9 year old kills instructor with an uzi.... American gun laws.

[Halloween Mike]

Truth be told i know how to behave and not find myself in such situations...

Now clerks and such are a different stories, and YES maybe clerks of convenient stores should be allowed to have a gun or something, but ONLY in the case of there work...

But most of the time victimes of violences are the people that are too " rambo" about it and thinking it can't happen to them or whatever. People NEED to be carefull and realize what kind of part of town/cities there in. I live in a village... I am not afraid to walk at night freely like i want to. But would i do the same in MTL? NO way... Everytime i walked in MTL late at night i always had my hand on my pocket knife... ready to hirt and i am ALWAYS looking at my back (easy to see with the shadows if somebody come from the back) . Maybe its because im a town boy.. thats why im so nervous in the big city, but people tend to forget this shit when they have been living there for so long... always stay on guard.... thats the key.

And i will repeat, 2 out of 3 street thug punk who carry a gun barely know how to use it. If they manage to get the security off, then they handle the thing so bad, at close range they can easily be took care off, and at longe range they aim so badly...spraying bullets all over the place and probably emptying that sit before hitting anything...

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

It's crazy to draw any conclusions in regards to all Americans based on the actions of a few nut jobs.

We have our own up here it is just that you have what 20 - 30 times the population maybe more. More nuts to fall out of the tree.

 

[smuler]

always stay on guard.... thats the key

:thumb:

I'd lose that knife if I were you Mike...

Best Regards

Smuler

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

And i will repeat, 2 out of 3 street thug punk who carry a gun barely know how to use it. If they manage to get the security off, then they handle the thing so bad, at close range they can easily be took care off, and at longe range they aim so badly...spraying bullets all over the place and probably emptying that sit before hitting anything...

Over confidence can also hurt you, many " street thugs " can fight very well and as most fighters know a street fight should only take 2 or 3 seconds.

 

[Halloween Mike]

:thumb:

I'd lose that knife if I were you Mike...

Over confidence can also hurt you, many " street thugs " can fight very well and as most fighters know a street fight should only take 2 or 3 seconds.

Best Regards

Smuler

Only carry it if i know ill have to move late at night.

And yes some does, but turst me my confidence is not "over" . I have been training for against this, and i don't fear a slice or 2. Most people go into a knife fight expecting to disarm without getting hurt. First thing my teacher said to me is "you will be hurt, you will get slice, its up to you to decide where" meaning non lethal slices would happen and are expected, its up to us to make sure we don't get hit in vital parts.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

Most people go into a knife fight expecting to disarm without getting hurt..

I meant showing up at a gun fight with a knife. Kids now a day are too fucked up to expect nothing but the worst. Being approached by street thugs and pull out a knife and they have a gun. Not doubting your abilities but things can be pretty fucked up out there, get some cracker who needs a rock ASAP. Pepper spray will work far better than a knife.

 

[saltydog]

To the fellows up North,
The Second Amendment came about because, 1) We had the balls to fight the Brits, and 2) We had the weapons to do it with. It was written so we could have the same weapons as the enemy, this has been bastardized by gun control.
EB, yes there is a MINORITY that wants us disarmed. That will never happen. EB I pick on you because you are a US citizen. To the rest of you, you would be speaking German if it wasn't for us, so please don't tell me what my rights are. I am free because of guns, and God willing, I will remain that way.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

To the rest of you, you would be speaking German if it wasn't for us,

Do not take all the credit as there were many factors and America was a tiny part.

http://topyaps.com/top-10-reasons-why-hitler-lost-world-war-ii

 

[saltydog]

Do not take all the credit as there were many factors and America was a tiny part.

http://topyaps.com/top-10-reasons-why-hitler-lost-world-war-ii

The only tiny part would be between your, never mind, you Canucks won the war that's right.

When your leaders want to disarm you, they are no longer looking out for your best interests.
Also back to the subject, the instructor was at fault. He was leaning so far into the girl, at times it appears he was in front of the gun. I have trained at least twenty some children to shoot. You never know what could happen, so you take all precautions. End of story.
Patron mentioned ISIS and the unarmed villagers, does anyone wonder why politicians talk about disarming their own people, but immediately want to send small arms to someone fighting somebody else? You can overthrow tyranny with small arms. We are proof.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

The only tiny part would be between your, never mind, you Canucks won the war that's right..

Defensive or what? Did you read the article I posted? Did I mention anything about Canada? And some of you wonder why you have the rep you have.

 

[Merlot]

Gents,

There is a vocal minority in favor of gun rights in the USA.

If so it's a very large minority.

Even in very pro-gun control Massachusetts and the very Democratic area I live in I find most people are in favor of the right to own a gun and to get one within reasonable ease. Massachusetts is one of the toughest gun law states in the country. I walked into a gun shop in late May and the owner wouldn't even let me touch one without a gun license. If opinions on having a gun here are very open where laws are tough then extrapolating the feelings elsewhere where laws are weak probably isn't very anti-guns.

Eager, i think Guns (exeptions of hunting rifles) should ONLY be carried by Policemen and women... thats it.

Did you mean policemen and policewomen? Because "women" are just as likely to be stable or nuts.

The Second Amendment is outdated and most people understand that.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/26/supreme-court-upholds-rig_n_109365.html

Mostly true IMHO, but in 2008 the Supreme court addressed the age old debate about the meaning of the key phrase underlined: "A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed" and decided the militia reference is not a restriction on the rights of law abiding citizens to own guns. As outdated as the 2nd Amendment might be, that decision made the Amendment an entrenched fact of Constitutional Law, and any possible reversal of the 2008 decision by another Supreme Court very unlikely for decades.

A shame this thread devolved into anti-American drivel ...

Knew it would.

...since those things have nothing to do with the story.

Even if the U.S. had more gun restrictions, they would not apply to shooting ranges. So I do not get how this story reflects the sick, arrogant American society or whether gun ownership should be more restricted.

Unfortunately the episode has everything to do with the 2nd Amendment. Whatever the parents motives were for letting the girl fire this weapon, the fact that she was legally able to do it is all about making sure the full freedom of the 2nd Amendment is impressed upon the minds of everyone. You can be sure gun advocates absolutely want the youngest possible indoctrinated with these beliefs to protect the 2nd Amendment.

Make no mistake, I don't think the incident was insane because it was an automatic weapon or if it had been any deadly weapon a child shouldn't control. I find it insane a kid is allowed to use any weapon when the mind and body is so far from being mature enough to handle it and the skilled decision-making that should go with it. Hell, she can't vote, drink, drive a car, but she can handle a deadly weapon legally. I mean "F" off.

Most of my sympathy is for the girl, obviously too young to have made an adult decision to shoot a weapon, and now permanently scared mentally. I think her most likely course for reasoning this out and living with the tragedy is to realize she was in the hand of at least three adults who didn't have the foresight or intelligence to know that regardless of politics there no way deciding to guide a kid into this act was a rational choice. I wouldn't be surprised if she already realizes what a mess the adult world is.

Really,

Merlot

 

[EagerBeaver]

Patron makes an interesting point about people on vacation thinking that nothing can go wrong. Reminds me of having witnessed a gruesome trampoline accident in the Turks and Caicos years ago. We had just arrived on a charter and I saw a woman who was on our flight bounce awkwardly from the middle of the trampoline towards the springs attaching the surface to the sides. As she came down her leg awkwardly jammed between the springs. I will never forget the sound of her tibia snapping like a twig, the sight of the fracture protruding through her skin and her agony in the aftermath. She was 2 hours into her vacation and it ended with a flight to Miami for emergency surgery.

Years later I had to research Dominican tort law due to an accident involving an American on vacation there. I was stunned at the amount of cases I found in the reporters involving Americans, mostly kids, suffering accidents on vacations. Drownings, falls down hotel elevator shafts, golf cart accidents, jet ski accidents, parasailing. Reading between the lines of the facts reported in these cases really poor caution by all parties to the incident.

 

[Doc Holliday]

To the rest of you, you would be speaking German if it wasn't for us, so please don't tell me what my rights are. I am free because of guns, and God willing, I will remain that way.

I've also used that line in the past but truth be told, it's actually very misleading & once again reeks typical american arrogance.

Josef Stalin & the Russians actually saved the world from Nazi dominance. We may all be speaking German if it weren't for 'Uncle Joe'.

 

[Mike Mercury]

To the fellows up North,
The Second Amendment came about because, 1) We had the balls to fight the Brits, and 2) We had the weapons to do it with. It was written so we could have the same weapons as the enemy, this has been bastardized by gun control.
EB, yes there is a MINORITY that wants us disarmed. That will never happen. EB I pick on you because you are a US citizen. To the rest of you, you would be speaking German if it wasn't for us, so please don't tell me what my rights are. I am free because of guns, and God willing, I will remain that way.

You fought the brits. You beat the germans. You must be 250 years old. chuckle chuckle.

 

[smuler]

reeks typical american arrogance

The soviets lost 8.7 million soldiers in WW2

Best Regards

Smuler

 

[hungry101]

The soviets lost 8.7 million soldiers in WW2

Best Regards

Smuler

The thing is that they killed about half of them themselves. That fucking murdering bastard Joe Stalin is no uncle of mine

 

[Merlot]

Wow,

I missed some of this before.

I am free because of guns,

Sorry, but this is absurd. Every petty dictator has had guns. Isis has guns, so does Al Qaeda, so did Hitler, Mussolini, Tojo, Hussein, etc. None of them have democracy or freedom though they had oodles of guns. You and I are free because of an enlightened philosophy that puts the rights of human beings ahead of everything else...at least in principle. Guns are only good for the principle they are used to back up. Guns themselves mean nothing without the principle behind them, and it's most unfortunate we need them to back up these principles.

Josef Stalin & the Russians actually saved the world from Nazi dominance. We may all be speaking German if it weren't for 'Uncle Joe'.

Wrong! Stalin lost the best experienced part of his army and most of his weapons during Operation Barbarossa from June 22, 1941 to December 5, 1941. It was so disastrous even Stalin thought his leadership was about to arrest and execute him. What saved Stalin and Russia was:

1. Nazi failure to prepare for huge winter blizzards.

2. The timely arrival of far eastern Russian reserves led by Zhukov against the paralyzed Germans.

3. A very long and bitter winter.

4. The most important...the reequipping of the Russian army significantly at first with a stream of American arms while the Russians got time to move their factories east, many times across the Urals.

Cheers,

Merlot

 

[Halloween Mike]

To the fellows up North,
The Second Amendment came about because, 1) We had the balls to fight the Brits, and 2) We had the weapons to do it with. It was written so we could have the same weapons as the enemy, this has been bastardized by gun control.
EB, yes there is a MINORITY that wants us disarmed. That will never happen. EB I pick on you because you are a US citizen. To the rest of you, you would be speaking German if it wasn't for us, so please don't tell me what my rights are. I am free because of guns, and God willing, I will remain that way.

Damn this kind of part is hard to reply in good manners. Do you realiz the BS you just put in that post dude? You talk first about a war that was in the 1700s... In a time where guns would shoot ONCE and take time to reload. News flash that war is over since a long time ago, why bringing the brits and that war into the subject? It was good for that time, but a constition can be written again im sure or changed.

And that last sentence... you would be speaking german if it wasn't for us... HAHAHA ridiculous. Who march in berlin first? The soviets... They suffered the worst in that war and i am SICK of seeig americans take all the credit for a war that they entered exremely late against an already weekened ennemy and only because the ennemy step on there turf... The downfall of the germans can be attributed for many things, war on 2 fronts being one of them, but stop with that BS that the americans alone won the war. Canada was fighting along the brits in that war way before.

And you are not free because of gun, you are "free" (if free to you again mean the independance war) because people way before your time stood up and decided something. Guns in the 20xx only lead to crime, murders and shit like that.

 

[Siocnarf]

Josef Stalin & the Russians actually saved the world from Nazi dominance. We may all be speaking German if it weren't for 'Uncle Joe'.

The funny part is, if the Nazis had won people today would say ''if it wasn't for gun we would all be speaking English now!''

Now the army has nuclear submarines and atomic bombs, which you are not allowed to own even if you can afford them. How are personal rifles going to protect the people from the government? That historical argument is ridiculous.

That being said I am not totally against gun. But I would expect that the age requirements to use one would be as serious as for driving a car of buying a beer. How can you have a society where you can shoot an SMG at 9, drive a car at 16, be a porn star at 18, buy a drink at 21 and sell sex never unless there is a camera running? Isn't there something wrong with these priorities?

 

[hungry101]

Damn this kind of part is hard to reply in good manners. Do you realiz the BS you just put in that post dude? You talk first about a war that was in the 1700s... In a time where guns would shoot ONCE and take time to reload. News flash that war is over since a long time ago, why bringing the brits and that war into the subject? It was good for that time, but a constition can be written again im sure or changed.

And that last sentence... you would be speaking german if it wasn't for us... HAHAHA ridiculous. Who march in berlin first? The soviets... They suffered the worst in that war and i am SICK of seeig americans take all the credit for a war that they entered exremely late against an already weekened ennemy and only because the ennemy step on there turf... The downfall of the germans can be attributed for many things, war on 2 fronts being one of them, but stop with that BS that the americans alone won the war. Canada was fighting along the brits in that war way before.

.

According to Atkinson The Guns of Last Light for every Tommy there were ~20 Americans in the lines on the Western front by the wars end (I think I have those numbers correct). The Brits were bled white.

It is amazing that you think so much about Joseph Stalin. This is quite troubling. I think Uncle Joe takes second only to Chairmen Mao in murder. Remember he and his buddy Hitler signed the Molotov-Ribbentrop treaty in WWII. Uncle Joe attacked Poland from the east while the Poles were fighting the Germans on the Western Front. The precursors of the KGB rounded up the Polish officer corp and murdered them by the thousands in the forest of Katyn and blamed it on the Germans. Uncle Joe sent a large segment of the population of Eastern Poland to the Gulags to be worked to death. Stalin sent Hitler letters of congratulations for their early victories! Ironically, the only thing that saved those Poles in the gulags was operation Barbarosa. Uncle Joe formed Polish divisions to fight the Germans. Meanwhile, Uncle Joe purged most of his officers that understood tank warfare because he feared they would double cross him. Early on, no Russian general would mass tanks. Fighting like the Germans was a sign of your loyalty to the Germans. You were likely to be purged. The book "No Greater Ally" talks about how the Russians during their great Soviet counter offensive stalled outside of Warsaw. They had made a deal with the Polish underground for the Poles to start an uprising when they were on the outskirts of Warsaw. The double cross was that the Soviets waited until the underground was defeated and then they advanced. The Soviets also considered all the people that were killed in the satellite states between Russia and Germany as Soviet casualties...even if the Soviets inflicted the casualties! Lastly, Mike when you ask the rhetorical question of who conquered Berlin? Stalin had the Soviets needlessly attack Berlin in several directions so that no General could claim to be the hero of Berlin. This caused several needless civilian casualties and massive friendly fire casualties but it did serve it's purpose...one of the two greatest murdering bastards in the history of the world would not have to contend with a single hero of the battle of Berlin as a political rival in the aftermath.

Has the US ever acted like this? Oh wait a minute, The CIA poured water on a terrorist...meanwhile the terrorists saw the heads off of Americans on TV and this is winced at...they don't know any better. And this is just a custom that Americans are too arrogant to try to understand.

What do I believe? I believe that what George Mason said still rings true: To disarm the people [is] the best and most effective way to enslave them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_Communist_regimes

But back to the title of the thread...what the fuck is a 9 year old doing shooting a machine gun?