Race/Ethinicity Question

[rbrown1000]

I am a long time reader and finally thought of sharing an in call experience I had at XO. I am new to this city so still learning to adjust.

I called ahead and booked an appointment and once I reached the location I sensed a hesitation before the door was opened. Finally a girl probably in her 20s opened the door and I was let in.
After the usual hi and hello I was told the girl I booked was not in today. I was not sure what to say as the girl I booked was right in front of me.

Now I politely said OK no problem and as I was about to leave, she asks me who did I book an appointment with? I said I booked with you but you are not here lol !!

She repeatedly asked me where I was from and why I chose her and did I inform "I am not local" when I booked the appointment? I did not respond and just left .

my question is should I disclose the fact that I am not white every time I book an appointment ?

 

[clark_larson]

If you can't take being rejected because of your race, you should yes. If you don't care, don't.

 

[Booty_Lover]

I don`t think I have seen a girl description on XO website excluding a specific race, but if some girls don't feel comfortable with a specific race may be XO management should mention it in the girl description. Waste of time for both the client and the SP (if she has to kick him out after he shows up). And a waste of money for the girl and the agency.

 

[Passionné]

my question is should I disclose the fact that I am not white every time I book an appointment ?

This kind of thing should not happen and no one should ever have to explain their ethnicity or race. Still what SHOULD be is never 100%. Agencies and Independents want to make money so if they have any ethnicity or race restrictions they will not say or notify anyone on their websites. I'm sorry to say this episode probably won't be the last of it's kind. Sorry you had to go through this. The only way to avoid the issue without telling the agency is to check reviews for this info but I doubt reviews will cover you situation very much. I guess checking before is the only way to be sure it doesn't happen again.

Escorts often get $20 when guys change their minds, in this case you should have been similarly compensated.

Good luck

 

[ssj3]

You should talk to Sam about it. I've only used XO once so far but I've talked to him several times before I ever booked and he's a great guy so he should be receptive to you. I also am not white and I've never had to state my race beforehand.

 

[talkinghead]

I'm also sorry to hear that this happened. While I think that SPs should have the right to refuse service, I can think of no good reason that this refusal should be based solely on race. In fact, I find that idea abhorrent. Still, you're getting good advice: check reviews, work with the bookers, and establish yourself. Good luck.

 

[EagerBeaver]

I'm also sorry to hear that this happened. While I think that SPs should have the right to refuse service, I can think of no good reason that this refusal should be based solely on race. In fact, I find that idea abhorrent. Still, you're getting good advice: check reviews, work with the bookers, and establish yourself. Good luck.

How do we know the refusal was based on race? Did she say "you are refused based on race"? Did she say "you are refused because you are one butt fucking ugly dude?" Did she say, "you are refused because you stink and have miserable hygiene?" How do we know the girl doesn't exist and the OP is Tony (look at his posting history- much like Tony's usually is when he reappears).

She did not say any of those things. The guy made a judgment that it was due to race that he was refused. It's an unproven assumption. All that we know for sure is he was lied to and the girl likely did not want to see him for SOME reason, which might be reasonable or not. She was obviously trying to spare the dude some bad feelings over the rejection. However the real reasons for the OP's rejections are unknown and frankly a much smarter course of action for him would have been to talk to Sam privately to learn what happened, because if it was one of the other things I mentioned, the whole fucking world is soon to know. And I have seen threads like this backfire badly on the OP in exactly that fashion.

 

[Ricky bonds]

I could only imagine how uncomfortable it must make some individuals feel, and feeling as if you should disclose your ethnicity whenever you arent asked must really be a nuissance.
It is more and more common and somewhat the norm for girls to not accept black customers..but now it is also any dark or brown skinned men as well. I also see a new trend of 'no black men under 40' popping up.
i'm not sure how it works in any other major city? But montreal girls definitely are very vocal about not seeing black or brown folks as customers, this cannot be debated or questioned..and must be respected. (That being said if this is the case it should be clearly written or mentioned to avoid any akward situations)
I guess that yes when you aren't asked you should specify ethnicity if you are from a country that is often refused by sp's.
In the end it is the girls right to select who she is comfortable being intimate with, without having to justify this in any way to anyone.

P.s eb has a very valid point...how do you know it was a refusal based on race? Some girls also refuse tourists for lack of basic french understanding as well

 

[EagerBeaver]

In the end it is the girls right to select who she is comfortable being intimate with, without having to justify this in any way to anyone.

Correctamundo! And if you don't qualify it sucks, but you suck it up, put on the big boy pants and move on to someone with whom you do qualify. No matter who you are or what race you are, life isn't gonna be all smooth sailing and you have to learn to deal with rejection, and failure, and adversity, and overcoming and moving past it.

 

[Passionné]

In the end it is the girls right to select who she is comfortable being intimate with, without having to justify this in any way to anyone.

I agree completely. But it if there are superficial limits it would be fair to have notice of them so that time is not wasted and embarrassment can be avoided for all.

As for whether it's about race or not in this case, that is what we were told by the poster. I don't see why we would throw doubt on anyone's honesty or perception unless we have a reason for it, otherwise everything anyone says can be put into doubt and then what would be the point of posting at all. Sure maybe he misunderstood the reason for her behavior, but since he was the one going through this sad experience he is the only person qualified to asses what went on. Unless the lady wants to come on and explain people should respect a post by anyone who has never given cause to do otherwise.

Also, a non-white owner hiring a non-white lady wouldn't necessarily mean anything about how someone looking for work feels about this issue.

 

[Ricky bonds]

well she has right to select who, but she should tell upfront which ethic she prefers. don't waste time of others.

agreed 100% it should be mentioned on websites and in ads and even asked during booking. Nobody should have to find out they are someones restricted type once they are at the door. There are many legit reasons a girl can refuse someone at the door of course, but when race is concerned, it can be mentioned in advance to avoid any waste of time and embarrassments

 

[EagerBeaver]

There are many legit reasons a girl can refuse someone at the door of course

And do we know what those reasons are here? Could they be that the guy was ugly, smelled like a skunk or reeked of alcohol? Are those legit reasons or not?

Many years ago on MERB a guy started a thread about an outcall escort coming to his door and after he opened it and a brief conversation ensued, she terminated the date and walked away. He complained of the girl and agency. It was later learned that he answered the door in an intoxicated state reeking of liquor, and the girl had just lost a close family member due to chronic alcoholism. To say that that the poster was made to look foolish would be quite an understatement.

We do not know what the situation was here but we will soon find out. I am tending to think this could be similar. Nobody in this thread has mentioned that the owner of this agency is not white and he employs at least one black girl.

 

[Ricky bonds]

Those are definitely legit reasons EB..drunk, stoned, just plain mean looking, ressemblance of a relative, dirty, dirty hands, smelly, rough, too direct, not polite, just plain akward, too shy, visually mentally unstable etc...we've heard them all from time to time again.(and any reason including any above, any others..or even if the girl simply changed her mind.. do not warrant any justification or reasoning, no is no. [But if its a general restriction such as a specific race then i do feel it should be mentioned to all in advance] )
Hey this isn't a restaurant, a product, a standard service industry..there are no ethical guidelines or norms, its case by case and 1 on 1.
And you are right, many of this agency in questions girls do not have these race standards in bold print and do see men of any skin tone, the owner is not white..and furthermore, if contacted with any dilemma or problems with service, he will do the necessary to ensure all implicated individuals are taken care of..(in fact i hope the thread starter took the time to voice his concerns with the agency before sharing any of this)

P.s rbrown1000, if i understood correctly you are not from montreal?
There are in fact many places that probably deserve to be called out and don't do things in a respectful manner..
But in the case of many merb advertisers, you have the advantage of being able to actually speak to them, or about them and voice your concerns.
In many cases they will do whatever it takes to make up for mishaps, mistakes and the occasional unsatisfied customer..
That is the privilege of having access to this community and the people that choose to advertise here. That leaves you with a responsibility to use the correct channels before calling foul play, or using the site to vent and possibly tarnish a good reputation.

 

[jonathankeeves]

I am not white and all of my recent rdv's have been with XO girls. The reason I keep repeating with XO girls is because bookings are easy to do with both Sam and Max, they have the best incall and above all I always get amazing experience everytime I see an XO girl.

 

[talkinghead]

How do we know the refusal was based on race? Did she say "you are refused based on race"? Did she say "you are refused because you are one butt fucking ugly dude?" Did she say, "you are refused because you stink and have miserable hygiene?" How do we know the girl doesn't exist and the OP is Tony (look at his posting history- much like Tony's usually is when he reappears).

She did not say any of those things. The guy made a judgment that it was due to race that he was refused. It's an unproven assumption. All that we know for sure is he was lied to and the girl likely did not want to see him for SOME reason, which might be reasonable or not. She was obviously trying to spare the dude some bad feelings over the rejection. However the real reasons for the OP's rejections are unknown and frankly a much smarter course of action for him would have been to talk to Sam privately to learn what happened, because if it was one of the other things I mentioned, the whole fucking world is soon to know. And I have seen threads like this backfire badly on the OP in exactly that fashion.

Fair enough, and I agree that he should talk it over with the agency. But "we know" that it was about race because that's what the OP reported. He didn't provide a transcript of the entire conversation, and you're right that he didn't quote the woman discussing race. But the OP, who was the only witness we have, clearly seemed to think the reason was race. And neither you nor I know what she said or didn't say; to say "she did not say those things" is speculation. (Okay--I like arguing with a lawyer! I'm playing devil's advocate here.) So our choice is to doubt the OP or to accept his interpretation. We can doubt him because he's new to Montreal and new to Merb; that's fine. Or we might ask him for more evidence, also fine. But we can also acknowledge that this kind of thing happens in Montreal based on race, and that maybe he had a bad first experience.

We do have plenty of contextual evidence that many SPs deny service because of race. I've never seen another market that tolerates this kind of language: "no black men." Perhaps that happens in BP around the country; it's nothing that I've seen.

And so while it is of course a "girl's right to select who she is comfortable being intimate with," and I said that in my post, I also find it troubling that "comfort" is sometimes based solely on skin color in Montreal. And if that's what happened to the OP, that's a shame.

 

[Halloween Mike]

Its been a discussion on the board many time. It may look a bit "old time at first glance" and i know the world is trying to fight racism and such, but we are talking intimacy here and yes its a reality that escorts can refuse anybody they want to anyway.

We have say many times you should mention if your not caucasian on phone, just in case.

 

[EagerBeaver]

I've never seen another market that tolerates this kind of language: "no black men." Perhaps that happens in BP around the country; it's nothing that I've seen.

It's actually fairly common in the American deep south. I have also seen some indies who do not exclude all, but some black men, saying "professional black men only." I think the translation on that is guys like Puff Daddy Coombs who can afford the HDH rates, but I don't really know what it means.

There are at least 4 or 5 reasons for the rejection, based on the conversation we were told by the OP, that are not racial. So I am not compelled towards any conclusion until all the evidence is in, which includes Sam telling the girl's side of it.

You guys simply rushed to judgment, much like the people who convicted Galileo based on the Earth being flat or the Salem Witch Trial judges who sanctioned the hangings of dogs based on one person saying the dogs gave her the "evil eye." The dogs did not testify.

 

[Ricky bonds]

Its been a discussion on the board many time. It may look a bit "old time at first glance" and i know the world is trying to fight racism and such, but we are talking intimacy here and yes its a reality that escorts can refuse anybody they want to anyway.

We have say many times you should mention if your not caucasian on phone, just in case.

Amen.
And i never understood how so many associate 'sex trade workers client race preferences' automatically to racism..it's a bit shocking to me actually. I have several close haitian, jamaican, dominican and african friends, people i consider family. In my intimate life i have no attraction to dark skinned woman what-so-ever..nada!, i even tried it a few times just to see if things would be different once the clothes were off lol, but nope..i have no sexual attraction at all to dark skinned ladies. That in no way makes me racist? It's an intimate preference.
Plus many girls date dark skinned guys in their private time but yet still refuse to see dark skinned customers? For sure some girls must be racist, but you cannot consider someone racist based off of a sexual partner preference or restriction.
..but yeah this has always came up and will come up again, many of us will always disagree on this.

 

[CLOUD 500]

What I find interesting is that there is a general pattern here of escorts refusing men of color. Has anyone ever heard of an escort refusing White men due to this race?

 

[Ricky bonds]

What I find interesting is that there is a general pattern here of escorts refusing men of color. Has anyone ever heard of an escort refusing White men due to this race?

never once in 13 years