Hamas & Israel

[minutemenX]

It’s about time to definitely get rid of hamas and the Jewish illegal settlements that are a problem for peace and the creation of a viable and peaceful Palestinian state.

Now settlements. Just another reason to continue the hate propaganda. Have you seen them? These are not settlements. Many of them are cities of tens of thousands with well developed infrastructure and industries. You want to blow them up? Forget about it, they are legal under Israeli law and they about to stay. Many countries claim that the whole Israel is illegal, so what? Palestinians were given 95% of all territory they wanted, and Arafat refused. They can continue “fighting” and loose much more. This is how world borders were drawn for centuries. Nobody vacates anything voluntarily. Ask 12 million Germans expelled from lands now in Czech Republic, Poland and the former Königsberg. Germans have been living in these places for centuries and in many were the majority. Japan lost Pacific islands to Russia that were also always Japanese. And what about half of California, Texas etc. These were Mexico not too long ago with predominant Latino population. Arabs lost countless wars to Israel. Palestinians already have state. It is Jordan where 75% are the so- called Palestinians and there is plenty of space still. By the way, Arab countries expelled more local Jews than Israel Arabs but they were absorbed by Israel and not claiming any refugee status or compensation.

 

[Alegit]

Now settlements. Just another reason to continue the hate propaganda. Have you seen them? These are not settlements. Many of them are cities of tens of thousands with well developed infrastructure and industries. You want to blow them up? Forget about it, they are legal under Israeli law and they about to stay. Many countries claim that the whole Israel is illegal, so what? Palestinians were given 95% of all territory they wanted, and Arafat refused. They can continue “fighting” and loose much more. This is how world borders were drawn for centuries. Nobody vacates anything voluntarily. Ask 12 million Germans expelled from lands now in Czech Republic, Poland and the former Königsberg. Germans have been living in these places for centuries and in many were the majority. Japan lost Pacific islands to Russia that were also always Japanese. And what about half of California, Texas etc. These were Mexico not too long ago with predominant Latino population. Arabs lost countless wars to Israel. Palestinians already have state. It is Jordan where 75% are the so- called Palestinians and there is plenty of space still. By the way, Arab countries expelled more local Jews than Israel Arabs but they were absorbed by Israel and not claiming any refugee status or compensation.

Mexico, japan, czech and so lost territories NOT THEIR COUNTRY. Jews from all over the world came to Israel in 1948 after more than a thousand years they were citizens elsewhere. Funny how you talking about 75% of jordan's being palestinian. If theres a public DNA compaign over all Israel... u dont wanna know. Despite all the histrorical narrative, the wars and the propaganda from each sides, hamas and this criminal governement of netanyahu, people there have the right to live in peace without fear and without hate. Cut the bullshit and criticize what must be criticize and stop defending the indefensible

 

[minutemenX]

Mexico, japan, czech and so lost territories NOT THEIR COUNTRY. Jews from all over the world came to Israel in 1948 after more than a thousand years they were citizens elsewhere. Funny how you talking about 75% of jordan's being palestinian. If theres a public DNA compaign over all Israel... u dont wanna know. Despite all the histrorical narrative, the wars and the propaganda from each sides, hamas and this criminal governement of netanyahu, people there have the right to live in peace without fear and without hate. Cut the bullshit and criticize what must be criticize and stop defending the indefensible

You are ignorant. Most Germans were expelled from territories that was Germany (Eastern Prussia). California and part of Texas was Mexico. Pacific islands was Japan proper. Anyway, there is the status quo now. It needs to be accepted by all sides as alternative only leads to perpetual war and misery

 

[minutemenX]

Yes, they should live without fear where they currently are. For this they need to abandon the so called "armed resistance" and all terrorist activities, change school curriculum recognizing Israel and promoting the peaceful co-existence. They should have all local autonomy that eventually may reach the federal state status or even the separate state by showing a mutually beneficial peaceful co-existence. This is the only way. Local Israel-proper Arab population (25% of total) is given the full citizenship and is not deprived of anything. Their standard of living is well above any Arab people in the neighboring countries and is Israel average.

 

[EagerBeaver]

This is the only way. Local Israel-proper Arab population (25% of total) is given the full citizenship and is not deprived of anything. Their standard of living is well above any Arab people in the neighboring countries and is Israel average.

There are many Israeli Arabs serving in the Knesset and the IDF as well. The Israeli Arabs who serve in the IDF are all volunteers; unlike Jews, they are not conscripted. Both male and female Jews are conscripted at age 18.

 

[Alegit]

You are ignorant. Most Germans were expelled from territories that was Germany (Eastern Prussia). California and part of Texas was Mexico. Pacific islands was Japan proper. Anyway, there is the status quo now. It needs to be accepted by all sides as alternative only leads to perpetual war and misery

How Im I ignorant mate? Theres still a country named Germany, Mexico and Japan and many others. As far as I know, palestine as a state doesnt exist...

Yes, mentality have to change of course, for both side. Before that, I think actions have to be shown. You cant beat a dog and expect him to be obeissant. Didnt jews in Varsovie resist ? South africans didnt resist ? To be clear here, hamas is a group of terrorists and I would slay them all till theres no one remains. We should not give ourself illusions Doing the same thing and expect a different result is madness statu quo has created hamas and will create something that I fear would be much worse. Man give them people hope... There's Mahmoud Abbas in the west bank, this guy want peace. Netanyahou doesnt wanna deal with him, why? Netanyahou gave the keys to hamas in gaza, why? Peace is like dancing you need a partner

I get your point they have rights like other citizens when they live outside the west bank/gaza. I still call it domination

I hope this debate will stay resepectful my friend

 

[Halloween Mike]

Now settlements. Just another reason to continue the hate propaganda. Have you seen them? These are not settlements. Many of them are cities of tens of thousands with well developed infrastructure and industries. You want to blow them up? Forget about it, they are legal under Israeli law and they about to stay. Nobody vacates anything voluntarily.

I am very on the side of Israel as i said many times, but this is THE one thing that kinda bug me. Its not about the "settlement" that are already existing. As you mention it would be a big issue to expell everyone and then what? Destroy it all? Nah... My issue is they keep MAKING MORE. This need to stop. They know its a problem and a reason why a lot of peoples are against them. Something clear has to be put in place for this. Because if Israel continue to expend... i can see them (peoples in the Westbank) having a point.

Gaza on the other hand is a different thing. Israel got out and look what it became? Yes there was restrictions on it, but the peoples calling it an "open air prison" are dellusional. Israel HAD to put some security. And even ...what they did was not enough clearly. My only solution for Gaza is that Egypt (whatever they want it or not) should absorb it. At least its an Arab country, maybe this could ease the whole thing.

I can't see "Palestine" as a country, at least not in Gaza, because the peoples are too radicalized. Its sad to say but Israel would need a "demilitarized zone" like the Koreas between them. I just think the world do not do enough to find a solution...

 

[minutemenX]

My only solution for Gaza is that Egypt (whatever they want it or not) should absorb it. At least its an Arab country, maybe this could ease the whole thing.

Why no country wants Palestinians:

 

[snakejack]

Now settlements. Just another reason to continue the hate propaganda. Have you seen them? These are not settlements. Many of them are cities of tens of thousands with well developed infrastructure and industries. You want to blow them up? Forget about it, they are legal under Israeli law and they about to stay. Many countries claim that the whole Israel is illegal, so what? Palestinians were given 95% of all territory they wanted, and Arafat refused. They can continue “fighting” and loose much more. This is how world borders were drawn for centuries. Nobody vacates anything voluntarily. Ask 12 million Germans expelled from lands now in Czech Republic, Poland and the former Königsberg. Germans have been living in these places for centuries and in many were the majority. Japan lost Pacific islands to Russia that were also always Japanese. And what about half of California, Texas etc. These were Mexico not too long ago with predominant Latino population. Arabs lost countless wars to Israel. Palestinians already have state. It is Jordan where 75% are the so- called Palestinians and there is plenty of space still. By the way, Arab countries expelled more local Jews than Israel Arabs but they were absorbed by Israel and not claiming any refugee status or compensation.

Then Israel must exchange territory. For every sq meter taken they must give land somewhere else.

 

[minutemenX]

Then Israel must exchange territory. For every sq meter taken they must give land somewhere else.

Sure, that what is happening. Europeans exterminated 6M Jews during WWII and now importing millions of Arabs instead.

 

[snakejack]

Sure, that what is happening. Europeans exterminated 6M Jews during WWII and now importing millions of Arabs instead.

In the 6 millions all were not Jews. Political opponents,
Homosexuals and others are included in the estimation.

This being said, if the Jews want peace they can have it by stopping the illegals settlements and exchanging land.

I don’t know how would react Xman if I go to your house and settle myself in your backyard…

 

[minutemenX]

In the 6 millions all were not Jews. Political opponents,
Homosexuals and others are included in the estimation.

This being said, if the Jews want peace they can have it by stopping the illegals settlements and exchanging land.

I don’t know how would react Xman if I go to your house and settle myself in your backyard…

Who said that Israel is robing Palestinians from their land? Nobody evicts people from their homes or taking municipal land. The new settlements are built on the empty unused land. If somebody has a deed on the empty parcel of land or if in the very rare occasion it is used as an agricultural land, then he is proposed compensation at the market rate, and it is lots of money. In fact, majority agree to sell land voluntary despite the following persecution from the Palestinian authority.

 

[Zero_Six]

Who said that Israel is robing Palestinians from their land? Nobody evicts people from their homes or taking municipal land. The new settlements are built on the empty unused land. If somebody has a deed on the empty parcel of land or if in the very rare occasion it is used as an agricultural land, then he is proposed compensation at the market rate, and it is lots of money. In fact, majority agree to sell land voluntary despite the following persecution from the Palestinian authority.

There's plenty of proof online about Israelis stealing Palestinian's land. But I'm sure you'd just consider that all propaganda. Here's some links anyways.

Under cover of war, extremists are seizing Palestinian land – they hope permanently

Israeli extremists are working to make settlements in the West Bank irreversible, analysts fear.

www.bbc.com

Israel's Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession

Mass human rights violations during the 50-year occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip have devastated the lives of millions of Palestinians.

www.amnesty.org

Israel wants to steal even more of Palestine. - JVP

The weapons and tactics used to target Palestinians abroad inevitably find their way back to the country supplying them (the U.S).

www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org

Seized, settled, let: how Airbnb and Booking.com help Israelis make money from stolen Palestinian land

As Israel deploys tanks in the West Bank for the first time in 20 years, we reveal how two of the world’s biggest travel companies are helping settlers commercialise stolen land

www.theguardian.com

 

[minutemenX]

There's plenty of proof online about Israelis stealing Palestinian's land. But I'm sure you'd just consider that all propaganda. Here's some links anyways.

They are “stealing” an empty, unoccupied, unused and often arid land that does not have any documented owner, bringing water, electricity, and communications and making it livable. Do you know the English proverb “The Dog on the Manger”? It describes the situation.

 

[Zero_Six]

They are “stealing” an empty, unoccupied, unused and often arid land that does not have any documented owner, bringing water, electricity, and communications and making it livable. Do you know the English proverb “The Dog on the Manger”? It describes the situation.

The land is unused because a permit is required. Who hands out the permits? Israel, of course. By their own admission, they reject 95% of permit requests from Palestinians.

John Oliver did a good episode that covers all this.

 

[minutemenX]

Often permits are not given because requester failed to provide viable development plan due to luck of sufficient resources and technical inability. Resources are lucking because large sums of aid money that Palestinians receive are either stolen or used to support “struggle” (read terror).

Luxury Alongside Poverty in the Palestinian Authority

In the Palestinian Authority, a surprising degree of luxury exists alongside poverty - Luxury Alongside Poverty in the Palestinian Authority - JCPA

jcpa.org

Netanyahu is widely criticized by the press and other mass media in Israel for luxurious living. Below is the photo of his residence

And this is the photo of Abu Abbas residence, the head of the Palestinian authority. He has never been criticized in the Palestinian media for luxurious living.

 

[snakejack]

Who said that Israel is robing Palestinians from their land? Nobody evicts people from their homes or taking municipal land. The new settlements are built on the empty unused land. If somebody has a deed on the empty parcel of land or if in the very rare occasion it is used as an agricultural land, then he is proposed compensation at the market rate, and it is lots of money. In fact, majority agree to sell land voluntary despite the following persecution from the Palestinian authority.

Come on. Stop writing this. All bullshit. Please, stop this you’re ridiculous.

Illegal settlements must be stopped.

 

[minutemenX]

Come on. Stop writing this. All bullshit.

“Where you stand depends on where you sit.” English
“The reverse side also has a reverse side.” Japanese

 

[snakejack]

“Where you stand depends on where you sit.” English
“The reverse side also has a reverse side.” Japanese

I stand on my side and support the eradication of all extremists, including Hamas and illegal settlers and the right wing Israeli cabinet members.

 

[snakejack]

“Where you stand depends on where you sit.” English
“The reverse side also has a reverse side.” Japanese

Read this…. Where do you stand on this specific subject ?

‘Olives are everything for us’: West Bank farmers prevented from harvesting by settler violence

About 70% of town’s olives are inaccessible without risking a potentially fatal clash with Israeli settlers

www.theguardian.com