....ce serait WOW....young/sexy et surtout sooooo spectacular....she has my vote.....relolllll

 

[EagerBeaver]

I watched the movie Sicario last night, directed by Denis Villeneuve. Anyone who questions whether he can helm a Bond movie should watch this film specifically. It's mostly about ruthless CIA operatives who use torture and brutality to thwart Mexican cartel operatives. And how these behaviors, although illegal, are both effective and politically sanctioned law enforcement tools.

 

[TheJames101]

whereas in the books I don't think he ages at all.

He doesn't age specifically, but the wear and tear takes a toll - in You Only Live Twice and Man with the Golden Gun, he is described as being hurt, and generally worn out by this point. Much like Fleming himself, actually.

After watching BALLERINA.....would stongly recommend DENIS VILLENEUVE ANA DE ARMAS as the next JAMES BOND.....lolllll.....ce serait WOW....young/sexy et surtout sooooo spectacular....she has my vote.....relolllll

I know you're joking, but it's always surprising how many people think James Bond and 007 are the same thing.

 

[Meta not Meta]

He doesn't age specifically, but the wear and tear takes a toll - in You Only Live Twice and Man with the Golden Gun, he is described as being hurt, and generally worn out by this point. Much like Fleming himself, actually.

For sure!

Thinking about it now, the YOLT novel may be the closest to Craig Bond, and they did use elements of it his final movie. I wonder if they might even be considering the beginning of TMWTGG novel, or some variation, as a way of introducing the new Bond.

There are a number excellent books out there about Fleming, who was far, far, far more fascinating (including his milieu, family & professional history) than any iteration of the Bond character himself.

Yeah, he had aged well beyond his years before his early death at fifty-six. One thing he shares with his literary character is that neither expected to live a long life. Fleming smoked & drank to excess, even after having suffered a heart attack.