2012 Off-Season Baseball Thread

[Doc Holliday]

Meh.... i'd take what the Jays are doing ANYDAY over the fiasco that is currently going on in beantown.

Agree with you on all counts. I can't believe he actually thinks the Jays (or anyone else for the matter) would want the likes of Carl Crawford, Kevin "Chaz" Youkilis, Puchholz, Fat Lester, Fat Beckett, Bard, Scutaro??

I'd take Ellsbury (who wouldn't?) & Pedroia in a flash. Not sure on Gonzalez.....i have a feeling he's not a team player & never accepts blame. Didn't he blame the recent historical collapse on God? LOL!!!

 

[Doc Holliday]

I beg to differ.

Buchholz is injury plagued so that does not make him very reliable.

Bard - You are joking, right?.

Youk - Coming off a injury and terrible season.

Ellsbury - Fluke season, will not have the same type of year, guaranteed(check his history).

Crawford - Need I say more?

Theo, gone, Francona, gone, looks like another year without the playoffs unless they sign Darvish, Pujols and Fielder.

Gotta agree with the good Doctor on this one.

I agree with you on all counts, however, i'd want Ellsbury on my team. Great leadoff hitter.

As for Darvish, would there be room for him if Youkilis stays? Wouldn't adding another tinkerbell be reason to worry about more shenanigans inside the clubhouse? Would Mrs. Youkilis even allow him to remain in Boston if Darvish were signed?

 

[Doc Holliday]

My biggest concerns as a Yankees fan is how to thwart off the surging Blue Jays and the pitching stacked Rays... It should be a dog fight for the top three in the east between the Yanks, Jays and Rays.

I totally agree with you. I'm also curious on whom the Red Sox would hire as manager. Of course, their options are limited since not many quality managerial prospects are interested in joining that soap opera right now, knowing full well that they'll likely be slandered & have their reputations dragged in the mud once they leave the team, whether by choice or by 'mutual decision'.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Blue Jays’ Lovullo interviews for Red Sox vacancy

The Boston Red Sox plan to interview Torey Lovullo and Gene Lamont for their managerial opening.

They team said Tuesday they will be interviewed this week along with Cleveland bench coach Sandy Alomar Jr., whose interview Wednesday was announced earlier.

Terry Francona left as manager two days after the regular season ended.

Lovullo, who will be interviewed Friday, managed the Red Sox triple-A team at Pawtucket in 2010 and was first base coach this year for the Toronto Blue Jays.

Lamont, third base coach of the Detroit Tigers since 2006, had that job with Boston in 2001. He managed the Chicago White Sox from 1992-95 and Pittsburgh Pirates from 1997-2000.

The Red Sox already have interviewed Philadelphia Phillies bench coach Pete Mackanin and Milwaukee Brewers hitting coach Dale Sveum.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/baseball/blue-jays-lovullo-interviews-for-red-sox-vacancy/article2230063/

 

[Joe.t]

I think the sox are in a whole lot more trouble than "some" in here refuse to believe. If they even wanna see post season again in 2012, it starts with stable management, something they currently lack. I am anxious to see who they end up with for a manager and coaching staff before i can truly say if they are headed back into the right direction.

On the flip side of things, i see the Yankees adding a starting pitcher somehow/someway, just not sure who yet, but i also think they will re sign one of Garcia/Colon as a depth move. Having Montero's bat in the lineup over Posadas just made them better offensively than last season, scary. And having a healthy Chamberlain, who was pitching great before his injury, and Pedro Feliciano healthy improves the best bullpen in the game to even better, again, Scary

My biggest concerns as a Yankees fan is how to thwart off the surging Blue Jays and the pitching stacked Rays... It should be a dog fight for the top three in the east between the Yanks, Jays and Rays.

Iggy my good man, there are two things right now that give me a instant hard on, the first one is the pictures of Molly on the Candyshop site and the second is the mere mention of the name "Jesus Montero" playing next year, I can't wait for the season to begin so I can watch this young man in action, it should be spectacular, excellent analysis as usual iggymeister!!!.

 

[lgna69xxx]

Why thank you my fellow good man.... and i am sure Molly and you will ruin the spare bed in my place in 2 weeks, just leave a deposit to cover expenses please.

Montero is a HUGE addition to what was already a very lethal offensive machine in the boogie down Bronx. Where will he hit? most likely he will start 6th or 7th in the batting order, but if he produces like the scouts say he can, look for him to be slotted in that #3-5 sometime next season.

If you think that was expert analysis, you should search another thread.

Iggy my good man, there are two things right now that give me a instant hard on, the first one is the pictures of Molly on the Candyshop site and the second is the mere mention of the name "Jesus Montero" playing next year, I can't wait for the season to begin so I can watch this young man in action, it should be spectacular, excellent analysis as usual iggymeister!!!.

 

[Merlot]

Hello BOYZ,

In fact, any considerate manager would find the Boston situation infinitely preferable to taking over the Blue Jays for the key reason that the Jays potential has such entrenched limitation because the incredibly wealthy owners handcuff everyone by refusing to commit the necessary investments make a real competitor. Of course money isn't everything, but if the organization had all the right player-management-recruiting dynamics in place to win regardless of funding they would have done better than fourth against the situation you describe as..."a joke"...which is quite an indictment of what's going on in Toronto. No manager would prefer to take over in a place like Toronto where championship potential is DEAD ON ARRIVAL!!!
Merlot

Teams don't make the playoffs merely by spending more money than the other guys. It has to be done intelligently.

Really. It seems I remember just saying that somewhere.

The Jays are still maybe two years from consistently competing for the playoffs but could get there sooner with some more shrewd moves and a little luck.

So you disagree with your pals who say the Jays are ready now.

Any team would get there sooner with some "shrewd moves"...and "luck"... it goes without saying doesn't it.

For Red Sox, dugout search goes well beyond the manager

http://www.boston.com/sports/columnists/massarotti/2011/11/for_red_sox_dugout_search_goes.html

In Boston, after all, we have seen this sort of thing before. Following the 1996 season, for instance, the Red Sox interviewed Grady Little for their managerial opening only to hire him as bench coach for Jimy Williams. And given the recent maneuverings involving Mike Maddux, who is due to interview for the Cubs' managerial opening today, one can only wonder whether the Red Sox had designs of luring Maddux in as their pitching coach, a far more convincing explanation beyond "family" for Maddux' withdrawal from consideration.

With all due respect to Maddux, the distance between the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex and Boston has nothing to do with anything. If the Red Sox were the only team ready to give him a manager's job, he'd hardly turn it down over an additional 1,500 miles in a continuously shrinking universe. What Maddux knows, perhaps, is that the Cubs intend to give him either their manager's job or no worse a position than the Red Sox do, and he isn't about to go from Texas to Boston for a lateral move.

Especially when it was reported last week that Sveum already is a leading candidate for the Boston job, an unsurprising development given Sveum's previous connection to the Red Sox (as a coach for the deposed Terry Francona) and his indisputable baseball acumen.

During Sveum's stint here as a third base coach, players privately raved about his knowledge. They respected him immensely. And they respected him not because he was nice to them or easy on them or allowed them latitude, but because he possessed real, tactical insight to which they could relate. They knew that he knew what he was talking about, which means they believed in him.

What someone like Sveum does not have is in-game managing experience, which is precisely why he needs someone like Lamont, a baseball lifer who has been in professional baseball for nearly 50 years. During his time in the game, Lamont has served as a coach, player and manager, and he has advised skippers ranging from Williams to Jim Leyland. When Williams and Dan Duquette were engaged in something of a power struggle during Williams' managerial tenure -- Duquette's reluctance to pay Little led to Little's departure for Cleveland -- former Sox executive Lee Thomas bridged the gap by suggesting Lamont as a bench coach, a move that stabilized the Boston staff.

Maybe the Red Sox today want Lamont as their manager, but it seems unlikely. Closer inspection of the Red Sox' model suggests the Sox are trying to assemble a staff that can cover all bases, the way they did when they flanked Theo Epstein with Bill Lajoie, among others, in the fall of 2002. Try thinking of Sveum and Lamont as a baseball version of Barack Obama and Joe Biden, a tandem of energy and experience that gives the Red Sox comprehensive coverage in the clubhouse and dugout.

Does that mean Sveum is a lock for the job? No. But it does give us some insight of what Cherington may be trying to build. Maybe Cherington wants Lovullo as his manager, or even Alomar. As in free agency, there are lots of moving pieces. But the greater likelihood is that Cherington went into the entire process with a plan, with names on his list for manager, bench coach, pitching coach and other positions, looking at the entire assembly of manager and coaches as a group.

Whether or not he is the manager, after all, someone like Lovullo would be important because he managed in the Red Sox minor league system and might have some relationships with younger Boston players. Someone like Alomar could help bridge any cultural gap that might exist in any clubhouse between American and Hispanic players. For Cherington, the idea is to close any holes that might exist in his clubhouse and dugout structure, and we all know that the 2011 Red Sox had plenty of those.

Where this all ends up remains difficult to say, but after the last 10-20 years of Red Sox history, this much is clear: the Red Sox don’t need the best manager on the market so much as they need the right manager for their existing operation. Once you get past the big names in any managerial search -- Leyland, Tony La Russa and their respective peers -- handicapping the field is difficult for those of us on the outside. Is any of us really equipped to know whether Maddux would make a better manager in Boston than Sveum? Hell no. What we look for then is the logic behind the decision, the philosophy, because every organization and every general manager must have a vision of what he is trying to accomplish.

In the end, barring the unexpected emergence of a big-name candidate -- given the Red Sox hiring history under this administration, that seems unlikely -- what the Red Sox are trying to do here is just as important as with whom. In fact, in the wake of the chicken-fried finish to September, the identity of the pitching coach might be every bit as important as that of the manager. Cherington is not empowering one man here so much as he is building the nucleus of the dugout and clubhouse operation, and there are lots of elements to cover beyond pitching changes and the hit-and-run.

In the fall of 2003, after all, few in Boston were inspired when the Red Sox hired Terry Francona as their manager.

But as it turned out, even if the Red Sox didn't hire the biggest name on the market at the time, they found the best fit.

And they surrounded him with an effective support structure.

Sveum may well have the inside track. I don't think Alomar has the experience in coaching/managing that makes him measure up to the task, certainly not in Boston.

It also seems like Pete Mackanin might be a good alternative.

Cheers,

Merlot

 

[Doc Holliday]

The Jays are still maybe two years from consistently competing for the playoffs but could get there sooner with some more shrewd moves and a little luck. As a Yankee fan I have been worrying more about the Rays the past few years than the Red Sox. Going forward, I'll be more concerned about competition from both the Rays and Jays starting in 2013.

I also agree with you in that the Jays are likely two years away from consistently competing for the playoffs. They first need to address some issues during the off-season. Starting pitching is still a question mark. The bullpen is a huge question mark & basically has to be rebuilt. There are still holes to be filled in the starting lineup. Who will play left field? Who will be their second baseman? Who will be JP Arencibia's backup at the catching position? Who will they go after in the free agent pool?

I doubt they Jays will improve much in 2012......but as you mentionned, 2013 is a more realistic target for them to make a push for the post-season.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Sveum may well have the inside track. I don't think Alomar has the experience in coaching/managing that makes him measure up to the task, certainly not in Boston.

It also seems like Pete Mackanin might be a good alternative.

I agree with you. Both Sveum & Mackanin would be good managerial candidates for the Red Sox, while Alomar likely doesn't have the experience that would be required on this version of the Red Sox. Wrong team, wrong time.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Nationals catcher Wilson Ramos kidnapped in Venezuela

Officials said Thursday they have found the vehicle used by armed men who abducted Washington Nationals catcher Wilson Ramos, a case that highlights a sharp rise in kidnappings for ransom in Venezuela.

Police found the kidnappers' vehicle abandoned in a nearby town Thursday morning and were gathering evidence, Justice Minister Tareck El Aissami told reporters.

“It's a very important find,” he said, vowing to rescue Ramos and capture his abductors. He said anti-kidnapping units led by “the best investigators we have” were dispatched to the area in central Carabobo state.

The 24-year-old Venezuelan player, who had just finished his rookie season, was seized from his home by kidnappers on Wednesday night.

“The abductors haven't made contact with the family or with anyone,” said Domingo Alvarez, vice-president of the Venezuelan Professional Baseball League, in a telephone interview. “We're worried.”

Ramos was taken away in an SUV by four armed men from his home in Santa Ines, spokeswoman Katherine Vilera of his Venezuelan team, the Aragua Tigers, said on her official Twitter account.

Police last year said that 618 kidnappings were reported in 2009, and the numbers have grown rapidly in recent years. In 1998, when President Hugo Chavez was elected, just 52 kidnappings were reported. Security experts say the real number of kidnappings today is much higher because many cases aren't reported to authorities.

The wealthy in Venezuela have taken steps to protect themselves; sales of armoured cars have soared in the past several years. Bodyguards also typically shadow Major League Baseball players when they return to their homeland to play in the winter league.

“Every major league player has his own security, but we don't know if at that time he had his security there,” Alvarez said. He said it's the first time a major league player has been abducted in the country, though other players' relatives have been held for ransom in the past.

A person close to Ramos's family, who asked not to be identified by name due to safety concerns, said the catcher was at home with his father and brothers when several men “entered the house and took him away.”

Drew Storen, a relief pitcher for the Nationals, tweeted his concerns: “Extremely upsetting news about Ramo. Thoughts and prayers with him. Scary situation.”

Ramos is considered one of the key young players for the Nationals as they try to become a contender in the National League East. As a rookie in 2011, he hit .267 with 15 home runs and 52 RBIs in 113 games. He also threw out 19 of 67 runners attempting to steal a base, a 28 per cent success rate that ranked third among qualifying catchers in the National League.

Washington acquired Ramos from the Minnesota Twins in a trade for all-star reliever Matt Capps in July 2010.

Venezuela is home to dozens of major league players and Alvarez said they are increasingly worried about the rise in kidnappings.

In November 2009, the 56-year-old mother of Victor Zambrano, who retired after a seven-year major league career, was rescued in a commando-style operation three days after she was kidnapped. The former pitcher's cousin, Richard Mendez Zambrano, had been kidnapped a few days earlier and was later killed.

In June 2009, Colorado Rockies catcher Yorvit Torrealba's 11-year-old son and brother-in-law were kidnapped and released a day later.

The mother of former player Ugueth Urbina, who was a two-time all-star pitcher while playing for six teams, spent more than five months in captivity until she was rescued in early 2005.

Ramos's abduction “makes us worry, makes us stay alert facing a situation that is truly dramatic and unfortunate,” Alvarez said.

Venezuela has one of Latin America's highest murder rates, and violent crime has worsened in recent years. As ransom kidnapping has soared, the government passed a revised law in 2009 that stiffened prison sentences for kidnapping and also allowing authorities to freeze the banks accounts of victims' families to prevent them from paying ransom.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Jorge Posada: Return won't happen

NEW YORK -- Jorge Posada remains undecided on his future but believes it won't be with the New York Yankees.

"It's not gonna happen," Posada said Wednesday night at a Manhattan function for The Jorge Posada Foundation. "I don't think there is even a percentage of a chance that I can come back."

The free agent says he's not bitter with the organization he has played for his entire career. He said five or six teams have shown interest in his services.

"I will always be a Yankee. The New York Yankees, for me, is my second family," Posada said. "It'd be tough to put on another uniform for real and learn a new set of rules. But it's one of those things where I have to see if I wanna keep playing."

"At the end of the day, it's a business," he added. "You look back and you wish there were some things that could've gone differently, but they didn't. Everything happened for a reason. I'm not bitter at the Yankees. I'm not bitter at (manager) Joe Girardi. I'm not bitter at (general manager) Brian Cashman. It just happens."

Posada, 40, hopes to make up his mind early next year, which will give him ample time to get ready for spring training. He doesn't plan on letting the decision linger.

"I started working out again Nov. 1 like I always do, but I have no idea what's gonna happen," Posada said. "A lot of teams called after the season was over. I'm undecided. I don't know if I wanna play or stay home. I'm having fun with the kids and my family, but I don't know what I wanna do. I don't wanna make the mistake of telling you that I'm not gonna play or telling you that I am gonna play when I don't know what I wanna do."

General manager Brian Cashman told reporters Wednesday that he hasn't spoken with Posada's representatives. Posada's four-year, $52 million contract expired at the end of the 2011 season.

Posada -- a five-time All-Star and a four-time World Series champion -- hit a team-high .429 during the American League Division Series, but he batted a career-worst .235 with 14 home runs and 44 RBIs during the regular season. The switch-hitter had just six hits in 65 at-bats (.092) against left-handed pitching.

"It was hard to deal with after the (Game 5 elimination) loss," Posada said of being resigned to knowing he wouldn't be returning. "It was very hard that day. I was very emotional at night. It was tough for me to know that I was not coming back."

Posada, relegated to designated hitter duty for the first time in his career because the Yankees didn't feel he could continue as an every-day catcher, struggled to acclimate himself to his new role.

On May 14, Posada and his .165 average were dropped to ninth in the batting order against the Boston Red Sox. He then removed himself from the lineup, prompting heavy criticism for the move.

Posada was later benched by manager Joe Girardi on Aug. 9 in Boston. Posada went 3-for-5 on Aug. 13 with a homer and six RBIs against the Tampa Bay Rays, but he hit .228 to close out the regular season, and many were unsure if he'd even make the postseason roster.

Jesus Montero emerged as a legitimate bat during his rookie year in 2011, and it appears as though he'll begin the 2012 campaign as the Yankees' every-day DH, while getting spot starts behind the plate. Incumbent No. 1 catcher Russell Martin, who is arbitration-eligible, should be back as the starter.

Posada's former manager, Joe Torre, has a hard time envisioning Posada playing anywhere but in the Bronx.

"It's really tough when you play with one team and create the relationships that he has all these years. It's probably going to be tough to think about going somewhere else," Torre said Tuesday night.

Posada has regularly spoken with former teammate and friend Bernie Williams, who also went through a difficult exit to his Yankee career.

"He told me, 'Make sure you make the right decision,'" Posada said. "'Don't say or do something that you are going to regret.'"

Posada's wife, Laura, echoed those sentiments.

"You need to really be sure about your decision, because you don't wanna have any regrets," she said, adding that she'd love for Posada to finish his career in Miami with the Marlins, where their family resides.

"I love Miami. It would be a nice transition."

Posada is a career .273 hitter with 275 homers and 1,065 RBIs.

According to its official website, The Jorge Posada Foundation is a nonprofit organization started by Posada and his wife which aims to create awareness and raise money in an effort to find a cure for Craniosynostosis, a condition which affects the growth of the skull. Posada's son, Jorge III, suffers from the condition and has undergone numerous corrective surgeries.

Mike Mazzeo is a regular contributor to ESPNNewYork.com.

 

[daydreamer41]

Jorge Posada: Return won't happen

NEW YORK -- Jorge Posada remains undecided on his future but believes it won't be with the New York Yankees.

"It's not gonna happen," Posada said Wednesday night at a Manhattan function for The Jorge Posada Foundation. "I don't think there is even a percentage of a chance that I can come back."

Jorge Posada should look for a coaching job. He would not see much action with any team, including the Pittsburgh Pirates or Kansas City Royals. He'd develop into a good coach at some level. He has many years of experience. He was a good ball player in his prime. I would think he has a good baseball acumen.

 

[Mod 8]

What was there in my post at the beginning of this thread that was so difficult for some people to understand? THIS THREAD IS FOR OFF SEASON BASEBALL DISCUSSION ONLY!!! Any further posts that do not follow the rules I set out for this thread will be removed and a two month suspension will be the result for the poster.

This is my one and only warning in this thread.

Mod 8

 

[Doc Holliday]

Oral Hershiser serious 'contender' to purchase LA Dodgers

The ownership group interested in purchasing the Los Angeles Dodgers, led by former Dodger greats Steve Garvey and Orel Hershiser, hasn't yet revealed details about who their financial backers are except to say that they have them.

Thursday afternoon, in his first public comments since Dodgers owner Frank McCourt announced that he would put the team up for sale via an auction in bankruptcy court, Hershiser shot down skepticism about the seriousness and strength of their bid.

"I'm as serious as my heart beats," Hershiser told ESPNLosAngeles.com. "The next step in the process is to be approved by baseball to bid on the team. We think with the people we have in place and the assets we have in place, we will be a serious contender."

Hershiser, a baseball analyst for ESPN, said the group's financial backers prefer to remain in the background at this point. But after reviewing details of their plan this week, he's confident they have more than enough capital and assets to make a serious run at the team, which most analysts have estimated could sell for between $800 million to $1.2 billion dollars.

"I'm excited to be involved in the process. It would be a dream come true to go after one more prize, one more championship, and do something special for the fans of Los Angeles," he said.

"I don't think I can evaluate and grade how personal this is for me. I have had my distance from the organization, I have maintained that because of my relationship with ESPN, but when the possibility of being able to step back into the L.A. community and be part of the Dodger organization existed, it became something that my heart tells me I can not turn away from."

Hershiser, who has also worked in the Texas Rangers front office, said he wasn't sure when the auction would take place or how long the process would take, but he hoped it would be soon.

"I think sooner is better than later," he said. "That's what would be great for the Dodger fans, it would be great for the next owner of the Dodgers, it would be great for Major League Baseball.

"I think that's where the commissioner needs to be applauded for helping this be as short of a process as possible instead of being lengthened out through next year or as long as it could've been."

In the week and a half since McCourt announced the team would be sold, former Dodgers owner Peter O'Malley and former general manager Fred Claire have also said they intended to bid on the team.

Hershiser said he has maintained a good relationship with both men and said the ultimate goal is for the "Dodgers to end up in the right hands."

"We can compete like gentlemen with all the other groups," he said. "We can respect the fact that Mr. O'Malley has his hat in the ring, that Fred Claire does, and that there will be some other fine people who will too. I don't feel like you have to have a competition where people don't have a relationship when it's over with.

"There was a time in my life when I tried to get Steve Garvey out when he played for other teams. Now we're linked in our history with the Dodgers, and now in our efforts to bring the Dodgers to a better place."

Ramona Shelburne is a columnist and reporter for ESPNLosAngeles.com.

 

[Joe.t]

Oh boy things have gone from bad to worse in Beantown, the Phillies just singned Papelbon who was the top free agent closer available and one player the Sox could not afford to lose, this leaves them with Bard as their closer, yikesss!!!!, I would imagine that rumples is one nasty, very pissed off person right now.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/...-philadelphia-phillies-multi-year-deal-111111

 

[Doc Holliday]

Oh boy things have gone from bad to worse in Beantown, the Phillies just singned Papelbon who was the top free agent closer available and one player the Sox could not afford to lose, this leaves them with Bard as their closer, yikesss!!!!, I would imagine that rumples is one nasty, very pissed off person right now.

Yes indeed! Pappy will be taking his 'riverdance' act to the city of brotherly love! Here's the story from ESPN:

Papelbon to sign with Phillies

"Goodbye Beantown! I'm rich! I'm rich! I'm rich! Yeah, baby!"

Papelbon, the longtime Red Sox right-hander who has anchored their bullpen for six years, including a World Series title in 2007, has agreed to a four-year, $50 million deal with the Philadelphia Phillies pending a physical, a source familiar with the negotiations told ESPN.com senior writer Jayson Stark on Friday.

The deal includes a vesting option that could take it beyond $60 million for the 30-year-old, the source said.

If finalized, the contract would be the largest total package ever signed by a relief pitcher. The previous high was the five-year, $47 million deal signed by B.J. Ryan with Toronto in December 2005.

The $12.5 million average annual value of the deal would be tied for the second-highest ever signed by a reliever.

Mariano Rivera's $15 million a year, in each of his last two contracts, ranks No. 1.

Papelbon's annual pay would be tied with former Phillies closer Brad Lidge, who signed a three-year, $37.5 million extension during the 2008 season, covering the 2009-11 seasons.

SportsNation: Free Agency
How long of a contract would you give Albert Pujols? Who's the best free agent pitcher? Can you name all of baseball's biggest contracts? Vote!

Papelbon takes 219 career saves, with a 2.33 ERA and 1.02 WHIP, with him to Philadelphia, despite pitching his entire career in the AL East.

It remains uncertain whether the Phillies will have to surrender their first-round draft pick next June to the Red Sox as compensation for Papelbon, because draft-pick compensation is one of the unresolved issues still on the table during the ongoing labor talks.

Under the current rules, because Papelbon is a Type A free agent, the Red Sox would receive the Phillies' No. 1 pick, the 31st overall pick, in the draft.

However, the players' union has been seeking to reduce the number of premier free agents who would require a team to surrender a draft choice. So until labor negotiations are completed, neither team can be certain of the new definition of players who would still require compensation.

Nevertheless, a source familiar with the labor talks predicted Friday that Papelbon is still likely to be among the elite free agents who would cost their team a No. 1 pick.

The deal comes after the Red Sox said they would like to re-sign Papelbon, and the Toronto Blue Jays and Florida Marlins reportedly also had expressed strong interest.

Information from ESPN.com senior writer Jayson Stark was used in this report.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Oh boy things have gone from bad to worse in Beantown, the Phillies just singned Papelbon who was the top free agent closer available and one player the Sox could not afford to lose, this leaves them with Bard as their closer, yikesss!!!!, I would imagine that rumples is one nasty, very pissed off person right now.

So Papelbon doesn't suck any more, Joe? Just a month ago, you were telling us what a dog he is. You're one funny guy.

Papelbon a Mistake for Phillies: "I thought signing Ryan Madson for four years and $44 million was a bad idea, even though he is the best free-agent reliever on the market for both the short- and long-terms. The history of signing relievers to deals of that length is simply too awful to ignore.

That contract was a bargain relative to the one the Phillies are about to give Jonathan Papelbon -- more money, plus a lost draft pick, for an inferior reliever who gives up more fly balls.

Papelbon was the second-best relief option on the market, but even in one of his best seasons in 2011, he was only worth two to three wins above replacement, and I'd put the over/under on his WAR for this deal at around eight, which would still make it a pretty bad contract. But the real issue with any reliever and with Papelbon specifically is their high attrition rates -- they don't last, and their peaks tend to be short."

Law is not the only one who thinks that Madson is a better option than Papelbon.

 

[lgna69xxx]

YES!

On the flip side of things, just go ahead and book the Phillies in next seasons World Series.... Yanks in 6 however :thumb:

Oh boy things have gone from bad to worse in Beantown, the Phillies just singned Papelbon who was the top free agent closer available and one player the Sox could not afford to lose, this leaves them with Bard as their closer, yikesss!!!!, I would imagine that rumples is one nasty, very pissed off person right now.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/...-philadelphia-phillies-multi-year-deal-111111

 

[Special K]

Oh boy things have gone from bad to worse in Beantown, the Phillies just singned Papelbon who was the top free agent closer available and one player the Sox could not afford to lose, this leaves them with Bard as their closer, yikesss!!!!, I would imagine that rumples is one nasty, very pissed off person right now.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/...-philadelphia-phillies-multi-year-deal-111111

Does the name Heath Bell mean anything to you Joe?

 

[Merlot]

HEY BOYZ,

"just go ahead and book the Phillies in next seasons World Series.... Yanks in 6 however"

That's the same bilge that was "guaranteed" last year at this time, and still the Yankees didn't even make it to a playoff series that even had six games.

:lol: :nod: :noidea: :thumb:

So Papelbon doesn't suck any more, Joe? Just a month ago, you were telling us what a dog he is. You're one funny guy.

Opinons are as frivolous around here as the honor of their word.

"But the real issue with any reliever and with Papelbon specifically is their high attrition rates -- they don't last, and their peaks tend to be short." Keith Law

I'll say the same thing I've said about Papelbon for two years. He's still very good generally, but against the best teams or in the most key moments he can be shaky. His pitches don't have the movement or speed they used to and he got far too predictable using fewer different pitches. He's a loss for the Sox only over the accumulation of saves over the regular season. In the clutch or the playoffs you pray he doesn't goof, which tends to be in bunches...GOOGLE: Papelbon, September 2011, Orioles, TWICE!!!

I have to agree with Law. He will never be worth $50-60 million over 4-5 years. But good for Paps. We knew he had been about the money since he signed his last deal with the Sox, and he has been gunning for a big pay day for years. Now he got it robbing the Phillies...NOT the Sox. For two years (maybe) they will love him...then he and his contract will be a burden.

Does the name Heath Bell mean anything to you Joe?

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/11/report-red-sox-will-pursue-ryan-madson-and-heath-bell/

As for Bell, he told Jim Bowden earlier this week that he would prefer to stay on the West Coast with either the Padres, Angels or Dodgers, but would also be open to signing with the Phillies or Red Sox.

Bell has been under an ERA of 3.00 for 3 straight years. It's the terms that will be the issue for guys like him.

Cheers,

Merlot