View Poll Results: Does the outcall business need to be "reengineered"?

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  • The outcall business should be reengineered, but it won't happen.

    6 24.00%
  • The outcall business functions fine as it is.

    4 16.00%
  • Someday, a smart agency will reengineer the outcall business to make it more "client friendly".

    15 60.00%
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Thread: Can the outcall industry be "reengineered"?

  1. #1
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    Can the outcall industry be "reengineered"?

    I'm not somebody to talk with any authority about the outcall business in Canada, but part of the reason for that is that I don't feel comfortable with the way the industry functions in Canada.

    Any of you who have worked or travelled overseas will know what I'm trying to say. Take a look at Banger's review from Saigon in the "Other Cities" thread if you want to get an idea of how things function elsewhere.

    To put it simply, my limited experience with outcalls in Canada tells me that the experience involves the following: a call from the client to the agency; the girl arrives at the hotel room; since the girl works on an hourly basis, the client has at most 15-20 minutes to get to know the girl before they progress to having sex together.

    Personally, I don't function that way. It's hard for me to have sex with somebody I've just met 15 minutes before.

    I've worked in Africa, Asia and the Philippines. In all these places, there isn't much of an "outcall" business as such. Instead, men and SPs congregate at certain bars to meet. The client is able to look over the ladies available in a natural setting and then approach the one he likes. If the girl is interested, the two begin their "date" by dancing and sitting together and chatting. This can last for thirty minutes or several hours. Then, if the girl feels safe with the man, she goes home with him. She might stay for one hour but often stays longer, sometimes even the whole night. There is no telephone call after one hour to tell her she has to leave. In the morning, the girl asks for her "taxi money", the fair amount already being known to both the man and woman.

    In China, certain hotels arrange to have the girls downstairs with the clients where everybody sings and dances together. People can go up to a room when they want. It's not quite as relaxed at the African experience, but resembles something more like a "saloon" in western movies with entertainment downstairs and rooms upstairs.

    In Canada, even if you take an SP on a real date, you still have to pay on an hourly basis. So that means that if you have spend two hours having dinner and having drinks at a bar, you will need to pay for three hours by the time you finish your one hour in the hotel. Three hours is at least $450.

    I wonder if the reason that many woman have unpleasant encounters with clients is that they don't have any means to screen the client, while the client for his part is rushing, trying to get DATY, BJ and multible SOG before the clock runs out.

    Is there any solution? Should the outcall business be reworked to make it more natural and less rushed? Is it even possible in the Canadian context?

  2. #2
    franky sayz
    not likely. the reason the scene works this way is because the providors want it to work this way. The girls and the agencies all make more money by having it be a quick wham bam thankyou and on to the next client. The girls want to make the most money in the least amount of time. I have had one or two escorts meet me on the side and a more relaxed pace was had by all. The nicest ,"offer" was an SP who suggested we go out on the town. I would only pay her for the time in the hotel having sex. Otherwise I would just treat her to the dinner, or movie etc. It was great, but alas how many are willing to do this? Few I suspect.
    So there it is , little will change
    franky

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by franky
    franky sayz
    not likely. the reason the scene works this way is because the providors want it to work this way. The girls and the agencies all make more money by having it be a quick wham bam thankyou and on to the next client. The girls want to make the most money in the least amount of time. I have had one or two escorts meet me on the side and a more relaxed pace was had by all. The nicest ,"offer" was an SP who suggested we go out on the town. I would only pay her for the time in the hotel having sex. Otherwise I would just treat her to the dinner, or movie etc. It was great, but alas how many are willing to do this? Few I suspect.
    So there it is , little will change
    franky
    I understand what you are saying. However, Chinese, Africans and Filipinos all like money too. And they still manage to make the business more friendly and natural.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Happy Buddha
    Chinese, Africans and Filipinos
    It works that way in those countries because the average salary there is like $1000/year. So when you go there with your western salary, everything seems cheap. But in fact, if you were a local, you would probably be paying the equivalent of Montreal prices or more.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by longtimers
    FHB
    I know a place where the owner of the bar/strip club/motel will accept to have SP and MP in his business and deal with the customer the way you mention. The place is a bit far away from Montreal, it's in Clarenceville near Chez Diane bar. The place is call the Manoir Champlain, they advertise few months ago on this board.

    If we can convince an agency owner to bring fews girls and gatter enought hobbyist in the same night we might have an explosive combination to make this happen
    I will go fishing in few agency and ask the owner if they might be interested in such experience. My opinion is that the high season is over and any good suggestion to bring some business to an agency is worth a try!

    I'll get back to you on my fishing...

    Longtimer
    Sounds very interesting! The perfect GT!

    Now, if you could just convince the owner of Cleo's to turn the upstairs bar into bedrooms, we would see the beginning of a Golden Age in hobbying in Montreal.
    Last edited by Fat Happy Buddha; 01-11-2007 at 11:47 PM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Happy Buddha
    Is there any solution? Should the outcall business be reworked to make it more natural and less rushed? Is it even possible in the Canadian context?
    No chance, especially in poor Montreal where at $160/hour, it has become a volume business, i.e. bang as many dudes as possible to make the SP, the agency owner and the driver happy.

    Here is an idea for an indy - the clock only starts after dinner. I think this is reasonable but then again, I am not selling my time or body.

    GG

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler
    It works that way in those countries because the average salary there is like $1000/year. So when you go there with your western salary, everything seems cheap. But in fact, if you were a local, you would probably be paying the equivalent of Montreal prices or more.
    To a certain extent you are right, but this is not the case in China. In some of the establishments there, it is rare to find a foreignor. Also, even in African there are lots of locals.

    Sometimes I wonder if it's not a bit like the tea ceremony. For Japanese the buildup to drinking the tea is just as or even more important than drinking the tea itself.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by General Gonad
    No chance, especially in poor Montreal where at $160/hour, it has become a volume business, i.e. bang as many dudes as possible to make the SP, the agency owner and the driver happy.

    Here is an idea for an indy - the clock only starts after dinner. I think this is reasonable but then again, I am not selling my time or body.

    GG
    Or what if there were two prices for "regular" time and "hotel" time. For example, $70/hr (the same as a psychologist!!) for time spent with dinner, drinks, etc. Then the normal rate for hotel time.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Happy Buddha
    Or what if there were two prices for "regular" time and "hotel" time. For example, $70/hr (the same as a psychologist!!) for time spent with dinner, drinks, etc. Then the normal rate for hotel time.
    Most indies I know of have a dinnerdate rate - and that is exactly how that is calculated. I used to be happy to meet people socially outside of SP time, unfortunately, most also took advantage of my kindness...

    There are plenty of ways to get to meet SPs before you get naked - we have Meet and Greets, they are great for getting to know a few of the ladies... I know I know a bit more about some of the guys here and would be very comfy getting naked with them (lol)

    xoxox
    Anik
    Last edited by Just-ass-weet; 01-12-2007 at 12:23 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by longtimers
    If we can convince an agency owner to bring fews girls and gatter enought hobbyist in the same night we might have an explosive combination to make this happen
    I will go fishing in few agency and ask the owner if they might be interested in such experience. My opinion is that the high season is over and any good suggestion to bring some business to an agency is worth a try!

    Quote Originally Posted by General Gonad
    No chance, especially in poor Montreal where at $160/hour, it has become a volume business, i.e. bang as many dudes as possible to make the SP, the agency owner and the driver happy.

    GG
    GG, the key it to keep a positive attitude like longtimers. Look at the guy. The poll isn't up ten minutes and he's proposing solutions.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just-ass-weet
    Most indies I know of have a dinnerdate rate - and that is exactly how that is calculated. I used to be happy to meet people socially outside of SP time, unfortunately, most also took advantage of my kindness...

    xoxox
    Anik
    Thanks, Anik, for that information. As I said, I don't know the local industry well.

    I would be very interested to read your take on this poll. Do you think the outcall business be improved?

  12. #12
    I'm actually the opposite. I much prefer the outcall, I guess because I'm really embarrassed of being seen going into places, even though I know I'm really far from home, I'll never see these people again, I absolutely couldn't do unless I got HAMMERED when I was in Thailand. I mean, there were married couple tourists walking on Sukhumvit and I was debating whether to walk into Soi Cowboy or whatever it was, and decided I needed to drink more at the bar before I could do that. I finally did it though. Then the getting them into the hotel thing, god, fortunately at my hotel, I was in the annex building, so I just went up, but if I went to the main building, Iw ould have probably had to go to the front desk and let them know, because they'd probably stop her anyways.. I hear Costa Rica is the same way. Just people knowing what I"m going to be doing really bothered me. When I was in Phuket, I saw the same woman twice, and fortunately I was pretty drunk so it didn't bug me too much when she gave her ID to the hotel worker.. On my last night in Thailand, I finally found the Lolitas BJ bar, which once I got passed my embarrassment of going in (I must have drank forever at Corleones across the street) i went it, and really like it. If I ever go back, I'd probably just go there instead of ladybars. The only ladybar in BKK I went to was the one that had the glass floors where they danced..

    Anyways, sorry, I digressed. I just really, really, really prefer the outcall experience. I normally, though not always, get 2 hours anyways. Spend a while to get to know them (you'r right about that, I absolutely cannot have sex with someone I don't know, I won't get off).. drink some wine, then get to it. 1 hour is iffy for me. This 1/2 hour thingy in Europe is really going to suck for me. It literally takes me a minimum of a half hour to get off, that's AFTER talking with them for a b it, but hopefully there will be some decent talking at the FKK place I'm going to...

    But I'm literally CRAVING going back to Toronto and Montreal to do the outcall thing again. I like them coming to my room. It used to make me incredibly nervous. I would literally vomit from being so nervous the first time or two I did it, now I could call up sober and do it. I wish to God it were legal where I live. Wow, okay, maybe he wouldn't want that, but you know what I mean..

    Oh, and though it's too late, I've seen SPs that asked if I wanted to have dinner with them afters (no charge). I paid, but it was pretty interesting to get to know them better. One of them even drove me. I know it's too late for that particular time, but if you see them again, you know them pretty well.

  13. #13
    Having a GT in a place with rooms upstairs would attract the laws pertaining to communicating and bawdy house and then all would be doomed

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamelessdork
    I'm actually the opposite. ....but if you see them again, you know them pretty well.
    Your post was really interesting dude. Are you serious about the name Lolitas BJ Bar? Sounds like such a name would be illegal, even in Thailand.
    Last edited by Fat Happy Buddha; 01-12-2007 at 12:51 AM.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Happy Buddha
    Your post was really interesting dude. Are you serious about the name Lolitas BJ Bar? Sounds like it would be illegal.

    I don't think a BJ bar would be legal, but I would sure like to go to one. Yeah, that's probably not a good name, even for Thailand, unless you want to get on some pedo watchlist or something. They should call it 18+ Lolitas BJ Bar. I miss it though. I really would love to go back to Thailand just for that place, as I don't think I'd be able to go to the ladybars, but damn, that food is SO good there.

    When I was in Phuket, I would hang at a regular bar called "Champs" and their Massaman curry was SO good. Wow....... I want to go back so badly.. But It's SUCH a long flight, costs so much. There was a place in Phuket that I was too scared to go to. It was basically a giant Brothel/Massage place. Pretty huge building for Patpong Beach. I loved the street food venders. I loved eating rambutans, playing pool at Champs. I drank SO much though. I never even went to the beach once except to take a look. went to the ladybar area two nights when I was in Phuket. Both times I went to the same empty bar and played connect four with the girl, and she went home with me both nights. I was too scared to go elsewhere. The women made me feel frightened and stuff. I just wasn't meant to do that. That's why outcall is for me. I guess my name rings true even when they're not going to reject you! I don't know why I was afraid, I just was!

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