Nice la Presse Article on XO this morning
- Thread starter felixLg
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I don’t know it depends on many factors but I don’t think we could charge $280 and all make equal profit maybe I’m wrong
A lot of professionals who went to university and have to pay licensing fees and income taxes charge around or less than that in many cases.
I don’t know who said providers working in agencies are all victims but it wasn’t me. Like I said many times, there are good agencies. I have friends working in good ones in Toronto.
Some agencies, especially in Montreal are very exploitative. Yes, in those cases, providers working there could be victims
Side topic, I know a lot of providers living in Montreal that simply refuse to work here because they don’t like the clientele. No, that has nothing to do with money but just in the general attitude
In the 10+ years I’ve been working, I’ve often heard providers calling Montreal a boot camp “if you can survive working in Montreal, you can work anywhere”
Some agencies, especially in Montreal are very exploitative. Yes, in those cases, providers working there could be victims
Side topic, I know a lot of providers living in Montreal that simply refuse to work here because they don’t like the clientele. No, that has nothing to do with money but just in the general attitude
In the 10+ years I’ve been working, I’ve often heard providers calling Montreal a boot camp “if you can survive working in Montreal, you can work anywhere”
Mais genre mec! Pourquoi tu ramènes tout le temps d’autres professions. Do you not realize it has absolutely no correlation.
Si tu peux garder tes vêtements et ne pas avoir à coucher avec des inconnus qui se battent avec toi pour ne pas se doucher, bien sûr que les prix sont différents. Je ne pense pas que ça soit difficile de comprendre que les escortes chargent ce qui les rendent confortable pour la tâche à effectuer
No, it is not the same.
A lot of people who are for decriminalization of prostitution want sex workers to have rights and don't want us to be exploited and in danger. We never said ''agency girls are nothing but victims'', most of us have worked for spas and agencies and we never said it was unethical to do business with agencies, you are just choosing to read things in an overly simplistic way. We can denounce poor working conditions of certain workers and exploitation, or talk about abusive client behavior, without wanting to abolish prostitution.
There is a difference between being anti sex work, and being realistic about the industry. Personally I understand why girls choose to work for agencies, they have good marketing and they know they will have clients. Things aren't black or white tho, everything isn't just ''IT'S WRONG'' or ''IT'S AMAZING'', there are shades of gray in everything, including the sex industry. The more vulnerable you are and the more it's obvious you need money, the more you are likely to be targeted by predators and exploited. Saying that doesn't mean we agree with radfem abolitionists, it's just the truth.
Not everyone can be indy or at least not right away, and a lot of the issues we face, particularly the most marginalized workers, is because of the law that criminalizes clients and prevents providers from working together and having rights and support. For instance, because clients are criminalized, it's a lot harder to be independent since clients are afraid of the police, and everything is pushed underground. A girl who hosts from home could lose her housing if her landlords find out that she has clients over too. The fact that we are marginalized workers gives these employers a lot of power. We just want girls who enter the industry and work for agencies and spas to have good experiences, that's all. The business model that is held by some agencies and some MPs do not make it sustainable for the workers.
A lot of people who join this industry are in a bad place financially and can't afford to rent an incall or to brand themselves a certain way. Does this mean they are not making a choice by entering this industry? Absolutely not. That isn't the same as being groomed or trafficked. But I think it's sticking your head in the sand to ignore that these women are not vulnerable to falling into certtain traps.
None of us said all agencies are bad. I also have friends in Toronto who work for agencies and love their work place. I also know people who have worked for spas and really love it. We also didn't say that clients who go to agencies are inherently shitty. It's annoying that we can't have nuanced conversations here.
We are NOT talking about ''the ethics of paying for sex'' here! We are talking about abusive working environments! This is an entirely different subject!
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This whole affair comforts me on 2 levels. First I'm glad I see only independent SP's who are most likely in the business after carefully thinking it over. They get to screen their clients and they keep 100% of the money.
Also, I am glad that nobody around me knows about my secret life with escorts. This world can be really nasty with abusive clients and pimps (operating an escort agency makes you a pimp).
By not telling anyone, I don't have to justify myself by explaining that I am not abusing anybody and that the encounter is pleasant for the two persons involved. The first thing I say to the lady I meet is « thank you for accepting my invitation » and she usually replies with « thank you for inviting me ». Whether it is the first time or the tenth time I see her, I am always grateful because even though I paid for it, I figure I'm asking for a big favor and I feel lucky that they agreed to spend time with me.
This XO affair, exposing the dark side of the business, is bad for everybody.
Also, I am glad that nobody around me knows about my secret life with escorts. This world can be really nasty with abusive clients and pimps (operating an escort agency makes you a pimp).
By not telling anyone, I don't have to justify myself by explaining that I am not abusing anybody and that the encounter is pleasant for the two persons involved. The first thing I say to the lady I meet is « thank you for accepting my invitation » and she usually replies with « thank you for inviting me ». Whether it is the first time or the tenth time I see her, I am always grateful because even though I paid for it, I figure I'm asking for a big favor and I feel lucky that they agreed to spend time with me.
This XO affair, exposing the dark side of the business, is bad for everybody.
Yeah well Montreal is not Toronto or Vancouver. People seem to have forgotten that Montreal was in economic decline for a long while and that cost of living and salaries are STILL lower here so escort agencies prices reflect that.
Yet if you follow the abolitionist discourse you would know that all sex workers are victims. Some of the them are just not aware of it yet. In time they will see themselves as such.
!!!
I can confirm the blackmailing, I was a part of XO in my early days. A reason I never exposed myself as an XO provider after the outrageous experiences I lived through my first 4 months of escorting, I was young naive …. All I can say is I am grateful they finally got caught and are no longer in business !!!!
I think it's really weird that you are weaponizing abolitionist discourse in order to maintain the status quo about abuse and exploitation in the sex industry, but that's just me. lol
Nobody here has said that all sex workers are ''victims'' with no voice and no options. There's a difference between talking about the violence that sex workers experience, and removing their agency & reducing them to nothing but victims.
If it is explained to them properly, someone can understand very well the difference between a sex worker who sees good clients who respect her boundaries, and someone who is being exploited. They can understand the difference between a respectful client and someone who is just trying to exploit weakness. Same thing for employers.. this industry is not regulated, so obviously there will be huge differences between how a business is managed compared to another, even if there are certain patterns that come back.
I think it's really odd to say ''nobody should talk about XO or about abusive clients because we want to maintain a good image of the industry''.. uh.. sounds like this lacks nuance, but ok
Je ne pense pas avoir fait ce genre de comparaison ailleurs. À moins que tu compte quand j'ai mentionné que les SP qui n'aiment pas leurs conditions peuvent walk away si tel est leur choix, comme n'importe qui d'autres. Ce qui d'ailleurs semble arriver très souvent.
Ce que je remarque c'est que certaines ici ne semblent vraiment pas apprécier quand on écrit des choses avec lesquelles elles sont en désaccord ou qu'on les challenge un peu même si on reste très poli.
Je vais avouer que je suis pas sûr de saisir ton commentaire sur la douche. Mon but était juste de souligner que 280/h ce n'est pas un taux horaire de crève faim. Et oui je sais que les escortes ne font pas 40h semaine, qu'il y a des particularités, etc. Still. Il y a plein de monde qui ont des job essentielles qui font en dessous de 30$/heures
Agencies don't only advertise on merb, and there is probably a context behind that.. I don't think they would have been able to press charges for that reason alone. This reminds me of that case that occurred a while back, a guy who filmed an appointment without a girl's consent, and she took him to court. They were able to convict him, but they only pressed charges for buying sex. This was an excuse to convict him. They wouldn't have done it otherwise.
Mais elles ne font pas 280$/h par contre. Pas loin mais pas 280$, parfois 200$ parfois 150$ si elles sont malchanceuses.
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