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SWINE FLU ---- airplanes + internet = pandemic hysteria

Possum Trot

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More cases in Nova Scotia and Alberta ( Quebec only hase two) but, as with the others, these are mild and do not require hospitalization.

Most of those sick in this country have been young vacationers back from Mexico, or in direct contact with them. Keep your fingers crossed but so far the effects on these people seems less, if anything, than regular flu. This was a comment from Toronto's Chief Medical Officer. There are concerns that it may mutate into something worse but that is pure speculation at this point.

No explanation yet why the effects have been mild here and deadly in Mexico.
 

YouVantOption

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Possum Trot said:
More cases in Nova Scotia and Alberta (Quebec only hase two) but, as with the others, these are mild and do not require hospitalization.

I'm not sure where you got that information. Here's the latest update from the W.H.O.:

http://www.who.int/csr/don/2009_05_04/en/index.html
Influenza A(H1N1) - update 13

4 May 2009 -- As of 06:00 GMT, 4 May 2009, 20 countries have officially reported 985 cases of influenza A (H1N1) infection.

Mexico has reported 590 laboratory confirmed human cases of infection, including 25 deaths. The higher number of cases from Mexico reflects ongoing testing of previously collected specimens. The United States has reported 226 laboratory confirmed human cases, including one death.

The following countries have reported laboratory confirmed cases with no deaths - Austria (1), Canada (85), China, Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (1), Costa Rica (1), Colombia (1), Denmark (1), El Salvador (2), France (2), Germany (8), Ireland (1), Israel (3), Italy (1), Netherlands (1), New Zealand (4), Republic of Korea (1), Spain (40), Switzerland (1) and the United Kingdom (15).

There is no risk of infection from this virus from consumption of well-cooked pork and pork products.

It is considered prudent for people who are ill to delay international travel and for people developing symptoms following international travel to seek medical attention, in line with guidance from national authorities. Individuals are advised to wash hands thoroughly with soap and water on a regular basis and should seek medical attention if they develop any symptoms of influenza-like illness.

WHO advises no restriction of regular travel or closure of borders.

Further information on the situation will be available on the WHO website on a regular basis.
 

Time to Punt

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YouVantOption said:
I'm not sure where you got that information. Here's the latest update from the W.H.O.:

.

It was in the Toronto newspapers which provide considerably more detail for cases within Canada. Total cases here in the mid-80's.

I see that the number of deaths in Mexico reported by WHO, in there update, is now only 25 and not the 150 that was reported in a lot of the print media. US numbers were 226 cases , one death, which if memory serves was a 2 year old of Mexican descent. There were no other deaths in any of the countries reporting.

They also are not recommending travel or border restrictions. It is reported that Mexico now claims the situation has stabilized.

The US CDC has more detailed and better information than WHO but less frequent updates:

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/swineflu_you.htm

"How severe is illness associated with this new H1N1 virus?
It’s not known at this time how severe this virus will be in the general population. CDC is studying the medical histories of people who have been infected with this virus to determine whether some people may be at greater risk from infection, serious illness or hospitalization from the virus. In seasonal flu, there are certain people that are at higher risk of serious flu-related complications. This includes young children, pregnant women, people with chronic medical conditions and people 65 and older. It’s unknown at this time whether certain groups of people are at greater risk of serious flu-related complications from infection with this new virus. CDC also is conducting laboratory studies to see if certain people might have natural immunity to this virus, depending on their age."
 
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YouVantOption

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Time to Punt said:
It was in the Toronto newspapers which provide considerably more detail for cases within Canada. Total cases here in the mid-80's.

They jumped 20+ in the past 12 hours:

printable version
Influenza A(H1N1) - update 14

4 May 2009 -- As of 18:00 GMT, 4 May 2009, 21 countries have officially reported 1085 cases of influenza A (H1N1) infection.

Mexico has reported 590 laboratory confirmed human cases of infection, including 25 deaths. The United States has reported 286 laboratory confirmed human cases, including one death.

The following countries have reported laboratory confirmed cases with no deaths - Austria (1), Canada (101), China, Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (1), Costa Rica (1), Colombia (1), Denmark (1), El Salvador (2), France (4), Germany (8), Ireland (1), Israel (4), Italy (2), Netherlands (1), New Zealand (6), Portugal (1), Republic of Korea (1), Spain (54), Switzerland (1) and the United Kingdom (18).
 

EagerBeaver

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USA Death

The one death in the USA was a 23 month old Mexican male who was transported to Houston, TX, USA for medical care from his native Mexico. He was already in critical condition on arrival to the USA.
 

Time to Punt

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EagerBeaver said:
The one death in the USA was a 23 month old Mexican male who was transported to Houston, TX, USA for medical care from his native Mexico. He was already in critical condition on arrival to the USA.

Either the Mexican dead all had some pre-existing condition ( which CDC seems to be pursuing obliquely) or you have to wonder whether there is something genetically different.

Meanwhile the National Post reports that the Canadian experts do not expect it to mutate as a result of the infection back to pigs in Alberta , since swine was the original origin of this flu. Dr Hachette, a microbioligist, said it was unlikely that the bug would change into a mass killer.
 

EagerBeaver

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Either the Mexican dead all had some pre-existing condition ( which CDC seems to be pursuing obliquely) or you have to wonder whether there is something genetically different.

I have travelled extensively through Mexico and it is a poor country with substandard medical care as compared to the USA and Canada. This Mexican infant was likely brought to the USA too late to do anything for him.

The problem with the swine flu is that the onset of symptoms are like ordinary flu. If it then precipitates an overwhelming immune response, the situation can likely deteriorate very rapidly.

If the Mexican decedents had preexisting conditions it could have been asthma or other respiratory ailments. That may be what the CDC is looking at. Just speculation-
 

Doc Holliday

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US Government official says swine flu no worse than regular flu

Swine flu no worse than regular flu, Napolitano says

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The swine flu virus that has sparked fear and precautions worldwide appears to be no more dangerous than the regular flu virus that makes its rounds each year, U.S. officials said Monday.

"What the epidemiologists are seeing now with this particular strain of U.N. is that the severity of the disease, the severity of the flu -- how sick you get -- is not stronger than regular seasonal flu," Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said Monday as the worldwide number of confirmed cases of swine flu -- technically known as 2009 H1N1 virus -- topped 1,085.

The flu has been blamed for 26 deaths: 25 in Mexico and one in the United States, according to the World Health Organization.

Still, Napolitano noted, the seasonal flu results in "hundreds of thousands of hospitalizations" and roughly 35,000 fatalities each year in the United States. There are still concerns that the virus could return in the fall, in the typical flu season, as a stronger strain.

"We are cautiously optimistic that this particular strain will not be more severe than a normal seasonal flu outbreak," Napolitano said.

Napolitano acknowledged claims by health officials in Mexico, the epicenter of the H1N1 outbreak, who believe their cases have peaked and said, "I have no reason to think that is inaccurate."

The WHO said there were no immediate plans to raise its alert to the highest level, Phase 6. That designation would mean "that we are seeing continued spread of the virus to countries outside of one region," Assistant Director-General Keiji Fukuda said.

"If you are seeing community outbreaks occur in multiple regions of the world, it really tells us if the virus has established itself and that we can expect to see disease in most countries in the world."

In the United States, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported 286 confirmed cases across 36 states, 60 more cases than were confirmed the day before.

Many of the cases are among children; the median age is 16, said Dr. Richard Besser, acting director of the CDC. The youngest confirmed case is a 3-month-old, he said.

There are also more than 700 probable cases across 44 states, Besser said.

"This likely represents an underestimation of the total number of cases across the country," he said, because not everyone with flu-like symptoms goes to the doctor and gets tested.

The numbers are expected to increase. Dr. Anne Schuchat, the CDC's interim deputy director for public health, said Sunday, "We believe we're just on the upswing here."

But in Mexico, where the first cases were reported, illnesses may have peaked for now.

Mexico City will reopen government offices and restaurants Wednesday as officials cited improvements in the battle against swine flu.

In another sign of improving conditions with the H1N1 virus, federal officials lowered the nation's health alert level Monday from red, or "high," to orange, or "elevated."

"The measures we have taken, and above all the public's reaction, have led to an improvement," Mexico City Mayor Marcelo Ebrard said at a news conference.

"But I insist that the virus is still present, that we need to remain on alert, and the resumption of activities will be little by little, not all at once."

In China, an airplane will be picking up dozens of Mexican citizens who want to return home after being held by Chinese officials for "health reasons," Mexico's Foreign Ministry announced Monday.

China has denied discriminating against Mexicans, saying it is exercising proper precaution to prevent the spread of the virus.

The plane will stop in various cities in China where there are "concentrated" numbers of Mexican citizens who wish to leave the country, the foreign ministry said in a statement.

In the U.S., residents gripped by concerns about the swine flu, also had a hopeful sign Monday. The St. Francis Preparatory School in Queens, New York -- which had the first confirmed U.S. cases of swine flu -- reopened Monday.

More than 100 St. Francis students had come down with flu symptoms two weeks ago. Some were tested and found to have the H1N1 virus.

New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg was on hand to welcome them back to a school that had undergone an intense scrub-down.

"The school has been completely sanitized," St. Francis Principal Leonard Conway said in a letter to students and their parents.

The U.S. Department of Education said that 533 schools were shut Monday, about 100 more than Friday and about half of 1 percent of all schools in the United States. The closures affect about 330,000 students in 24 states.

New cases of swine flu were leaving soldiers isolated in California.

A spokeswoman for the U.S. Marine Base at Twentynine Palms, north of Palm Springs, California, said two new cases of the flu were confirmed by the CDC. The two Marines show no symptoms but are being kept in isolation, spokeswoman Jennie Haskamp said. Previously, one other case was confirmed at the base.

The U.S. Defense Department also reported that a crew member stationed aboard the USS Dubuque in San Diego, California, was confirmed to have swine flu and is currently ashore. The department said there were 13 other "probable" cases among Dubuque personnel.

And California officials were looking into a suspected case at Centinela State Prison in Imperial County. Authorities suspended visitation and other "non-essential activities" at the prison pending confirmation.

Even as health officials worldwide worked to battle the outbreak, intense efforts were under way to develop a vaccine -- with lessons from history in mind.

"In 1918, the Spanish flu showed a surge in the spring and then disappeared in the summer months, only to return in the autumn of 1918 with a vengeance," WHO spokesman Gregory Hartl said Sunday. "And we know that that eventually killed 40 million to 50 million people."

Health officials are not making such dire predictions in this case. And they can't know for certain whether the swine flu will make a big return later in the year.

Still, they're taking no chances.

In that effort, health officials have a tool unlike anything they've had before.

"This is the best surveillance we've ever had," Fukuda said Monday. "You know, we're really monitoring and able to see a situation unfold in a way we have never been able to do in history before."
 

YouVantOption

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WHO Update and Canada's First Severe Case

5 May 2009 -- As of 06:00 GMT, 5 May 2009, 21 countries have officially reported 1124 cases of influenza A (H1N1) infection.

Mexico has reported 590 laboratory confirmed human cases of infection, including 25 deaths. The United States has reported 286 laboratory confirmed human cases, including one death.

The following countries have reported laboratory confirmed cases with no deaths - Austria (1), Canada (140), China, Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (1), Costa Rica (1), Colombia (1), Denmark (1), El Salvador (2), France (4), Germany (8), Ireland (1), Israel (4), Italy (2), Netherlands (1), New Zealand (6), Portugal (1), Republic of Korea (1), Spain (54), Switzerland (1) and the United Kingdom (18).

Alberta girl sick with Canada's 1st severe case of swine flu
 

Time to Punt

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Wonder how many cases of the regular flu there has been during this time period and how many deaths ? Until ( or if) it mutates into something more serious ( let's hope the Alberta girl is the exception - although she is reportedly "doing well" ) is does not seem to be that much of a problem unless you are Mexican.

The world wide numbers seem exceptionally low except for North America and even those are low compared to regular flu where nearly 40,000 people die annually in Canada and the US combined. Obviously a far greater number actually catch the flu.

Speculation by some is that it will die out in the summer and return in late fall.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e6260d9a-37d4-11de-9211-00144feabdc0.html?nclick_check=1
 
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Doc Holliday

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Canadian lab cracks swine flu code

OTTAWA — Canadian scientists working through the night to pick apart the genes of the human swine flu bug have, in a world first, sequenced the virus in a Winnipeg laboratory.

"This is the first complete sequencing of the H1N1 flu virus and it's vitally important to our understanding of this outbreak," Federal Health Minister Leona Aglukkaq said.

Genetic sequencing involves decoding the basic building blocks of the virus.

"This is a world first and a real validation of Canada's scientific excellence," Aglukkaq said.

Samples of virus taken from Nova Scotia and Ontario and samples from Mexico appear to be a genetic match. The team found nothing to explain at the genetic level why the virus is causing severe pneumonia and deaths in Mexico, while cases in Canada and the U.S. have been mostly mild.

"That's one of the big questions that everybody has been asking," said Dr. Frank Plummer, scientific director general of the National Microbiology Laboratory in Winnipeg.

"It's likely not the virus itself that is explaining the differential in severity of disease between Mexico and the rest of North America."

Cracking the genetic code of the virus moves scientists an important step closer to understanding how swine flu spreads and changes over time, how long it has been in the human population, and where it originated. It will also help in the development of a vaccine.

The genetic sequences of the three viruses have been sent to GenBank, a public database where genetic sequences can be studied and compared by scientists around the world. "This is a significant and important milestone for us, but there is still a lot more work ahead of us," Plummer said.

Officials also said Wednesday the outbreak of swine flu in a central Alberta hog farm has been contained.

Officials believe the pigs contracted the virus from a Canadian worker who returned from Mexico on April 12 and arrived on the farm two days later. It is the first known human to swine transmission of the H1N1 flu virus. Officials said the pigs have recovered, or are recovering, and that no decision has been taken to cull the herd.

"We can reassure Canadians unequivocally that the situation remains contained on that farm," said Dr. Brian Evans, Canada's chief veterinary officer.

Evans said the pigs from the Alberta hog farm could enter the food supply once they have recovered and are shown to pose no threat to human health.

"If we can satisfy ourselves that this virus behaves no differently in swine than any other influenza virus, then our approach on this will be to manage this in the most prudent responsible way to protect public health," said Evans, executive vice-president of the Canadian Food Inspection Agency.

"If it is determined that virus-negative pigs do not pose a risk in the food supply . . . then we would be moving in that direction."

He said the standard operating practice in Canada "is the fact that you do not slaughter sick animals and you do not slaughter dead animals for human consumption."

The World Health Organization was warning Wednesday that meat from pigs infected with the new H1N1 virus shouldn't be used for human consumption. WHO's comments appear more cautious than those from the Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) and World Organization for Animal Health (OIE), which said import bans are not required to safeguard public health because the disease isn't food-borne and has not been identified in dead animal tissue.

WHO, however, said it was possible for flu viruses to survive the freezing process and be present in thawed meat, as well as in blood.

"Meat from sick pigs or pigs found dead should not be processed or used for human consumption under any circumstances," Jorgen Schlundt, director of WHO's Department of Food Safety, Zoonoses and Foodborne Diseases.

Canada's total number of confirmed cases of swine flu stands at 201.

Canada's public health agency confirmed 36 new cases across the country Wednesday. Eight new cases were confirmed in B.C., four in Alberta, 13 in Ontario, six in Quebec and five in Nova Scotia.

In Montreal, Michel C. Dore, an official with the Civil Security department, said that some employers are asking staff returning from Mexico to get a certificate of good health before resuming their work.

"Not only are these requirements are against public health recommendations in Quebec but furthermore they could overburden the health system," he said.

In Edmonton, medical-supplies manufacturer priMED is turning away desperate requests for masks because its Chinese plant can't keep up with the demand sparked by swine flu.

The Edmonton company's facility at Liyang, two hours west of Shanghai, is running 24 hours a day supplying the extra orders from its regular customers, chairman Chris Thompson said Wednesday. "We're getting lots of calls from RCMP detachments and school districts, but we can't supply them because of existing contracts and customers. It's really unfortunate because you can hear the desperation in their voices."

Meanwhile, after mounting a spirited defence of its decision to quarantine a group of Canadian students and their teacher, China relented Wednesday and let them go.

The 27 students from the Universite de Montreal and Laval had been under quarantine in Changchun, in northeastern China, for suspected H1N1 flu since last Saturday. None had any recent contact with a flu victim or had shown any symptoms before they were summarily sequestered when they arrived to begin a 10-week language course.

On Wednesday, WHO raised its global totals to 1,658 confirmed cases of swine flu in 23 countries. The disease is believed to have caused 31 deaths worldwide.

In Mexico, as its capital began to stir back to life Wednesday, the country cut its confirmed death toll from the HIN1 flu to 42, as dozens of test samples came back negative.

The streets of Mexico City were again clogged with traffic and vendors working the sidewalks after authorities lifted a five-day shutdown to try to contain swine flu.

The world health agency could decide as early as next week whether to recommend that drug manufacturers start full-scale production of a swine-flu vaccine, once one is developed.

Many developed countries, including Canada, already have agreements with drug companies to ensure supply of a pandemic vaccine. Canada has a contract with GlaxoSmithKline Biologicals to supply enough vaccine for the entire Canadian population in the event of a pandemic, according to the federal government.

However, it is not yet clear if Canada would have to line up behind other countries to receive its supply.

http://www.montrealgazette.com/Health/Canadian+cracks+swine+code/1570387/story.html
 

Time to Punt

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WHO answers to a political body so its motivations are not entirely risk free.

I've been flamed for saying this in the past but it does have a record for overhyping this. We only have to look at SARS and Avian flu in recent memory.
 

YouVantOption

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Time to Punt said:
WHO answers to a political body so its motivations are not entirely risk free.

I've been flamed for saying this in the past but it does have a record for overhyping this. We only have to look at SARS and Avian flu in recent memory.

OK, please point out how SARS was over-hyped, and how Avian Flu, which, world-wide, virologists expect to be the next serious pandemic, is/has been 'over-hyped'.

Be specific in your answer, provide examples.

The fact that the W.H.O. 'answers' to the UN doesn't make it de facto suspect. Indeed, better a political organization than driven by commercial interests.
 

YouVantOption

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Latest W.H.O. Report

Canada leapt up 50 cases.

7 May 2009 -- As of 06:00 GMT, 7 May 2009, 23 countries have officially reported 2099 cases of influenza A(H1N1) infection.

Mexico has reported 1112 laboratory confirmed human cases of infection, including 42 deaths. The United States has reported 642 laboratory confirmed human cases, including two deaths.

The following countries have reported laboratory confirmed cases with no deaths - Austria (1), Canada (201), China, Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (1), Colombia (1), Costa Rica (1), Denmark (1), El Salvador (2), France (5), Germany (9), Guatemala (1), Ireland (1), Israel (4), Italy (5), Netherlands (1), New Zealand (5), Portugal (1), Republic of Korea (2), Spain (73), Sweden (1), Switzerland (1) and the United Kingdom (28).

Joint FAO/WHO/OIE Statement on influenza A(H1N1) and the safety of pork
 

Time to Punt

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YouVantOption said:
OK, please point out how SARS was over-hyped, and how Avian Flu, which, world-wide, virologists expect to be the next serious pandemic, is/has been 'over-hyped'.

Be specific in your answer, provide examples.

The fact that the W.H.O. 'answers' to the UN doesn't make it de facto suspect. Indeed, better a political organization than driven by commercial interests.


Lol...no, I don't feel the slightest bit compelled to justify my opinion to you. Plus I have a feeling that you have dug in your heels and have some overwhelming desire to prove that your own opinion cannot be wrong and that by using your superior debating skills you will smite me down :D

You may wish to read Michael Fumento's piece in yesterday's National Post. He is a health and science writer. His basic point on this particular flu is that:

"on average, seasonal flu and its complications hospitalize about 20,000 Canadians a year and kill 4,000. That's 140 hospitalizations a day and 25 deaths per day during flu season. Worldwide deaths are 250,000 to 500,000 per your ( beloved) WHO. All inbdications are that the swine flu is both less harmful and harder to transmit than seasonal"

"For other contagious diseases, according to the CDC, it's(spread factor) vastly higher: 6-7 for diphtheria, 12-18 for measles, 4-7 for mumps, and 6-7 for Rubella.

Most importantly for our purposes the basic reproductive number for seasonal flu seems to range from 1.5 to 3.0. (Although you do see much higher numbers.)

That means no swine flu pandemic. The WHO can label it a pandemic; they can also label it a wombat. But because it won't begin to approach the severity of worldwide seasonal flu (700 - 1,400 deaths daily, it will not be a pandemic. Flu pandemics are supposed to be MORE severe than typical flu years, not far less."


Here is his blog where the article is reprinted.

http://www.fumento.com/weblog/


Why don't we do this the other way around and you justify the WHO actions invis a vis North America in respect of SARS and AVIAN flu, be specific and supply evidence that credible organizations such as CDC concurred on a post morten basis. I suspect that 99% of the people in Toronto think that SARS was overhyped and that by the time the WHO acted it was undercontrol.
 
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YouVantOption

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Time to Punt said:
You may wish to read Michael Fumento's piece in yesterday's National Post. He is a health and science writer

Actually, he is a conservative hack with the Hudson institute who has a degree in law. He penned such charming titles as 'The Myth of Heterosexual A.I.D.S.' and a screed against the E.P.A.

If that is the best you can do ... then I'll just go on believing that an international institution made up of actual, you know, scientists who know WHAT THE FUCK THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT, might be right, instead of eating up Asper spoon-fed crap any day of the week.
 
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Time to Punt

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YouVantOption said:
Actually, he is a conservative hack with the Hudson institute who has a degree in law. He penned such charming titles as 'The Myth of Heterosexual A.I.D.S.' and a screed against the E.P.A.

If that is the best you can do ... then I'll just go on believing that an international institution made up of actual, you know, scientists who know WHAT THE FUCK THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT, might be right, instead of eating up Asper spoon-fed crap any day of the week.

The only way around his compelling logic is to discredit him I see. Perhaps you could point out which of the facts in his argument are wrong. Afterall you wanted facts. Death rate? Spread rates? Hospitalization rates ? If those stand up to scrutiny then the conclusion is fairly obvious whether he is liberal, conservative - hell I'd even forgive him being a lawyer at one point.

A little less stamping of feet and holding of breath and yelling please :D

I figured this was the way it was going to go and this was why I felt no compulsion to reply. If you don't agree with me fine but until you can give me different facts I'm forced to believe the ones I see because they correspond to what has been widely reported.
 

YouVantOption

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Time to Punt said:
The only way around his compelling logic is to discredit him I see. Perhaps you could point out which of the facts in his argument are wrong. Afterall you wanted facts. Death rate? Spread rates? Hospitalization rates ? If those stand up to scrutiny then the conclusion is fairly obvious whether he is liberal, conservative - hell I'd even forgive him being a lawyer at one point.

A little less stamping of feet and holding of breath and yelling please :D

I figured this was the way it was going to go and this was why I felt no compulsion to reply. If you don't agree with me fine but until you can give me different facts I'm forced to believe the ones I see because they correspond to what has been widely reported.

Pandemic is a specific term for a specific circumstance. Whether you care to believe the W.H.O. who actually make the call as to whether or not a pandemic is actually occurring, well, good for you.

Yes, discrediting him as a source of information is entirely correct. You discredited the W.H.O. with vague accusations and no facts. I provided facts as to why he isn't a credible source of information, and why his bias interferes with any statement he makes.
 

Time to Punt

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YouVantOption said:
Pandemic is a specific term for a specific circumstance. Whether you care to believe the W.H.O. who actually make the call as to whether or not a pandemic is actually occurring, well, good for you.

Yes, discrediting him as a source of information is entirely correct. You discredited the W.H.O. with vague accusations and no facts. I provided facts as to why he isn't a credible source of information, and why his bias interferes with any statement he makes.

Why don't you try to discredit the facts he points out - which you can't. If you believe the facts concerning death rates, hopitalization, rate of spread then there is only one logical conclusion and it doesn't matter who wrote the article. Ronald McDonald could have written it the conclusion is self-evident.

If you prove to me the death rate for Swine is higher than seasonal flu, the hospitalization rate is higher and the spread rate is higher then you may have a point. Otherwise you have to admit WHO has a very unusual hit and miss criteria known only to them as to what they call a pandemic.

Calling someone a conservative hack is not a vague accusation ? :D

So where are these facts of yours to dispute what he drew to our attention ?
 
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YouVantOption

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Time to Punt said:
If you prove to me the death rate for Swine is higher than seasonal flu, the hospitalization rate is higher and the spread rate is higher then you may have a point. Otherwise you have to admit WHO has a very unusual hit and miss criteria know only to them as to what they call a pandemic.

Yes, other diseases have different hospitalization rates, and kill rates.

And?? Your point is??

Jesus Christ, I don't believe I'm even discussing this.

The W.H.O. level criteria is very transparent, and if you actually take the time to read factual scientific materials instead of politically-driven crap (you know, which was your actually knock against the W.H.O., but you have completely failed to prove), you might come away educated.

http://who.int

Epidemic and Pandemic Alert and Response (EPR)
 
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