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Thread: HDH Clarification

  1. #1

    HDH Clarification

    Sorry for the newb question, but what defines a HDH? Is it simply price (hence the High Dollar part), and what is considered high dollar in Montreal? I've noticed that the "regular rate" is in the $200-ish price range give or take... what is the cutoff considered to be for HDH, $300+? Are services any better, or is it more of a case of supply and demand? Thanks in advance for your help!

  2. #2
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    Well for me categories of escort are most of time hard to define since there a huge quantity of shades of gray ... But for the most part even at 250$ you may begin but it isn't the only factor that define HDH as there also her attitude .. to me HDH will tend to offer longer date so there more room to take your time with the lady

    But once again some LDL does that too so it really depends ..
    Et je l'écoute (Joël Bouchard) toujours jusqu'à la fin de son laïus parce que je suis convaincu qu'un jour, il va terminer en nous offrant des voitures usagées à des prix INCROYABLES!

    -Ronald King

  3. #3
    A couple of stupid questions from a novice in this area:

    1. Where can I find a good HDH agency? (All the ones on MERB seem to charge in the $200 range?).

    2. Aren't you taking a bit of a risk hiring HDH? Five hundred an hour times two is ONE large. That's a lot of money to put down on an un-reviewed girl.

    3. Is there a lot of supply at that range? I could only find one agency - FKS. And maybe one or two independents....but who knows if they are still working.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by mauricevachon View Post

    2. Aren't you taking a bit of a risk hiring HDH? Five hundred an hour times two is ONE large. That's a lot of money to put down on an un-reviewed girl.

    3. Is there a lot of supply at that range? I could only find one agency - FKS. And maybe one or two independents....but who knows if they are still working.
    Hi all
    I have had the pleasure of meeting those types of escorts many times 3 are active Merb posters
    1.Monica Del Fiore ! Big Boob sensation ,she does post FKS TOO !
    2.Clara Versailles !Best spinner racer ass
    3.MissAnnabelle!Amazing passionate DFK with great all around body and attitude
    I have reviewed the 3 on merb
    2 of them where not reviewed prior my encounter or few reviews
    i wiill try other HDH at my return since my experience was great with all
    Warm Regards
    BookerL

  5. #5
    One of the best things about Montreal, Maurice, is that a great number of Montreal providers meet the definition that Cap'n Renault provided for HDH, at the relatively lower $180-$220 per hour price, which is why The HDH market in Montreal is less prevelant. In a less urban, less college- oriented locale, the commercial sex market is more dominated by skanky, drug-abusing providers that do not have any sophistication or class. A HDH operating in that environment can do quite well differentiating herself.

  6. #6
    Makes sense Patron. I usually buy off the menu. But have been thinking of treating myself for some time. There are just too many slam-dunks at the lower end, to merit the extra dough.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptRenault View Post
    If you're looking for a no-risk, low cost experience, use Youporn and your dominant hand.
    Thank-you Louis. I think that this is going to be the start of a beautiful friendship.....

  7. #7
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    Personally i have paid 300$ + only for one girl in my life and it was a pornstar. I guess her status made it that i was willing to spent more. It started by a one time deal, thinking to myself "i will be able to say i banged a pornstar lol" but i had a great time so i repeated, i did had more money back then so could afford it.

    But as some put it what defines an HDH per say? I don't give a damn if she knows about wine, traveling or whatever. All i ask is that she is happy to be there, or lets say at least act the part well lol. I like a fun conversation and some clicking is indeed important, but when it comes to my needs, i do not need a level of sofistication per say...

    There some girls that enter the HDH range, and they are truly beautifull, but paying 300$ for safe GFE for exemple is not my style.

    I guess the problem is there are some VERY VERY hot girls in agencies, therefore paying 100-200$ more just seem soporific. Also HDH often mean either a 2 hours minimum, or my favorite part(sarcasticaly speaking) they request to be received in a 4-5 star hotel... And we all know those don't offer siestas usually... so paying 250$ a night for an hotel room... not my cup of tea,

    ANYWAY, i guess if you have the money, and you want a particular girl because you saw so much agencies girls that your running out, then by all mean allow yourself, but the average joe i think can find happiness very easily in agencies or regular indies.
    Life is a party ! Death is the Hangover.. 70-49-6

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by ezekiel View Post
    Well for me categories of escort are most of time hard to define since there a huge quantity of shades of gray ... But for the most part even at 250$ you may begin but it isn't the only factor that define HDH as there also her attitude .. to me HDH will tend to offer longer date so there more room to take your time with the lady

    But once again some LDL does that too so it really depends ..

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptRenault View Post
    What defines an HDH girl is subjective but for me, a Montreal HDH is generally defined by:


    1. A per hour rate between $300 and 500
    2. A minimum date time of 2 hours
    3. An expectation that the girl will be better dressed and groomed than a regular escort. So tasteful, more expensive clothes and nicer hair and makeup.
    4. A girl with at least of veneer of sophistication and worldliness (some knowledge of wine, food, travel, geography, culture, etc)
    5. An expectation that the girl is doing only one or at most two dates per day or only a few per week.
    6. An expectation that the girl will be exceptionally attractive and fit, more so than the average escort.
    7. An expectation that the girl is more mature than the average escort with an age between 21-30+. No 18 or 19 year olds.


    Now having given this general description, do I think that HDH girls are "better than" or "worth more" or truly different from average $200/hour agency girls. No, absolutely not. Some agency girls can easily match some or even all of the characteristics that I have described (apart from price). Many agency girls are more desirable than HDH girls. Some girls start out with an everyday agency and graduate to HDH status. Some girls move back and forth between HDH and everyday girl. HDH girls are like any luxury product--they definitely cost more but whether they are worth paying for depends entirely on the value that the client places on the perceived characteristics of the product. I think it's true that most MERBites don't hire HDHs and don't really see the point of paying their elevated prices. Furthermore the type of guy who uses HDHs probably doesn't participate much in MERB. However, speaking for myself, would I see them if I had much more money to spend? Yes, definitely!
    Thanks for your input, guys! I'm trying to better understand how things are in Montreal. It's funny how relative things can be in different markets. Not that I speak with much experience in Montreal, but judging by who and what you guys have experienced and reviewed about the norm and standards in Montreal, you would have a mile long line for any of the top providers were they in LA. Here, $300-500 will get you "average," and I have a strong suspicion that our average is well below that of Montreal's. And GFE is non-existent compared to what you have there. So for every subpar experience you have there, console yourself with the fact that it's still probably a lot better than what we are getting here. I don't hobby much, never here... probably for this reason primarily, and I'm lucky to have a very accommodating friend, but Montreal sounds like the perfect place for a fuckation

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptRenault View Post
    If you're looking for a no-risk, low cost experience, use Youporn and your dominant hand.
    If you use your less dominant hand though, it's like you're getting some strange...

    Quote Originally Posted by Halloween Mike View Post
    Personally i have paid 300$ + only for one girl in my life and it was a pornstar. I guess her status made it that i was willing to spent more. It started by a one time deal, thinking to myself "i will be able to say i banged a pornstar lol" but i had a great time so i repeated, i did had more money back then so could afford it.

    But as some put it what defines an HDH per say? I don't give a damn if she knows about wine, traveling or whatever. All i ask is that she is happy to be there, or lets say at least act the part well lol. I like a fun conversation and some clicking is indeed important, but when it comes to my needs, i do not need a level of sofistication per say...

    There some girls that enter the HDH range, and they are truly beautifull, but paying 300$ for safe GFE for exemple is not my style.

    I guess the problem is there are some VERY VERY hot girls in agencies, therefore paying 100-200$ more just seem soporific. Also HDH often mean either a 2 hours minimum, or my favorite part(sarcasticaly speaking) they request to be received in a 4-5 star hotel... And we all know those don't offer siestas usually... so paying 250$ a night for an hotel room... not my cup of tea,

    ANYWAY, i guess if you have the money, and you want a particular girl because you saw so much agencies girls that your running out, then by all mean allow yourself, but the average joe i think can find happiness very easily in agencies or regular indies.
    $300 wouldn't get you a CBJ from a pornstar here as a private (industry term for porngirls who do extracurriculars), so it sounds like you got a great deal from where I sit. The top pornstars are in the $1500-$2000 per hour range. Some more... I think the pornstar thing can be overrated... some are amazing, some are not... but not to burst anyone's bubble, PSE is relative... in almost all cases, industry girls fuck differently on camera and in their personal lives... In the few cases I've experienced both, the off camera is much, much better...

    Don't get me wrong, I'm all about chemistry... HDH/LDL takes a distant second to chemistry... and while I like sophistication, I also like simple... most importantly, I like it as real as she is comfortable revealing to me.

    I don't see having some VERY VERY hot girls in agencies as being a problem... Seriously though, I do understand your viewpoint. I'm actually a pretty simple guy and have no problem throwing back some beers and crashing on a buddy's floor (not sure what you mean by a siesta though), but I also like treating myself to a nice scotch and a comfy room too...

  9. #9
    I love the study of economics as it relates to sex work.

    Many scholars view prostitutes as the ultimate Veblen Good - the perceived satisfaction increases as the price increases.

    If someone sees a $400 an hour prostitute in a market in which the typical price is $200 an hour, not only will he go in expected her to be superior, but he may in fact find her superior without really analyzing whether she was more physically appealing or made him cum better than the lower-priced provider. Consequently, almost all higher-priced prostitutes get great reviews.

    Many reviewers start this activity by saving up and seeing a very expensive provider. They have difficulty ever getting accustomed to taking a "step-down" to the lower priced alternative.

    But we all know that there can be a very big difference in quality between girls at different price levels. The $50-$100 Montreal street hooker really does not offer the same product as the $180 - $220 agency or independent provider, but there really is scant difference between the $400 - $500 HDH and the $180-$220 provider in Montreal. I base this on years of experience and having seen HDH at Montreal's old HDH Allyssa's agency and comparing them to the girls I see now. And I base it on pics and reviews on Merb of these LDL ladies. If the LDL is young, cute, intelligent and does all the aspects of sex, what more could a HDH offer?

    Most HDH girls are very good marketers who understand the concept of Veblen Goods, and the psychology of johns who have hang-ups like insisting that she only fuck one guy a day. Cars are no different. Plenty of middle class cars are just as good as luxury cars, even though a very wide differential exists between the lowest price car and the middle class car. But the luxury car owner will feel much better about his luxury car than the middle class car owner feels about his car. Just marketing and advertisement.

  10. #10
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    (not sure what you mean by a siesta though)
    Siesta is the common term for a 4 hour motel renting... When you book for 4 hours, they know why you are there...and its not to actually sleep a couple hours :P

    I know the USA market is very different, but then again everything is... I mean would i meet a quebec "actor" , no matter who he was i would be like "hey is that xxx xxxx , oh yeah it is" and continue my way. Unless maybe its a certain blond girl who does he weather on week end monday, she is so cute i may ask for a pic with her lol. But would i see an american actor, HOLY SHIT i would be like "daaaaamnnn" and ask for a pic for sure, no matter if its Dolph Lundgren, Stallone, or any other male.

    So when you book en american pornstar, you pay for the fame. How awesome would it be to say i "fucked Madison Ivy" lol, but first of all the rules of prostitution themselves are harder in the states, normal girls range at 400$+ and like i said pornstars are more known. Quebec pornstars have to deal with a smaler market, a more affordable market also, and even if they shot in the states, they are usually not as big of a name there than here...

    So was the 350$ cim included GFE+ meeting with a pornstar worth it? YES it was, and its great memory. But would i had paid 500$? Dunno... maybe once, but i doubt i would had repeat no matter how awesome it could had been.

    There is a certain price line you got to establish to yourself. Mine is 220$ the hour for a regular girl (+ extra) and 300$ for a pornstar if its one im shitting my pants to meet. There is some exeptions possible IF the girl is incredibly beautifull, if i know she is one hot fox in bed, and if she is not picky with hotels and such, but it would most likely be a one time deal. Can't afford to repeat too much at highter price.

    But then would by a miracle i knew Madison Ivy would come to MTL and escort, offering a PSE experience, i would maybe save some $ if i know it well in advance and would maybe try to meet her, because she is my favorite pornstar. Even at 1000$ it would be a great deal.

    But i won't go to the USA , get a passport, risk getting caugh and pay over the top hotel fees and plane fees for seeing her.

    Of course everyhing is relative in this world, when i look at Maria Star for exemple at 200$H for PSE, and everybody says she is very "naughty" , then i am much more tempted to book her than another independant at a highter price for simple GFE or safe GFE. Of course physiques is a matter of personal taste, me i like the blond stripper look, some don't. But what im trying to say is that i see 2 beautifull independant, one offering more than the other, for less money, ill go with the better deal. Chemistry is something you can't really know until you experienced it...
    Life is a party ! Death is the Hangover.. 70-49-6

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halloween Mike View Post

    Of course everyhing is relative in this world, when i look at Maria Star for exemple at 200$H for PSE, and everybody says she is very "naughty" , then i am much more tempted to book her than another independant at a highter price for simple GFE or safe GFE. Of course physiques is a matter of personal taste, me i like the blond stripper look, some don't. But what im trying to say is that i see 2 beautifull independant, one offering more than the other, for less money, ill go with the better deal. Chemistry is something you can't really know until you experienced it...
    Hi all
    Very interesting what you say here you go for the" better deal "best price price for what is offered ,obviously you are right to take the best deal ,I would too .
    And as you say you only know the chemistry after you have experienced it !
    But I also so enjoy to take a risk on a Indy at $300 or more a hour , its a part of my pleasure and excitement and build a ambiance that favor chemistry ,the thrill of the unknown !
    Warmest Regards
    BookerL

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patron View Post
    I love the study of economics as it relates to sex work.

    Many scholars view prostitutes as the ultimate Veblen Good - the perceived satisfaction increases as the price increases.



    Many reviewers start this activity by saving up and seeing a very expensive provider. They have difficulty ever getting accustomed to taking a "step-down" to the lower priced alternative.

    But we all know that there can be a very big difference in quality between girls at different price levels. The $50-$100 Montreal street hooker really does not offer the same product as the $180 - $220 agency or independent provider, but there really is scant difference between the $400 - $500 HDH and the $180-$220 provider in Montreal. I base this on years of experience and having seen HDH at Montreal's old HDH Allyssa's agency and comparing them to the girls I see now. And I base it on pics and reviews on Merb of these LDL ladies. If the LDL is young, cute, intelligent and does all the aspects of sex, what more could a HDH offer?

    Most HDH girls are very good marketers who understand the concept of Veblen Goods, and the psychology of johns who have hang-ups like insisting that she only fuck one guy a day. Cars are no different. Plenty of middle class cars are just as good as luxury cars, even though a very wide differential exists between the lowest price car and the middle class car. But the luxury car owner will feel much better about his luxury car than the middle class car owner feels about his car. Just marketing and advertisement.
    Hi all
    A analysis of the economic situation ?
    Montreal is not in a good economic situation at moment it does reflect in the escort world as well .
    The market for escorts as change alot in Montreal in the last 20 years ,I started my booking career in the early 90's and many things have change since .Multiple girls bookings where common Now what is common is hour bookings .
    When the biker gangs where arrested it did show in the escort industry because they where calling escorts often .
    When customers can hardly afford their rent what will come first obviously it is a question of economics and cash flow ,the more extra money we have the less we care about rates ,we tend to look more at the greater experience and the exclusivity of it !
    If you can afford a Rolex you can certainly afford a Timex unfortunately the reverse scenario is not true .

    Quote Originally Posted by Patron View Post
    Most HDH girls are very good marketers who understand the concept of Veblen Goods, and the psychology of johns who have hang-ups like insisting that she only fuck one guy a day..

    Is it the only place where they are better are they even better ?Being better is for each clients to choose from is own wishes .
    I do meet both high end and merb sponsors agencies SP's my experience was excellent with both .
    I will still meet the higher price ones because my budget permits it !Its a cash flow economics thing .By the way I do not care how many guys she has fucked on that day ,week or year ,I only care about the one I receive nothing else ! as long she smells good and taste good !
    I saw the same girl for a year she was escorting for fantasm agency my personal friend was the main booker ,I even new her route and the quantity of clients she had saw prior meeting me ,since we where friends she was even allowed to be driven on calls by me it is strange but I have been in the adult entertainment for long so I guess I felt it was normal .
    Warmest Regards
    BookerL

  13. #13
    You make a couple of good points BookerL. HDHs thrive best in a market in which a lot of cash is rolling out from rich guys. If that is not currently the case in Montreal, that market would be less existent.

    And many luxury good markets thrive on the customer showing off his purchase to others, such as the Rolex that does not keep time better than the Timex. Montreal has plenty of extremely good-looking $170-$220 an hour escorts. Even if perhaps a $400 an hour Montreal escort were 10 percent better looking due to spending a lot more on make-up, the customer meeting her in the lobby and riding up the elevator with her is unlikely to get to show her off to everyone for very long.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patron View Post
    You make a couple of good points BookerL. HDHs thrive best in a market in which a lot of cash is rolling out from rich guys. If that is not currently the case in Montreal, that market would be less existent.

    And many luxury good markets thrive on the customer showing off his purchase to others, such as the Rolex that does not keep time better than the Timex. Montreal has plenty of extremely good-looking $170-$220 an hour escorts. Even if perhaps a $400 an hour Montreal escort were 10 percent better looking due to spending a lot more on make-up, the customer meeting her in the lobby and riding up the elevator with her is unlikely to get to show her off to everyone for very long.
    It is true the Rolex does not provide you better time just more prestige ,a watch collector or car collector does not necessarily show is collection to everyone but he knows he has it,its a personal satisfaction .

    To have 1/2 million grand complication watch in platinum from Patek , will not be recognize by other's then watch connoisseur other rich guy's, but it does make you heart beat faster when you ware it and if by chance you meet someone that knows what you are wearing wich is only the privilege few on that day you will be proud.
    Higher end SP satisfies you personally ,if it does its worth it, if its to show off you might be dissapointed ,but like I have previously posted I was satisfied by the services of both the High end SP's and agencies girls Montreal has a great combo ,the sessions I had with the HDH where for four hours and more and one in a duo, memorable encounters each time ,
    I will repeat with HDH and with agencies, both are good in the Montreal market ,
    Depending on what I looking for !
    Anyhow every is entitle to his opinion but when you do have the extra money money HDH girls are different but not necessarily cuter !
    And they do not need anyone's permission ,they go with the flow they control there bookings !
    Kind Regards
    BookerL

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Patron View Post
    I love the study of economics as it relates to sex work.

    Many scholars view prostitutes as the ultimate Veblen Good - the perceived satisfaction increases as the price increases.

    If someone sees a $400 an hour prostitute in a market in which the typical price is $200 an hour, not only will he go in expected her to be superior, but he may in fact find her superior without really analyzing whether she was more physically appealing or made him cum better than the lower-priced provider. Consequently, almost all higher-priced prostitutes get great reviews.

    Many reviewers start this activity by saving up and seeing a very expensive provider. They have difficulty ever getting accustomed to taking a "step-down" to the lower priced alternative.

    But we all know that there can be a very big difference in quality between girls at different price levels. The $50-$100 Montreal street hooker really does not offer the same product as the $180 - $220 agency or independent provider, but there really is scant difference between the $400 - $500 HDH and the $180-$220 provider in Montreal. I base this on years of experience and having seen HDH at Montreal's old HDH Allyssa's agency and comparing them to the girls I see now. And I base it on pics and reviews on Merb of these LDL ladies. If the LDL is young, cute, intelligent and does all the aspects of sex, what more could a HDH offer?

    Most HDH girls are very good marketers who understand the concept of Veblen Goods, and the psychology of johns who have hang-ups like insisting that she only fuck one guy a day. Cars are no different. Plenty of middle class cars are just as good as luxury cars, even though a very wide differential exists between the lowest price car and the middle class car. But the luxury car owner will feel much better about his luxury car than the middle class car owner feels about his car. Just marketing and advertisement.
    I think that's over-generalizing things a bit... or perhaps I'm the exception to the rule... I don't have any expectations that a provider is going to be superior because she is more expensive than the norm (even for double the price per your example) for her local market. In fact, not having much experience hobbying overall, I don't have a strong frame of reference nor a basis to have such expectation, especially in a given market. So finding her superior is relative to my experiences overall, not based on a comparison to the local market. Even when asked, I'm not one to compare experiences as each one has been unique. But for the sake of this thread, I will make an exception and try my best.

    On a trip to Budapest, I was scouting new models and ended up seeing two providers during that particular visit, one being twice the price of the other. In retrospect, there was no distinction between HDH and LDL, but pricing relative to even Montreal would put both at LDL. I found and chose them based off their modeling "potential," though like Montreal, their faces were largely hidden, and I didn't have a resource like MERB to get a reasonable approximation to to their looks on a scale of 1-10. To my luck and surprise, without exaggeration both were 10's facially and physically (for reference, I have shot and worked with some absolutely stunningly beautiful women including NFL cheerleaders, Playboy and Penthouse models, ex-Vivid/Hustler/Brazzers/Private contract girls, etc.) -- one was Playmate of the Year caliber, the other was Pet of the Year caliber without doubt. In a nutshell, the more expensive one was I-can't-believe-my-dick-is-inside-something-so-perfect exciting, but the action was a bit tepid... the other was a I-must-have-died-and-gone-to-heaven-or-I-will-give-my-left-testicle-if-don't-have-to-wake-up-from-this-dream hot GFE... So while the second experience was more magical and more indelible in my memory, there is no way I would give up the first experience because the visual excitement (as a photographer, I'm a very visual person obviously) of the first encounter was about as perfect as it gets.

    Similarly, I shot a scene with Cherry Potter in Montreal a few years back... we had great chemistry, and I easily forgot that I was working. Earlier that day, I had shot another well-known Canadian pornstar who has always been one of my all time favorites ever, especially after meeting her, but due to certain circumstances, it was a solo shoot only. We also had great chemistry which made her "the one who got away" even more than usual. She had me so worked up that even though Cherry was so deliciously satisfying, I "needed" a local SP to try and get her off my mind (IIRC her name was Christina from Devilish, I think). She was a very pretty GND, with a great figure, and a very GFE. Obviously, the going scene rate vs. local SP rate is markedly different, much more than double at the time. And while Cherry was hired AS a pornstar which is actually different from PSE, if she were a private instead, I would have happily paid that rate, because as wonderful as Christina was, she couldn't hold a candle to Cherry.

    So I don't really understand your reference to "stepping down"... I understand what you are saying, but it doesn't apply to me as I don't typically base my decisions on price. And while I respect your years of experience from which you base your comparative analysis, my experience is much more varied and international than most. I appreciate your opinions as it offers me a local perspective with which I am rather naïve.

    Marketing or not, I respectfully disagree with your car analogy (unless you are renting ). You are renting a SP, or rather you are paying for an experience... unless you are lucky, you are likely not keeping her. You own (or keep for a term in the case of a lease) the car... Besides, I'm not a car guy... I'm more of a bike guy... and while my Japanese bikes are just as good (and in some respects better) as the exotics, I won't part with my Ducati's ... it has nothing to do with price or perceived luxury/exclusiveness. It has more to do with the character of the bike and the quality of the ride... YMMV, no pun intended

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