Nice la Presse Article on XO this morning

hobbyvil · Saturday at 10:44 AM

I agree with you….. agency, nassage or indy you never know exactly the whole story of the lady…

Oon Tryst you can see “independants” who actually also work in agencies…

That’s why its important to use judgement and feel out the situation. Talking to the lady to feel the vibe, try to see regulars who seem 100% of free mind and body. Also ask for consent, always. Its not implied because she took the money.

I have no doubt that agency was one of the worst. And if you listen to her carefully, she uses the r word not because every client forced her, but because she felt trapped by the agency hence any activity that occurred was not of free choice…..

My question is, when are they going to start going after the obvious cases such as asian agencies who have girls who barely can say a few words in English?

What’s unfortunate about this situation, besides her experience of course, is the message to the population. As if her story is the story of every women in the industry which only feeds their legal strategy and legitimizes going after the clients….. legalization is the way, not moving this industry further under ground.

I know many smart, beautiful women of free will who chose this line of work and are happy with it. Many if these women have careers outside this industry and a successful life.I think society should protect them.

Lunaseraphim · Saturday at 10:54 AM

hobbyvil said:
I agree with you….. agency, nassage or indy you never know exactly the whole story of the lady…

Oon Tryst you can see “independants” who actually also work in agencies…

That’s why its important to use judgement and feel out the situation. Talking to the lady to feel the vibe, try to see regulars who seem 100% of free mind and body. Also ask for consent, always. Its not implied because she took the money.

I have no doubt that agency was one of the worst. And if you listen to her carefully, she uses the r word not because every client forced her, but because she felt trapped by the agency hence any activity that occurred was not of free choice…..

My question is, when are they going to start going after the obvious cases such as asian agencies who have girls who barely can say a few words in English?

What’s unfortunate about this situation, besides her experience of course, is the message to the population. As if her story is the story of every women in the industry which only feeds their legal strategy and legitimizes going after the clients….. legalization is the way, not moving this industry further under ground.

I know many smart, beautiful women of free will who chose this line of work and are happy with it. Many if these women have careers outside this industry and a successful life.I think society should protect them.

A lot of indies work for agencies and spa as well, just to have different sources of income. That doesn't mean they are not fully independent under their indy persona. It can also be that while they are beginning to build a reputation as an indy, they still need to work for an employer for a little while. I know girls like this and they don't have to rely on agency or MP work for all of their income, they have a lot more freedom.

Actually you should take it as a good sign for the agency because that means their employer is allowing them to work as an indy and didn't try to discourage them from doing work independently.

The other point you're making, about agencies with girls who can barely speak english or french, is an excellent thing to note and think about in my opinion. But I don't think anyone here should be upset that a 19 year old who didn't have a good experience in the industry is speaking out lol I think we should be allowed to talk about negative experiences without being accused of demonizing every client and encouraging abolitionist honestly... Nuances are great.

Glyscore · Saturday at 11:05 AM

All of your insight are interesting. None the less, this XO shit might impact and bonifie my vetoing process on Who's service i'm taking. I dont want to participate on womens sufferance.

hobbyvil · Saturday at 11:06 AM

Oh ya I agree with you @Lunaseraphim that she should express herself and this can help others.

My worry is specific to how the general population perceives this (most people just retain the titles)….

Lunaseraphim · Saturday at 11:08 AM

hobbyvil said:
Oh ya I agree that she should express herself and this can help others.

My worry is specific to how the general population perceives this (most people just retain the titles)….

I don't want to sound depressing but most people don't actually care about us. To most people this is just another "fait divers".

hobbyvil · Saturday at 11:09 AM

Lunaseraphim said:
I don't want to sound depressing but most people don't actually care about us. To most people this is just another "fait divers".

Sad….. but I care and am sure many of us on merb also care.

EagerBeaver · Saturday at 11:16 AM

Lunaseraphim said:
most people don't actually care about us.

There are actually some who care too much......the so called "saviors", a couple of whom were banned from industry parties in the past because they annoyed SPs to no end with ridiculous questions in their misguided efforts to "save" them.

Lunaseraphim · Saturday at 11:17 AM

EagerBeaver said:
There are actually some who care too much......the so called "saviors", a couple of whom were banned from industry parties in the past because they annoyed SPs to no end with questions in their misguided efforts to "save" them.

I'm talking about the general public here, not clients. We also don't like it when clients ask us certain types of questions

RobertNYC · Saturday at 11:38 AM

EagerBeaver said:
There are actually some who care too much......the so called "saviors", a couple of whom were banned from industry parties in the past because they annoyed SPs to no end with ridiculous questions in their misguided efforts to "save" them.

Lunaseraphim said:
I'm talking about the general public here, not clients. We also don't like it when clients ask us certain types of questions

I’d like to think most clients would not patronize any agency whose behavior is an affront to anyone’s human dignity. Sadly some do.

It’s up to law enforcement working with victims and their families to bring justice. If other escorts within XO agency are witness to trafficking and rape, they’re culpable too. Nobody should ever have their dignity taken away silently.

I’ve never used XO because I don’t do incall in Montreal. But I’ve seen plenty of US agency busts (including one I referenced above)

That said, I’d let history of US agencies be a guide here.
Some agency owners can be scumbags (if not criminals, sounds like that’s the case here).
But victims in these types of agency cases can and do embellish what happened to them. Prosecutors can trump up charges and lead victims to use certain words which carry legal weight.
The media salivates when hearing these stories.
Every client, Indy etc puts every agency under microscope. Guilt by association.
White knights are unleashed.
Nervous nellies are now paranoid about using any agency service.

It is possible other agencies helped bring down XO, maybe justifiably so.

Rinse and repeat.

Lunaseraphim · Saturday at 12:00 PM

RobertNYC said:
I’d like to think most clients would not patronize any agency whose behavior is an affront to anyone’s human dignity. Sadly some do.

It’s up to law enforcement working with victims and their families to bring justice. If other escorts within XO agency are witness to trafficking and rape, they’re culpable too. Nobody should ever have their dignity taken away silently.

It's not that simple. Even if one of those girls witnessed abuse, what could she have done? She can just choose to leave but when we speak out against this sort of thing we are often severely punished.

And I'm tired of hearing "victims are lying or embellishing their story" ... It's just so dismissive and upsetting. I can tell everyone who who has said things like this on this thread never experienced any type of abuse.

Involving LE in situations regarding sex work is extremely tricky. I've heard of girls who went to the police after reporting an assault and had cash money taken away from them or were laughed at. LE is often not on our side.

RobertNYC · Saturday at 12:15 PM

Lunaseraphim said:
It's not that simple. Even if one of those girls witnessed abuse, what could she have done? She can just choose to leave but when we speak out against this sort of thing we are often severely punished.

And I'm tired of hearing "victims are lying or embellishing their story" ... It's just so dismissive and upsetting. I can tell everyone who who has said things like this on this thread never experienced any type of abuse.

Involving LE in situations regarding sex work is extremely tricky. I've heard of girls who went to the police after reporting an assault and had cash money taken away from them or were laughed at. LE is often not on our side.

We agree to disagree. Yes, victims can and do embellish stories. You may find it insulting, but you’re living in a cave to think that never happens. It absolutely does, and it happens well outside this industry. I have enough friends who are cops who give countless stories. And prosecutors lead these victims to use words that carry certain legal weight. I’m not saying definitely that’s the case here, but often it is.

As for escorts reporting or not reporting abuse they see, well, that’s a moral dilemma. But my opinion is when you’re an adult, you have a moral obligation to speak. “I’m scared, or “They won’t believe me” is a cop out. Do not do what you think is right, do what IS right. And the right thing is speaking up for the victim in your midst, within your company when she’s being physically abused. Sorry, that’s basic humanity at its core.

If you’re old enough to vote, to go into the military, you’re mature enough to do the right thing and call out rape and abuse if it actually occurred.

Whether LE will listen, won’t listen, take your money. Just do the right thing and TRY to stop the abuse.

Hydargoos · Saturday at 12:36 PM

Pour ma part, j'avais rencontré une fille 2 fois, travaillant pour cette agence. A ma sortie, lors du 2e rendez-vous, des voisins m'avaient vu sortir et m'ont regardé d'un drôle d'air.

Je ne suis plus jamais retourné à cet endroit depuis. C'est pour ça que ma 2e rencontre fut ma dernière avec eux. Mais ça me surprend ce que ce reportage a dit, la femme que j'avais rencontré était plein d'enthousiasme et ne semblait pas être le genre de fille à s'en laisser imposer. Elle avait du caractère.

RobertNYC · Saturday at 12:43 PM

Hydargoos said:
Pour ma part, j'avais rencontré une fille 2 fois, travaillant pour cette agence. A ma sortie, lors du 2e rendez-vous, des voisins m'avaient vu sortir et m'ont regardé d'un drôle d'air.

Je ne suis plus jamais retourné à cet endroit depuis. C'est pour ça que ma 2e rencontre fut ma dernière avec eux. Mais ça me surprend ce que ce reportage a dit, la femme que j'avais rencontré était plein d'enthousiasme et ne semblait pas être le genre de fille à s'en laisser imposer. Elle avait du caractère.

Forgive me. I had to use Google translate. Smart move by you not to return. Instincts are good guides.

And sorry to say, but if this XO escort knew abuse and r— were happening feet from here, and she did nothing, she didn’t have “good character” as you say.

forever newbi · Saturday at 12:48 PM

Sorry, don’t read much French and cannot get the whole story, lol

Just found it’s really low to dig up and agency closed six month ago to write a piece, since. There won’t any opposite of “ the story “

More over, if the dude ( whom I think has a good chance used XO many times) really think the girls are victims, then post their photo does nothing but victimize them a second time.

There are so many different kind of lonely people out there, pastors, cops, judges, journalists, you name it and I won’t be surprised them number pop out on an agency’s call log.

As one owner told me before:

“My favourite sob story quote from it is « A father found her daughter by accident on an esc website and booked her to beg her to stop » …. Nah he was trying to book a girl and then got scandaled by the fact girls like this could be his daughter! « By accident » yeah ok ”

Glyscore · Saturday at 12:57 PM

Lunaseraphim said:
It's not that simple. Even if one of those girls witnessed abuse, what could she have done? She can just choose to leave but when we speak out against this sort of thing we are often severely punished.

And I'm tired of hearing "victims are lying or embellishing their story" ... It's just so dismissive and upsetting. I can tell everyone who who has said things like this on this thread never experienced any type of abuse.

Involving LE in situations regarding sex work is extremely tricky. I've heard of girls who went to the police after reporting an assault and had cash money taken away from them or were laughed at. LE is often not on our side.

The funny thing about what you're saying is, even if going to autorities is a traumatic process, its because of Clementine deposition that XO got takken down, every damn deposition stacked themselves up enough to build a case to arrive to that conclusion. So yeah, pusshing for people to see the police and autorities is absolutely the thing to do. Furthermore, transform the legal process so it's more victims friendly also the thing to do. Both can be pushed for at the same time.

RobertNYC · Saturday at 12:59 PM

forever newbi said:
Sorry, don’t read much French and cannot get the whole story, lol

Just found it’s really low to dig up and agency closed six month ago to write a piece, since. There won’t any opposite of “ the story “

More over, if the dude ( whom I think has a good chance used XO many times) really think the girls are victims, then post their photo does nothing but victimize them a second time.

There are so many different kind of lonely people out there, pastors, cops, judges, journalists, you name it and I won’t be surprised them number pop out on an agency’s call log.

As one owner told me before:

“My favourite sob story quote from it is « A father found her daughter by accident on an esc website and booked her to beg her to stop » …. Nah he was trying to book a girl and then got scandaled by the fact girls like this could be his daughter! « By accident » yeah ok ”

Nobody will ever see a call log. And as I said, it’s difficult to determine facts from a sensational article such as this.

Victims can embellish and bask in the limelight. Prosecutors trump up charges. Agency owners will say or do anything to defend past heinous actions. The truth is in there somewhere, and it may only be revealed when everyone involved in this story is the next big Canadian influencer.

I don’t mean to sound cynical, but look around.

LeDodo · Saturday at 1:01 PM

RobertNYC said:
Forgive me. I had to use Google translate. Smart move by you not to return. Instincts are good guides.

And sorry to say, but if this XO escort knew abuse and r— were happening feet from here, and she did nothing, she didn’t have “good character” as you say.

The French having "character" means she was kind of tough. Meaning she didn't look frail, fragile or easily be bullied.

LeDodo · Saturday at 1:03 PM

forever newbi said:
“My favourite sob story quote from it is « A father found her daughter by accident on an esc website and booked her to beg her to stop » …. Nah he was trying to book a girl and then got scandaled by the fact girls like this could be his daughter! « By accident » yeah ok ”

It was my 1st thought too ...

RobertNYC · Saturday at 1:03 PM

LeDodo said:
The French having "character" means she was kind of tough. Meaning she didn't look frail, fragile or easily be bullied.

So sorry. Lost in translation. Got it!

LeDodo · Saturday at 1:09 PM

Lunaseraphim said:
I can tell everyone who who has said things like this on this thread never experienced any type of abuse.

RobertNYC said:
As for escorts reporting or not reporting abuse they see, well, that’s a moral dilemma. But my opinion is when you’re an adult, you have a moral obligation to speak. “I’m scared, or “They won’t believe me” is a cop out. Do not do what you think is right, do what IS right. And the right thing is speaking up for the victim in your midst, within your company when she’s being physically abused. Sorry, that’s basic humanity at its core.

If you’re old enough to vote, to go into the military, you’re mature enough to do the right thing and call out rape and abuse if it actually occurred.

Whether LE will listen, won’t listen, take your money. Just do the right thing and TRY to stop the abuse.

It's always easy to have a good judgement or be courageous or very smart.

But to Luna's point, if you didn't experience it it's always easier.

Nice la Presse Article on XO this morning

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