Oh yes you can....think house.
BTW what comes first the chicken or the egg. Its the egg since chickens evolved from dinosaurs .
Does anyone on here believe in god and the bible?
- Thread starter warikahill
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Oh yes you can....think house.
BTW what comes first the chicken or the egg. Its the egg since chickens evolved from dinosaurs .
Stephen Hawking is famous for being the smartest person alive, and for his thoughts on the origins of our universe. I respect his views very much. At the same time, I hope he is wrong. I believe in a God, but I believe there is a lot of fictional material in the bible.
Here is a quote from Hawking:
"When people ask me if a god created the universe, I tell them that the question itself makes no sense. Time didn’t exist before the big bang, so there is no time for god to make the universe in. It’s like asking directions to the edge of the earth; The Earth is a sphere; it doesn’t have an edge; so looking for it is a futile exercise. We are each free to believe what we want, and it’s my view that the simplest explanation is; there is no god." (From a brief history of time).
Here is a quote from Hawking:
"When people ask me if a god created the universe, I tell them that the question itself makes no sense. Time didn’t exist before the big bang, so there is no time for god to make the universe in. It’s like asking directions to the edge of the earth; The Earth is a sphere; it doesn’t have an edge; so looking for it is a futile exercise. We are each free to believe what we want, and it’s my view that the simplest explanation is; there is no god." (From a brief history of time).
Well exept that if you did that, you wouldn't have sex outside wedding let alone with escorts lol
I'd hypothesize religion started as a means to explain what humans could not understand and provide comfort to human fears. Then as civilization expanded it was useful as a means to sanctify whatever social order had developed to justify and validate it regarding social hierarchy...ie...kings over peasants, an order falsely said to be set by god(s). It was made to serve the interests of those who had taken power and thus polluted.
However, I don't think that because religion has so often been polluted by mankind's self-interests that there isn't really something above and beyond...something well beyond corporeal life and eternal, though I don't subscribe to literal scripture but rather the spiritual essence of scripture.
He is not that smart if he claims that time began with the big bang. What caused the big bang and are there universes outside of our own?
If yes than time started when the first universe was formed and if there are infinite universes then time itself is infinite and maybe so is God. Lots of possibilities here and none of us , including Hawkins, can claim to have the answers
BTW one can go stir crazy trying to figure all this shit out
I was born Roman Catholic. When I was a kid, I was a believer with praticing of my own (and influenced by my mother). During my teenage years, I've started to take an interest in other christian ways, like protestantism and calvinism. I became during this time a deist.
But now, i'm an atheist. I even ask my apostasy. So, I'm no longer a official member of the Roman Catholic Church since 11 years now.
But now, i'm an atheist. I even ask my apostasy. So, I'm no longer a official member of the Roman Catholic Church since 11 years now.
I'm a believer in science, which is incompatible with many religious beliefs. When I learned that Galileo (credited by Einstein as being one of the first modern physicists) was inquisitioned by the Catholic Church in the 1630's for blasphemy against the Church for theorizing that the Earth revolves around the Sun instead of the biblical decree that the Earth is set in place and the Sun rises and sets each day, I realized that the Bible couldn't have been written by God (who would know the truth) but by some Middle East desert dweller, who didn't know shit from shinola about science. Still the all-time stupidest un-scientific belief that most modern religions have, is that the Earth was created some 6,000 years ago. Also, how could a true all-powerful God look down upon one of his disciples on Earth buggering a 10 year old altar boy in the asshole and not do a thing to stop it?
I do not believe in a God and I think the Bible is full of shit. It is a tool designed by the few powerful to manipulate the population. It was also created by people who cannot live in an uncertain world. The most elementary statement and the beginning of wisdom is "I do not know how and why?". I mean look at the US which still outlaws prostitution and spends so much money and time policing it while letting the real criminals like bankers and CEOs get away with their crimes. I am for science and the provable. Here lies the major difference between science and religion... Religion attempts to justify things to make their stuff true while science attempts to explain why an observation occurs. I am for facts, reality, solid concrete proof. Religion is all fantasy.
No. I stopped being a believer in this nonsense at around the age of 12. I tell people believing in Santa Claus makes more sense. I refer to the bible as that 'old jewish book of fairytales'. Surprisingly, some of my favorite movies are religious-themed movies (Ben Hur, King of Kings, Ten Commandments, etc). What can i say? I'm always a sucker for a great story.
I've also studied religion over the years through several great books about the topic. One of them is called "The Jesus Papers". Very interesting book. I'm also a big fan of writer Richard Dawkins. "The God Delusion" is one of my favorite books of his. Another favorite writer of mine is the late Christopher Hitchens. You can go to YouTube and check them out in interviews. You may even learn something or be enlightened by their views. I'm also into Stephen Hawkins. And Neil Degrasse Tyson. Love them!
By the way, i'm university educated and i love science. I can't see how advanced education and a passion for science is compatible with religion. I learned last year that something like 30% of priests also happen to be atheists. Why they joined the priesthood if they weren't believers? Because they wanted to serve their fellow man and doing charity work though organized religions was the easiest and most efficient way to do it.
By the way, i believe that religions are behind the majority of wars we've had since the introduction of organized religion. Wars are started and continued over religion. And i've learned that the more fanatic you are about religion, the least tolerant towards others a person usually will be. Bad, bad, bad!
p.s. However, i respect people's right to be religious and to be believers. That's their right and i respect that.
I've also studied religion over the years through several great books about the topic. One of them is called "The Jesus Papers". Very interesting book. I'm also a big fan of writer Richard Dawkins. "The God Delusion" is one of my favorite books of his. Another favorite writer of mine is the late Christopher Hitchens. You can go to YouTube and check them out in interviews. You may even learn something or be enlightened by their views. I'm also into Stephen Hawkins. And Neil Degrasse Tyson. Love them!
By the way, i'm university educated and i love science. I can't see how advanced education and a passion for science is compatible with religion. I learned last year that something like 30% of priests also happen to be atheists. Why they joined the priesthood if they weren't believers? Because they wanted to serve their fellow man and doing charity work though organized religions was the easiest and most efficient way to do it.
By the way, i believe that religions are behind the majority of wars we've had since the introduction of organized religion. Wars are started and continued over religion. And i've learned that the more fanatic you are about religion, the least tolerant towards others a person usually will be. Bad, bad, bad!
p.s. However, i respect people's right to be religious and to be believers. That's their right and i respect that.
Sex according to Genesis Chapter 38
We should read Genesis chapter 38. God does not condemn sex nor escorts, not even...prostitutes. Judas, the founder of the tribe in which David and Jesus were born, goes with a prostitute and even gets her pregnant. God does not object to this at all. God, however does object to the fact that Judas opposed the adoption of Tamar into the tribe. Tamar rebelled, dressed up like a prostitute and 'solicited' Judas who walked happily into the trap. By getting pregnant, Tamar could finally be adopted with all the honours she deserved!
In the same chapter there is the related story of Onan. Onan is not condemned for having sex and practicing a primitive form of birth control (as in the past Catholic priests wanted us to believe!!!) but, again, because he refused to give a child to his brother's widow, thus blocking her integration into the tribe.
Please, Pope Dover, add some pearl from your Talmud notes!
The anti-sex bias came much, much later and, is mostly due to St. Paul, in my opinion. And then it became a very useful tool for controlling people (by keeping them unhappy, frustrated and feeling guilty for the wrong reasons).
This is great thread! Hopefully I'll contribute more in the next few days!
We should read Genesis chapter 38. God does not condemn sex nor escorts, not even...prostitutes. Judas, the founder of the tribe in which David and Jesus were born, goes with a prostitute and even gets her pregnant. God does not object to this at all. God, however does object to the fact that Judas opposed the adoption of Tamar into the tribe. Tamar rebelled, dressed up like a prostitute and 'solicited' Judas who walked happily into the trap. By getting pregnant, Tamar could finally be adopted with all the honours she deserved!
In the same chapter there is the related story of Onan. Onan is not condemned for having sex and practicing a primitive form of birth control (as in the past Catholic priests wanted us to believe!!!) but, again, because he refused to give a child to his brother's widow, thus blocking her integration into the tribe.
Please, Pope Dover, add some pearl from your Talmud notes!
The anti-sex bias came much, much later and, is mostly due to St. Paul, in my opinion. And then it became a very useful tool for controlling people (by keeping them unhappy, frustrated and feeling guilty for the wrong reasons).
This is great thread! Hopefully I'll contribute more in the next few days!
Hello all
Like I have said before I am agnostic ,but after studying the Bible for many years
Free will
http://biblehub.com/deuteronomy/30-18.htm
Interpretation by man for profit
Cheers
Booker
I believe in science absolutely also. But I see no reason to dismiss the existence of what we call God and a much higher state of being because of science. The problem with many religious doctrines is they were set up to serve the interests of humanity, the hopes, aspirations, fears, and weaknesses. Beyond that I find a lot that is true, very plausible, and beyond our current ability to understand. In my view to say it's all wrong, false, or BS is to say mankind knows all he can about life and the universe. It's the same kind of arrogance that created flawed self-serving doctrines in the first place.
Cheers
Yes, the Bible is full of contradictions, and so are we, human beings. I agree with you that the Bible is a wonderful book. It is (also) a wonderful mirror in which we can recognize ourselves and our contradictions. Somehow, though, these contradictions have a kind of direction: Man (short for Human Being) never gives up. After every fall there is a new beginning. In the Psalms, Man feels continuously abandoned by God, and then each Psalm ends with: Glory to God who has saved us (or variations thereof). I find the Bible extremely inspiring and useful in everyday life, regardless of the historical truth of the actual stories. In this sense, I 'believe' in the Bible: it is a source of Hope, and if I have to choose between hope and despair, I chose Hope. 'Therefore choose Life', as Booker remind us!
a god that allows children to be massacred by some lunatic is either disinterested or a bastard. either way not worth anyone's devotion. (given the amount of praying that goes on at sporting events, he may be spending too much time attending to baseball and football games. he needs to get his ass off the couch and pay attention.) religion serves its own self interests just like most institutions. the biggest lie is that religion promotes a higher level of morality- the most moral people i know are agnostics and atheists. i would rather be with the nonbelievers who cherish this life rather than surrounded by the religious fanatics who are banking on a better afterlife- those people are scary. i used to be pretty neutral on religion, thinking it may do more good than harm. i now see the religious wars and its repression of various peoples and i more often than not see it as evil.
I'm also skeptical that there even was ever a man named 'Jesus'. Many atheists do not believe in God and the Bible, but do believe that there was once a very charismatic figure named Jesus. The reason i'm skeptical is that among possibly 40 historians at the time, only 2 or 3 of them ever made mention of anyone named 'Jesus', and that happened decades after his supposed death. The stories about him which later appeared in the Bible were written hundreds of years after his supposed death. Back then, it was all mostly word-of-mouth stuff, passed on by individuals over the years. There was no internet, no newspapers, very few books at the time. Religion was used by various individuals and groups with personal agendas. For some, it was a way to inspire and regroup people. It worked with desperate people and gave them hope. It was also used as a tool to control people and groups. Making up a character in order to achieve their goals would not have been out of the ordinary.
You could also make a case that the many reasons to use religion are still in effect today. Back in the early days of Canada, the Roman Catholic Church was literally in bed with the British occupiers who had defeated the French at Quebec City on the Plains of Abraham in 1763 since the British realized being buddy-buddy with the french Roman Catholic Church would be their best way to appease the french population which colonized Lower Canada, which became the province of Quebec. Making that deal with the British rulers was also beneficial to the Catholic Church: it was allowed to operate and expand, and it gave it power not only over the french people, but within the region itself.
I would like to point out that although my origins are french-canadian, Lower Canada and it's french population were much better off with the British as their rulers instead of the French. The French pretty much only cared about their North American colony for its ressources. So you could conclude that it was actually a good thing that the Roman Catholic Church made that deal with the British rulers since it allowed them to maintain their rights and also permit them to preserve their culture and language. Had it not been the case, Quebec would be an english-speaking province today.
By the way, i also learned that there are over 20 different 'Gods' among other religions that have basically the same story as 'Jesus'. They all have pretty much the same story....born on December 25th, the three wise men, the stable, etc. So which is true and which isn't?? They are all totally different Gods within different religions....and they all have pretty much the same early story??? Give me a break!! It's all a bunch of mularkey if you ask me!!
Gods are lies and delusions made up by humans in order to exploit or destroy others. Indeed, they've also served for inspiration and to give hope to the repressed. But any 'God' is pure fiction. It doesn't exist. It's all made up. But again, people are free to chose and believe. This is what this great country allows them to do and protects their right to do so.
When you say that could you explain where it does those things specifically?
Otherwise the basic answer to why there are contradictions is not complicated. A lot early Christians fought over which were the correct beliefs and which books of many should be included in the Bible. When emperor Constantine started the opportunity for Christianity the become the state religion he required the religious leaders to come up with a unified doctrine, Bible. Generally the serious process of settllement began at the Council of Nicea in 325 and took many years to complete.
It was a human construction, debated on, given some compromise, unable to avoid contradictions.
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