The Trump Crime Family

[sambuca]

@Valcazar - I'm just raising the question why couldn't Mueller have issued his report in August/Sept? Has there been new ground broken by the investigation since October. I certainly think the report being issued before the midterms would have impacted the results to some degree. I don't think being quiet for a month or so helped Trump and the Republicans all that much.

The Trumps lied about their business dealings in Russia. So what? Obama and his Administration deliberately lied about the cause of the Benghazi attack in the weeks leading up to the 2012 election. That's what politicians do.

 

[sambuca]

...............................This thing is far from over.

This thing is over. I enjoy political theater as much as anyone else, but the third act has ended even if the actors refuse to get off the stage. I suppose you can still enjoy the little, funny clips that they run during the credits at the end of the film. I'm heading to the parking lot.

 

[Bred Sob]

Yes, I understood that. It is part (but not all) of the theory Barr put in his letter - that it is impossible to obstruct justice if you didn't get charged with the underlying crime. This is, of course, ridiculous on its face as a legal theory. Besides the obvious fact that if I successfully obstruct you, I don't get charged, which according to this theory means I didn't obstruct; it also means that if you are investigating a murder, and I obstruct because looking at me as a suspect is going to reveal I am embezzling from my company, I didn't obstruct. The entire idea is basically nonsense.

Oh, now I see what happened. Trump succeeded in obstructing justice and caused Mueller to abort the investigation when he was still warming up. Which convincingly proves that Mueller and Barr were in cahoots with Trump and Putin from the start.

Thank you so much for opening my eyes!

 

[Valcazar]

@Valcazar - I'm just raising the question why couldn't Mueller have issued his report in August/Sept? Has there been new ground broken by the investigation since October. I certainly think the report being issued before the midterms would have impacted the results to some degree. I don't think being quiet for a month or so helped Trump and the Republicans all that much.

Cohen plea, Manafort trial, Stone arrest are all post-midterms. And we don't know what was actually going on in terms of investigating at that point. For all we know, it was during that portion where he decided there was no evidence of criminal coordination and it should be ruled out. Maybe if he stopped before he would have had to do what he did with Obstruction and write that while the investigation doesn't prove a crime, it also doesn't exonerate the president.

We honestly don't know, and won't until we see the report. (Assuming the report is so long because it explains what he investigated and why.)

The Trumps lied about their business dealings in Russia. So what? Obama and his Administration deliberately lied about the cause of the Benghazi attack in the weeks leading up to the 2012 election. That's what politicians do.

You're immediate default to fox news talking points is always fascinating. I get it, you think politicians lying isn't an issue. But even if you think that, I am under the impression you think corruption, taking bribes, being a foreign agent, and the like *is* an issue. That Trump lied about his business dealings in Russia isn't illegal. It also wasn't the point of the investigation.

I am trying to parse your watergate comment. Did you mean Watergate is a good example of actual presidential obstruction of justice?

 

[sambuca]

Did you mean Watergate is a good example of actual presidential obstruction of justice?

Yes, it was very deliberate and broad-reaching.

 

[sambuca]

You're immediate default to fox news talking points is always fascinating. I get it, you think politicians lying isn't an issue.................... That Trump lied about his business dealings in Russia isn't illegal. It also wasn't the point of the investigation.

We disagree in almost all our political opinions, why not disagree about facts.

Benghazi was certainly overdone by Fox News and Republican Congressmen. That's kind of the point. Selective outrage.

Denying you're currently looking to do business in Russia or even denying you took a meeting with a Russian lawyer are not big deals in my opinion. Smart? Perhaps not. With the Press inciting and liberals going nuts on this Russia thing on social media almost from the onset of the election results, I don't know if I blame the Trumps. Again, selective outrage.

With politicians, I try to look at a lie in isolation and determine how does that hurt me and the American public. In the words of a great statesperson, "What difference does it make?"

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

Trump is busing migrants to sanctuary cities, odd that they are all Democrat cities, says they can take care of them.

 

[Valcazar]

^^^ Is he though? He talked about it, but as is often the case with Trump, there doesn't appear to be any actual plan, just a lot of big talk. The idea is kind of silly to begin with, sanctuary cities are where lots of people end up, so paying to send them there and saving them some money doesn't actually come off like a horrible threat. But it would depend on how they did it. If they piled up thousands at a time and just dumped them in the middle of the street without any forewarning, that would be a problem. If it is just releasing people after the 20 day holding period and sending them to the nearest sanctuary city, no one would even really notice except the immigrants, who would get free transportation.

It's hard to think that this is anything more than Trump trying to troll people and there is no real plan. If a real plan shows up, it can be debated then.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

^^^^ Updates today. Guess it was planned before and turned down but now Trump wants a go at it again.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...6a7eb36cb60_story.html?utm_term=.b4cd3ccbeee0

 

[jalimon]

^^^^ Updates today. Guess it was planned before and turned down but now Trump wants a go at it again.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...6a7eb36cb60_story.html?utm_term=.b4cd3ccbeee0

Nothing is planned with Trump. He goes with the flow with the end justify the means. That's it. Ho that and destroying all of Obama's achievement.

Today I read that he claims to have a 2.9 handicap at golf. Haha that made me laugh so much. It's well known that he is quite good but still cheats every single game. He is Lance Amstrong... Talented yes but no matter cheats is way to the top.

Cheers,

 

[Fradi]

He is Lance Amstrong... Talented yes but no matter cheats is way to the top.

Cheers,

Fake news, neither Lance nor Trump ever cheated in anything.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

Ho that and destroying all of Obama's achievement.,

Can you list 4 of the Obama achievements Trump is trying to destroy? You can leave out Obamacare as it is not an achievement, this has been gone over recently.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

Funny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=74&v=U8XJPwmX3jo

 

[Valcazar]

Can you list 4 of the Obama achievements Trump is trying to destroy? You can leave out Obamacare as it is not an achievement, this has been gone over recently.

Well, you've already given the game away by saying things you don't consider achievements don't count. I will therefore include Obamacare anyway.

1) Obamacare.
2) The Consumer Financial Protection Bureau
3) The Iran Deal
4) Allowing people who are transgender to serve in the military
5) The Paris Accord
6) DACA

I'm sure I could find more if I wanted to.

Note that of the above, Trump has succeeding in destroying/overturning most of them.

 

[jalimon]

Thanks Valcazar

You know Trump is really succeeding at making sure american are reviving the american dream. Yep the more he goes the more we can make sure that it will stays only as a dream

Cheers,

 

[Fradi]

Dream or nightmare

 

[Valcazar]

"Oh my God. This is terrible. This is the end of my Presidency. I'm fucked."

That is going to be a meme, I'll wager.

 

[Bred Sob]

"Oh my God. This is terrible. This is the end of my Presidency. I'm fucked."

Kudos to Mr. Mueller! His 675-day $25(+) million investigation actually bore tangible fruit.

 

[Bred Sob]

By the way, while the quote posted above by the Honorable Monsieur Valcazar is being passed around all over the cyberspace, somehow no one seems to be interested as to what exactly Trump had in mind. Whereas it is not too difficult to find out, as in the very same paragraph (on page 290/448) Mueller states:

"The President returned to the consequences of the appointment and said, "Everyone tells me if you get one of these independent counsels it ruins your presidency . It takes years and years and I won't be able to do anything. This is the worst thing that ever happened to me."

Could it be that -- banish the thought! -- Trump is after all not so dumb as the left-wing crowd wishes to paint him?

 

[Valcazar]

Kudos to Mr. Mueller! His 675-day $25(+) million investigation actually bore tangible fruit.

It's ok, Bred Sob, you can just say you didn't read the report and aren't going to.