Can a massage with HJ be called prostitution

[Luvs-mssgs]

In a thead in the Montreal massage section the following conversation started and evolved https://merb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=325399#post325399 . In order not to highjack that thread, with this question, I am posting here quotes of the pertinent intervention, I think the subject should interest many.

Huh? Some girls do more, some girls do less, but it is all prostitution. Penetration doesn`t make it any more so than a handjob.

I think there`s a line in there somewhere when "sex" plays an integral part in the session. If you were a virgin before you walked into Kama as opposed to PMC (and took the top option available at both places)... would your status have changed by the time you walked out?? MP and SP aren`t really the same (in my book).

I`m outing you! "I did not have sexual relations with that woman!" I knew Al Gore was in town, didn`t think his pal Bill was too.

Sure. I agree with you. However, say you drive the hot teen babysitter home and she takes out her tits and give you a hand-job. Your wife`s best friend walks by. Do you think it is gonna fly in divorce court that it ws `only` a hand-job? Or if there is a bust?

Of course sex plays an integral part of the session. I don`t find myself going to places offering men, or fugly women, too too often. I want a stone hottie to pull my pud for me, or hop on top if that`s what she`s into.

So what do you think?
A massage with HJ: prostitution? or massage therapy?

 

[Tracy]

No, a massage with a HJ is not prostitution. In Ontario it has been legalised and actual Massage therapy clinics offer it because men have a tendancy to get aroused during a massage which defeats the point of relaxing. It is actually legal.
Prostitution is the act of selling sex services. HJ is not sex.

 

[Dee]

men have a tendancy to get aroused during a massage which defeats the point of relaxing.

HJ is not sex.

Hi Tracy,

This reminds me of a little bit of summer theater I saw years ago where a sexy girl stepped forward on the stage and said:

"Every time I relax with a man, he gets all tense."

HJ isn't sex you say... could have fooled me... I'll have to stop enjoying it so much!

 

[Tracy]

Hi Tracy,

This reminds me of a little bit of summer theater I saw years ago where a sexy girl stepped forward on the stage and said:

"Every time I relax with a man, he gets all tense."

HJ isn't sex you say... could have fooled me... I'll have to stop enjoying it so much!

well of course it is SEXY. legally though it is not concidered sex. I think in ontario they brought up a point of the mans penis being a muscle. you get a massage and a muscle tenses up, well, logically if you think about it....
I think that is how they legalised it in all salons

 

[Luvs-mssgs]

No, a massage with a HJ is not prostitution. In Ontario it has been legalised and actual Massage therapy clinics offer it because men have a tendancy to get aroused during a massage which defeats the point of relaxing. It is actually legal.
Prostitution is the act of selling sex services. HJ is not sex.

Criminal law is a federal jurisdiction, not provincial !
NOTE TO SELF:
If I get my legal advice from an escort...
maybe I can ask my lawyer for a TCIMWS
(she -my lawyer- is quite a stunning woman)

 

[Tracy]

Criminal law is a federal jurisdiction, not provincial !
NOTE TO SELF:
If I get my legal advice from an escort...
maybe I can ask my lawyer for a TCIMWS
(she -my lawyer- is quite a stunning woman)

I am not giving legal advice, I am just stating what I know to be true from experience in working at these places.
I can guarantee that I will never make a remark unless I have expereinced the situation or have researched information from extremely reliable sources (doctors, lawyers and such.)
I do not mean to be rude. I just felt that I should clarify that I am not giving legal advice persay.
Also a TCIMWS is prostitution and actually no it is not illegal for a womman to sell these services.
I am saying that a HJ is not prostitution.

 

[jacep]

I am saying that a HJ is not prostitution.

I'm not sure if a HJ (or happy ending) at a massage parlor is prostitution or not but being caught in this act will probably lead you to being arrested/convicted for being "found in a bawdy house" even though no sex occured.

Anyways, prostitution in Canada is legal... only solicitation, living off the avails of prostitution, and being found in a bawdy house are illegal.

 

[Luvs-mssgs]

I'm not saying HJ is prostitution,
but I'm not saying it is not sex either

((An american president was almost impeached for saying..."I did not have sex with that woman... " maybe he should have demanded the WS part from Monica... then all evidence would have vanished... But maybe he asked... and she refused because of the... calories ))

all I'm saying is that:
> if it's legal in Ontario,
> then it's also legal across Canada
> because criminal law is a federal jurisdiction,
> not a provincial jurisdiction.
ask any lawyer

 

[Luvs-mssgs]

Je me suis toujours demandé si c'était légal mais, dans le fond, au nombre de salon de massage érotique qu'il y a, si ce serait illégal, ils fermeraient tous

Tout le monde roule a 120 sur les autoroutes et la vitesse légale c'est 100, c'est même écrit sur les panneaux...
est-ce que si c'était illégal ils les arreteraient tous ?

Est-ce que la police arrête tous les poteux de la rue Saint-Denis ou le cokeux de la rue Crescent? Ça n'est légal parce qu'il les laisse faire...

Ça s'appelle de la tolérance pas de la légalité.

 

[muddy]

OK, I think we've cleared up the legal issue pretty well, but what about the social meaning of a HJ?

I would bet that a lot of masseuses justify giving HJs by telling themselves it's not prostitution. And a lot of clients go to MPs, and tell themselves that it's not prostitution, that they are not cheating on their SO, they are not paying for sex.

And a lot of massage sessions go further than a simple HJ and both the provider and the client justify it as YMMV.

But at some point sex is being exchanged for money. Maybe it's better that we kid ourselves about this. Most girls would never enter the business if we called it by it's real name. The same goes for clients. Pretending is half the fun.

 

[korbel]

No, a massage with a HJ is not prostitution. In Ontario it has been legalised and actual Massage therapy clinics offer it because men have a tendancy to get aroused during a massage which defeats the point of relaxing. It is actually legal.
Prostitution is the act of selling sex services. HJ is not sex.

Hello Tracy,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kama_Sutra
2. On sexual union Chapters on stimulation of desire, embraces types, caressing and kisses, marking with nails, biting and marking with teeth, on copulation (positions), slapping by hand and corresponding moaning, virile behavior in women, superior coition and oral sex, preludes and conclusions to the game of love. It describes 64 types of sexual acts (10 chapters).

It seems that the Kama Sutra would include HJ and it`s characteristics in it`s chapters on sexual arousal. Now maybe when a guy simply sees a lady from a distance and becomes "stiff with arousal" that is not sex. But a lady performing a HJ to continue stimulating and maintaining arousal is sex. What you probably meant is the law does not define HJ that way.

Cheers,

Korbel

 

[YouVantOption]

No, a massage with a HJ is not prostitution. In Ontario it has been legalised and actual Massage therapy clinics offer it because men have a tendancy to get aroused during a massage which defeats the point of relaxing. It is actually legal.
Prostitution is the act of selling sex services. HJ is not sex.

please provide citations to prove this - newspaper articles, links to provincial law.

I believe you are wrong, but am certainly open to the possibility that I am.

 

[YouVantOption]

I am not giving legal advice, I am just stating what I know to be true from experience in working at these places.

Just because you did it doesn`t mean it was legal

Also a TCIMWS is prostitution and actually no it is not illegal for a womman to sell these services.
I am saying that a HJ is not prostitution.

no, but communicating the sale of sex services in a public place is.

I`m not a lawyer, but that does put an interesting spin on speaking about such things in a place of business (which is not considered to be a private place), posting services on websites, and speaking on the telephone about pricing.

I would be interesting to consult with a lawyer and have she or he review the entire transaction and give pointers as to what to avoid.

 

[Nemo]

What was the question?

The question is, if I read well,
Is a massage with HJ = prostitution ?
NOT
Is a massage with a HJ = legal ?

Prostitution per se is not illegal in Canada
only some of the aspects surrounding it are
(sollicitation, bawdy house, but NOT the sex for money part...)
So, back to the question

Is a massage with HJ = prostitution ?
I think not
Would I like my S.-O. to find I have HJs with my massages
I would not

Is a massage with HJ = sex for money?
I think not
I pay the therapist to relax every muscle in my body
And I tip according to the overall quality of her service

Read the reviews, in the massage parlour section
Many will refer, at lenght to the massage technique
Hard, soft, medium, califonia, sports etc...
The MP lovers are different from the SP seekers

And if at some point in time,
things take a different direction
Less technical, more sexual,
Well, that's the human nature

So, I think a massage with HJ it is a legitimate massage therapy
The penis is an integral part of the body
A complete body massage should include every part
From head, to head, to toe

 

[korbel]

Is a massage with HJ = sex for money?
I think not
I pay the therapist to relax every muscle in my body
And I tip according to the overall quality of her service

Hello Nemo,

If it isn't sex why not have a guy named Big Doug do it for you?

Every Muscle? So if she ignores your sphincter muscle have you been cheated...or do you make sure that is covered too?

If you get hard and fail to ejaculate do you get you money back since she failed to "relax" you?

If she massages your penis and you stay relaxed is that "quality" service?

If she strokes...ahem...massages you and gets excited herself, is mutual arousal still not sex?

So was Bill Clinton right? If she massages the penis muscle with her lip technique it isn't sex?

Really Nemo, I am all for this paying for massage to "legalized completion" from a woman. If the law says it isn't sex then that's fine with me. But we both know it sure would save a lot of money on paying SPs for...uh ...shhhhhhh ...not too loud okay...seeexxx...shhhhh.

Toodles,

Korbel

 

[Nemo]

Every Muscle? So if she ignores your sphincter muscle have you been cheated...or do you make sure that is covered too?

Ooooohhhh! I do make sure that this is also covered
It's close to being the best part

 

[korbel]

Ooooohhhh! I do make sure that this is also covered
It's close to being the best part

Hello Nemo,

LOL...love it. It's not my thing though.

Cute,

Korbel

 

[Nemo]

Hello Nemo,
LOL...love it. It's not my thing though.
Cute,
Korbel

Hey Korbel

Have ever tried it ?...
with a nice gentle pro.
It really gets your geyser...
geysing... it's amazing!

But(t) make sure to bring...
plenty o' K-Y
OK, why?
Ohhh! K-Y ! [ENTER]

http://youporn.com/watch/60669
http://youporn.com/watch/151450
http://youporn.com/watch/64167

 

[naughtylady]

I am not sure a happy ending is not considered sexual services in Quebec.

There are many differences in PQ and ON laws. For example in ON women are permitted to go topless.

Ronnie,
Naughtylady

 

[Kepler]

I am not sure a happy ending is not considered sexual services in Quebec.

You're correct, it's very possible that if there's a bust, a client getting a HJ will be charged with being in a bawdy house. Criminal law is the same across Canada, it's just that police officers and prosecutors have different priorities in different cities.

There are many differences in PQ and ON laws. For example in ON women are permitted to go topless.

Not exactly legal in Ontario. That was the result of a court decision, trial level I believe. If it was litigated again, there's no guarantee that the decision would be affirmed.

In Quebec there hasn't been a similar case. So it might be legal here to. Or not.

Only way to find out is for a lady to try it. Any volunteers?