Finding out a loved one is in the hobby...

Special K said:

If this is true, you've proven to me you're a very shallow individual and I am quite surprised that amongst everyone here, you'd be the one to say this! Very disappointing GG!

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Thanks for bringing this up. I was the one who first initiated the joke about a "son who was an SP" and I was just feeling bad about it, especially in view of my reaction to Oliver's "New York Blackout Photos". My apologies to anyone who was offended.

On a different note, I've been reading over this thread and I find it disturbing. At first I wasn't sure why, then I realized that it was this whole idea of a group of adults talking about not wanting to disappoint their parents.

Living one's life in a manner that does not disappoint other people, be it parents or friends, seems to me to be a pretty sad way to live one's life, especially since it is so short. In the end, the only person that we have to look at in the mirror is ourself and I think that should be our standard. Likewise, we should encourage our family and friends to do what feels right to them, not what feels right to us.

Well, as much as I don't like responding to GG's moral and quasi-philosophical threads, I feel uniquely qualified having two adult daughters and knowing one former SP who sometimes feels like a daughter-by-proxy. Not to mention a son approaching legal age.

My daughters do not live their lives for me, but for themselves and, at some future point perhaps, for their children as well. Whatever make them happy and healthy, both physically and emotionally, is fine by me. This business can certainly wreak havoc on a young woman's psyche, given different girls' capacities for handling it emotionally and the different conditions under which girls work. I'd certainly hate to see either of my girls working under agency conditions, but if one or the other were to find herself in an indy hdh position and enjoying herself, more power to her, so long as she recognized that she was not on a career path and that her income would dry up as she aged. In any case, any reaction of mine would not be based on moral grounds (that would be the height of hypocrisy, c'nest pas?) but out of concern for her mental well being.

My "daughter-by-proxy" came into the biz under difficult circumstances and left it more damaged than she entered. She's come a long, long way since her retirement, still has a ways to go, and has a new career choice, shortly to start that education. I'd hate to see her go back into the business as that would signal a serious backsliding. She is the primary reason, seeing the potential for devastation that accompanies working in this business, that I've stopped hobbying. (Again, no moral judgement here toward those of you who continue. This was just a personal choice that I had to make.)

As for my son, if he were doing it for fun, fine. If he were doing it to compensate for an inability to find or maintain a meaningful relationship, that would sadden me. As for his being a gay SP, that would really bother me if he was straight.

General Gonad said:

Have you ever met an SP who left the business "less damaged" than when she entered it?

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I'm certainly not qualified to make this judgement. The difference between us is that, not all-knowing and all-seeing, I'm not will to pass judgement here.

General Gonad said:

I am being honest about this, not because I am homophobic

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GG I need some clarification because there is an enormous amount of hypocrisy oozing out of your comments. From a man that glorifies the ladies he encounters I would expect more open minded comments and a little bit more compassion.

Would you be disappointed if your child became a garbage person, a cop or a janitor? I just want to know if you see being an SP as a bad occupation because your selling your body or is it bad because it's not fitting of your offspring and socially unaccepted? Or is it because of your convoluted way of seeing SP's?

I come from a family that produced engineers, scientist and mathematicians so I grew up with the mindset that unless you have a good education and a good socially acceptable job then you're a failure. As I got older I learned how wrong those perceptions are. My only goal for my children is happiness, no matter how it makes me feel. If my daughter wants to be an SP then I will do everything I can to convince her against it but at the end I will support her. And so you know, the only reason I would try to dissuade her is for the fear of STD's. Same way I would try to dissuade her from a military life, firefighter or becoming a cop. Fear for my childs life is the only reason and I would do my best not to judge her.

There is no shame in earning a living, no matter what it is you do. We all have to earn a living, pay the bills and feed our dependents. Morales be damned, I would rather bet my life on an SP then a broker any day of the week!

If my son was a gay SP, I'd shoot myself.

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Shame on you, A fathers job is not to judge but to guide.

Not often but possible! I agree with Dirtier 100%.

General Gonad said:

...

If you really care about someone, no matter what the consequences, you tell them the truth.

GG

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Gonad,

I have to thank you for the biggest laugh I've had in ages, and I am fairly easily amused. No, really, I couldn't see through the tears gushing from my eyes! My stomach is still hurting 15 minutes later. I'd expound why, but I'm about ready to hit the sack and... geez. I think folks can gather why on their own.

As far as the actual topic is concerned, can't really think why I'd be more concerned about a daughter vs. a son being an SP. Assuming that these are adults we're talking about, exactly how much control do I have over them in the first place (assumption also being that they're living on their own and not bringing work where I'm trying to sleep)? Then again, my family's been interesting (to say the least) and maybe my parents were too laid-back with my upbringing.

Numb by Linkin Park


I'm tired of being what you want me to be
Feeling so faithless lost under the surface
Don't know what you're expecting of me
Put under the pressure of walking in your shoes
(Caught in the undertow just caught in the undertow)
Every step that I take is another mistake to you
(Caught in the undertow just caught in the undertow)

[Chorus]
I've become so numb I can't feel you there
Become so tired so much more aware
I'm becoming this all I want to do
Is be more like me and be less like you

Can't you see that you're smothering me
Holding too tightly afraid to lose control
Cause everything that you thought I would be
Has fallen apart right in front of you
(Caught in the undertow just caught in the undertow)
Every step that I take is another mistake to you
(Caught in the undertow just caught in the undertow)
And every second I waste is more than I can take

[Chorus]

And I know
I may end up failing too
But I know
You were just like me with someone disappointed in you

Korbel said:

Hello General,
I am single, never been married, and there are no kids.

Korbel

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Same status as Korbel, but I love this hobby !!!!!! I think it’s the best thing since sliced bread. I don’t see how it could ever damage me as it only brings unparalleled enjoyment.

On the topic at hand, lets not forget about the day of the hetaera, that companion of ancient Greece whom held an esteemed position in society. I really see this as the future of SP’ing. Most daughter’s are selling their bodies in one way or another. At least the SP is honest about it.

How would I feel if either of my sons

- were working as male escorts - seeing both men and women, or either.

I would hope and ensure that doing this was a choice they made on their own, that they were never without other options. I would ask them to take steps to always be safe, and try to ascertain that they are not in the business because of a drug addiction or that it was not connected to other detrimental behaviours. If I could clarify that, as long as they were happy, and healthy, I would be fine with it.

- If my son was seeing SPs - so what? SPs are no better or worse than any other group of people.

- If my son was gay - that is his business not mine!

Finally, I truly accept that I have left the business in a much better position emotionally, financial and self-confidence-wise, than I was in when I entered the business.

JAS

Just-ass-weet said:

- If my son was seeing SPs - so what? SPs are no better or worse than any other group of people.

- If my son was gay - that is his business not mine!
JAS

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Great post Annik and i totally agree with you especially on these two points.

Just-ass-weet said:

- If my son was seeing SPs - so what? SPs are no better or worse than any other group of people.

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If I'm reading this right, Anik, are you saying that SPs, as a whole, are no better than lawyers? Coulda fooled me.

Point of view...

What Anik said comes back to what I have stade in the past, it depends on the reasons why you're SPing.

Then, concerning the topic, I would consider diffrent point of view...

I was talking about it with a man once and he told me he thought his daughter was in the business and that's why he was a bit freaky about seeing some, just in case he end up on her!!!

He told me also that before having those doubts, he never thought he would be in a such controversal mood-feeling regarding him seeing SP's and knowing his little one was one. He couldn't get to separate the 2 of it....

I answered 2 things that frozed him:

1- You're seeing SP's to satisfy a "scientific" natural need;
2- You have problems to accept she could be an SP cause only a man absolutely knows what men are hunting for.

He said he was going to think a lot about this...

It all depends of what you have experienced in life and the reasons why it happens. If you volontary decided to do it to get to your dreams faster, then good. If you go in those shoes because you have no choice, bad!

A mother who had a lovely husband, may consider her little SPing for good reasons, or should I say at least she may have fun.

A mother who have deal with basters, she may be sorry for her daugther but may also think that finally someone will get paid from those bad guys.

Same for a father...
If he is a good husband and a gentlemen while seeing SP's, he may understand some of the reasons why his dauther is doing it.

If he's a pain in the ass dring his encounter, he may feel very sorry for his little. Not in all cases cause this one goes back to number 2 reason...

Many scenarios could be applyed, but going that far, it would be like having a psycho lesson.

...

The Wizard of Oz said:

(...) concerning the topic, I would consider diffrent point of view...

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You described a few and wisely concluded that the list goes on. If it was possible to write an exhaustive list of emotions a parent can go through once confronted to certain realities affecting their children, there would still be nothing contributed to the field of "good parenting". "Feeling happy" or, at the other extreme, "being devastated" upon discovering such realities contribute nothing positive to the "problem", should there be a problem. As a matter of fact, such emotions, when displayed in a way where the parent is putting his own emotions in the center of the issue, can contribute negatively to the problem: either by instilling (or, often, reinforcing) a feeling of rejection into the child, should the emotions be all negative; or by encouraging the child to pursue an activity that might be detrimental, should the parent give his blessings without addressing the issue (saying: "I'm happy for you if what you do makes you happy" is certainly the appropriate conclusion though reaching such conclusion without going through the exercise of a sustained and positive dialogue with the "trouble child" would equate to parking kids in front of the tube all day because the parents can't be bothered).

I have an idea of how I would feel should I discover that my daughter or my son are prostituting themselves but I can't know for sure unless I'm actually confronted to the situation. What I know is I would eventually (and the sooner the better) have to put aside all the emotions that have the potential to discourage a possible dialogue.

This thread has been cleaned up. Please all stay on topic as much as possible and refrain from flaming or baiting other members into confrontation.

Thanks

M7

When you have raised and nutured children for 18 plus years you always have hopes and dreams for them, pehaps higher education, good jobs but their happiness in life is paramount. It true however, that it`s their life and theirs alone and that they`ll find their own path, make their own way.You hope that they`ll be happy in life and nothing bad happens to them, as parents we worry.
As parents, we don`t want our children to grow up to be prostitutes (or for the politically correct, escorts) or a number of other sp jobs. I can`t understand a parent who says otherwise.
It`s big money involved and people like big money but I`d rather my daughter work at job that did not pertain to the ejaculation of a man for money. Look Dad, I made the best CIM thread in merb. For the people who say otherwise, cry me a river. It`s her choice, true! But to say that you`d be supportive, I don`t believe that for a moment.
To the young SP`s who replied to this thread, you`re not a parent and your ideas will surely change over the next 20 years, of this I am sure.
We`re men, we`re horny and we love women. We are willing to pay for the privilege of tasting the forbidden fruit and that what makes this hobby as successful as it is.

This subject hits home big time - back on topic

I had been involved in the hobby during quite some time, and had opportunities to see different aspects of it, not only as a client. Like quite a few other hobbyists I'm sure, I built friendships with a few SPs, agency owners, and other clients, on top of other more unique experiences that are out of the scope of this post.

This hobby was more like a separate life to start with, a life on its own, and as time passed and I got more involved with friends (some real, some not so real), the hobby became closer and closer to my personal life. The separation between the two lives started to blur and things happening in one life eventually leaked on the other...

So what about finding out about a loved one is in the hobby? That question can be answered from two point of views: 1) people finding out about you and 2) you finding out about one of your loved ones. The whole dynamics of what is going to happen, how people will react, their feelings, etc, is in my opinion all based on one's perception about this business and people involved in it, both the clients and the providers.

It's always struck me how people outside of this business are close-minded and have prejudices against sex workers and clients. How often did I hear people say things like "look at those sluts, how can they expect any kind of respect". Damn! If they only knew! It's so easy for some people to patronize and look at this business with disdain when they don't have a clue what's going on and the people involved! Everyone in this biz have their reasons for doing what they do, some unfortunately have been forced to be there, hopefully it's a minority, and others are there by choice, and when I say "by choice" it doesn't mean the choice was easy to make. I, for one, have the utmost respect for women working in this profession (because, like it or not, it's a work).

Back to the "finding out" question, one thing that comes into play is love. More often that not we are all willing to accept difficult situations because we love the person involved. I can only speak about myself here, but because of the carelessness of a lady "friend", I eventually had to tell my (ex-)wife about my extra-conjugal activities (I posted about this before but it got deleted by the Mods as being part of a flaming thread - oh no! like this one!). If I was to tell you she accepted it without saying a word I'd obviously be lying, but love being what it is, love helps accept a lot more than one would expect. Although our relation is over now (not because of that), she was totally forgiving (but NOT forgetting) and was ready to continue, mainly because I didn't deny and admitted to everything, obviously with a commitment on my part to STOP it... and stop it NOW. The fact I cheated her with SPs didn't seem to make much of a difference though, as surprising as it may sound. In fact I think it would have been worst if the women had not been SPs, because not only the body, but the mind and soul would have been involved. As I didn't want to rub it in, it's not something I discussed with wifey, so I can't really comment.

The other "finding out" has to do with my daugther. I didn't find out anything per say, but she told me very recently she wanted to learn massotherapy. My heart must have skipped quite a few beats when she told me that. We didn't yet have a chance to have a lengthy discussion about it, only a quick phone conversation, but I know it will be a difficult subject, and for multiple reasons...

Being a client of MPs once in a while, I obviously know what's going on there. Even if my daugther vehemently tells me she would refuse to provide ANY sexual favor to ANYONE, depending on where she works I know she might be faced with situations that may almost be out of her control. I'm a very respectful person by nature, but not all clients are like me and I'm scared about some types of men who go to MPs, the stories I heard from girls (and read on MERB), about some a--h--es they sometime have to deal with. Sorry guys, but we are no angels here (not even me! ).

How do we, fathers, approach something like this has to do with our own experiences of course, and I would say the fact we read boards like MERB and know about this business somewhat helps us deal with it. Saying I would approve such a decision because she's major and has to live her life would be like bull-shitting myself. It would bug me for sure, not because of bad stereotypes attached to the women doing this profession (which I do not adhere to), but because I heard so many horror stories I want to save her from that.

My initial face to face discussion with her will be a tough one, mainly for me. As a good father I want her to make choices with all the facts in hand, and I want her to feel and know that I'm knowledgeable on the subject, to make sure she takes my advices seriously. By doing so I'll have to tell her that I've been involved in this, something not really easy to admit. But while silence is silver, truth is Gold. I know she's mature and whatever she decides to do after, I'll be supportive, and I'll make sure to stay as close to her as possible, so as to guide her and help her make the right choices along the way.

I feel there is so much more to write on this subject, but I wouldn't want to bore you all!

While I wrote those lines a number of thoughts crossed my mind, not necessarily in relation to the "finding out" question. I wonder how it's like for other hobbyists...

Having the privilege to meet hundreds of women in this hobby, it became obvious to me how the general public perception is biased. There are WONDERFUL people to meet here, very often people you would not have had the chance to meet otherwise, and who may even have changed your life. I know for me some did, and still do to this day.

Those thinking the hobby can be kept out of your personal life (my belief at the beginning), be honest to yourself and look again. You might be surprised. Think about it...

- How many friends you have in the hobby? and outside of the hobby?
- For those who indulge on a regular basis, how intimate can you become with an SP? Would you fall in love with one? With the right person I personally would, no hesitation!
- How addicted to the hobby did you become? How many times per week/month do you have to indulge? How long could you stand NOT seeing someone? And what if you lived in Montreal? Could it be as bad as going bankcrupt?
- What is the board providing you? Could you live without coming regularly? a week? a day? an hour (yeah, yeah, some handle come to mind when I write this )?

ok, ok, I'll stop here! LOL

CA

CA,

It's interesting that your daughter would even bring up the subject of massotherapy with you. My guess is the majority of young women would not broach this subject with their fathers, unless they thought that approval (at least on some level) and/or insight based on experience might be forthcoming as part of the discussion.

What's a bit more interesting here is the fact that you are a client of MPs, and as such perhaps having to consider the possibility of encountering your own daughter at an establishment that you may frequent. This does indeed bring the subject of GG's thread very close to home.