The mileage variation

[terrybogard88]

I noticed there seems to be a higher rate of YMMV cases in hobby lately. All contexts considered (Indies, Agency, duo). Expectations in the content of sessions, seem to not be met, more than what i could imagine.

* Do you make the same remark ?

* is "eager to please" an outdated human quality that we no longer want to invest into ?

* What could explain that ? Are SP finding more ways to just get out of meetings with easy money with no hard work or are we all just less tolerant to each other ? Could be also that clients have unrealistic demands and surprises

I guess im just worried that exceptions become the new rules. Please share your thoughts

 

[CLOUD 500]

I noticed there seems to be a higher rate of YMMV cases in hobby lately. All contexts considered (Indies, Agency, duo). Expectations in the content of sessions, seem to not be met, more than what i could imagine.

* Do you make the same remark ?

* is "eager to please" an outdated human quality that we no longer want to invest into ?

* What could explain that ? Are SP finding more ways to just get out of meetings with easy money with no hard work or are we all just less tolerant to each other ? Could be also that clients have unrealistic demands and surprises

I guess im just worried that exceptions become the new rules. Please share your thoughts

Yes big time in 2025 and that is because a lot of the members are accepting sub-par service. I also see too many overly positive reviews and many are too afraid to write negative reviews. Many negative things are omitted. If the clients began to stand there ground and not accept it things would change fast. I remember years ago an escort who posted as an anonymous SP who worked at one of the agencies vented out on how she hated doing DFK and was disgusted by the clients who wanted it and how that was only for her BF. In reality she kept doing DFK because the clients wanted it and if she did not offer it she would not get much bookings. Indys are the most YMMV, agencies do have some standards that need to be meet but it has become lax in 2025, some of the stuff I read today would have resulted in the SP being booted out of the agency 15 years ago.

 

[terrybogard88]

Yes big time in 2025 and that is because a lot of the members are accepting sub-par service. I also see too many overly positive reviews and many are too afraid to write negative reviews. Many negative things are omitted. If the clients began to stand there ground and not accept it things would change fast. I remember years ago a stripper who posted as an anonymous SP who worked at one of the agencies vented out on how she hated doing DFK and was disgusted by the clients who wanted it and how that was only for her BF. In reality she kept doing DFK because the clients wanted it and if she did not offer it she would not get much bookings. Indys are the most YMMV, agencies do have some standards that need to be meet but it has become lax in 2025, some of the stuff I read today would have resulted in the SP being booted out of the agency 15 years ago.

I have to agree with this 100%, that is unfortunate

 

[Fradi]

I noticed there seems to be a higher rate of YMMV cases in hobby lately. All contexts considered (Indies, Agency, duo). Expectations in the content of sessions, seem to not be met, more than what i could imagine.

* Do you make the same remark ?

* is "eager to please" an outdated human quality that we no longer want to invest into ?

* What could explain that ? Are SP finding more ways to just get out of meetings with easy money with no hard work or are we all just less tolerant to each other ? Could be also that clients have unrealistic demands and surprises

I guess im just worried that exceptions become the new rules. Please share your thoughts

This is why I see the same couple of young ladies ( Indy’s) now for years.
Never a disappointment, they are always doing their utmost to please me.
I know every time I see them I will have an amazing time.

 

[urquell]

This is why I see the same couple of young ladies ( Indy’s) now for years.
Never a disappointment, they are always doing their utmost to please me.
I know every time I see them I will have an amazing time.

I'm the same way, and it's why I see the same circle of people as well. It helps that none of them ever have to worry about reviews and client acquisition so I'm sure that the reaction I'm getting is honest, natural and true to me, whether positive or negative (everyone has bad days too, lol. It's usually fine the next time). I also find that people put a lot of pressure on themselves to try to get the same experience that someone else had (why did so-and-so get DFK but not me?), when every individual interaction is different and some people just simply click better together. It doesn't make anyone a bad person. People just need to find people whose vibe and energy latches theirs. I don't understand why people get disappointed when their interaction wasn't the same as someone else's. A service is what's offered, not automatic chemistry. It just seems unreasonable to me to presume that that a personal connection should be the same for every person. Oh well, people are the heroes of their own story, I guess.

Still, what does seem clear is that as a general statement service is becoming more impersonal and is being broken into too many pieces and acronyms for organic sessions to be as common as they were in previous environments. The world just keeps on spinning, and some stuff gets better and some stuff gets worse. Everybody gets to decide hat that is for themselves.

 

[terrybogard88]

This is why I see the same couple of young ladies ( Indy’s) now for years.
Never a disappointment, they are always doing their utmost to please me.
I know every time I see them I will have an amazing time.

So you are not in the dating circuit anymore, i mean regarding new encounters. That s indeed one solution... And time makes connection even deeper between people that have a genuine "eager to please" quality

 

[Fradi]

So you are not in the dating circuit anymore, i mean regarding new encounters. That s indeed one solution... And time makes connection even deeper between people that have a genuine "eager to please" quality

I do see someone new from time to time maybe two or three a year, sometimes in a duo with one of the ladies I know for many years.

 

[CLOUD 500]

I'm the same way, and it's why I see the same circle of people as well. It helps that none of them ever have to worry about reviews and client acquisition so I'm sure that the reaction I'm getting is honest, natural and true to me, whether positive or negative (everyone has bad days too, lol. It's usually fine the next time). I also find that people put a lot of pressure on themselves to try to get the same experience that someone else had (why did so-and-so get DFK but not me?), when every individual interaction is different and some people just simply click better together. It doesn't make anyone a bad person. People just need to find people whose vibe and energy latches theirs. I don't understand why people get disappointed when their interaction wasn't the same as someone else's. A service is what's offered, not automatic chemistry. It just seems unreasonable to me to presume that that a personal connection should be the same for every person. Oh well, people are the heroes of their own story, I guess.

Still, what does seem clear is that as a general statement service is becoming more impersonal and is being broken into too many pieces and acronyms for organic sessions to be as common as they were in previous environments. The world just keeps on spinning, and some stuff gets better and some stuff gets worse. Everybody gets to decide hat that is for themselves.

It is a question about money, at least for me. If I have to fork out $500 on an Indy and jump the hoops to book her but get no DFK and a poor service then that is a pricey loss for me but she still expects the full amount. Before I even would book an Indy I would ask directly for the services I want. What about some of the guys on this board who dished out $700 on a session but the girl spent the entire time talking? If it were a 30 min session at $200 then I am okay if I did not get the service I wanted, but $500? Totally unacceptable. In 2021 I did a few TOFFT and it resulted in a good session but man in 2025 there are just so much sub-par SPs and the prices are much higher. Something just does not ad up.

This is why I see the same couple of young ladies ( Indy’s) now for years.
Never a disappointment, they are always doing their utmost to please me.
I know every time I see them I will have an amazing time.

I do the same. I got my regulars but I at times want to indulge in variety because after 5 years of the same group of girls you loose the novelty and excitement. But eventually these regulars will move on to other things.

 

[terrybogard88]

It is a question about money, at least for me. If I have to fork out $500 on an Indy and jump the hoops to book her but get no DFK and a poor service then that is a pricey loss for me but she still expects the full amount. Before I even would book an Indy I would ask directly for the services I want. What about some of the guys on this board who dished out $700 on a session but the girl spent the entire time talking? If it were a 30 min session at $200 then I am okay if I did not get the service I wanted, but $500? Totally unacceptable. In 2021 I did a few TOFFT and it resulted in a good session but man in 2025 there are just so much sub-par SPs and the prices are much higher. Something just does not ad up.

I do the same. I got my regulars but I at times want to indulge in variety because after 5 years of the same group of girls you loose the novelty and excitement. But eventually these regulars will move on to other things.

Aerk ! dont even remind this to me , a lot of time this year i have been stucked with SPs who appear to just want a sweet chit-chat, she will talk forever and not follow your directions to move into action. You even book her a second time because she is sexy, another 2 hours yet she does the exact same thing infinite talking ditching your touches and not following at all your direction, just enjoying the drink and the music

Not to mention those that indeed follow your direction towards action but a few seconds later find an excuse like "ouch you touched my skin i hate when someone touches my skin, yes anywhere", you have to pull everything right ? We are all respectful and everything

I believe we cannot ignore the fact that there are now hundreds of SPs out there who think they can do that activity but really THEY CANNOT and they should not.

 

[urquell]

It is a question about money, at least for me. If I have to fork out $500 on an Indy and jump the hoops to book her but get no DFK and a poor service then that is a pricey loss for me but she still expects the full amount. Before I even would book an Indy I would ask directly for the services I want. What about some of the guys on this board who dished out $700 on a session but the girl spent the entire time talking? If it were a 30 min session at $200 then I am okay if I did not get the service I wanted, but $500? Totally unacceptable. In 2021 I did a few TOFFT and it resulted in a good session but man in 2025 there are just so much sub-par SPs and the prices are much higher. Something just does not ad up

Yeah, that's why I don't see people who do timed sessions anymore (except when in MPs) because the value simply isn't there. I usually consider any session that's timed to be a waste of money almost irrespective of what the amount is. With massages the approach is a bit different, because I'm principally paying for the massage and somewhere between 60-90 mins is the most I would want to spend on that anyway. Anything over and above the massage is just a cherry on top, although it's a very enjoyable cherry. When it comes to the full sex experiences none of the people I see operate on a timer, and sessions last for as long as they last, often with a social component. It just makes everything so much more relaxed and I personally like to take my time and dislike the pressure of having to define my session and/or perform on a time schedule.

As for TOFTT I agree with you that these days it's tougher to take the plunge because the cost of getting it wrong it so high, in both time and money. It's getting harder to trust in reviews being objective and accurate too.

 

[Fradi]

I do the same. I got my regulars but I at times want to indulge in variety because after 5 years of the same group of girls you loose the novelty and excitement. But eventually these regulars will move on to other things.

Perhaps I am just too easy to please lol.
I have been mostly seeing the same 2 ladies for 8 years now. My ATF I see quite often.
The novelty hasn’t worn off if anything we have become friends and I look forward to seeing them not just for sex but as friends, they are kind and interesting young ladies whose company I enjoy.
They never disappoint me and it is so easy and natural to be with them.

 

[CLOUD 500]

Yeah, that's why I don't see people who do timed sessions anymore (except when in MPs) because the value simply isn't there. I usually consider any session that's timed to be a waste of money almost irrespective of what the amount is. With massages the approach is a bit different, because I'm principally paying for the massage and somewhere between 60-90 mins is the most I would want to spend on that anyway. Anything over and above the massage is just a cherry on top, although it's a very enjoyable cherry.

I tried the MP during the covid lockdowns, just was not my cup of tea and at the time prices were good. Now they are just too high for what you get.

When it comes to the full sex experiences none of the people I see operate on a timer, and sessions last for as long as they last, often with a social component. It just makes everything so much more relaxed and I personally like to take my time and dislike the pressure of having to define my session and/or perform on a time schedule.

That is the type of experience I have with the regulars I see. There were strippers I meet at the club, when you click with one it is so much better. About the timer this is very apparent with the incalls, you immediately feel that you are in an assembly line in a factory.

As for TOFTT I agree with you that these days it's tougher to take the plunge because the cost of getting it wrong it so high, in both time and money. It's getting harder to trust in reviews being objective and accurate too.

Yep. Just not worth it anymore with these prices. It will only get worse till guys stop accepting sub-par service, go out of their way to please the girls, and to post overly positive reviews (the reviews cannot even be trusted as you said here because they are overly positive). I checked some members and they always post a positive review, how can anyone never have a negative review? To me negative reviews are much more valuable then the positive ones.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Sometimes I wonder what clients mean by YMMV. I've realized that some providers don't offer the same services to all clients, for a wide variety of reasons.. At MP's it seems to be common. I personally offer the same services (as in, the same acronyms) to all clients.. The few times that I didn't was because the clients had really poor hygiene. However realistically it's impossible for clients to all have the same experience with the same SP. I can imagine that some SP who don't offer certain services technically would offer them to regulars or clients they like better, and in a way I think that is kinda normal. If she doesn't offer them officially the clients who experienced these acronyms are just lucky and others shouldn't be complaining. ''YMMV'' shouldn't mean ''I have the right to be a horrible client and I should still get the same service'' in my opinion.. If you're rude, why should you expect to be having the same experience as someone who shows up to the date with a smile on his face and a good attitude?

 

[bodick7]

''YMMV'' shouldn't mean ''I have the right to be a horrible client and I should still get the same service'' in my opinion.. If you're rude, why should you expect to be having the same experience as someone who shows up to the date with a smile on his face and a good attitude?

You are right dear, there are horrible clients as there are horrible SPs…
I always try to do my best ethically and found some « low mileage » (not as advertised) SPs on my way anyway. The thing is, they were not reviewed and as a client, I still have right of « no repeat ».
Don’t know if you had horrible clients who repeated…I hope not.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Absolutely dear, there are horrible clients as there are horrible SPs…
I always try to do my best ethically and found some « low mileage » (not as advertised) SPs on my way anyway. The thing is, they were not reviewed and as a client, I still have right of « no repeat ».
Don’t know if you had horrible clients who repeated…I hope not.

I have had horrible clients who repeated unfortunately, and I had a hard time setting boundaries when I entered the industry so I tolerated some pretty fucked up behavior. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt and more than one chance. In the past year most of my clients have been lovely, however. I've been really lucky.

I think I'm naive and I assume that all SP are having the same experiences that I have but I can imagine some SP are really rude in person.. If I were a client I wouldn't want to be greeted by someone who isn't smiling, isn't interested in who I am as a person and does the bare minimum... I also agree that some SP are dishonest and advertising services they aren't providing, which creates an atmosphere of mistrust.

 

[Giselle Montreal]

[...] I can imagine some SP are really rude in person.. If I were a client I wouldn't want to be greeted by someone who isn't smiling, isn't interested in who I am as a person and does the bare minimum... I also agree that some SP are dishonest and advertising services they aren't providing, which creates an atmosphere of mistrust.

Exactly, and they ruin it for us all since when a client meet one of those girls, they say "I'm done with Indys!" They are non-professionals or scammers, they don't represent us all.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Exactly, and they ruin it for us all since when a client meet one of those girls, they say "I'm done with Indys!" They are non-professionals or scammers, they don't represent us all.

No they don't. That's what I don't understand. Nobody who is in this industry is going to be advantaged by giving a bad service, unless they are doing this just for a short period of time. If you want regulars and repeat clients, you have to put effort into it, regardless of reviews. However nobody is perfect and we all have bad days, we also have clients we get along with better than others.

Clients also have their preferences... I don't think there's a universal definition of what makes a provider really good. We can mostly agree on what's bad. Like obviously a provider who is wearing dirty sweatpants and has messy hair and does a line of coke in front of a client and looks at her phone the whole time isn't providing good service. lol

I think feedback and communication are really important. If a client is doing something I don't like, I communicate about it to preserve our relationship, unless I really don't want to see him again and won't have to interact with him. We can all learn to better ourselves. If there is something you didn't like in your experience with a provider, I think it's important to tell her.. In a nice way of course. I think this will have positive impact on the industry because we talk to each other and we do want to know what clients like better, we want to be appreciated. That's why I look at this forum so often even if I don't like many aspects of it.

 

[bodick7]

I don't think there's a universal definition of what makes a provider really good.

No but SPs who continue after I got a wild orgasm certainly earn a special status?…

 

[Lunaseraphim]

No but SPs who continue after I got a wild orgasm certainly earn a special status?…

What do you mean by continue? Generally sure. But you have to ask. Some clients want msog, but actually many don't want it. Some guys don't even want GFE. There are people here who complain about girls talking, but some clients will book girls precisely because they know they'll have good sex and good conversations.

Sometimes clients aren't clear about expectations and aren't totally sure of what they want. If a guy wants a PSE experience he will be disappointed with me, for instance, but not everyone wants that. If he assumes I offer acronyms associated with PSE (other than cimsw) and that I will act like a porn star, after reading my ad, that's kinda his fault. I think if you want a specific type of experience, you have to do your research and talk to the girl. I think if everything is clear in the ad or during the conversation with the girl or the booker, technically you shouldn't be having an issue unless you were lied to.

In any case, personally if a client has criticism to make, I'd like to hear it from him. Also, like I said, you won't make good money as an escort if you are too YMMV and if you don't know how to adapt to clients, at least in my experience. You have to maintain a good reputation in order to keep working.

 

[David Sel et Poivre]

Sometimes I wonder what clients mean by YMMV. I've realized that some providers don't offer the same services to all clients, for a wide variety of reasons.. At MP's it seems to be common. I personally offer the same services (as in, the same acronyms) to all clients.. The few times that I didn't was because the clients had really poor hygiene. However realistically it's impossible for clients to all have the same experience with the same SP. I can imagine that some SP who don't offer certain services technically would offer them to regulars or clients they like better, and in a way I think that is kinda normal. If she doesn't offer them officially the clients who experienced these acronyms are just lucky and others shouldn't be complaining. ''YMMV'' shouldn't mean ''I have the right to be a horrible client and I should still get the same service'' in my opinion.. If you're rude, why should you expect to be having the same experience as someone who shows up to the date with a smile on his face and a good attitude?

It all depends on the connection