The Official MERB 2011-2012 NHL Hockey Thread

[lgna69xxx]

S**T disturb when things have been going so well? Why? :noidea: :nono: I dont get you guys.

How is plus/minus of "even or a +1" horrific? Last i checked Eric Staal (he is a great player for the Carolina Canes, rumps) was a -17, does that make him a bad player? newsflash, i would take Eric Staal on my team ANYDAY! You clearly do not understand hockey special k. 1. That is the most overrated stat in all of hockey. And 2. Kessel is the leading goal scorer as we speak with 18, sorry to disappoint,

Oh and 3. Boston is 2-2 as well, your point? :lol: Thanks for playing tho :thumb:

PS. The great Phil Kessel, aka, leading the NHL in goals with 18, is now +2 not +1, tyvm Peter C.

Evening Boys...

Leafs give up a hat trick to defenseman Dennis Wideman...YES, DENNIS WIDEMAN! WOW!!
Dennis Wideman scored three power-play goals and added an assist It was the first time this season the Capitals have scored more than two power-play goals.
Nicklas Backstrom also scored and had two assists for Washington.
Phil Kessel and Cody Franson scored for the Maple Leafs, who defeated Washington 7-1 in Toronto the last time these teams met on Nov. 19.

Leaf's are now 2-2 in December :lol: On a side note, former NHL leading goal scorer and point leader Phil Kessel finally brought his horrific +/- to a positive 1 for the season!

 

[Doc Holliday]

i actually think montreal made a great trade offloading an older dman for a younger one with similar if not better passing skills. of course we're losing some of space k's blocking abilities but he's been hurt anyway.

Kaberle isn't a young pup anymore. He'll be 34 years old in a few months. Kaberle's skills have eroded & he's been a turnover machine over the past two years. He won't be useful as a passer for Subban since Subban shoots right-handed.

But the biggest problem with this transaction is Kaberle's big contract. If he'd be on the last year of his contract, fine. But the habs are stuck paying him for another year. He's also an extremely soft defenceman, and never shoots the puck.

What i don't get is why they gave away a reliable veteran defenseman when this is what they currently lack on this team. Spacek is also extremely popular among his teammates & appears to be a good person. A lot of habs players were in shock today (and very sad) when they were informed of the trade. My guess is that they probably could have had Kaberle for nothing. Carolina was desperate to trade him over the past 2-3 weeks & there were rumours that he'd be sent down to the minors if he couldn't be traded. He was a healthy scratch for several games & it was obvious to everyone following the Canes that his days were numbered.

Yesterday's transactions hints that the Habs might not expect Andrei Markov this season. Who knows.

What angered many in the media yesterday was the fact Pierre Gauthier told the media that Tomas Kaberle had a very good season with the Bruins last year. Say what? He was absolutely brutal! Everyone knows this! Boston gave away 2 first-round picks & a 2nd-rounder to Toronto for Kaberle & they didn't even want to hang on to him after last season, preferring to see him walk away for nothing.

How long can Pierre Gauthier hang onto his job? There has been rumours circulating all season long that coach Jacques Martin would get fired. However, let me state that the transactions his GM has made since Bob Gainey's departure haven't been fair to the coach.

 

[Doc Holliday]

I'm not a serious hockey fan, K, so could you set me straight on something. Tyler Seguin has a +/- of plus 19. In the rest of the world, 19 is greater than 1. That's true for the hockey world, to, n'est pas?

My dear friend, let me enlighten you. Plus/minus is a very overrated statistic. It has more to do with who your linemates are than how you play. A team with a great goalie will often have high plus/minus numbers. And vice-versa. It also has a lot to do with the type of system that your team uses. For example, if an average player spends an entire season playing on a top scorer's line....say Sidney Crosby....he's likely to wind up in the high pluses. On the other hand, if a team plays with a lousy defence or a goaltender that can't stop a beach ball, they'll likely have a very high 'minus' number, even though they've played well personally & the goals scored against them had nothing to do with their own play.

Heck, even Mike Komisarek had decent plus/minus numbers this season until he got hurt. :lol:

And finally, i don't deny that Tyler Seguin is a good young hockey player with a very good future ahead of him. This isn't surprising, considering Boston traded away the rights to Phil Kessel for him. Phil Kessel is a formidable player himself & he currently leads all NHL players (incl. Sidney Crosby) in all-star game balloting.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

My dear friend, let me enlighten you. Plus/minus is a very overrated statistic.

Let me enlighten you, Doc. I'm not quite as ignorant about hockey as I claim. Hockey is a two way game; defensemen aren't the only ones who play defense and linemen aren't the only ones who play offense. To some degree plus/minus is overrated, but not entirely. It does suggest how well you play defense, which, in Kessel's case, suggests that if hockey had a DH, he'd be one. From a team standpoint, plus/minus, in the Leafs case, tells us that the team has been playing over their head and that the rest of the season probably won't be as kind to them as the first part has been. If they don't start playing better hockey, they're going to be in a death scramble for the last playoff spot.

It has more to do with who your linemates are than how you play.

So you're telling me that Wilson is putting Kessel out there on a line with two guys who suck? No wonder the TO papers are constantly calling for his head.

Phil Kessel is a formidable player himself & he currently leads all NHL players (incl. Sidney Crosby) in all-star game balloting.

Yep, they do sell some tickets in Toronto.

 

[Special K]

S**T disturb when things have been going so well? Why? :noidea: :nono: I dont get you guys.

Oh Iggy...Amazing how you only see things through Leaf colored blinders here. How was my post any different than you buddy's post here? I can't wait for this explanation.

Hello boys............ :lol:

Panthers ice Bruins & blank them 2-0

BOSTON -- Tomas Kopecky broke a scoreless tie with 2:32 left and Jose Theodore stopped 40 shots as the Florida Panthers beat the Boston Bruins 2-0 on Thursday night and sent Tim Thomas to his first loss in 11 games. :lol: :lol:

It was the second shutout of the season for Theodore.

Florida added an empty-netter with 42 seconds left, outracing the Bruins to a loose puck and backhanding it into the net to clinch it.

The Bruins dominated the scoring chances for most of the game, but Florida put pressure on Thomas in the last 5 minutes and then struck quickly when Thomas left a rebound in front of the net. Sean Bergenheim skated over the puck and missed, but Kopecky followed up and put it in.

The Bruins went all of November without losing a game in regulation, but they are 2-2 in December.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/recap?gameId=400046896

Cheers!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[evillethings]

Kaberle isn't a young pup anymore. He'll be 34 years old in a few months. Kaberle's skills have eroded & he's been a turnover machine over the past two years. He won't be useful as a passer for Subban since Subban shoots right-handed.

But the biggest problem with this transaction is Kaberle's big contract. If he'd be on the last year of his contract, fine. But the habs are stuck paying him for another year. He's also an extremely soft defenceman, and never shoots the puck.

What i don't get is why they gave away a reliable veteran defenseman when this is what they currently lack on this team. Spacek is also extremely popular among his teammates & appears to be a good person. ...

tomas is still 3yrs junior to spacek's 37 and spacek has been an IR regular for sometime. better a healthy body than nobody.

kaberle doesnt have to be feeding PK subban... could be a guy like gionta or plekanc or another trigger man.

and i disagree. kaberle's contract is reasonable for a veteran defenseman. wideman, green, and for 3 seasons + 2 season phaneuf & markov (respectively) wasn't/isn't earning their contracts.

giveaways, no worries ... i'll take what good's left in kaberle with the bad but kaberle likes an audience, he'll get one in MTL.

 

[evillethings]

Actually, i think giving McCabe a cheap "rest of the season" deal would of been a better option than what they did.

:nono: no man, no! mccabe is too old and so not in game shape he'd step on the ice like huselius and tear his groin or dislocate both shoulders. unless mccabe's been playing in the AHL since september, he's no good to most teams.

 

[evillethings]

... How long can Pierre Gauthier hang onto his job? There has been rumours circulating all season long that coach Jacques Martin would get fired. However, let me state that the transactions his GM has made since Bob Gainey's departure haven't been fair to the coach.

if burke can trade away tyler seguin & dougie hamilton and still be the highest paid employed GM, then gauthier's job is safe given his deals. remember, the GM's job is to build the entire organization and gauthier has a strong farm and solid core in the NHL.

but whatever, all GM do the same thing and one's just about as good as the other.

 

[Mod 8]

I would advise everyone to avoid the confrontational posts if you want this thread to remain open. I would also advise a little more intelligent use of smilies. Continuing to use them in an attempt to laugh at another team's game results will not end well.

 

[lgna69xxx]

Kessel has been one fo the best 2 way forwards in the whole NHL this season, bar none. You actually have to watch the games instead of just looking at a useless stat like +/- In fact the reason Phil is atop the scoring leaders this season and has took his game from good to great is because of his defensive play. Rumps, in all honesty, no joking around, take some time and actually watch a few games, and watch some of the best 2way forwards and how they hustle to get back into the defensive side of the game after a offensive rush down ice and you will see what i mean. Not many have done it better than Mr. Kessel this season and thus he has been rewarded with more ice time than usual, been given the A on his jersey (alternate Captain, rumps) and is atop the entire NHL in goals and points and is the leading Allstar vote getter and no, they do not sell them rumps, you can actually go online and vote up to 30 times.

If in fact the Leafs do get the last playoff spot, it is still a huge improvement from the last several years, and any Leafs fan will be happy just to get into postseason. Not bad when everyone else thinks it takes a 5 yr rebuild to even have a shot at that, but this is only year 3 of Burke's rebuild and being the youngest team in the NHL on most nights, there is no shame in 8th, but i do feel this team will finish higher if they can ever get the darn penalty kill figured out like they have the other part of their special teams, the powerplay, which is currently 2nd in the entire NHL. Again, for a young team, any playoff spot will due. This season the Leafs just wanna knock and come thru the door, next season and beyond, we kick the SOB in.

Let me enlighten you, Doc. I'm not quite as ignorant about hockey as I claim. Hockey is a two way game; defensemen aren't the only ones who play defense and linemen aren't the only ones who play offense. To some degree plus/minus is overrated, but not entirely. It does suggest how well you play defense, which, in Kessel's case, suggests that if hockey had a DH, he'd be one. From a team standpoint, plus/minus, in the Leafs case, tells us that the team has been playing over their head and that the rest of the season probably won't be as kind to them as the first part has been. If they don't start playing better hockey, they're going to be in a death scramble for the last playoff spot.Yep, they do sell some tickets in Toronto.

 

[lgna69xxx]

But the return was greater to a team that needed help now, not 3 years down the road and Kessel and Liles are helping the Leafs greatly, now. Also Joe Colborne will be a stud centreman next season and beyond. There were also futures in draft picks Tyler Biggs and Stuart Percy so all in all, I'd say the Leafs/Bruins trades so far are even, and maybe even in favor of the Leafs just a little because of Kessel's strong start. All in all it will take YEARS to decide who won the trades and if it works out for both teams, then all the better because a great trade is one who helps both clubs.

Gauthier on the other hand, well lets just say i have quite a few habs friends and they all see the Kaberle deal as desperation by PG. The one thing they hate is PG taking on another bad contract. Kabs did have 2 assists today in a 2-1 habs win over NJ so at least he is off to a good start and he has to be otherwise the Bell Cantre faithful will boo him out of town quickly. It is a good thing they have a guy in goal named Price, heaven forbid if he ever gets injured.

Also about the Kaberle signing, does this mean Markov is done? There said 4-6 weeks on monday and are now saying at least 8 weeks before his return, but we have heard this all before.

if burke can trade away tyler seguin & dougie hamilton and still be the highest paid employed GM, then gauthier's job is safe given his deals. remember, the GM's job is to build the entire organization and gauthier has a strong farm and solid core in the NHL.

but whatever, all GM do the same thing and one's just about as good as the other.

 

[Doc Holliday]

But the return was greater to a team that needed help now, not 3 years down the road and Kessel and Liles are helping the Leafs greatly, now. Also Joe Colborne will be a stud centreman next season and beyond. There were also futures in draft picks Tyler Biggs and Stuart Percy so all in all, I'd say the Leafs/Bruins trades so far are even, and maybe even in favor of the Leafs just a little because of Kessel's strong start. All in all it will take YEARS to decide who won the trades and if it works out for both teams, then all the better because a great trade is one who helps both clubs.

Iggy, you should be a hockey analyst on tv. Your comments are 100% right on & it exposes to all that you're an astute hockey connoisseur. You know your hockey! :thumb:

 

[Doc Holliday]

Let me enlighten you, Doc. I'm not quite as ignorant about hockey as I claim. Hockey is a two way game; defensemen aren't the only ones who play defense and linemen aren't the only ones who play offense.

Linemen? This is hockey, not football.

To some degree plus/minus is overrated, but not entirely. It does suggest how well you play defense, which, in Kessel's case, suggests that if hockey had a DH, he'd be one. So you're telling me that Wilson is putting Kessel out there on a line with two guys who suck?

I'm confused. What exactly is wrong with Phil Kessel's plus/minus numbers? I believe they entire hockey world (minus a few jealous & frustrated Bruins fans) would find that his plus/minus numbers are quite respectable.

 

[lgna69xxx]

Thanks and that would be an awesome gig to have but really it is just common sense and a ton of homework on my part. Actually i take that back, nowhere should the word "work" be associated there, because if you Love something so much, it is never work.

Btw you write pretty well yourself and something tells me you have dabbled in that field before.

Iggy, you should be a hockey analyst on tv. Your comments are 100% right on & it exposes to all that you're an astute hockey connoisseur. You know your hockey! :thumb:

 

[lgna69xxx]

I do not give much care to plus/minus ratings as it is the most overrated stat in all of hockey, well, that and hits, but with a +2 and on pace to be a ppg player for the first time in his young career after being a -20 player last year is something to say the least. It is great to see Kessel grow up and take this next step in what should be a fantastic HOF career if he stays healthy all or most of it.

I'm confused. What exactly is wrong with Phil Kessel's plus/minus numbers? I believe they entire hockey world would find that his plus/minus numbers are quite respectable.

 

[evillethings]

...I'd say the Leafs/Bruins trades so far are even, and maybe even in favor of the Leafs just a little because of Kessel's strong start. All in all it will take YEARS to decide who won the trades and if it works out for both teams, then all the better because a great trade is one who helps both clubs.

Gauthier on the other hand, well lets just say i have quite a few habs friends and they all see the Kaberle deal as desperation by PG. The one thing they hate is PG taking on another bad contract. Kabs did have 2 assists today in a 2-1 habs win over NJ so at least he is off to a good start and he has to be otherwise the Bell Cantre faithful will boo him out of town quickly. It is a good thing they have a guy in goal named Price, heaven forbid if he ever gets injured. ...

it disappoints me when i hear you speaking like you're a bosox loyalist. god.

seguin's a stud already. kessel's been around 4-5 yrs and only really helping toronto consistently this yr the way burke anticipated.
just this deal alone would sink 50% of the GMs out there.

...then to add the sour grapes comment about kaberle's 2 A's 1st game in as a hab... oh boy. where do i get that prescription for leafs blue tinted glasses?
you have to admit 2 points for tomas (he was in on all of montreal's goals) says a little something don't you think? nevermind, this discussion is smelling like cheap red wine all of a sudden. lol

markov might as well be done with his, what, 3rd surgery in 12months. i wrote him off last season.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Evening Boys...

Leafs give up a hat trick to defenseman Dennis Wideman...YES, DENNIS WIDEMAN! WOW!! :lol::lol::lol:

WASHINGTON -- Dennis Wideman scored three power-play goals and added an assist and the Washington Capitals beat the Toronto Maple Leafs 4-2 Friday night.
Wideman finished his first career hat trick and sealed the win with a shot from the point with 1:19 left in the game.

Not so fast, young man.....

NHL voids Dennis Wideman hat trick

WASHINGTON -- Dennis Wideman says he didn't deserve the hat trick. Turns out he was right.

The NHL on Saturday changed the scoring on the Washington Capitals defenseman's final goal in Friday night's 4-2 win over the Toronto Maple Leafs.

Wideman said after the game that the puck went in the net off teammate Brooks Laich.

The league agrees. Laich now gets credit for the goal, with assists to Wideman and John Carlson.

It would have been Wideman's first career hat trick. The last Capitals defenseman to record a hat trick remains Sergei Gonchar in 2000.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/7338230/nhl-voids-hat-trick-dennis-wideman-washington-capitals

On a side note, former NHL leading goal scorer and point leader Phil Kessel finally brought his horrific +/- to a positive 1 for the season!

A plus/minus of +1 is horrific? Really?

Ok, if you say so.

 

[lgna69xxx]

bosox loyalist? Thems there are fighting words , hahahahah...... Not sure what your talking about as far as Kaberle and my comment, i never had any sour grapes comment at all, just reporting what a bunch of habs fans i talk to said was all, which is what i stated in the original post. As far as Kessel only helping the Leafs this year, i do believe he was a big part of the Leafs push to the playoffs the last 30 games of the season that came up a few games short but led to hope for the carryover to this season, which has held true and ever since he was put with Lupul (29 games at the end of last season) he has not only improved his own game but has made Lupul a great player as well. Like i said it will take years likely to see if there is actually a winner in the Kessel deal and again hopefully the trade helps both teams equally, but there is no sense debating it any further here because as of now it is what it is, dead even for the most part.

it disappoints me when i hear you speaking like you're a bosox loyalist. god.

seguin's a stud already. kessel's been around 4-5 yrs and only really helping toronto consistently this yr the way burke anticipated.
just this deal alone would sink 50% of the GMs out there.

...then to add the sour grapes comment about kaberle's 2 A's 1st game in as a hab... oh boy. where do i get that prescription for leafs blue tinted glasses?
you have to admit 2 points for tomas (he was in on all of montreal's goals) says a little something don't you think? nevermind, this discussion is smelling like cheap red wine all of a sudden. lol

markov might as well be done with his, what, 3rd surgery in 12months. i wrote him off last season.

 

[joelcairo]

I do not give much care to plus/minus ratings as it is the most overrated stat in all of hockey, well, that and hits, but with a +2 and on pace to be a ppg player for the first time in his young career after being a -20 player last year is something to say the least. It is great to see Kessel grow up and take this next step in what should be a fantastic HOF career if he stays healthy all or most of it.

Plus-minus is certainly a flawed system for many reasons but HITS is not an overrated stat.

 

[Lovemaker]

I believe they entire hockey world (minus a few jealous & frustrated Bruins fans) would find that his plus/minus numbers are quite respectable.

Jealous of what? The Bruins won the Stanley Cup last year, the Leafs haven't made the NHL finals in almost 45 years. The last time they won the Stanley cup was in 1967, almost a half century ago, this is the longest-active championship drought in the NHL. Forget winning the Stanley cup, the Leafs haven't even made it to the playoffs for almost a decade now, 2003/2004. Jealous of what?

That's like saying the Penguins' fans are jealous of the Columbus blue jackets lol