Possible curfew?
- Thread starter TigerWould
- Start date
Common Sen give it a break, you don’t have enough in the political threads.
Trump had fuck all to do with what is going on here in Quebec, how about you let Legault, Aruda, and the people of Quebec own this one.
You cant look at world numbers. China is reporting nothing. You need to look at provincial and federal numbers. Therefore, .02 is a proper assessment.
@Halloween Mike
I think it will strongly discourage any socialization after 8pm. Fines are quite hefty (ranging from $1000 - $6000). Dunno about you, but that makes me think twice about going out after 8pm unless necessary. There are no absolutes (ppl will find loopholes), but at least it will make it that much harder/annoying for them to do so and reduce the frequency of people doing this on a regular basis. For the ones having blatant house parties, LE should go hard on them and fine them the max amount, cuz they deserve it.
In terms of travel, you know about the new variant of COVID-19 from the UK. These are things we need to minimize from spreading throughout the world. I don't think the lockdown will be over in a month (like you said, and I'm okay with that). I *do* hope however that at least the curfew will be over by then.
I think it will strongly discourage any socialization after 8pm. Fines are quite hefty (ranging from $1000 - $6000). Dunno about you, but that makes me think twice about going out after 8pm unless necessary. There are no absolutes (ppl will find loopholes), but at least it will make it that much harder/annoying for them to do so and reduce the frequency of people doing this on a regular basis. For the ones having blatant house parties, LE should go hard on them and fine them the max amount, cuz they deserve it.
In terms of travel, you know about the new variant of COVID-19 from the UK. These are things we need to minimize from spreading throughout the world. I don't think the lockdown will be over in a month (like you said, and I'm okay with that). I *do* hope however that at least the curfew will be over by then.
The only reason I don’t agree with the curfew is that I don’t believe it will make any difference and that government should not get used to that kind of power. People will simply see who they want to see before 8 pm.
There will of course be some who will disregard it and will get caught, I don’t have too much sympathy for them.
I haven’t been out past eight since the last time I took my adult children out to dinner so it really does not make a difference to me.
Closing all non essential businesses and schools is probably the only logical steps to do, unless you want to take the final step with a lock down like they did in some parts of Europe and Australia where nobody was allowed out except for maybe a one time short visit to the pharmacy and grocery store and only for those that can prove that there is no possibility of having these things delivered.
It sucks big time but until the vaccines get us out of this shit there aren’t too many options left, we have tried relying on people’s good will and common sense and the results speak for themselves.
There will of course be some who will disregard it and will get caught, I don’t have too much sympathy for them.
I haven’t been out past eight since the last time I took my adult children out to dinner so it really does not make a difference to me.
Closing all non essential businesses and schools is probably the only logical steps to do, unless you want to take the final step with a lock down like they did in some parts of Europe and Australia where nobody was allowed out except for maybe a one time short visit to the pharmacy and grocery store and only for those that can prove that there is no possibility of having these things delivered.
It sucks big time but until the vaccines get us out of this shit there aren’t too many options left, we have tried relying on people’s good will and common sense and the results speak for themselves.
0.02 is accurate I agree. It’s just that he wrote 0.02%. In fact, 0.02% is 0.0002. Mortality is worse in Quebec. 8647 deaths / 226233 cases = 0.038 or 3.8%. It is twice the world’s ratio.
I am not a spring chicken and at the same age or probably older than Fradi, but I will tell you this. If I were 20-25 y.o. now no f-ng government rules would keep me home with blue balls and away from socializing with my peers. It is way too often people of age forget how you feel and think when you are young.
It wouldn't be anyone over 50. It would be anyone over 65. Anyone RETIRED and collecting a pension stay home. Anyone over 65 who is still working should have been given indefinite unemployment with the caveat of getting their position back when the "R rate" has fallen enough. It's a simple solution that should have been put in place long ago, and would have cost much less than the CERB. The same would apply to anyone who is high risk, which would entail those with preexisting respiratory issues. With regards to Retirement homes, which is where the overwhelming majority of deaths have occurred, it could have been prevented with minimum oversight. During the worst bits, it is well known Care workers were cross contaminating sites. The visitors may have contributed to, but not nearly as much. Good retirement homes, like the one my mom is in have a limitation to visitors, mandatory temperature test, face mask +shield wearing, closure of all activities, do not have staff working at multiple places, and limit CLSC, Physiotherapy, etc visit. Support should have been given to all these places for hiring of "temporary exclusive on site staff" from the beginning, which would likewise have limited blow back of many people losing their jobs. Everyone's freedom should not be restricted for the minority, unless TRUE Empirical evidence exist Covid causes long term debilitation for anyone (even asymptomatic) who contracts it. That evidence does not yet exist and never will. It really amazes me that in the backdrop of the vaunted vaccine capable of reducing symptoms that this farce is continuing.
The lock downs in capacity they have been used in Quebec have not been proven to work. To the best of my knowledge, since I don't follow this stuff to closely, no data indicates they have. As a result, I would say it's a forgone conclusion the curfew will not work either once schools and day cares reopen. Children only represent, I believe 10% of cases. However, I would double or triple that, since children have parents, and those parents come into contact with others. So even if everywhere was wearing mask, it will still spread. Covid will spread no matter in Winter months what short of a true lock down.
Tracking the number of cases and daily updates is useless fear mongering that should end. ICU Capacity, which is only stretched as thin as it is in some cases due to limitation put in place by our govr and Death should be reported only.
The curfew is not where this ends. It won't be long until more of our freedoms are taken away!
The lock downs in capacity they have been used in Quebec have not been proven to work. To the best of my knowledge, since I don't follow this stuff to closely, no data indicates they have. As a result, I would say it's a forgone conclusion the curfew will not work either once schools and day cares reopen. Children only represent, I believe 10% of cases. However, I would double or triple that, since children have parents, and those parents come into contact with others. So even if everywhere was wearing mask, it will still spread. Covid will spread no matter in Winter months what short of a true lock down.
Tracking the number of cases and daily updates is useless fear mongering that should end. ICU Capacity, which is only stretched as thin as it is in some cases due to limitation put in place by our govr and Death should be reported only.
The curfew is not where this ends. It won't be long until more of our freedoms are taken away!
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You are probably not older, but yes I get what you are saying and it is not easy to convince 20-25 year olds that they are not invincible, unfortunately I still remember searching for my car and not remembering whether it was me or my buddy that drove home and drag racing cars at 2am on Sherbrooke.
I still don’t like having blue balls and seeing my ATF is the only thing I am doing outside of all the recommendations.
It Is tough seeing my children and grandchildren only on FaceTime especially seeing as they only live a short drive away.
That's no excuse though. And btw... @Halloween Mike is no spring chicken himself. He may not be middle age yet, but he's getting there, lol.
Right now, the best strategy is go all out on vaccinations:
- Vaccinate people 24/7
- Any suitable site or mobile clinic for conducting vaccinations shld be used
- Anyone who’s qualified or can be trained to inject the vaccine shld be employed to do so at attractive, above-market wages
- All vaccines doses to be released & production ramped up
- Pass whatever laws needed to overcome the red tape
- Pay whatever training, overtime cost needed
- Whoever is not vaccinated by April or May will not be allowed to leave their houses (impossible & illegal to enforce but that’ll panic people into action
)
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in Florida they reachout with Publix pharmacies to contribute the the effort. New York will go 24/7 in 5 vaccination sites. i dont think they have enough doses to answer the demand. That will of course change when the single dose Johnson&Johnson vaccine will be available in february, knowing that J&J is obviously not waiting for government « approval » to manufacture hundred of thousands of doses every day since november. when this precious stock will be distributed, that’s the moment we will have a real mass vaccination program for all.
I prepared this post in a notepad because i had lots of catching up so excuse the lack of actual quoting...
Fradi : Thats not what i said, i said peoples who take care of elders in CHSLD, the very very old peoples who need cares for everything including baths and changing diapers, the peoples taking care of them should wear the hazmat suit or proper gaz mask. I know it LOOK horrifying at first glance but it would fully protect those elders. You do not catch covid going grocery shopping by the way, mask or not, been proven between March and July 2020. But if older folks want to go do their groceries, they can always wear that special quality mask made specifically for that. Its not forever anyway... right? And flu do not completely go away in the summer either, i had my worst case of flu in my like in the middle of summer a few years ago.
Sene5hos : Everyone is allow mistakes and trials and errors at the beginning of a new thing, but not 10 months on. What they doing now is unnaceptable.
Charmer : The variants will make it anyway, it couldn't be "discovered" soon enough. We will probably make our own variants too. Viruses like that mutate, its normal. As for socializing well you can always arrive early and leave very late. I checked outside for "knowledge" and the first few days police were passing with lights on a lot between 8 and 11, but in the night, gone. And after the first 2-3 days they refuced their presence too. I wouldn't be surprise peoples who wan to socialize will do it anyway and will do sleepovers or whatever. I seen a few peoples mention these tickets are infringing rights and could have a good chance of fighting them in court. Hopefully its true.
Marky : The 0.02% was CIDC numbers (USA)
Oobe : Better protection for elders especially in CHSLD would be a start. As Almostmidaged mentioned, they could had made special programs for older folks and peoples at risk. The reality as of now is that the Quebec health system is such in a bad shape they fear it will be teared down, but in reality if it was in better shape, we could had protected the peoples who had legit risk of dying from it and put MINIMAL restrictions for the rest and right now LOTS of peoples would been naturally immunized. Even if it last just 6 months, thats still 6 months with no worries for that person.
Charmer 2 : I am in my thirties so yeah no "spring chicken" but i am young at heart and had a pretty rough life socially from 18 to 24 or so. I started "living" more in my mid 20s so yeah even in my thirties im still super down to have a spring break "chicken" party LOL. Not now... but in general i mean
Donbush : You i will quote ... "Whoever is not vaccinated by April or May will not be allowed to leave their houses (impossible & illegal to enforce but that’ll panic people into action"
THAT is LUDACRISS and its exactly what we are fighting for NOT to happen. Vaccine shall remain by choice, we are against "covid passports" and other liberty infringing stuff like that but you go even further with the litteral "stay home". Man i wouldn't want you anywhere near a position of power...
Personally i do not want the vaccine, im still fairly young and trust my body if by some ununfortunate event i get it, i know ill fight it naturally and win. And if for some reason i die, then so be it, my time had come, what can i say. But i do not trust their rushed experimental vaccine. Not because i fear there is a microship or crap like that, simply because it was developed very fast and there is already sign of side effects, i prefer to wait a couple years so if there is no long term worst effect and by then it may completely be gone anyway (covid).
Fradi : Thats not what i said, i said peoples who take care of elders in CHSLD, the very very old peoples who need cares for everything including baths and changing diapers, the peoples taking care of them should wear the hazmat suit or proper gaz mask. I know it LOOK horrifying at first glance but it would fully protect those elders. You do not catch covid going grocery shopping by the way, mask or not, been proven between March and July 2020. But if older folks want to go do their groceries, they can always wear that special quality mask made specifically for that. Its not forever anyway... right? And flu do not completely go away in the summer either, i had my worst case of flu in my like in the middle of summer a few years ago.
Sene5hos : Everyone is allow mistakes and trials and errors at the beginning of a new thing, but not 10 months on. What they doing now is unnaceptable.
Charmer : The variants will make it anyway, it couldn't be "discovered" soon enough. We will probably make our own variants too. Viruses like that mutate, its normal. As for socializing well you can always arrive early and leave very late. I checked outside for "knowledge" and the first few days police were passing with lights on a lot between 8 and 11, but in the night, gone. And after the first 2-3 days they refuced their presence too. I wouldn't be surprise peoples who wan to socialize will do it anyway and will do sleepovers or whatever. I seen a few peoples mention these tickets are infringing rights and could have a good chance of fighting them in court. Hopefully its true.
Marky : The 0.02% was CIDC numbers (USA)
Oobe : Better protection for elders especially in CHSLD would be a start. As Almostmidaged mentioned, they could had made special programs for older folks and peoples at risk. The reality as of now is that the Quebec health system is such in a bad shape they fear it will be teared down, but in reality if it was in better shape, we could had protected the peoples who had legit risk of dying from it and put MINIMAL restrictions for the rest and right now LOTS of peoples would been naturally immunized. Even if it last just 6 months, thats still 6 months with no worries for that person.
Charmer 2 : I am in my thirties so yeah no "spring chicken" but i am young at heart and had a pretty rough life socially from 18 to 24 or so. I started "living" more in my mid 20s so yeah even in my thirties im still super down to have a spring break "chicken" party LOL. Not now... but in general i mean
Donbush : You i will quote ... "Whoever is not vaccinated by April or May will not be allowed to leave their houses (impossible & illegal to enforce but that’ll panic people into action"
THAT is LUDACRISS and its exactly what we are fighting for NOT to happen. Vaccine shall remain by choice, we are against "covid passports" and other liberty infringing stuff like that but you go even further with the litteral "stay home". Man i wouldn't want you anywhere near a position of power...
Personally i do not want the vaccine, im still fairly young and trust my body if by some ununfortunate event i get it, i know ill fight it naturally and win. And if for some reason i die, then so be it, my time had come, what can i say. But i do not trust their rushed experimental vaccine. Not because i fear there is a microship or crap like that, simply because it was developed very fast and there is already sign of side effects, i prefer to wait a couple years so if there is no long term worst effect and by then it may completely be gone anyway (covid).
HM,
Your are entitled to your opinion, obviously I don’t share any of it.
Nothing has been proven that grocery shopping does not spread disease, quite the contrary if that was the case then we wouldn’t have a mask mandate and cashiers would not be behind a plexiglass barrier.
If anything is true, even after a year of this, the best scientists are issuing conflicting views on just about everything.
What cannot be disputed is the fact that the whole world is affected and all the people that have died.
Currently Quebec hospitals are close to being over run and there is a lack of nurses and doctors to give the required care not only to covid patients but ones with other illnesses as well.These are facts.
I am not in favour of this curfew simply because I think it is a half assed useless measure.
People will simply see whoever they want to see between 8pm and 5 am, and if you are going to open schools then it just makes it even more laughable.
This just makes it a little more uncomfortable for those wanting to party at night, which is a half assed measure typical of governments all over the world wanting to look as if they are doing something while still trying to not piss of most because they will eventually need their votes.
Your are entitled to your opinion, obviously I don’t share any of it.
Nothing has been proven that grocery shopping does not spread disease, quite the contrary if that was the case then we wouldn’t have a mask mandate and cashiers would not be behind a plexiglass barrier.
If anything is true, even after a year of this, the best scientists are issuing conflicting views on just about everything.
What cannot be disputed is the fact that the whole world is affected and all the people that have died.
Currently Quebec hospitals are close to being over run and there is a lack of nurses and doctors to give the required care not only to covid patients but ones with other illnesses as well.These are facts.
I am not in favour of this curfew simply because I think it is a half assed useless measure.
People will simply see whoever they want to see between 8pm and 5 am, and if you are going to open schools then it just makes it even more laughable.
This just makes it a little more uncomfortable for those wanting to party at night, which is a half assed measure typical of governments all over the world wanting to look as if they are doing something while still trying to not piss of most because they will eventually need their votes.
Well as of January 9, the number of declared cases from groceries and other similar shops are around 1700. VERY SMALL fraction. Like i said before cloathed mask are a useless piece of junk. Only place they actually make sense is in the subway at peak hours because everybody is super close to each other. The plexiglass im not against as cashiers to have to speak to the clients and they see hundreds of peoples pass everyday BUT its even more dumb to mask them because they being a glass...
Hospitals are overun because our health system been crap for years. They almost got overrun a few years ago in january as well because of flu... so that should tell. The reality is the governements and medias threat covid like its Goldberg, when its more like Gillbert actually. Not sure if you will get my wrestling reference but googles Goldberg vs Gillbert and you will understand
HM,
Again I hate to dispute your scientific knowledge against those of professionals but it kind of goes along the lines of you commenting on the lives of SP.
You may have fucked a few but you know little about each ones real life.
I can’t say I am a fan of the type of wrestling you are referring to as it is a planned show and entertainment for the North American masses, but yes I am aware who Goldberg is.
I once sat next to Hulk Hogan in the Detroit airport and my children asked me if I talked to him or asked him for his autograph.
my response was why on earth would I do that.
I do watch real wrestling sometimes especially during the olympics, both Greco Roman and Freestyle, kind of boring but I am a sports junky.
Again I hate to dispute your scientific knowledge against those of professionals but it kind of goes along the lines of you commenting on the lives of SP.
You may have fucked a few but you know little about each ones real life.
I can’t say I am a fan of the type of wrestling you are referring to as it is a planned show and entertainment for the North American masses, but yes I am aware who Goldberg is.
I once sat next to Hulk Hogan in the Detroit airport and my children asked me if I talked to him or asked him for his autograph.
my response was why on earth would I do that.
I do watch real wrestling sometimes especially during the olympics, both Greco Roman and Freestyle, kind of boring but I am a sports junky.
Just to get a reference
In 2019 Cancer killed 600,000 people in the US
At the one year anniversary of Covid the US will probably be pretty close to that, over 500,000 probably less than 600,000. This despite lockdowns, some people wearing masks and one of the best health care systems in the world.
Out of curiosity, is Cancer a Goldberg or a Gillbert ?
The issue with "scientific" knowledge is a lot of professional can't or won't speak in fear to loose their jobs. The ones who does are down talked by the medias and governements or ignored.
Pro Wrestling got to be seen as entertainement, kinda like theatre but with contacts. It may be staged but its still very physical and injuries are happening. Its the kind of show you follow like following a tv show but live. Personally despite Hulk's views and comments a few years ago and knowing he is partly responsible for the downfall of WCW and TNA due to creative control i would still had been happy to see him live. I mean the guy is a living legend of the wrestling business. If i had been you i would had try (but if turn down i would had respect his wish and not be an ass) to get a pic with him or something.
Galantca, the issue is out of those deaths A LOT are actually "death WITH Covid" and not "death FROM Covid". Look at what happened here in CHSLDs, lots of very old peoples who were already close to death. The flu despite vaccines etc kills tons of peoples in CHSLD every year. Its not to minimize their death, i mean its always sad to see someone die, no matter the age, they were certainly someones parents or grand parents etc but deaths of peoples over 80 are surely not a good indicator on how deadly a virus is. I would need to have a look at the stats of how many peoples under 60 died from it, then rule out peoples who had other problems, because yes they will count someone who had stage 4 cancer but had also covid and died as a covid death...
But if you follow this, Données COVID-19 par âge et sexe au Québec | INSPQ you will see that there was a HUGE ... 27 deaths of peoples between 50 and 59 due to covid, and again i dunno if they had risk factors or other problems. 40-49 are a big 6 deaths...
Im sorry but those numbers are not enough to justify paralizing an economy, putting businesses on bankrupcy, causing mental distress in both kids and adults, and removing our aquired rights to liberty.
Again those 27 and 6 peoples were humans, its sad they died, but peoples die all the time from various things. If the virus was extremely deadly, and dropped everybody regardless of age at a 25% rate or such, i would agree on full lockdown. But right now we have been paralized for 10 months for 33 deaths under 60. I say it from the start, protect the elders better, but let the rest live roughly normal. Obviously im not against SOME measures, but the ones thatt make sense like no big events, employees behind glasses, travel restrictions. Not this whole curfew, mask everywhere, not being able to see friends etc etc
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