My friends want to know
- Thread starter LC18
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I had a SB for a couple of years. It was a regular ff type of relationship, in the sense that we didn't have sex each and every time. Often enough, but sometimes we were just happy to hang out, play pool, catch-up with each other. It was a very pleasant and relaxed relationship. When the relationship ended, she remained a good friend. We still hang out from time to time.
I didn't pay her a fix allowance. I bought her expensive clothes she wanted, bought her a laptop, jewelry, paid for her driving lessons (lol!). Yes some money was involved but she preferred expensive gifts and I was fine with it (isn't it what daddies do?) It came up to about $1500/month.
We saw each other at least once a week for sex, but more often socially. She'd call me for lunch if she was around where i worked, sometimes a quickie in an hotel, sometimes she'd stay the night, some other times we just went out and kissed each other good night. There was never any pressure, which made the sex all the more enjoyable. When we had sex, she was also in the mood (and demonstrated it quite loudly! Lol!)
You might wonder if after all she was not just a friend with benefits. But given she was very hot, 20yo and really stunning, model type, and that I was in my 50s, I doubt she would have spent all that time with me. She was being hit on all the time, so she was not desperate for partners. But I guess she did also appreciate my friendship, mentorship and company after all. Or at least, she was very good at giving me that illusion...
Does it answer your questions LC18?
I didn't pay her a fix allowance. I bought her expensive clothes she wanted, bought her a laptop, jewelry, paid for her driving lessons (lol!). Yes some money was involved but she preferred expensive gifts and I was fine with it (isn't it what daddies do?) It came up to about $1500/month.
We saw each other at least once a week for sex, but more often socially. She'd call me for lunch if she was around where i worked, sometimes a quickie in an hotel, sometimes she'd stay the night, some other times we just went out and kissed each other good night. There was never any pressure, which made the sex all the more enjoyable. When we had sex, she was also in the mood (and demonstrated it quite loudly! Lol!)
You might wonder if after all she was not just a friend with benefits. But given she was very hot, 20yo and really stunning, model type, and that I was in my 50s, I doubt she would have spent all that time with me. She was being hit on all the time, so she was not desperate for partners. But I guess she did also appreciate my friendship, mentorship and company after all. Or at least, she was very good at giving me that illusion...
Does it answer your questions LC18?
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That’s the spirit, thank you for your reply!
Where would you look for a sugar ba by? Online, in person, escort/stripper turned sugar baby?
Seeking.com (formerly SeekingArrangement) is the most common way for guys and girls to find each other. It works pretty well, but it takes time, sometimes lots, for both guys and girls to sort through all the possibilities, exchange some text messages, have initial meetings, negotiate, etc. Lots of guys and girls get frustrated quickly and just don't have the patience to find the right deal. Subscriptions are free for girls and cost $90-110/month for guys.
What are your expectations in terms of dates per week vs money?
The expectations can vary tremendously. Most guys are probably using Seeking as an alternative to escorts and so their expectations are not that different from what they expect from escorts. Guys are mainly interested in meetings for sex and any social time is a bonus. A few guys might be willing to pay for arrangements that include social time besides sex, but the goal for most guys is sex. So it's not much different from hiring an escort and the frequency of "dates" is probably the same--for some guys once or twice a week and for others once or twice a month.
Do you prefer allowances or "pay per meet" ?
Most guys prefer PPM though you can't even use that acronym on Seeking. Again, from the guy's point of view, the sugar scene is mainly an alternative to escorts. It's all about sex with a small possibility of extending the relationship into more of a s sex + social time deal.
What is the difference between an escort and a sugar b aby if you do "pay per meet" ?
This is the key question! The answer defines the difference between an escort and a sugar baby, in my opinion. A sugar baby is what I call an "amateur escort". An amateur escort is a woman who exchanges sex for money (or other resources) with a man that she choses on terms that are highly negotiable. Unlike escorts, she does not make an implied commitment to have sex for a set price with anyone who hires her (and maybe passes some minimal level of screening). A sugar baby fields requests for intimate companionship from multiple candidates and choses one guy (or sometimes 2 or 3) with whom she would like to establish an intimate relationship. She may negotiate different terms with different guys depending on her level of interest in them and how much in demand she is.
What would be your budget per month?
No different from a budget for hiring escorts.
Would you feel like paying someone's bills every month feel too transactional?
It's easier just to pay cash. Guys don't really care how much a girl pays in bills every month. Prices for a SB are governed by market forces, just like escorts.
How much would you pay for one evening a week (5 pm - 10 pm approx) ?
Impossible to say-depends on the girl-her looks, service level, ability to hold an interesting conversation, commonality of interests, etc. Again not that different from escorts.
Are you still using seekingarrangement?
It can be maddeningly frustrating or surprisingly rewarding. I'm still using it, but only one month at a time.
Do you expect your sugar ba by to send you nudes and text messages when you're not seeing each other? (if you allow it)
Expect it? Absolutely not, anymore than I expect an escort to do that. But some escorts that I have known have offered to let me take nude photos of them--that's always a much appreciated gesture!
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You know LC18, my reason for having a SB rather than an escort was to have someone special in my life. The SB/SD relationship can be very transactions oriented when either side is avoiding to connect emotionally at some level. But it can be a true mentorship experience also, when the older man is ready to share both money, wisdom, network, and the sb is ready to let go a bit of the business distance. And this makes the relationship more valuable and pleasant for both.
For e.g I helped my sb to prepare fur job interviews, helped her with university assignments by putting her in touch with resources I knew, gave her financial advices that she benefited greatly from. She gained much more than money from me. But she allowed it to happen. And that mentorship relationship still exists, years after the sb/sd deal finished because she moved out of town.
So that would be for me the difference with seeing escorts.
For e.g I helped my sb to prepare fur job interviews, helped her with university assignments by putting her in touch with resources I knew, gave her financial advices that she benefited greatly from. She gained much more than money from me. But she allowed it to happen. And that mentorship relationship still exists, years after the sb/sd deal finished because she moved out of town.
So that would be for me the difference with seeing escorts.
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In the past, i knew nothing about the SB world but i meet one or two SP in regular base..! so i met my favorite SP almost every week and i keep this frequency for almost a year. In return, i felt appreciated and having great companionship with her. So our relationship is almost like a SB relationship that i have right now.
To be honest , i prefer to have a SP like SB if the arrangement could workout. Unfortunately, with inflation, i don't think a SP will accept a arrangement with budget 2K/month (with extra on gifts and meals and travel...).
Where would you look for a sugar ba by? Online
What are your expectations in terms of dates per week vs money? I do per month 500 for about 6 hours
Do you prefer allowances or "pay per meet" ? Pay per meet
What is the difference between an escort and a sugar baby if you do "pay per meet"? The price, a SB its 500 for about 6 hours, with the SP it way more.
What would be your budget per month? 500
Would you feel like paying someone's bills every month feel too transactional? Yes and would never agree to that.
Are you still using seekingarrangement? No, SA
Do you expect your sugar ba by to send you nudes and text messages when you're not seeing each other? (if you allow it) I don't like nudes, but if she's at the gym and sends a pic of her working out is cool, or just sends a pic from her work to say hi. I like text messages that say hi or whatever, obviously I would not expect them every day, unless she initiates.
What are your expectations in terms of dates per week vs money? I do per month 500 for about 6 hours
Do you prefer allowances or "pay per meet" ? Pay per meet
What is the difference between an escort and a sugar baby if you do "pay per meet"? The price, a SB its 500 for about 6 hours, with the SP it way more.
What would be your budget per month? 500
Would you feel like paying someone's bills every month feel too transactional? Yes and would never agree to that.
Are you still using seekingarrangement? No, SA
Do you expect your sugar ba by to send you nudes and text messages when you're not seeing each other? (if you allow it) I don't like nudes, but if she's at the gym and sends a pic of her working out is cool, or just sends a pic from her work to say hi. I like text messages that say hi or whatever, obviously I would not expect them every day, unless she initiates.
I guess online is the most straightforward way for me to reach out to young (~25yr) women.
I flirt with young women i meet repeatedly, but no opening there.
I'm looking for weekly meeting, with different kind of meeting. Lunch encounters to chat. Cultural activities (movies, theater, museums, music shows, etc.) And intimate evenings. Always planned ahead.
Over that, occasionnal weekend adventures, upon agreement (extra $$).
Allowance
3000 to 4000 $ per month. Based time spent.
Not now but i used to.
No, i seek a sb/sd relationship with a good connection. Sex matters, on appropriate occasion.
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Tbh, I've never really been in a financial situation where this type of relationship is an option. Having said that, I've seen quite a few conversations about it over the years and it is something I've thought about if circumstances were to allow me to do it. I think for me, it would likely have to be a pay per meet thing as opposed to a monthly or whatever allowance. That's not an absolute mind you. That would also allow her some freedom in regards to her time and schedule. I know that some of the stuff I've read in the past suggested that the guy expected the lady to be available whenever he was in the mood.I get that the guy is paying her a fairly large some of money but I find that kinda crass and it wouldn't be in my nature. Having dealt with the public for most of my working life, I've seen so many people with a sense of entitlement, it just puts me off and I make sure I am never like that.
As for budget, obviously that would depend on what my disposable income was. Just as it is when seeing an escort. If I have enough for a 3hr dinner date and fun and it's one of the beautiful ladies I know or even someone I'm meeting for the first time but is a lady I think I would like that with, I go for it and enjoy a wonderful evening. But then there are times when it's just a day off work and dammit, I'm horny and want to play, lol. At any rate, if I were to ever be in the situation, I would compensate the lady well for her time and wherever that price tag falls, sobeit. If I were rich, I probably would have no problem giving her a monthly allowance but I don't know what that is. The cost of everything these days has gotten so high that it's hard to put a set number on things. Hell, whatever the cost, it's still a fuck of a lot cheaper than what my ex-wife cost me. Besides, I'm at a point in my life where I know I'm not taking anything with me so to hell with it. Roof overhead, clothes on my back and food in my belly and a bit of a social life with friends. What else does an old dawg really need besides a little fun in the bedroom.
I'm not sure if my response is even helpful to the conversation but it's just my ramblings and musings on the subject. Cheers everyone.
As for budget, obviously that would depend on what my disposable income was. Just as it is when seeing an escort. If I have enough for a 3hr dinner date and fun and it's one of the beautiful ladies I know or even someone I'm meeting for the first time but is a lady I think I would like that with, I go for it and enjoy a wonderful evening. But then there are times when it's just a day off work and dammit, I'm horny and want to play, lol. At any rate, if I were to ever be in the situation, I would compensate the lady well for her time and wherever that price tag falls, sobeit. If I were rich, I probably would have no problem giving her a monthly allowance but I don't know what that is. The cost of everything these days has gotten so high that it's hard to put a set number on things. Hell, whatever the cost, it's still a fuck of a lot cheaper than what my ex-wife cost me. Besides, I'm at a point in my life where I know I'm not taking anything with me so to hell with it. Roof overhead, clothes on my back and food in my belly and a bit of a social life with friends. What else does an old dawg really need besides a little fun in the bedroom.
I'm not sure if my response is even helpful to the conversation but it's just my ramblings and musings on the subject. Cheers everyone.
That’s what my clients say. It’s expensive but a lot cheaper than a divorce or sometimes trying to plan something for their wife
In addition to my previous responses to your questions (see earlier in this thread), I have a few more thoughts.
The vitality of the sugar scene varies from city to city, depending a lot on the legal and cultural tolerance for paid sex in a given city/province/state.
Montreal has a very tolerant and well-defined environment for prostitution. For most visitors to Montreal it is the North American Adult Disneyland of paid sex, especially compared to where they live. The only cities in North America that are close to Montreal's level of safety and tolerance are Toronto and maybe Vancouver. Sure, with a bit of research and experience, you can find good sex workers in cities like New York, LA, Miami, etc. But it's just not as easy.
So in a place like Montreal where it's so easy to find great escorts, whether agency girls or indy girls, why would guys resort to the sugar scene? And why would girls choose that route when it is so easy to work as an escort?
Well, there are some understandable reasons why some guys and girls might prefer the sugar scene to to escort scene. For one, some guys and girls think of sugaring as somehow more acceptable than straightforward paid sex. Whether it is or not is debatable--to me they are just two roads to the same place. One road is fast, easy and direct, like a four lane highway. The other road is like driving on the back roads to the same place-slower, more time-consuming and for some people more rewarding.
But in a city like Montreal, most guys, especially visitors, are going to take the highway-the escort route. I think most local guys do too. In such an environment, many guys are just not going to bother with the sugar scene. So women in a city like Montreal are going to have a harder time finding a real, longterm sugar daddy than guys in cities with less tolerant legal and cultural environments for paid sex. If a guy in Montreal really wants a sugar relationship, it's easier just to try to convert a favorite escort into a sugar baby--many escorts are willing to consider that kind of relationship.
Why would some girls still resort to the sugar scene in a place like Montreal? I think there are two main reasons: 1) Some girls just can't bring themselves to take the BIG STEP of thinking of themselves as a sex worker; and 2) As I stated in my responses above, some girls are OK with getting paid for sex but they want to be able to choose their own client(s)--that's impossible to do if you work for an agency and pretty hard if you are an indy.
In cities less tolerant of paid sex than Montreal, the sugar scene operates as a substitute or alternative to the escort market. You can find escorts anywhere if you know how and where to look and if you can pay the market price. But some places these days make it so difficult and sometimes dangerous for clients and sex providers to find each other and do business, that alternative kinds of markets get started.
The genius of Seeking is that it is just far enough on the side of legality and legitimacy that it operates pretty freely in markets where paid sex is just too scary for a lot of people. There are lots of places in "flyover country" in the U.S. (and in Canada too) where both potential clients and providers are greatly inhibited from participating in paid sex. Seeking is an outlet for them, though it is not anything like the market for escorts. It take a lot of effort, including making a good profile, sorting through profiles, messaging, meeting in person, negotiating a deal and then finally, hopefully consummating it. It's time consuming and not every encounter winds up in a long term relationship.
But for those who have patience and maybe enjoy the game, it's worth it. At least I can say that it has been for me. But would I use it if I lived in Montreal? Maybe but only as a sometime diversion from the escort scene. Some visitors say they have used it but given how much time it can take to convert a "potential" into a sex partner, it's just not a good bet.
So my advice to your friends is: if they are already doing escorting, they should try to convert a current or future client into a sugar daddy. If they do not want to escort but are willing to try sugaring, well, bonne chance , but you may find it frustrating in Montreal.
Very good points @CaptRenault . There's definitely a lot there to think about on both sides of the equation. If I were in the position to go this route, it would definitely have to be with a lady I've spent a good amount of time with already and have very good chemistry with.
Not really that much to think about. If you are in a place like Montreal or Germany then the only reason to use Seeking is if you are really seeking something novel or a deal that includes social time for a weekly or monthly “allowance”. Most guys on Seeking are not really looking for that and most girls probably won’t find it. But in places like Paris or Flyover USA where it is much more challenging to find good, reasonably priced escorts, then Seeking is a good alternative for guys to find paid sex and women who are offering it
Many of you seem to be assuming that anyone on Seeking wants a paid girlfriend type relationship. Some do but many girls are just “amateur escorts” i.e. girls who are willing to do paid sex as long as they can pick their clients(s) and who hope to get repeat business from just one or a few clients. In our minds their is no difference but to the girls there is an important difference. With Seeking, assuming they screen their client(s) well, there is no danger of being exposed as a prostitute. Their profile is just on a “dating” site. But most of the girls readily agree to “pay per meeting”-or PPM. Same as an escort but just a different road to get there.
One other difference—girls on Seeking are more likely to offer free social time, like lunch or dinner, along with paid sex. I have found some escorts will do that but not usually. Seeking girls will often do it because it makes them feel like they are just going on a date (again so not prostitution).
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