Dual Canadian-US Citizenship Not Permitted????

[EagerBeaver]

I recently asked a friend of mine who is from Canada originally and works in my field whether he had dual citizenship. I was very surprised by his answer. He told me that while Canadians are permitted to enjoy dual citizenship with other countries, the United States does not permit dual U.S.- Canadian citizenship. Hence, this friend was required to renounce his Canadian citizenship when he became a U.S. citizen. I asked this friend (originally from Ontario) whether this bothered him, and he replied "not really."

I was surprised to hear this. In the back of my mind I asked him the question because I would not mind holding a dual citizenship, if possible. But I would never renounce my U.S. citizenship, for any reason, so I guess I can't.

I wonder what are the policy reasons behind this?

 

[jons242]

I think if your already a U.S. citizen you can become a Canadian citizen without having to give up your U.S. citizenship. The Canadian gov. allows dual citizenship. It's if your Canadian and want to become an Amercian citizen the American gov. may require you to renounce your citizenship. I personally would never give up my Canadian citizenship even though at times I get sick of this goverment we have and the lack of leadership in this country.

 

[eastender]

Dual Citizenship

EB,

Visit:
http://www.amcits.com/dual.asp

Should answer most of your questions without
getting into tax ramifications etc.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Renunciation

Eastender,

The information contained in this page, while somewhat confusing, appears to contradict the prior poster by indicating that if I applied for Canadian citizenship I would have to renounce my U.S. citizenship. I should note that I am an American citizen by birth in the U.S.

 

[eastender]

Dual Citizenship

EB,
Actually quite clear - if it is your intent to
renounce your USA citizenship you may
do so but it is not a condition.

 

[Ned Nobody]

EB,

I believe this page from the State department shows that dual citizenship is tolerated in many cases. http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_778.html

When, as the result of an individual's inquiry or an individual's application for registration or a passport it comes to the attention of a U.S. consular officer that a U.S. citizen has performed an act made potentially expatriating by Sections 349(a)(1), 349(a)(2), 349(a)(3) or 349(a)(4), the consular officer will simply ask the applicant if there was intent to relinquish U.S. citizenship when performing the act. If the answer is no, the consular officer will certify that it was not the person's intent to relinquish U.S. citizenship and, consequently, find that the person has retained U.S. citizenship.

Canada does not seem to have a problem with dual-citizenship, assuming you meet their other rules for citizenship. http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/citizen/dual-info.html

Respectfully,
Ned

 

[EagerBeaver]

Here is the language that is confusing me (from Ned's link):

"However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship."

I would have to apply for Canadian citizenship, so does that mean I must renounce my U.S. citizenship?

 

[Ned Nobody]

EB,

I don't believe so. This, I think, is what they mean by a "routine" oath. If you do not have the intention of giving up US citizenship, you retain it.

Obviously, because of the potential consequences, this is something you should check out with the State Department before doing, but I don't think you would have any problem with it. As a US citizen, even if living in a foreign country, you retain the privilege of paying US Income Tax. There are exclusions, the first 85K of income, and others, but ultimately, they like keeping US Citizens where they may potentially continue to contribute to Uncle Sam.

Edit: Additionally, you may want to look at this page, with lots of links.
http://www.richw.org/dualcit/

Respectfully,
NN

 

[Special K]

NN,

Thanks for the links, very informative. By the way, where the hell ya been lately? I haven't seen many posts from you in awhile. It'd be good to see you back regularly as I've always been a fan of your contributions to this place.

Hope you're well,

SK

 

[Ned Nobody]

SK,

Out of town more than in recently, but hopefully that's going to change now.

See you at the usual place, I'm sure, in a couple of weeks.

NN

 

[bond_james_bond]

I have a similar friend who is formerly Canadian but recently attained US citizenship.

He tells me that he still keeps his Canadian passport locked away and he can still use it in event of extreme emergency.

This leads me to believe that the renouncement of Canadian citizenship may be just a formality, and that there's no verification that that was actually done.

 

[bond_james_bond]

To apply for Canadian citizenship, don't you have to like, live & work there for several years?

It's ok to make frequent trips for hobbying, but MOVING there is a life-changing thing.

I would assume that you'd first have to find a job there. To do that, you and your employer would have to demonstrate that no existing Canadian can do the job. Maybe you're in some highly specialized field or something, but somehow, that sounds difficult to do.

Even after all that is done, you're left with your new life in Canada. For an American, this is going to mean higher taxes, much more than you've ever paid in the States. In addition, I would venture to guess that Canadian companies are likely to pay less than American companies for equivalent work. Not to mention the fact that you'll be on the other end of the exchange rate.

If it means that much to you, then by all means go for it. But it certainly doesn't sound easy.

My formerly Canadian friend said that the high taxes come as a shock to Americans who move there.

As an alternative, couldn't you get some really long visa or something? Like what an ex-patriate does?

 

[EagerBeaver]

I have been advised that Ned is correct. The only caveat is that if I became a dual U.S.-Canadian citizen, and then decided to work for or join some aspect of the Canadian government (e.g., become a Parti Quebec member - yikes!!!!!!!!), the U.S. would require me to give up my U.S. Citizenship. I believe a further caveat is that each time I re-entered the U.S., I would be required to reaffirm my U.S. citizenship and my loyalty to the U.S.

 

[trailrunner66]

The only problem with dual citizenship is if both countries have a military draft and you qualify then you're screwed. It almost happened to me.
But then you can always go to Canada

 

[chowhound]

policy changes

I learned in my high school government class that in order to be a US Citizen you must renounce citizenship in other countries, and therefore in the eyes of the US government, dual citizenship was not recognized, although Canada did recognize dual citizenship.
I heard things to the contrary a few years ago and did some research regarding the discrepancy. Apparently there was a change in US policy at some point, I think during the 80's, which permitted dual citizenship, although a US citizen could not serve in a foreign military.
So that's my current understanding, based upon my recollection of research I did at least three or four years ago. Feel free to correct or update me, as this seems to show that the rules may change as we go along in life.

 

[Dawgone]

Legal Differences (ABC News)

Canada:

Smoking marijuana: Despite rumblings of legalizing marijuana, it's still not legal to smoke weed in public. Simple possession of a joint will probably get you a $100 (Canadian) fine (about US$80.)

Carrying a firearm: Firearms are strictly controlled. As of Jan. 1, 2001, visitors bringing firearms into Canada, or planning to borrow and use firearms while in Canada, are required to declare the firearms in writing using a Non-Resident Firearm Declaration form, which costs US$50 to process.

Driving 70 mph on the highway: Driving in Canada is similar to driving in parts of the United States. Distances and speeds, however, are posted in kilometers per hour, and some signs, particularly in the French-speaking province of Quebec, may only be in French. On highways, the posted speed limit is 100km/hr, approximately 65 mph. Fines are incremental, so figure $15 Canadian for every 5 kilometers above the speed limit.

Patronizing a prostitute: Prostitution is not illegal; however, soliciting sex is. Expect a fine of $250 Canadian (about US$200) if caught.

 

[bond_james_bond]

Sex, Drugs, & Rock N' Roll

Though, as far as Rock N' Roll goes, we'll take from Canada:

Rush

and give back:

Celine Dion!

 

[Stranger]

I recently asked a friend of mine who is from Canada originally and works in my field whether he had dual citizenship. I was very surprised by his answer. He told me that while Canadians are permitted to enjoy dual citizenship with other countries, the United States does not permit dual U.S.- Canadian citizenship. Hence, this friend was required to renounce his Canadian citizenship when he became a U.S. citizen. I asked this friend (originally from Ontario) whether this bothered him, and he replied "not really."

I was surprised to hear this. In the back of my mind I asked him the question because I would not mind holding a dual citizenship, if possible. But I would never renounce my U.S. citizenship, for any reason, so I guess I can't.

I wonder what are the policy reasons behind this?

We don't like sharing.

 

[HockeyFan4MSOG]

I'm not a lawyer, but it seems to me that the last part of that phrase is the key for those who could lose U.S. citizenship, "..and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship." You can apply for foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and WITHOUT the intention to give up U.S. citizenship.

I acquired an EU passport a couple of years ago in addition to my U.S. passport (born and raised in U.S.). There was no problem about renouncing U.S. citizenship, which I wouldn't have done anyway. For your convenience, always use your U.S. passport when leaving and entering the U.S., and there will be no confusion.

I believe that you have it perfectly explained there. You don't need to reannounce the citizenship to apply but you must meet the other criteria for Canadian immigration. Also in 2006 a passport is going to be required to re-enter the US, not just photo-id and birth certificate on the Canadian border.


Scenario, you purchase a place in Canada for camping/recreation(2nd or 3rd home) and intend on spending more than 90 days there. Rather than keep the visa stuff going you could apply for citizenship.


The issue and confusion I have is how do you do your taxes with dual citizenship? Would there be anything left!

 

[jpwic]

Also in 2006 a passport is going to be required to re-enter the US, not just photo-id and birth certificate on the Canadian border.

I thought Bush vetoed that when it was proposed because of all the fuss it would require...

jpwic

PS Little off topic I know, but I'm just curious