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Thread: High End SP / Dinner Date

  1. #1

    Question High End SP / Dinner Date

    I've never done any Dinner Date / high end SP. I've only been with escorts around the 150$/hour feel, and had, like most people here I guess, some very good and some poor experiences.

    From my perception, it does look like getting to the High End SP area is a bit of a dangerous road to go on. For me, low-end SP means that I give money to a girl for sex and that's what's going to happen, yes within the one hour we'll have some friendly talk and such but that's all there is to it. It's not a GFE and to me, it's good that it's not...

    I really feel like getting towards the High End market is basically starting paying not only for sex but for dates, and to a big extent to fullfill an emotionnal void. I'm not being a critic here, but I would fear that once you've been in that direction, once you were able to have the perfect date with the perfect looking girl and had incredible sex with her, it would totally remove the interest you might have for 'real' woman... as well as costing a lot of money. The situation must be worst when soemone just pick up the same SP all the time. I somehow perceive that there is something more abnormal in doing this than into just paying someone for sex and leave....

  2. #2
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    Crazy Dude, you are correct - the more money you spend for non-sex acitivities, the more you are trying to fill a void of "relationship" instead of "horny guy". While I can understand the idea of travelling business men who like to spend some time with someone, I think that if this is the end of things you are looking at, then there are other issues you need to consider.

    As a single time fun thing to try, I would certainly recommend it. As a replacement for real emotional relationships, I think you need to look at other better ways to end up in social situations with members of the opposite sex.

    IMHO, when the hobby stops being about your dick and starts being about your heart, something is getting out of hand.

    JMHO, of course!

    MATt
    Your mileage may vary... mine did!

  3. #3
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    Crazy Dude,

    As someone who rarely repeats with an SP (I think I have repeated twice in the last 3 years, and on each occasion only once), I agree with your point. As far as high end vs. low end, I think the likelihood that you will have a good experience, or the percentage chance for a successful encounter, is much higher with the high end SP. I have only had one "bad" experience with a so-called high end SP in Montreal and it was because we just did not click for some reason, not because her service was bad or because she was unattractive. You are right though, the high end SPs, when you factor in gifts, possibly dinner, and a nice hotel, can be a bit of an expense and it is not for everyone. I have heard arguments on both sides regarding booking with 2 lower end SPs vs. 1 high end SP, but that also depends upon the libido and sexual stamina of the hobbyist involved. My own opinion is that generally by paying the slightly higher cost of a high end SP, I get a higher quality lady. There are of course many exceptions, but if you do your research, there is usually a reason why the top girls at the low end agencies are working at those agencies and making less money.

    Eager

  4. #4
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    Would i repeat with an sp ??

    Oh yes I would !! if she gave a really good service i'*ll mos-def repeat.

    The primary reason for a repeat visit is the desire to relive a good previous experience
    plus the more times you see the same sp, the more liberal service you get from her., i guess that would be my secondary reason.

  5. #5
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    Re: High End SP / Dinner Date

    Originally posted by CrazyDude
    I`ve never done any Dinner Date / high end SP. I`ve only been with escorts around the 150$/hour feel, and had, like most people here I guess, some very good and some poor experiences.


    Crazydude,

    I guess I don`t get the connection. You can take 150$/hr. ladies out to dinner as well. You can also get your brains fucked out by HDH ladies without taking them to dinner.

    Originally posted by CrazyDude
    [B

    From my perception, it does look like getting to the High End SP area is a bit of a dangerous road to go on. For me, low-end SP means that I give money to a girl for sex and that`s what`s going to happen, yes within the one hour we`ll have some friendly talk and such but that`s all there is to it. It`s not a GFE and to me, it`s good that it`s not...

    [/B]

    It must be your perception. Whereaas it is true that some HDH ladies possess companion skills which might make them well suited as a travel or dinner companion for a business exec looking for company, its my experience that the common denominator is that most of them know their way around the bedroom. The rest of the stuff is ancillary.

    Originally posted by CrazyDude
    [B
    I really feel like getting towards the High End market is basically starting paying not only for sex but for dates, and to a big extent to fullfill an emotionnal void. I`m not being a critic here, but I would fear that once you`ve been in that direction, once you were able to have the perfect date with the perfect looking girl and had incredible sex with her, it would totally remove the interest you might have for `real` woman... as well as costing a lot of money. The situation must be worst when soemone just pick up the same SP all the time. I somehow perceive that there is something more abnormal in doing this than into just paying someone for sex and leave.... [/B]
    I am really curious as to why you believe that only HDH ladies have suitors that seek to take them on trips, shopping or dinner. It is the case that most HDH clients are in a better financial position to do those types of things, but there are just as many emotional cripples who use the market priced ladies as there are who use HDHs. The rationalization of saying that because a guy pays for a cheaper date, he is not an emotional cripple is funny to me.

    EBS
    mi nombre en inglés es "Good Sam"

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    EBS, there is a very big difference between paying for an hours worth of fun at motel no-tell compared to dinner dates and such.

    Price isn't the division, but I think the point is this: Paying more for a HDH for Crazydude is the point where he goes from fling to "attention"... moving from satisfying what is in his pants and moving on to satisfying his mind and soul.

    I personally think this is the edge of the abyss, one that many of us live in happily. However, just like any other rough neighborhood, I don't recommend it for everyone. I think the question has to do more with realizing that one is at that edge, and that the next step is a big one, where not only your body but your emotions get involved in a more significant way, maybe where you fool yourself more.

    To ask the question is to confirm the importance of the moment.

    MATt
    Your mileage may vary... mine did!

  7. #7
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    Originally posted by ManAboutTown
    EBS, there is a very big difference between paying for an hours worth of fun at motel no-tell compared to dinner dates and such.

    Price isn't the division, but I think the point is this: Paying more for a HDH for Crazydude is the point where he goes from fling to "attention"... moving from satisfying what is in his pants and moving on to satisfying his mind and soul.

    I personally think this is the edge of the abyss, one that many of us live in happily. However, just like any other rough neighborhood, I don't recommend it for everyone. I think the question has to do more with realizing that one is at that edge, and that the next step is a big one, where not only your body but your emotions get involved in a more significant way, maybe where you fool yourself more.

    To ask the question is to confirm the importance of the moment.

    MATt
    MAT,

    It seems to me that what's happenning here is that we're struggling for a definition of HDH. You're quite right it's not just about the price point, a point that I'm trying to make here. I'm basicially saying that there are HDH's that exist purely for sexual relief. Their ability to satisy any other emotional need may be just as impaired or nonexistant as the average market escort refered to by the gentleman. Whereas there may be a difference in price, the reasons for engaging the lady can and in many cases are the same..i.e. gratituitous sex. Just because I can afford to pay more money, it doesn't mean that I'm looking for a deeper meaning of life from the experience. It means that I need a lady that meets a profile that can be availible for me when I need her. I don't need her at an incall location servicing 6 walkins and I don't need to wait for her to get done with somebody else. I'll pay because I need her to be there, be fresh, expect to deal with me, and that will be the long an short of it. The notion that just because this guy employs a HDH, that all of a sudden he is into a level of commitment that didn't exist before...well..that's just nonsense. Two hours is enough time to have a civilized appointment. Emotionally stable people can handle that. Angry individuals with no balance in life, look at that as some kind of committment. They look at their entire participation in the pay for play game with a degree of regret. They need to denegrate their companions in order to feel their own self worth. The notion that they'll be paying a woman to put up with their sorry ass is quite a revelation. Now all of a sudden make them have to stretch their wallets..well that leads to a lot of the nonsensical comments often made on boards like this.

    EBS
    mi nombre en inglés es "Good Sam"

  8. #8
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    EBS: From the SP's point of view, the length of time and the dollars spent don't increase the emotional commitment, rather just the time obligation, the amount of time (and the quality of effort) to keep your game face on.

    Clients on the other hand are a grab bag of emotional flotsam that would just make you cry if you could see it all. You see much of it here (and more so right now on terb, where there are some SERIOUS cases posting!).

    Moving up in dollars, and moving away from a pure physical relationship and into a friendly / date / social event is a big step. It is a step where people maybe realize that what they looked for in an SP wasn't just good service, but a sort of interaction they are not getting elsewhere in the real world. Many people are willing to pay to make that interaction occur. You will see many reviews (yours included) that point to the "connection" part of a date. You are there, the difference is that you understand (I gather) the pay for play position you are in, and rather than suffer from it, you revel in it and the freedom it has apparently brought you. Good for you, you might be one of the few people that gets it.

    Crazydude is standing on the edge right now... a line once crossed has no going back (sort of like moving from $5 dances to $10... there is not much satisfaction to be had in a $5 dance after you have had a $10 dance... and there certainly isn't the same satisfaciton to be had in a one hour fling that you find in a two hour session, or possilby even a dinner date with dessert). He sees the risks that this can have in dealing with 'real' relationships and such... good for him for THINKING before acting.

    Not everyone is as secure in their view of the world to be able to take a minute and consider what their actions mean in reality, and what ripples come from dropping this rock in the pond.

    It ain't a bad thing, ya know?

    MATt
    Your mileage may vary... mine did!

  9. #9
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    MAT,

    Crazydude and a lot of guys in this hobby may already be over the edge. We agree that spending dollars for the extracurricular beyond the private time for sex, is a dangerous thing often emotionally driven. It is rare that I have a dinner date with an escort. When I do, we go on "her time". I have no shortage of platonic female partners who love to have dinner with me. I don't need to pay anybody for dinner or conversation. In fact, I'm such good company, they should be paying me..LOL. To me it is about achieving the best result. I believe that if a lady has a good time in my presence, that I will have better time. My time is worth more than the money spent for the tryst. I like maximizing my return on investment in time.

    On the other hand, you have to be kidding if you think it is emotionally healthy/normal to deny yourself any kind of emotional connection with an escort. There just isn't that kind of wall in a normal emotionally healthy human. Just look at the number of guys who demand kissing as an integral part of an experience. I don't believe this has anything to do with getting your rocks off. I never have and never will. It has never been a goal of mine to shove my tongue down the throat of a production line escort. If I have to hire one today, I get her coming on shift and keep her for the evening. What are such GFE requirements about if not about "feeling" a connection. What's with the machismo thing of not being able to admit emotion and feeling?

    Crazydude, like many men in the hobby may already be over the edge. Many men use encounters with escorts as substitutes for real life experience with the opposite sex. A guy talks about going to an escort to lose his virginity. Guys talk about using escorts instead of going through the dating and bar scene. Some middle aged loser was on here the other day talking about a failed courtship with a 23 year old alledgedly retired escort. There are more than a fair share of men who patronize prostitutes that are sociopaths and social misfits. If this isn't emotionally screwed up, I don't know what is. And note we haven't gotten to the part about dinner dates yet, we are talking about the fundemental observation that sex with prostitutes is a substitute activity for many men in lieu of having a real relationship with all of its attendant responsibilities. I think all the talk about dinner dates being a dangerous level of commitment is a self serving rationalization from a person whose life is so devoid of viable female companionship that he depends on escorts as his only source of contact and warmth with the female species. And the sad thing is that he's not alone.


    EBS
    Last edited by E B Samaritano; 07-07-2003 at 12:55 PM.
    mi nombre en inglés es "Good Sam"

  10. #10
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    EBS: I don't think that SP experiences should be devoid of emotional contact, but at the same time, that emotional stuff needs to be taken in the context of "I gave her money to like me", and needs to be framed differently from the girl you took to the prom or your last girlfriend. The part that downright scares me is that it is too easy to mistake one for the other, and get caught up paying for attention rather than seeking it out.

    I think this hobby is very healthy until that line is crossed, then it becomes a crutch and is a little tough to handle.

    Sort of like not having any depth perception in a 2D picture - you need the 3D to let you know where everything is...

    MATt
    Your mileage may vary... mine did!

  11. #11
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    MAT,

    That is a great analogy. It is a fine line you walk in this hobby between fantasy and reality. And all parties should know and understand their space. Unfortunately, I hear all too often the women in this business having their privacy invaded or their person threatened by jealous customers, who simply don't know how to keep themselves in check. Guys who don't understand that space and their relationship with an escort, probably don't understand human relationships and probably have never had a decent real relationship with a woman. I can certainly be in lust with a young lady young enough to be my daughter, in love NO WAY..LOL..

    It is important for clients to remember that the person you are dealing with is human, not just a semen repository. Is is not important to me to remember that money is involved as a precursor to my interlude with a lady. I have enough regular relationships with women to sort out those issues. Money is an ancillary issue to people who are out to enjoy themselves. People who lead with money considerations, seldom enjoy this hobby. That is precisely the reason why so many hobbiest who occassionally splurge to entertain a more expensive provider, have a hard time enjoying or appreciating the experience. They are too busy thinking about all the money they just spent rather than enjoying the moment.

    EBS
    mi nombre en inglés es "Good Sam"

  12. #12
    Well, since many people tried to understand my deep motives and psyche, I guess I should post a little follow-up… It’s true that I do question myself a lot these day, because indeed most people don’t question themselves very much and just act & have to live with the long term consequences of their actions. Maybe it’s some maturity that is coming with age, but now I tend to reflect a bit on my actions before acting, and try to think of the consequences and risk of any behavior that I may do (this applies to everything in life, not just behavior towards escorts!).

    Yes I did start seeing SP when I was out of female companionship, but I don’t think that it’s a pathetic thing to admit. What is much more sadder are people that just go and see SP even though they have much more to lose, whether it’s a good marriage or a good long-term relationship. When there will be another serious woman in my life I will retire from the scene (in which I’m still a novice I can probably count the number of SP I’ve been with on my fingers). So to me I’m just living an interlude now after coming of of a marriage, one that enables me to have some fun but in which I don’t jump in without thinking about the possible pitfalls.

    Let's be honest here who would pay for escorts if they could get for the same level of effort the same kind of attention from a equivalent 'normal' lady without paying for it?

  13. #13
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    Crazydude,

    I believe that most hobbyists see SPs to fill emotional voids of varying degrees and the bigger the emotional void, the more vulnerable you are. Its also worth pointing out that quite a few of the higher-priced escorts command such rates not only because of their looks but also their ability to establish emotional connections with clients. One can easily imagine a scenario in which a client's infatuation with an escort is entirely one-sided; no good can come out of this. Even worse is the vulnerable hobbyist who meets up with an unscrupulous SP, stories of hobbyists who decide to 'rescue' their favorite SPs by sending them money regularly only to find that they have been taken for a ride are fairly common on discussion boards. Even if you don't fall into such a trap, relying on high priced escorts to replace normal female companionship can be costly and depending on your financial situation, you might want to take that into consideration and start planning how you're going to pay for it. I'm probably a lot younger than the average hobbyist and take home the lower end of six figures after Uncle Sam takes his share so I budget about $5-10,000 for all hobbying expenses but I compromise on my living expenses. Of course, if you're rolling in the big bucks, that's a different story. Also, if you're not entirely confident that you'll be able to avoid falling in love with an SP, might want to try following guidelines like never seeing an escort more than a certain number of times (remember to keep that number low, LOL) or do what I do, never see an escort on her own time; sure, its nice and in fact, an immense compliment when an escort makes an offer like that but do you really want to tempt yourself like that? Hope this will be of some help to you.
    Last edited by donbusch; 07-08-2003 at 02:59 AM.
    I used to be schizophrenic, but we're OK now.

  14. #14
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    Originally posted by Train

    As far as having dinner .....I've done it once and have concluded it is a lot less awkward to have a 2 or 3 hour date with room service ....lol.

    Yep...having been on my share of lunchtime or dinner interview appointments I know they can be mighty awkward. I'm with you 100% there..LOL..

    EBS
    mi nombre en inglés es "Good Sam"

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