Guy fucked around & found out

[Fradi]

It most definitely is.

Consent is conditional on payment.

If you know she would not engage in sex if there was no payment, I'm not sure how you can ignore that no consent exists where payment is not made.

It is NOT a one night between consenting adults

Sexual assault yes, however there is a huge difference between not being payed and being violently attacked and raped.
Losing out on $$$ is definitely not equivalent to being beaten and raped against your will.
I don’t know how it feels and I am not a lawyer either I can agree with it being a form of sexual assault as the term of agreement has been withdrawn but let’s not compare it to a violent rape as that would be both ridiculous and making light of victims of violent rape who will be traumatized for life.
It definitely is a shity thing to do and the guy who did it deserves what ever he gets.

 

[Anna Bijou]

Sexual assault yes, however there is a huge difference between not being payed and being violently attacked and raped.
Losing out on $$$ is definitely not equivalent to being beaten and raped against your will.
I don’t know how it feels and I am not a lawyer either I can agree with it being a form of sexual assault as the term of agreement has been withdrawn but let’s not compare it to a violent rape as that would be both ridiculous and making light of victims of violent rape who will be traumatized for life.

I don't think anyone said it's a brutal rape. Where did anyone say it was they equivalent to being beaten and robbed? And is seems to be the only scenario some men think of when they think of rape and sexual assault. That's not the case.


I'd like to point out that my body is still my body and I get to choose what happens to it. It's not a matter of thinking well, you would have done it for money so it's only about money. It's a violation and more goes into it in terms of psychological repercussions. I went through similar cycles of embarrassment, sadness, guilt, and rage. I think we can agree I wouldn't feel this way about a few hundred dollars being stolen.

I get that it might be hard to understand how it's experienced by us but it's not just theft. It's not shop lifting, it's my body and the person is very aware that I would not be consenting if they were upfront about paying. I never said it was a violent attack but FYI the majority of sexual assaults, and even rapes, are not violent and brutal.

---

---

WHAT IS VITIATED CONSENT?

Section 265(3) of the Criminal Code includes circumstances where consent is vitiated or revoked, including in situations involving fraud and deceit. As a result, even if the person consented at the time, you can still be charged with sexual assault if they were enticed to consent by fraud or misrepresentation.

This provision is rooted in the idea that people have a right to know what they’re signing up for. Although all sexual activity may carry some risk, if there are additional risks, the complainant should have the information to make an informed decision.

 

[Fradi]

I don't think anyone said it's a brutal rape. Where did anyone say it was they equivalent to being beaten and robbed? And is seems to be the only scenario some men think of when they think of rape and sexual assault. That's not the case.

Sexual assault.

I'd like to point out that my body is still my body and I get to choose what happens to it. It's not a matter of thinking well, you would have done it for money so it's only about money. It's a violation and more goes into it in terms of psychological repercussions. I went through similar cycles of embarrassment, sadness, guilt, and rage. I think we can agree I wouldn't feel this way about a few hundred dollars being stolen.

I get that it might be hard to understand how it's experienced by us but it's not just theft. It's not shop lifting, it's my body and the person is very aware that I would not be consenting if they were upfront about paying. I never said it was a violent attack but FYI the majority of sexual assaults, and even rapes, are not violent and brutal.

Anna,

It must also be obvious to you that all the responses were comparing it to a violent sexual assault ( so was I ) and there is a huge difference.
I am not trying to make light of it not being a sexual assault and only you and other SP know how it feels.
When men think of sexual assault ( rape) it is almost always the violent type.

 

[Anna Bijou]

Anna,

It must also be obvious to you that all the responses were comparing it to a violent sexual assault ( so was I ) and there is a huge difference.
I am not trying to make light of it not being a sexual assault and only you and other SP know how it feels.
When men think of sexual assault ( rape) it is almost always the violent type.

I know, I realize that. But that's the least common type of sexual assault/rape. So I think it's important to detach from that idea. It's a spectrum and not only the most extreme and violent assaults are important.

In fact, a lot of the "non brutal" rapes are committed by people already known and I'd wager many of them don't even think they're committing any crime because they think rapes can only be brutal and violent when that is simply not the case. Makes it a dangerous misconception.

Everyone should know marital rape is a thing. Does everyone think marital rape is always brutally violent? No. But it doesn't make it any less serious.

Men need to do the work to inform themselves then. That's an outdated view and if anyone here is raising kids, they're doing them a great disservice by not making sure to understand this while teaching their kids about sexual violence. True, they learn in school but they still pick up whatever parents say.

Consent. It's about consent.

---

---

The term “sexual crime” is an umbrella categorization that governs many types of sexually related charges that involve violence and aggression. Sexual assault is a specific type of offence, and it can be defined as any form of sexual contact imposed on a person without their consent or free will.

The term “rape” is not used in the Canadian Criminal Code to lose the moral stigma attached to it and highlight the violent nature of the crime. The change in terminology to Sexual Assault also provides for more specific charges to be filed depending on the facts and circumstances (if a weapon was used, threats, etc.)


Types of Sexual Assault Charges

Sexual Assault is any assault of a sexual nature that violates the victim. It involves a sexual act that takes place without the consent of the victim. Depending on the nature of the sexual assault and aggravating factors, the charge includes:

1.Common Sexual Assault
2.Sexual Assault Causing Bodily Harm
3.Aggravated Sexual Assault

 

[Wearethenight]

I want to highlight the importance of treating an asp with respect and touching on Anna”s there are very real consequences if a client refuses both legally and criminally.

Keep in mind I am an immigrant, a few years ago I worked for an out call agency, served the client and low and behold he refused to pay me. I took matters into my own hands and English and French are not my first language. I called 911 and told the operator I am a sex worker and I was not paid for my services, Needless to say the police showed up 7 minutes and I explained what a happened. They walked him straight to an atm and made him pay my rate, or face charges of theft under 5000.

I got paid and that what matters, but I implore all service providers that even if a client refuses to pay let them know you will call the police. The police made sure I was paid and I did not give any cares for the agency at the the time or their opinion, I took the risk and I will do it again if a client refuses to pay it is simply assault and keep in mind if you do not pay you will be charged.

 

[Anna Bijou]

I want to highlight the importance of treating an asp with respect and touching on Anna”s there are very real consequences if a client refuses both legally and criminally.

Keep in mind I am an immigrant, a few years ago I worked for an out call agency, served the client and low and behold he refused to pay me. I took matters into my own hands and English and French are not my first language. I called 911 and told the operator I am a sex worker and I was not paid for my services, Needless to say the police showed up 7 minutes and I explained what a happened. They walked him straight to an atm and made him pay my rate, or face charges of theft under 5000.

I got paid and that what matters, but I implore all service providers that even if a client refuses to pay let them know you will call the police. The police made sure I was paid and I did not give any cares for the agency at the the time or their opinion, I took the risk and I will do it again if a client refuses to pay it is simply assault and keep in mind if you do not pay you will be charged.

I'm really glad your situation was resolved.

I'm curious. Are you in Montreal?

The issue is the person could not even have the money so while they can charge him in theory, many worry about outing themselves in the process. Or if it's an incall, drawing attention to themselves by having the police show up. It just makes the risks greater than the payback. Outcall is better (if not worried about outing yourself). I'm surprised he let it go that far.

 

[Obvio-0bvio]

There are different levels of severity of sexual assault. From what I understand, that's how the criminal code in Canada is created. Rape doesn't exist as a charge. It's all sexual assault, and the severity determines the specific charge.

I'd do a bit more reading about it because it isn't a clear cut question of rape or no rape. It's about consent. I don't think it's your place to tell me what it is or "unquestionably" isn't. It's sexual assault & I don't see how anyone would find that disrespectful.

Respectfully speaking. If both parties consented to a monetary exchange for sexual activities, how can it be categorized as sexual assault? Let me understand correctly, if the client compensates the service provider it's not considered sexual assault, but if the client refuse to pay, it is considered sexual assault? Did the client coerce the service provider into doing something against her will? Was the service provider forced by the client? The sole discrepancy seems to be that the client failed to fulfill their promise. The subject at hand is quite sensitive and poses a challenge to elucidate upon. One thing I am certain of is that it cannot be considered sexual assault as an agreement has been made between both parties regarding payment in exchange for sex. Just to let you know, I hold no regard for clients who fail to compensate service providers. It is appropriate that they are exposed and penalized for committing theft by being sent to prison.Although it may feel similar to rape, it is not the same thing. I kindly request you to refrain from passing any judgments on my point of view.

 

[Julia Sky]

Respectfully speaking. If both parties consented to a monetary exchange for sexual activities, how can it be categorized as sexual assault? Let me understand correctly, if the client compensates the service provider it's not considered sexual assault, but if the client refuse to pay, it is considered sexual assault? Did the client coerce the service provider into doing something against her will? Was the service provider forced by the client? The sole discrepancy seems to be that the client failed to fulfill their promise. The subject at hand is quite sensitive and poses a challenge to elucidate upon. One thing I am certain of is that it cannot be considered sexual assault as an agreement has been made between both parties regarding payment in exchange for sex. Just to let you know, I hold no regard for clients who fail to compensate service providers. It is appropriate that they are exposed and penalized for committing theft by being sent to prison.Although it may feel similar to rape, it is not the same thing. I kindly request you to refrain from passing any judgments on my point of view.

If one party doesn't respect the agreed upon condition for consent, then it becomes sexual assault. So yes, exactly : if the client refuses to pay, it is considered sexual assault. The client shouldn't coerce the service provider by lying about meeting her conditions for consent, the same way you can't remove a condom during sex and pretend it wasn't sexual assault. Consent often is dependent on using protection amongst other things. The "promise" you're talking about was a condition for consent. I have no idea how else to explain it to you as we keep repeating the same simple concept over and over again.

Are you really saying "One thing I am certain of is that it cannot be considered sexual assault as an agreement has been made between both parties but one person did not respect the agreement" ??? And "Although you may feel like you've been sexually assaulted, I actually live inside your mind and body and I promise you did not"? Are you okay, sir?

I kindly request you refrain from requesting women shut up about things they've been through at the hands of abusive men. We may come from Venus but clearly you come from Auda City.

I'm side-eyeing every person who seems to feel vicariously attacked by us calling this assault, lol.

 

[Numerati]

Well put it this way Anna wouldn't go on all fours for this guy for free. Would she date/have coffee with him? If he made conversation with her at the produce isle at the supermarket will she get all giddy and want to jump his bones? Most likely not. But she will do so for a price which he "agreed" to pay but didn't follow thru. Definitely not the honorable thing to do.

 

[Anna Bijou]

Respectfully speaking. If both parties consented to a monetary exchange for sexual activities, how can it be categorized as sexual assault? Let me understand correctly, if the client compensates the service provider it's not considered sexual assault, but if the client refuse to pay, it is considered sexual assault? Did the client coerce the service provider into doing something against her will? Was the service provider forced by the client? The sole discrepancy seems to be that the client failed to fulfill their promise. The subject at hand is quite sensitive and poses a challenge to elucidate upon. One thing I am certain of is that it cannot be considered sexual assault as an agreement has been made between both parties regarding payment in exchange for sex. Just to let you know, I hold no regard for clients who fail to compensate service providers. It is appropriate that they are exposed and penalized for committing theft by being sent to prison.Although it may feel similar to rape, it is not the same thing. I kindly request you to refrain from passing any judgments on my point of view.

I've explained it.

I've provided a parallel example (stealthing) that is considered sexual assault &

I've communicated that many others who have experienced it also see it as non consensual sex (aka sexual assault) & process it similarly to other types of sexual violence.

I'm not sure what more I can add. I'm going to be completely honest and direct here. I've been disturbed all afternoon at the gaslighting. I can't even believe I've been told survivors of violent rapes would be offended and I'm making light of their assault. This, as an argument to challenge my experience. I mean, the audacity.

If an actual victim has this to say, they can say it but no one else should sit there and speak for them and project their own misunderstanding of sexual violence onto hypothetical survivors.

(If it's hard to understand, think of it like a burn. You can get a 2nd degree burn and someone else gets a 3rd degree burn. They both hurt. Everyone understands there's a difference in severity but calling both of those burns does not diminish anyone's pain. It's pretty simple.)

That's wild. Wild how many of you don't understand and instead of thinking 'wow I had no idea, maybe I should read up on it if I can't identify what is considered sexual assault and what is not'. Instead you're arguing that you know better and I'm wrong.

Clearly you're not alone. I can understand not having thought of it that way before, ok. But turning around and repeatedly mansplaining (the word applies perfectly here) sexual assault to women with his whole chest. That's quite something.

So according to you, being stealthed is not sexual assault either? Respectfully, I think you could benefit from reading up on the concept of consent.

Like, gentlemen. This is not alright. Do better.

 

[Fradi]

I know, I realize that. But that's the least common type of sexual assault/rape. So I think it's important to detach from that idea. It's a spectrum and not only the most extreme and violent assaults are important.

In fact, a lot of the "non brutal" rapes are committed by people already known and I'd wager many of them don't even think they're committing any crime because they think rapes can only be brutal and violent when that is simply not the case. Makes it a dangerous misconception.

Everyone should know marital rape is a thing. Does everyone think marital rape is always brutally violent? No. But it doesn't make it any less serious.

Men need to do the work to inform themselves then. That's an outdated view and if anyone here is raising kids, they're doing them a great disservice by not making sure to understand this while teaching their kids about sexual violence. True, they learn in school but they still pick up whatever parents say.

Consent. It's about consent.

---

---

The term “sexual crime” is an umbrella categorization that governs many types of sexually related charges that involve violence and aggression. Sexual assault is a specific type of offence, and it can be defined as any form of sexual contact imposed on a person without their consent or free will.

The term “rape” is not used in the Canadian Criminal Code to lose the moral stigma attached to it and highlight the violent nature of the crime. The change in terminology to Sexual Assault also provides for more specific charges to be filed depending on the facts and circumstances (if a weapon was used, threats, etc.)


Types of Sexual Assault Charges

Sexual Assault is any assault of a sexual nature that violates the victim. It involves a sexual act that takes place without the consent of the victim. Depending on the nature of the sexual assault and aggravating factors, the charge includes:

1.Common Sexual Assault
2.Sexual Assault Causing Bodily Harm
3.Aggravated Sexual Assault

I know, I realize that. But that's the least common type of sexual assault/rape. So I think it's important to detach from that idea. It's a spectrum and not only the most extreme and violent assaults are important.

In fact, a lot of the "non brutal" rapes are committed by people already known and I'd wager many of them don't even think they're committing any crime because they think rapes can only be brutal and violent when that is simply not the case. Makes it a dangerous misconception.

Everyone should know marital rape is a thing. Does everyone think marital rape is always brutally violent? No. But it doesn't make it any less serious.

Men need to do the work to inform themselves then. That's an outdated view and if anyone here is raising kids, they're doing them a great disservice by not making sure to understand this while teaching their kids about sexual violence. True, they learn in school but they still pick up whatever parents say.

Consent. It's about consent.

---

---

The term “sexual crime” is an umbrella categorization that governs many types of sexually related charges that involve violence and aggression. Sexual assault is a specific type of offence, and it can be defined as any form of sexual contact imposed on a person without their consent or free will.

The term “rape” is not used in the Canadian Criminal Code to lose the moral stigma attached to it and highlight the violent nature of the crime. The change in terminology to Sexual Assault also provides for more specific charges to be filed depending on the facts and circumstances (if a weapon was used, threats, etc.)


Types of Sexual Assault Charges

Sexual Assault is any assault of a sexual nature that violates the victim. It involves a sexual act that takes place without the consent of the victim. Depending on the nature of the sexual assault and aggravating factors, the charge includes:

1.Common Sexual Assault
2.Sexual Assault Causing Bodily Harm
3.Aggravated Sexual Assault

Anna,

I am not disagreeing with you and said it was a type of sexual assault.
It is definitely a type of sexual assault as the term of agreement was violated, and yes there are many marital and girlfriend sexual assaults also.
I have never condoned any kind of violence or miss treatment of any woman.
I think misguidedly most of us were comparing it to a violent sexual rape but yes there are many forms of assault also. An aggravated assault causing bodily harm carries a much heavier penalty than an assault that does not.
i don’t think there is one person here that condones not paying an SP for services provided.

 

[Obvio-0bvio]

If one party doesn't respect the agreed upon condition for consent, then it becomes sexual assault. So yes, exactly : if the client refuses to pay, it is considered sexual assault. The client shouldn't coerce the service provider by lying about meeting her conditions for consent, the same way you can't remove a condom during sex and pretend it wasn't sexual assault. Consent often is dependent on using protection amongst other things. The "promise" you're talking about was a condition for consent. I have no idea how else to explain it to you as we keep repeating the same simple concept over and over again.

Are you really saying "One thing I am certain of is that it cannot be considered sexual assault as an agreement has been made between both parties but one person did not respect the agreement" ??? And "Although you may feel like you've been sexually assaulted, I actually live inside your mind and body and I promise you did not"? Are you okay, sir?

I kindly request you refrain from requesting women shut up about things they've been through at the hands of abusive men. We may come from Venus but clearly you come from Auda City.

I'm side-eyeing every person who seems to feel vicariously attacked by us calling this assault, lol.

Julia, I mean no offense, but the term "sexual assault" carries significant weight. Genuine sexual assault survivors never consent to exchanging sex for money, but regrettably, they were not afforded the choice to trade sex for financial compensation. A sexual assault victim was deliberately subjected to non-consensual sexual contact or compelled or physically manipulated into engaging in sexual activity against their wishes. I understand and support your perspective, however, according to the law, it does not qualify as sexual violation. In my opinion, it would be appropriate to refer to it as either sexual assault or rape.
As a man of courtesy, I hold in high regard both women and those who offer services. Those individuals who refuse to compensate their service providers should be held accountable for committing sexual assault. I want to clarify that I support you and I am not opposed to you. However, it is regrettable that according to the law, the action cannot be categorized as sexual assault or rape.

 

[Numerati]

Now if we can hear his side of the story. Lol.

Wait. I (We) don't. Take that back. Would be too much of a shit slinging exchanges it that would happen. Anna's usual TL2R yapping is enough.

 

[Obvio-0bvio]

I've explained it.

I've provided a parallel example (stealthing) that is considered sexual assault &

I've communicated that many others who have experienced it also see it as non consensual sex (aka sexual assault) & process it similarly to other types of sexual violence.

I'm not sure what more I can add. I'm going to be completely honest and direct here. I've been disturbed all afternoon at the gaslighting. I can't even believe I've been told survivors of violent rapes would be offended and I'm making light of their assault. This, as an argument to challenge my experience. I mean, the audacity.

If an actual victim has this to say, they can say it but no one else should sit there and speak for them and project their own misunderstanding of sexual violence onto hypothetical survivors.

(If it's hard to understand, think of it like a burn. You can get a 2nd degree burn and someone else gets a 3rd degree burn. They both hurt. Everyone understands there's a difference in severity but calling both of those burns does not diminish anyone's pain. It's pretty simple.)

That's wild. Wild how many of you don't understand and instead of thinking 'wow I had no idea, maybe I should read up on it if I can't identify what is considered sexual assault and what is not'. Instead you're arguing that you know better and I'm wrong.

Clearly you're not alone. I can understand not having thought of it that way before, ok. But turning around and repeatedly mansplaining (the word applies perfectly here) sexual assault to women with his whole chest. That's quite something.

So according to you, being stealthed is not sexual assault either? Respectfully, I think you could benefit from reading up on the concept of consent.

Like, gentlemen. This is not alright. Do better.

Anna, I want to clarify, as I have with Julia, that I do not intend to be disrespectful, but the expression "sexual assault" holds great significance. Unfortunately, legitimate victims of sexual assault were not given the option to exchange sexual favors for monetary gain, although they would never willingly consent to such a transaction. Someone who has suffered from sexual assault has been intentionally subjected to sexual contact without their consent, or coerced or physically forced to engage in sexual activity against their will. While I appreciate and back your point of view, it falls outside the legal definition of sexual assault. To my thinking, it is fitting to label it as either sexual assault or rape.
As someone who values politeness, I greatly respect both women and service providers. Individuals who fail to remunerate their service providers must face consequences for committing a form of sexual misconduct. My intention is to communicate that my stance is one of support for you and that I am not in opposition to you. Although the law unfortunately does not classify the act as sexual assault or rape, it is unfortunate.

 

[Anna Bijou]

.
.​

I'm super confused about what exactly you're saying.

In my opinion, it would be appropriate to refer to it as either sexual assault or rape.

Those individuals who refuse to compensate their service providers should be held accountable for committing sexual assault.

It would be appropriate therefore you agree with us?

But then, what does this mean:

Genuine sexual assault survivors never consent to exchanging sex for money, but regrettably, they were not afforded the choice to trade sex for financial compensation.

This sounds completely fucked up but I'm not sure what exactly you're trying to say. You totally lost me.

So I actually have no idea what you're saying. It would be great if you could clarify?

A sexual assault victim was deliberately subjected to non-consensual sexual contact or compelled or physically manipulated into engaging in sexual activity against their wishes. I understand and support your perspective, however, according to the law, it does not qualify as sexual violation.

Are you shifting the goal post on us? You were speaking for survivors of violent sexual assaults but now it's about the law? That's not the argument you were making previously. However, that is neither here nor there because no one has argued that the law considers it sexual assault. We already know it does not. I addressed it already saying the law wasn't there yet.

But like I've already said, 3 years ago, neither was stealthing but now it is viewed as sexual assault. So whether or not the law considers it sexual assault or not can very well mean it's just (as usual) late catching up with the times. Just like marital rape was legal for a long time and still actually acceptable to some people. It has no bearing on the reality that most people who have experienced it are telling you it is sexual assault and they felt violated.

You're not expected to understand on a personal level because you have never been in that situation, nor will you ever be. What happens when that's the case is you listen to those who do have lived experience and you believe they know their own minds more than you. That's what support is. Not.. this, whatever this is.


And btw, you avoided answering the question: Is stealthing sexual assault?

 

[Anna Bijou]

.​

Ok now that I've read the reply addressed to me, I'm a little more clear on some things but your comments are still very ambiguous. Some of the points you've tried to make in both replies by using different wording appear to confirm some of my initial interpretation of the reply addressed to Julia. But it's still confusing.


And this. Well this is messed up:

Unfortunately, legitimate victims of sexual assault were not given the option to exchange sexual favors for monetary gain, although they would never willingly consent to such a transaction.

Genuine sexual assault survivors never consent to exchanging sex for money, but regrettably, they were not afforded the choice to trade sex for financial compensation.

What the actual eff.

I have no idea what your choice of words "genuine" and "legitimate" victims is supposed to imply? What does being "given the option to trade sex for financial compensation" or not even relevant comparison? Comparison to what? "Genuine" and "legitimate" victims? Huh? What?

Are you saying that "willingly consenting to such a transaction" makes it impossible to conceive that we could be "genuine" and "legitimate" victims? Like, what? Is that really what you're saying?

I'm sitting here ttinking I can't be reading this right. No one would actually say this openly...right? Right??

Then you're saying it should be labeled sexual assault but your comments contradict it at the same time. Please make it make sense.

 

[Cap'tain Fantastic]

Did the client coerce the service provider into doing something against her will?

Yes he did, since the initial agreement is sexual services are strictly provided based on the monetary exchange, refusing to pay her revokes her consent, as she, obviously NEVER would have sex with him in her real life.

 

[Julia Sky]

Julia, I mean no offense, but the term "sexual assault" carries significant weight. Genuine sexual assault survivors never consent to exchanging sex for money, but regrettably, they were not afforded the choice to trade sex for financial compensation. [...]
As a man of courtesy, I hold in high regard both women and those who offer services. [...] However, it is regrettable that according to the law, the action cannot be categorized as sexual assault or rape.

Boi, I mean no offense but I'm not an idiot. I've been sexually assaulted more than once, including with the use of violence, including as a toddler, including as a sex worker... I know what sexual assault is. I know it carries significant weight. And you're not going to gaslight victims into thinking they aren't victims. Full stop. You sound so guilty right now.

Sex workers who this happens to ARE genuine victims. The condition for consent happens to be money whereas for someone else it might be wearing protection, or not cheating, or being a certain age, or showing real test results, etc. Condition not met = sexual assault, no matter if the condition is payment or something else.

At this point just say you hate sex workers and think they should accept sexual violence because they chose to do this job. Such a gross thinking. Yes, we agreed to sex for money. So we should be getting money, otherwise consent is null. Void. Do some soul searching.

You've been disagreeing with us about our own experience this whole thread and now you wanna turn around and pretend like you agree and only the law doesn't - I see right through the gaslight and backpedaling. Try again (just kidding, dont). If you did agree with us you wouldn't try so hard to say we aren't "genuine victims".

"As a man of courtesy, I hold in high regard both women and those who offer services."

This reeks of good man energy. If you have to self-proclaim you're a man of courtesy I have doubts that you actually are. People who like and respect women "and those who offer services" (which happens to be overwhelmingly women as well) don't gaslight them about their own experiences and feelings and things they've been through, and they certainly don't ask them to shut up about those things.

Oh, and back to the subject of law... Hundreds of thousand of children get legally married to an adult in the states every year. For someone like you who bases their moral compass on the law, this says a lot. I wouldn't let a kid or a woman near you, at this point.

I may sound like a savage cunt in this reply (thanks, I know) but at least I'll never sound like a predator in disguise (not at all referring to you, just kidding, I am)

 

[Julia Sky]

Seriously this logic reads as follows :

"This girl agreed to sex with protection so me removing the condom mid-sex cannot be assault as genuine victims were not given the option to use protection"

Are you not ashamed of your logic, dude? Effectively outed yourself as a potentially dangerous and predatory client to most providers who read merb and who talk in group chats etc. Félicitations, bravo!

 

[Obvio-0bvio]

.
.​

I'm super confused about what exactly you're saying.





It would be appropriate therefore you agree with us?

But then, what does this mean:



This sounds completely fucked up but I'm not sure what exactly you're trying to say. You totally lost me.




Are you shifting the goal post on us? Now it's about the law? That's not the argument you were making previously. No one was claiming that the law currently recognizes it as sexual assault. I clearly mentioned the law isn't there yet.

So I actually have no idea what you're saying. It would be great if you could clarify?

Seriously this logic reads as follows :

"This girl agreed to sex with protection so me removing the condom mid-sex cannot be assault as genuine victims were not given the option to use protection"

Are you not ashamed of your logic, dude? Effectively outed yourself as a potentially dangerous and predatory client to most providers who read merb and who talk in group chats etc. Félicitations, bravo!

Boi, I mean no offense but I'm not an idiot. I've been sexually assaulted more than once, including with the use of violence, including as a toddler, including as a sex worker... I know what sexual assault is. I know it carries significant weight. And you're not going to gaslight victims into thinking they aren't victims. Full stop. You sound so guilty right now.

Sex workers who this happens to ARE genuine victims. The condition for consent happens to be money whereas for someone else it might be wearing protection, or not cheating, or being a certain age, or showing real test results, etc. Condition not met = sexual assault, no matter if the condition is payment or something else.

At this point just say you hate sex workers and think they should accept sexual violence because they chose to do this job. Such a gross thinking. Yes, we agreed to sex for money. So we should be getting money, otherwise consent is null. Void. Do some soul searching.

You've been disagreeing with us about our own experience this whole thread and now you wanna turn around and pretend like you agree and only the law doesn't - I see right through the gaslight and backpedaling. Try again (just kidding, dont). If you did agree with us you wouldn't try so hard to say we aren't "genuine victims".

"As a man of courtesy, I hold in high regard both women and those who offer services."

This reeks of good man energy. If you have to self-proclaim you're a man of courtesy I have doubts that you actually are. People who like and respect women "and those who offer services" (which happens to be overwhelmingly women as well) don't gaslight them about their own experiences and feelings and things they've been through, and they certainly don't ask them to shut up about those things.

Oh, and back to the subject of law... Hundreds of thousand of children get legally married to an adult in the states every year. For someone like you who bases their moral compass on the law, this says a lot. I wouldn't let a kid or a woman near you, at this point.

I may sound like a savage cunt in this reply (thanks, I know) but at least I'll never sound like a predator in disguise (not at all referring to you, just kidding, I am)

I've noticed that some of you seem to have a surplus of free time and I am exhausted from repeatedly clarifying myself. I regret to inform you that I cannot continue repeating and clarifying myself. However, please be assured that I am not opposed to you and I support you. I appreciate your viewpoint and hold no opposition to it. I hold high regards for you, your opinions, and perspectives, as a courteous individual. My intention is not to engage in any argument with you, therefore I sincerely apologize if my words were misinterpreted. I have conveyed my message and now I am progressing forward. It's alright if you fail to comprehend my perspective, as it's insignificant.