The vaccine passport (QR code), a new debate.

[Halloween Mike]

The day or you will understand that this is for the good of all, I hope you will realize it?

No its not !! Thats the thing. At this point the measures make no sense. I base my arguments on official numbers, and also on aquired rights as Canadians.

I can't legally visit ONE friend, yet i can take the metro, go at costco etc. In the meantime the USA are packing Arenas and stadiums... Im not saying we should do 20 peoples party, but a few friends together to watch an UFC event, like 2 or 3... that should be allowed at this point.

We are about 40% in vaccination, we are in late spring almost summer time, and we can't even see peoples OUTSIDE on our own land. Last year at same date we could see some friends, restaurants were open without having to litteraly DOX yourself at the entrance, no mask was required yet either. Yes we may had less total cases but we tested way less (14 000 vs 30 000 now) and the issue was the vulnerable population wich is the one vaccinated now, some even at 2 doses.

Then the curfew... a month "electroshock" thats is going on 5 months now !! Not being able to go walk when i want is infuriating and im sure im not the only one. Not being able to go at the store til 11 pm to buy beer as well (always hated the 11 rule too to be honest) Not being able to walk freely in a free country thats fucked up !!

Basically at this moment there is no valid reason to keep such liberty infringing measures. Soon we will have to be home before the sun goes to sleep... like cmon man.

If for some reasons peoples are not vaccinated and at risk they can always stay home for a few more months, or go out in an hazmat suit if it make them feel safe. My liberty as well as the one of others who thinks like me shouldn't be based on an health care system that can't handle a total of 500 patients (120 in ICU) . Thats their problem !!

At one point what is it gonna be? Curfew til 2023 because not 100% are vaccinated with 4 doses and we get 10 cases a day?

There is peoples in mental health distress, loosing their business, some commit suicide, a whole generation of teen is supose (but how much actually do it tough...lol) not see a single friend outside of school... NO, just NO !

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

If I remember the last time I went to the restaurant, it was March 01, 2020.

In short, that more than a year that I had not socialized, in real life. Since I have been vaccinated I have felt myself come back to life.

For myself I have been in restaurants / pubs on a weekly basis, travel around and only stopped due to restrictions. For those who chose to keep away not an issue, their beliefs. I am on a plane again on Wednesday heading to Montreal for some TO, daughter reminded me of the curfew, can work around that one. Hope all have an entertaining summer.

 

[Stx]

Restrictions will be lifted as vaccination increases and transmission decreases. They're taking their time unlike last year because:

1. The variants are 50%+ more transmissable compared to covid last year, therefore it's necessary to be more cautious.

2. They want this to be the last lockdown, unlike last year where they knew that eventually they would have to reimpose restrictions. Indeed, if this reopening is done properly, there should not be any more lockdowns in the future.

The US has a higher rate of 2 dose vaccination (as does the uk) therefore they can reopen more. In other words, they're where we should be in a few months.

As for vaccination requirements, as long as everyone has access to them, then I don't see any ethical reason to be against them. If you choose not to receive it that's fine, you have that right. Going to restaurants, bars and other private establishements is not a right however, and that is the price you would have to pay.

Overall, from this summer and onwards, things are only gonna get better thanks to the vaccines.

 

[Halloween Mike]

They could still lift the more extreme ones without going for full open too fast.

And as you say PRIVATE establishement should be allowed to decide by themselves. If a restaurant or a bar decide to not let enter someone not vaccinated its their right and ill be more than happy to not give them my business. But the places that DO want to let us inside need to be allowed to.

I don't want an experimental rushed product inside of me, and this shouldn't make me a pariah to society by gouvernement decret...

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

This is what the EU plans, vaccination not required.

The aim of the EU pass is to get travel moving across borders, "without discrimination", but getting it all organised in a short space of time will be a significant challenge. EU leaders have called for legal and technical work to go ahead "as a matter of urgency" while maintaining restrictions on non-essential travel for the moment. The original plan is for the certificate to be in place for the summer but that deadline could be hard to meet.
The certificate, either digital or on paper, will enable anyone vaccinated against Covid, or who has tested negative, or recently recovered from the virus, to travel across all 27 member states. The EU also wants to include non-EU countries such as Norway, Iceland and Switzerland.

Covid passports: How do they work around the world?

How are countries enforcing vaccine passports and what can people use them for?

www.google.ca

 

[IamNY]

They could still lift the more extreme ones without going for full open too fast.

I’m all for opening things up, but it must be done in a slow orderly fashion. In the US we are “packing arenas” and quite frankly, we’ve earned it. Our rate of vaccination is much much higher than Canada’s. But going to an arena is not without proof of vaccination or a negative COVID test. Guess how they verify this? By vaccine passports. Canada will eventually get there. But right now, Canada is so far behind other countries with their vaccinations that they have no choice but to open at a snails pace.

 

[gallantca]

I’m all for opening things up, but it must be done in a slow orderly fashion. In the US we are “packing arenas” and quite frankly, we’ve earned it. Our rate of vaccination is much much higher than Canada’s. But going to an arena is not without proof of vaccination or a negative COVID test. Guess how they verify this? By vaccine passports. Canada will eventually get there. But right now, Canada is so far behind other countries with their vaccinations that they have no choice but to open at a snails pace.

you are looking at very old data. Canada is vaccinating quite quickly. The US and UK still ahead, but we are more vaccinated than all of Europe for example.

Canada is being FAR more cautious on re-opening. I think the US is weighing Covid fatigue much higher in their decisions to re-open. They may be right, but the decision is not 100% based on vaccination.

 

[IamNY]

you are looking at very old data. Canada is vaccinating quite quickly. The US and UK stay ahead, but we are more vaccinated than all of Europe for example.

Canada is being FAR more cautious on re-opening. I think the US is weighing Covid fatigue much higher in their decisions to re-open. They may be right, but the decision is not 100% based on vaccination.

Last time I checked Canada was at around 3% fully vaccinated. Canada might be quick now, but they were very slow getting to the dance. Canada is more cautious because they have limited supply so they have to keep the pace slow. The US is basing their reopening on the science more so than anything. In NY for example, our positivity rate is less than 1% right now and our fully vaccinated rate is 43% and the single shot is over 50%. Not close to heard immunity, but close enough that our numbers and much of the country will rapidly get better in the next few weeks.

 

[gallantca]

Last time I checked Canada was at around 3% fully vaccinated. Canada might be quick now, but they were very slow getting to the dance. Canada is more cautious because they have limited supply so they have to keep the pace slow. The US is basing their reopening on the science more so than anything. In NY for example, our positivity rate is less than 1% right now and our fully vaccinated rate is 43% and the single shot is over 50%. Not close to heard immunity, but close enough that our numbers and much of the country will rapidly get better in the next few weeks.

Fully vaccinated is important but at this point of the cycle, more single shots is even more critical. The second shot does increase efficiency, but it especially increases longevity of the immunity. Totally made up numbers here, but it preferable to have 75% of single does than 50% of double dose in the short term. The large double dose number is not what re-assures me short term. Long term, absolutely, but preventing short term outbreaks or impact of variant, more single shot rules.

Canada's bottleneck was supply. The US bottleneck will become vaccine hesitation. The first is easier to get over. Don't get me wrong, we will have hesitation here, but not to the extent you do.

Canada is not on a slow pace. More shots are going into arms today than the US (on a per population basis). Supply is no longer an issue. Vaccination is happening very quickly. And bonus, the young are stepping up to the plate.

I do believe the US is basing this on science, but the messaging is questionable and it's almost guaranteed compliance will be bad.

I hope the US stays VERY tough on borders.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

An article I found this morning.

Canada’s vaccination rate is eclipsing the U.S. Experts say the comparison is complicated - National | Globalnews.ca

While vaccine resistance is playing a role in the slowing U.S. rate, experts say comparing the two countries is not 'apples to apples' as they are in very different places.

globalnews.ca

 

[Halloween Mike]

I’m all for opening things up, but it must be done in a slow orderly fashion. In the US we are “packing arenas” and quite frankly, we’ve earned it. Our rate of vaccination is much much higher than Canada’s. But going to an arena is not without proof of vaccination or a negative COVID test. Guess how they verify this? By vaccine passports. Canada will eventually get there. But right now, Canada is so far behind other countries with their vaccinations that they have no choice but to open at a snails pace.

I heard states like Florida was against domestic vaccine passeport. It may change from states to states tough. But my point was that the difference is insane. I never asked to pack an arena now in Quebec, but that we can't even see friends OUTSIDE on our ground is completely insane. That they ask peoples to wear mask outside if they meet at a park or whatever is INSANE !! At this point we should be able to receive a few friends even inside in small groups (like 2-3 peoples max) without any issue and like i said the dreadfull curfew should have been lifted MONTHS ago.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

^^^^^ Never expect something rational from a politician

 

[sene5hos]

So become a politician

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

^^^^^^^ You and your squad would not be pleased.

 

[Fradi]

I agree with vaccine passports and think everyone should seriously think about getting vaccinated.
I never believed half assed curfews will do anything, you either have a real lock down for 2-3 weeks or don’t bother.
The science says that outdoor transmission is minimal and with almost 50% of Quebec’s population being vaccinated ( with first dose) and over 75% of the older and more vulnerable it is time to allow out door terraces to open and have families be able to see each other in their backyards up to 10 people like last summer.
For now I would maintain the wearing of masks indoors everywhere, it is not such a big deal and next to vaccination seems to be the best protection we have not only for covid but all kinds of other viral transmissions. Once we have 75% fully vaccinated this can be stopped also and people can decide themselves if they want to wear one or not.
Hopefully by end of summer we will all be back to something more normal and borders will be open and we can all start travelling again.

 

[Halloween Mike]

Fradi, honestly anybody that want to get vaccinated should go for it, thats all fine. Do you think i didn't heavily think about taking it or not? I considered taking the Pfizer at some point (but i banned the Astrazeneca from my body long before the Gov backtracked on it) but then i taught about it and realized why should i take it? The vaccine does not stop transmission, it stop aggravating symptoms. As a mid 30s guy in good health i know my body can fight the disease. I gone a year and 2 months without catching it, and the cases will keep dismishing as summer goes on, so why take a vaccine now? I never took a flu shot either.

There is the same dumb narrative about the vaccine as there was for the mask. Do it for others, not for you. NO !! Its not to me to endanger me or do something that make me feel uncomfortable for others when they can do it themselves. I kept repeating if you are at risk and fear the virus, wear a full hazmat suit, garanty you won't get infected, or stay home ! If you are at risk, take the vaccine, if you catch covid you shouldn't be too shaked up by it by when you got 2 doses.

The reality is there was a lot of deaths in Quebec because of the governements incompetence when it comes to the health care system and "CHSLD". Otherwise the death toll wouuld had been so much smaller.

Now will we get 75% vaccinated? Can't blame the peoples in their 20s not taking it, they don't need it. The govs should accept the % they reach and thats it. If 70% want to take it, so be it, if its 80% then same, if its 60 then too bad but thats it. They should not put fear into citizens of being treated like a second class citizen with discrimination because they decide to not take it.

Hey if a business say you need a vaccination proof to go there by their own will, so be it, its THEIR BUSINESS, and ill be happy to not give them my business but the govs should not force it on anyone and anyone that is for this concept im my opinion is against freedom and rights.

As for wearing mask indoor, its been a problem for me for almost a year now. Ill give it to you its just annoying having to carry one in my pockets and always put it on when i enter a shop, but its not "horrible". BUT keeping that on all day i am unable. I just can't. I would have anxiety panic attack. Best i ever did was 4 hours with 2 breaks of 10 mins and i felt so ill and when i could finally remove it , it felt like an orgasm... i could breathe again...

So what you think of a problem it is for me right now? Yeah i can't work in about 90% of legal jobs.

 

[charmer_]

@Halloween Mike: it's your body, and you can do whatever you want to it (keep eating those bags of Cheetos and drinking those bottles of beer my man...I'm sure your body is like a temple ).

But it's also a shared society. You don't want take the vaccine...fine. But you shouldn't expect to blend in with the rest of society if you aren't able to conform to it (especially when everybody else is doing their part by getting vaccinated).

Enjoy the home life, lol.

 

[Halloween Mike]

@Halloween Mike: (keep eating those bags of Cheetos and drinking those bottles of beer my man...I'm sure your body is like a temple ).

But it's also a shared society. You don't want take the vaccine...fine. But you shouldn't expect to blend in with the rest of society if you aren't able to conform to it (especially when everybody else is doing

I do love beers sure but cheetos? Nah. Actually since i lost weight i cut on almost everything beside beer. But hey we ain't all perfect.

Read my post above dude. Vaccine do not stop transmission. This argument is invalid. Vaccine passeport is nothing but a fear mongering tool to have you vaccinated. Its like curfew, no scientific proof but they don't want peoples to meet in home so they use that. Basically that equivalent to nuking a town because you want a criminal group hiding there.

 

[charmer_]

Vaccine do not stop transmission.

Where'd you hear that? Do you have a URL to back this up?

Just by googling, I found the following ( https://www.news10.com/news/can-i-still-spread-covid-if-im-vaccinated/ ):

Dr. Peter Chin-Hong, an infectious disease expert at University of California at San Francisco School of Medicine, says he thinks “it’s very unlikely” that vaccinated people can transmit the virus.

“The more evidence we get, it appears it’s very unlikely for a vaccinated person to transfer the virus to someone else,” he said.

Also, I think it's pretty evident that the # of cases has dropped significantly since people started to get vaccinated (especially in the States, which has pretty much re-opened now it seems).

Dunno why anybody would want to be "against" the vaccine. If anything, it's currently the best solution for things to get back to normal.

 

[Tro]

Yellow fever vaccine is compulsory in quiet a few countries. There are a few others depending the country. Why not Covid ? it's dangerous,, esily transmitted and hard to treat in the accute form.