Unemployment rate among blacks in Quebec

[MakeIt]

I hadn't really looked at this thread before. Having just read the entire thread I can say that it seems a little off track again. So i will only add 2 comments. First there is racism everywhere and blacks in quebec are first, second or maybe third generation. So overcoming this racism does take time. So its not surprising that their unemplyment rate is higher. And I would be really interested to know what the unemployment stats for blacks are in the rest of Canada and the US. I'm sure the ratios are similar to Quebec which would only prove that we have similar levels of racism at work here as elsewhere. Overall I don't think were better or worse than elsewhere which means we need improvement. However, I can tell you that the US has much more proactive programs to improve employment levels of blacks. Virtually of level of government in the US has laws for this purpose - of course many people in the US don't think these are good things but that's another debate.

My second comment is that Quebecers in urban areas, especially Montreal are much more accepting of minorities than rural areas of Quebec. Acceptance of blacks in Drummondville and Chicoutimi and smaller places is much lower than in Montreal. There are also noticeably far less visible minorities in those areas. Its also remarkeable the entire media and entertainment industry in Quebec has but a handful of visible minorities. Still got lots of work to do.

By the way, I'm going to really open a can of worms here - most of you participate in the sex trade - so how many of you non-visible minority customers avail yourselves of a black sex worker? How about sex workers - how many won't see a black man?

 

[Cosmo]

Wow

I have reread this whole thread and :

1. I don't see anyone saying Quebecers are any more racist than anyone else.

2. I don't see any comments from Toronto residents that are more critical of Quebecers .

Shijak has the most intelligent comments on racism.

The fact that blacks have a higher unemployment rate in Quebec is not a statement on increased levels of racism in Quebec until it is established that this situation is unique to Quebec. That has not been done in this thread.

One thing I can say is that there are at least two Quebecers here that are ultra sensitive. Calm down guys.

Train,

If you read other politically oriented threads you will see a few not so subtle attacks against PQ,BQ,Bill 101,sovereignist and quebecois at large coming mainly from within Canada namely To and Mtl.
This threa itself has some sort of insinuation about quebecers beign more racist than others.

MakeIt,

As for the media and entertanment industry,do you watch French tv,listen to french radio,music,read french books,attend french humorist shows???
Have you seen the ''Pure Laine'' comedy show on Télé Quebec?
There are many more ''minorities'' than you think.
Someone on this thread already mentioned a few and I could add Danny Laferriere,Maka Koto,Michel Mambara,Luck Mervil,Rachid Badouri,the little girl in Les Bougons(Rosalie something) and many others.
Quebecers are no more racist than any others.
Bonjour.

 

[Mike Mercury]

Its also remarkeable the entire media and entertainment industry in Quebec has but a handful of visible minorities. Still got lots of work to do.

Again a jab at Quebec. And this is so ingrained in you guys that you would only notice your jabs if they involved spitting and throwing rocks. Then again maybe not.

Your statement above is so incorrect that it is tantamount to an outright lie or outright lack of knowledge as to the Quebec star sytem, celebrities, comics, entertainers and & radio & television personalities.

As for my critics who call me over sensitive. Save it friend.
This thread is not raising my blood pressure, it is not increasing my heart rate, it is not irritating me and it is not angering me one bit. Take care of yourself. I can take care of myself.

I just want to make it clear that after 6 months here I know who the anti-French anti-Quebec posters are.
And you don't impress me one fcking bit.

 

[MakeIt]

As for the media and entertanment industry,do you watch French tv,listen to french radio,music,read french books,attend french humorist shows???
Have you seen the ''Pure Laine'' comedy show on Télé Quebec?
There are many more ''minorities'' than you think.
Someone on this thread already mentioned a few and I could add Danny Laferriere,Maka Koto,Michel Mambara,Luck Mervil,Rachid Badouri,the little girl in Les Bougons(Rosalie something) and many others.
Quebecers are no more racist than any others.
Bonjour.

I watch TV every day though mainly for news. I have also seen a number of Quebecois comics live couple time per year. I may not be the best judge of this but I'm not making the comment without experience. However, my second comment was poorly presented. The context is that there is not much employment of blacks in certain areas of Quebec as well as in the media - not proportional to the population anyhow. I'm not saying were more racist as elsewhere as I stated in my first comment - were probably about the same as elsewhere. I can tell you this just from observation as I've lived up the river in QC and know many people from that area as well as from rural areas of Quebec. I've also travelled extensively in the US. You see similar patterns in the US except in areas where blacks are the visible majority (such as in some southern states). The only difference in racism here versus the US is that they are more obvious about it. In Quebec, we are more subtle about it.

So how about it - how often do you see black sex work providers?
a) Never
b) Once in a while
c) Regular
d) Always

 

[zigezon]

I'm sure the ratios are similar to Quebec which would only prove that we have similar levels of racism at work here as elsewhere.

My second comment is that Quebecers in urban areas, especially Montreal are much more accepting of minorities than rural areas of Quebec. Acceptance of blacks in Drummondville and Chicoutimi and smaller places is much lower than in Montreal.

There are also noticeably far less visible minorities in those areas. Its also remarkeable the entire media and entertainment industry in Quebec has but a handful of visible minorities. Still got lots of work to do.

Can you actually prove that the unemployment rate among blacks is explained by racism ? There is no such fact that I know of, here or in Canada. This rate can be explained with severals explanations, and racism is probabibly part of it, but maybe only 1% or maybe 10%.

Again a jab at Quebec. And this is so ingrained in you guys that you would only notice your jabs if they involved spitting and throwing rocks. Then again maybe not.

x1, so true!

 

[MakeIt]

Can you actually prove that the unemployment rate among blacks is explained by racism ? There is no such fact that I know of, here or in Canada. This rate can be explained with severals explanations, and racism is probabibly part of it, but maybe only 1% or maybe 10%.

I can't prove it - its my assumption. I think you're right that its only part of the explanation. But the only other factors that people have in not getting jobs is they're unqualified or unsuitable. Being unqualified is strongly possible - I believe that many blacks in Quebec are 1st and 2nd generation from poor countries so many blacks may not yet had a chance to acquire skills as the rest of the general population. Unsuitable usually means they have criminal background, health issues or certain beliefs making them unsuitable for a job. I don't know that this is a significant factor that explains the additional black unemployemnt over the general population.

Overall I still think that racism is a major for the additional unemployment - maybe 50% but that's a guess.

 

[Cosmo]

I,ve had a few black sp's in the past,but it,s been awhile.
The last time I had one was at a straight parlour-L'Absolu.
The girl was Haitian,unfortunately her massage sucked.
There was no emotion,no sensuality and no finish.
It had nothing to do with her skin colour that I found rather appealing.
She was georgous btw.
Wich reminds me-I'm due for some brown sugar!
I know this is not the thread,but can someone suggest me a good black mp or sp?
French or not
Salut.

 

[shijak]

By the way, I'm going to really open a can of worms here - most of you participate in the sex trade - so how many of you non-visible minority customers avail yourselves of a black sex worker? How about sex workers - how many won't see a black man?

I love them ... when I can actually find one...not many of their photos on the agency websites (hint, hint!)...I've met Carmen from the Satin Dreams agency and she was a slice of heaven. And there are two dancers at Cleopatra's that definitely heat up my blood...

And they're not black, but I went to Asia a few years ago, and loved discovering asian women and their distinctive ways...(damn, i miss being there...)

Latina women...why haven't you crossed my amorous paths yet?!?

Pour ce qui concerne notre sujet plus controverse...je me retiens pour le moment, mais j'aimerais donc que le site offre un smiley qui se cogne la tete contre un mur de brique...!

 

[Mike Mercury]

Black or mixed island girl SPs. At least six maybe 8 or more.
Asian, Fillipino, Chinese at least at least six.

 

[MakeIt]

I'm glad to see that we're not hypocrits (not totally anyway) by contributing to the employment of blacks and other visible minorities. I also have been to the Dark Side from time to time and usually enjoyed myself - in fact some of my more memorable moments. Unfortunately, not enough that I see fit the style I like. I was interested by Carmen but I thought she was a fairly light Mulatto.

 

[Mike Mercury]

I watch TV every day though mainly for news.
The context is that there is not much employment of blacks in certain areas of Quebec as well as in the media - not proportional to the population anyhow....................
I can tell you this just from observation as I've lived up the river in QC and know many people from that area as well as from rural areas of Quebec...............
The only difference in racism here versus the US is that they are more obvious about it. In Quebec, we are more subtle about it.

Makeit,
You seem like a nice guy so I'll continue this.

Blacks are highly represented in the media at the star & celebrity level. Much more highly represented than in Ontario, the rest of Canada and in the States.
I can name five maybe ten black Quebec celebrities. One of which is the biggest entertainment money maker in Quebec. One became Governor General.
Blacks in lower levels of the media. I have no clue.
Black bus drivers, policemen, firemen. This was a battle in the 70's that is continuing today.
Blacks in construction, electricians, plumbers, hmmmmm. Not many.
Blacks in medicine, engineering, law. Some but not many


A little joke first. Quebec City is down the river from Montreal. The St Lawrence river flows down hill from the higher altitude Lake Ontario to the sea level ocean. However on a map Quebec city is to the right and up above Montreal. Thus I see where you got "up the river" from.

As for racism being more discrete in Quebec. Interesting in that Montrealers love their Chinese food, their smoked meat and bagels. They love black musicians and black actors & actresses.
In the country side it is different in that most people do not know black, asian, jewish or moslem people. They can be surprised by the appearance and can pull out the generic stereotype labels.
However no where in Quebec have laws limiting the rights of minorities been implemented (language laws yes I concede), no where have police dogs been used to attack civil rights demonstrators, no protestors have been murdered and buried in swamps and no-one has gotten lynched. Well perhaps the British hung a few Patriotes but that was a long time ago (nice jab at the "fair-play" Britts if I do say so myself, eh).

 

[MakeIt]

Hydra

Thanks. You are right on all your points and I will add. I tend to compare my experience in Quebec to the US because I have travelled there a lot and I think blacks have been able to improve their position thanks to laws such as the EEOC (not really a law but anyway). I'm not sure about comparing to Toronto but I would suspect that blacks are highly under-represented in the media there from what little I have seen of TO media. In fact, I think Indians are much better represented. If you've been to Pearson airport, its very noticeable that the majority of security workers are Indian/Pakistan origin - I'm a little surprised that they have such a high representation in a single area.

Michael Jean is very admirable as Gregory Charles. There a few others so compared to TO, blacks from Quebec have done well. Youo talk about blacks in a bunch of highly unionized public service jobs and there's not many - its worth noting that all levels of govt has done a poor job of meeting its own hiring targets for minorities in general. They always seem to have lots of money but can never spend it on anything useful. Don't get me started on unions and the Quebec govt.

Out in the country, as you said, if they see a black person they are surprised. But for the most part they will ignore them or at least be polite. In private, they'll be scandalized if any whites socialize with them. That's what I mean by subtle. In the US, if a white person doesn't like blacks, they're pretty public (and obnoxious) about it. I would concede that blacks have been treated with less a racists attitude in Quebec but it still exists. I also wonder what contributes to their high unemployment rate if they are not discriminated against - is it a cultural issue perhaps. Maybe blacks feel more comfortable working with other blacks and thereby limit their job opportunities.

As for Quebec, you are certainly right that its down the river. When I was in Quebec, we always said we were going up to Montreal and I got confused on that. I refer to travel to Quebec more in French, which for once is simpler than English (j'men va a Quebec).

 

[MakeIt]

Hydra

Thanks. You are right on all your points and I will add. I tend to compare my experience in Quebec to the US because I have travelled there a lot and I think blacks have been able to improve their position thanks to laws such as the EEOC (not really a law but anyway). I'm not sure about comparing to Toronto but I would suspect that blacks are highly under-represented in the media there from what little I have seen of TO media. In fact, I think Indians are much better represented. If you've been to Pearson airport, its very noticeable that the majority of security workers are Indian/Pakistan origin - I'm a little surprised that they have such a high representation in a single area.

Michael Jean is very admirable as Gregory Charles. There a few others so compared to TO, blacks from Quebec have done well. Youo talk about blacks in a bunch of highly unionized public service jobs and there's not many - its worth noting that all levels of govt has done a poor job of meeting its own hiring targets for minorities in general. They always seem to have lots of money but can never spend it on anything useful. Don't get me started on unions and the Quebec govt.

Out in the country, as you said, if they see a black person they are surprised. But for the most part they will ignore them or at least be polite. In private, they'll be scandalized if any whites socialize with them. That's what I mean by subtle. In the US, if a white person doesn't like blacks, they're pretty public (and obnoxious) about it. I would concede that blacks have been treated with less a racists attitude in Quebec but it still exists. I also wonder what contributes to their high unemployment rate if they are not discriminated against - is it a cultural issue perhaps. Maybe blacks feel more comfortable working with other blacks and thereby limit their job opportunities.

As for Quebec, you are certainly right that its down the river. When I was in Quebec, we always said we were going up to Montreal and I got confused on that. I refer to travel to Quebec more in French, which for once is simpler than English (j'men va a Quebec).

 

[LikesCats]

How many of you here discussing this matter would be able to consider themselves a "visible" minority. Racism is alive and well, and in no way less represented in this province than any other.

I find it humorous whenever someone refers to the presence of a handful of "ethnic" celebrities as proof of a more liberally minded society. That said, I agree with former posters that we here in Canada are no less prone to predjudice than our southern neghbours...we're just in deep denial about it.

Culture is Culture, eventually we will realize that we are all the same "Coke" drinking, "American idol" watching, "Sneaker" buying, tribe of hairless apes. It'll take a while...but it will happen. In the meantime, some of us should follow the example set by our close kin, the Bonobo Chimps... if there's a problem...if you're stressed...HAVE SEX!!!

 

[Cosmo]

American Idol watching!?!!!!
Now that's an insult!

 

[zigezon]

How many of you here discussing this matter would be able to consider themselves a "visible" minority. Racism is alive and well, and in no way less represented in this province than any other.

I find it humorous whenever someone refers to the presence of a handful of "ethnic" celebrities as proof of a more liberally minded society. That said, I agree with former posters that we here in Canada are no less prone to predjudice than our southern neghbours...we're just in deep denial about it.

Culture is Culture, eventually we will realize that we are all the same "Coke" drinking, "American idol" watching, "Sneaker" buying, tribe of hairless apes. It'll take a while...but it will happen. In the meantime, some of us should follow the example set by our close kin, the Bonobo Chimps... if there's a problem...if you're stressed...HAVE SEX!!!

I dont believe anyone is saying there's less racism here than there. It's ok to have little opinions on differents races, who doesnt ? The problem lies with the people who take those opinions and start acting on them... We all have different experiences, different social background, no one can say hey, I have no opnions on race. No one can say, hey, I have no opinions on sex (as in the sex of someone).

It's part of life mate. What I hate is that we can't accept that. We are suppressing everything in the name of political correctness, and as soon as someone criticizes a group of people, well then he either a sexist, a racist, a facist, etc...



You shall not believe Those who say they have no opinions on race, for they are liying...

Of course nowadays, when you have a good comment on a race, your not racist, but when it's a bad comment, well you are racist. How stupid is that logic. You are almost has likely to commit a prejudice toward a group of people if you have a good or bad opinion over a group or another group of people.

 

[Techman]

Of course nowadays, when you have a good comment on a race, your not racist, but when it's a bad comment, well you are racist. How stupid is that logic. You are almost has likely to commit a prejudice toward a group of people if you have a good or bad opinion over a group or another group of people

This is very true. I remember seeing Quincy Jones, the famous producer composer and bandleader, on Oprah one day. They were talking about racism in the music business and in general. At one point they showed some photos of his family and three ex-wives. Not once was it brought up that his ex-wives all happen to be beautiful, blond and white. When I, a white male, mention that I don't find black women, in general, to be appealing to me, some people in the past have called me racist. But a black man who only dates white women is not?

 

[Mike Mercury]

It may seem surprising that we can understand the gist of an almost coherent text.

As long as the first and last letters of short words are there and the grammar is not too garbled most of us can pick the intentions of the writer.

 

[EagerBeaver]

OK

99.9% of the beggars I have seen in downtown Montreal are white.

 

[hornyanglo66]

I don't care what colour the person is I go by gut feel when it comes to giving to beggars. Most of the beggars seem to be shit assed lazy fucks who are just looking for the quick buck so they don't even get the used toilet paper from my ass, but some look genuinely in trouble and are just looking for some help. Those are the ones I give my $$ to and although I may be wrong in the assumptions I think I do help some out.