Nice la Presse Article on XO this morning

[Gazoo64]

I had the same experience as you.

Because, like me, you were a client of the first version of XO. Run by Sam. He was not perfect, but everything went downhill after he had to leave.

Please, someone, correct me if we are wrong.

No, that’s not correct, according to what I heard. It’s the other way around!

He only “had to leave” after they got busted and the agency closed.

From what I heard, early on when it started 2015, XO was a decent agency.

In the last 2-3 years, it went downhill (2022-24). Drugs, orgies, forcing girls to participate in orgies and having sex, coercion, PLUS all the stuff mentioned in the article.

 

[mauricevachon]

Did you watch the video from the girl who reported them? She clearly says that they didn't check and care of her ID.

To the average viewer Clementine is highly attractive and convincing.

However to anyone who is familiar with the hobby it is clear she is lying at least twice.

1. She says that when she joined Seeking Arrangement (at 19) she did not realize that clients would be expecting sex.

2. More important she says that when she joined XO (which an SA client referred her to) that Sam told her she would not have to have sex with clients.

Sam was many things.
But he was not a time waster.
He would never have told a girl that.

*****

Clementine comes from a good family and social network.
She thus has a real need to justify her past actions.
Blaming it all on others is one way to do that.

She lied twice; but more important, much of the rest of what she says is not fully credible either.
(That XO "forced" her to see clients. She could have walked out at anytime. Never once saw anyone watching these girls).

Ses agresseurs arrêtés | Agence d’escorte démantelée à Montréal: une des victimes témoigne

Écoutez le témoignage de Clémentine, 26 ans, victime d exploitation sexuelle, mercredi à Radio textos avec Marie Eve Tremblay.

www.985fm.ca

 

[Lunaseraphim]

It was. I know not only from what friends told us, but also from the fact that Sam himself messaged me in recent years to ask for social media advice for his agency.

Interesting. We also know things about agency & spa owners because they book providers including indies and tell us things or have abusive behavior toward us.. let's just put it that way.

Are you saying that because 90% of them "appeared" comfortable, it's reasonable that the remaining 10% could be abused because the majority is fine? 100% of the women working in an agency should be treated like queens and be (and not simply appear) comfortable doing their job.

Your "understanding" and what "appeared" are no facts.

Even if a client saw one provider at some point during her time with an agency, doesn't mean things didn't go downhill afterward.

But indeed, considering all the agencies in Montreal, most of the time the experience of both the provider and the client should be positive. As I said above, this story only reminds us that exploitation is closer to us than we think and as a client, you probably have met at least one girl that has been affected by the abuse and violence in her agency without knowing it.

I think it's so funny that people who have been in ''the hobby'' (lol) for a long time don't realize the pressure of clients and employers on us to act a certain way. If we look unhappy, we risk getting fired, or getting a bad review, or both.

 

[Julia Sky]

(That XO "forced" her to see clients. She could have walked out at anytime. Never once saw anyone watching these girls).

The person who told her she wouldnt need to have sex was initially the "sugar daddy" who told her about the agency. Not Sam. The agency on the other hand probably did sell her the illusion that she wouldn't have to do anything she's not comfortable with. If you claim they didnt do that either we have another problem.

As for nobody watching, lol, lmao even. I myself applied to an agency when I was 18 and was told there would always be someone in the unit right across or right next to the unit I'd work from. And what about the client in this very thread who confirms (and wrote it in a review months ago) that he saw Sam and the other guy watch him on his last encounter when he arrived and when he left ?

 

[sigyn]

To the average viewer Clementine is highly attractive and convincing.

However to anyone who is familiar with the hobby it is clear she is lying at least twice.

1. She says that when she joined Seeking Arrangement (at 19) she did not realize that clients would be expecting sex.

2. More important she says that when she joined XO (which an SA client referred her to) that Sam told her she would not have to have sex with clients.

Sam was many things.
But he was not a time waster.
He would never have told a girl that.

*****

Clementine comes from a good family and social network.
She thus has a real need to justify her past actions.
Blaming it all on others is one way to do that.

She lied twice; but more important, much of the rest of what she says is not fully credible either.
(That XO "forced" her to see clients. She could have walked out at anytime. Never once saw anyone watching these girls).

Ses agresseurs arrêtés | Agence d’escorte démantelée à Montréal: une des victimes témoigne

Écoutez le témoignage de Clémentine, 26 ans, victime d exploitation sexuelle, mercredi à Radio textos avec Marie Eve Tremblay.

www.985fm.ca

Even if that is the case, which I don't believe it is, it still wouldn’t invalidated experiences other SP have shared about the immoral practices that go on in the industry. I find it disheartening that people are trying to rationalize away abuse.

 

[LeDodo]

Plenty of people stay in abusive situations due to lack of ressources, fear and coercion

Clémentine even said at the end of her interview that she was lucky to have been surrounded by her family and friends giving her the support to speak out.

She also stressed that not only courage is needed but support plays a strong role in speaking out.

There are lot of people in abusive situations who just don't know the next steps, who they could turn to to speak, etc.

The mindset to think they have the choice to just walk away is merely simplifying and diminishing the situation.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

To the average viewer Clementine is highly attractive and convincing.

However to anyone who is familiar with the hobby it is clear she is lying at least twice.

1. She says that when she joined Seeking Arrangement (at 19) she did not realize that clients would be expecting sex.

2. More important she says that when she joined XO (which an SA client referred her to) that Sam told her she would not have to have sex with clients.

Sam was many things.
But he was not a time waster.
He would never have told a girl that.

Dude, you are naive. She is NOT lying.

I know a fuck ton of girls who joined Seeking Arrangements and believed they wouldn't have to have sex with men. A lot of young girls who are in the sugar baby scene lie to other girls about what they're doing because they are ashamed. Even last year, a friend of mine told me that her friend is a sugar baby and ''made tons of money just for going to restaurants with men'' lol I told her she was lied to about it.

Even when I was younger, I was tempted to find a sugar daddy because I was under the impression that I wouldn't have to have sex with him. That is also the way these websites do their branding and the reputation they try to maintain. It's deceptive for the girls.

''he is not a time waster'' maybe but he is a liar and a manipulator LOL even when you join MP, they tell you ''you don't have to do anything you don't want to do with clients''.. Anyone who's naive will fall for it and end up getting caught up at the end of the day, or they know it's a lie.

It's also that you can tell in this interview that this girl is ashamed of having been an escort and that is what they are focusing on. She initially didn't want to do this, but you can read between the lines and understand that she was naive and in need of attention and easily manipulated and pushed.. It wasn't hard to get her to do these things. She explains it very well, she lacked self esteem and felt lonely and wanted validation.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Clémentine even said at the end of her interview that she was lucky to have been surrounded by her family and friends giving her the support to speak out.

She also stressed that not only courage is needed but support plays a strong role in speaking out.

There are lot of people in abusive situations who just don't know the next steps, who they could turn to to speak, etc.

The mindset to think they have the choice to just walk away is merely simplifying and diminishing the situation.

It's also that Clémentine is a ''perfect victim'' in this case. She isn't actively working as an escort and she did not join fully aware of what was going to happen. A lot of women experienced abuse in this industry, but they are still working, either as indies or for MP or agencies. These women will not be seen with such kind eyes.

 

[mauricevachon]

Are you saying that because 90% of them "appeared" comfortable, it's reasonable that the remaining 10% could be abused because the majority is fine? 100% of the women working in an agency should be treated like queens and be (and not simply appear) comfortable doing their job.

Abuse is intolerable under any conditions.

That said, many escorts are not fully comfortable with their work.

These include:
Lesbians, girls working their first shifts, girls at the end of their shifts, girls on drugs, girls cheating on their boyfriends, girls who used to work at MPs who are not comfortable moving to GFE, girls who work because they are desperate for money (single mothers) etc...

It"s not always due to abuse.

I think it's so funny that people who have been in ''the hobby'' (lol) for a long time don't realize the pressure of clients and employers on us to act a certain way. If we look unhappy, we risk getting fired, or getting a bad review, or both.

Escorting is in many ways a performance art.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Escorting is in many ways a performance art.

It sure is. But that also means you can't know for sure if someone is happy at their work place just because ''they seem to be''.

Also there is a difference between someone who isn't comfortable with their work and choosing to do it anyways on their own terms, and somebody who is being exploited and abused.
It's very very easy to understand the difference. lol

SITUATION A
Cindy is a lesbian, but she chooses to work as an escort independently, and she works at a massage parlor one day a week. She is not attracted to men and does not enjoy the work, but it brings her good money, she gets to choose clients who are clean and respectful, and she sets her own boundaries. Nobody is exploiting her, her boss at the parlor doesn't force her to see clients she doesn't want to see, doesn't try to have sex with her and gives her good working conditions.

SITUATION B
Karine is an escort who works for an agency. Her clients are aggressive and regularly try to coerce her into bbfs, but her boss doesn't care. If she is sick, she may have to pay 500$ out of her own pocket if she doesn't show up. Once, her employer put xanax in her drink, God knows what happened to her later. She is routinely told to get skinnier and her boss tries to give her cocaine to manage her weight. Karine wishes she could work independently or change agencies, but the boss threatens to out her to her family if she quits and tells her she will never succeed anywhere else.

Do you see the difference?

 

[Wildstar]

XO was by far the best agency Montreal has ever seen

[...]

....XO was by far the best agency Montreal has ever seen.

Guess I must be crazy, would have assumed the best agency would not recruit underage girl(s), drug and sex assault the SPs, and try with some success to enforce involuntary sexual servitude.

 

[LC18]

Je ressens le même malaise que toi.. Et même si je trouve ça cool que des femmes qui travaillent en agence ont de bonnes expériences et viennent nous le dire ici, c'est plate qu'elles se sentent obligées de devoir le faire probablement par crainte de perdre du travail ou pour justifier leur choix. On ne devrait pas toujours justifier nos choix dans cette industrie et sentir cette précarité.

Je dirais qu’à la lecture de l’article et à l’écoute de l’entrevue. Je suis contente et soulagée que certaines viennent dire ici qu’elles ont eu un experience positive. Tant mieux pour elles.

Par contre ça ne devrait pas diminuer les expériences négatives de nos collègues


Premièrement, nous n’avons pas toutes le même seuil de tolérance et les mêmes rapports avec les autres individus

 

[TheJames101]

Ouf. If be shaking right now if I was a client of theirs. Especially if you've been there for ten years and now know all this info.

Btw, you declaring you saw them here, I hope you are using a VPN. If not, gg on the easy confession

tbh I'm not sure the cops are going to be hunting down people on the forum here, connecting them to seized phone numbers, etc. That seems like quite the operation. Maybe, but it seems unlikely.... and I'm as concerned as anyone about the numbers being siezed.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

I want to add something very important.. Yes, for many of us this is a job that allows us to have better financial conditions or that allows us to survive. Maybe it's not our first choice, maybe some of us don't like the job, maybe some of us are not huge fans of several aspects of the work but still choose to continue. That is not the same as being exploited and coerced.

But I do think that our clients should be sensitive to our comfort and working conditions..

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Je dirais qu’à la lecture de l’article et à l’écoute de l’entrevue. Je suis contente et soulagée que certaines viennent dire ici qu’elles ont eu un experience positive. Tant mieux pour elles.

Par contre ça ne devrait pas diminuer les expériences négatives de nos collègues


Premièrement, nous n’avons pas toutes le même seuil de tolérance et les mêmes rapports avec les autres individus

Je suis d'accord avec toi. Tant mieux. Et, oui, ta dernière phrase me semble très pertinente, et présente tout un éventail de nuances.

 

[TheJames101]

To the average viewer Clementine is highly attractive and convincing.

However to anyone who is familiar with the hobby it is clear she is lying at least twice.

I don't know about your examples and am not prepared to say she was lying about those things. One thing that raised a flag for me, though, was when she said she had never seen a nice/good client. She was there for a year. Only awful people booked her? It seems very implausible, if not impossible. So, she is either telling the truth, exaggerating, or has that whole period of life labelled as bad, which could be understandable.

But it stood out to me, because it seemed to imply that most (or all) people who booked with XO were abusers or bad people who didn't care about how the women felt. I doubt any SP here would say that everyone they have encountered has been bad.

This is not to minimize her story or how she felt, but it's just to say how I felt listening to it from the other side of the fence.

 

[LC18]

Ciboulot @mauricevachon tu fais exprès ou t’es comme ça 24/7

Il y a beaucoup de gens qui se font dire qu’elles n’auront pas à coucher avec leur sugardaddy, d’ailleurs le site lui-même ne faisait pas la promotion du sexe contre rémunération parce que ça ferait d’eux des complices.

Oui on peut se douter qu’il pourrait y avoir du sexe mais Clémentine avait 19 ans. A cet âge là j’étais naive moi aussi et quand des femmes plus vieilles te disent “inscris toi tu vas voir c’est payant en plus tu peux garder tes vêtements”, évidemment que tu vas les croire

 

[EagerBeaver]

tbh I'm not sure the cops are going to be hinting down people on the forum here, connecting them to seized phone numbers, etc. That seems like quite the operation. Maybe, but it seems unlikely.... and I'm as concerned as anyone about the numbers being siezed.

It seems like there were complaints to LE and they set up a sting, the goal of which was to shut down the agency and charge its principals. This was accomplished. It's a low hanging fruit situation. Going after clients based on seized phone numbers and texts seems like an expensive and more difficult proposition. It seems unlikely. Unless they got very specific information/evidence of, or a witness to criminal behavior by the client and feel compelled to charge it.

 

[LC18]

Il y a une énorme différence entre

ne pas être au courant d’une situation, obtenir les informations et se rendre compte que la situation n’était pas bonne

et

ne pas être au courant d’une situation, obtenir les informations et choisir de continuer de supporter les actions sachant que la situation n’était pas bonne

 

[Lunaseraphim]

I don't know about your examples and am not prepared to say she was lying about those things. One thing that raised a flag for me, though, was when she said she had never seen a nice/good client. She was there for a year. Only awful people booked her? It seems very implausible, if not impossible. So, she is either telling the truth, exaggerating, or has that whole period of life labelled as bad, which could be understandable.

But it stood out to me, because it seemed to imply that most (or all) people who booked with XO were abusers or bad people who didn't care about how the women felt. I doubt any SP here would say that everyone they have encountered has been bad.

Maybe that's how she experienced it, even if the clients felt like they were being nice to her. I also don't believe that it's possible to have only bad clients, and I don't think everyone who booked with XO is an abuser.. but I don't think this means we shouldn't believe her.

It sounds like she was being maybe hyperbolic.. She had so many bad experiences that she felt like ''all clients were bad''. That's honestly how I felt when I entered the industry. I attracted so many boundary pushers and violent clients as a beginner that I didn't feel I had one single nice client for a while.. Nowadays, most of my clients are very kind and respectful. But I can see how a new girl, naive, 19 years old, would attract a lot of predators and unpleasant clients..