IMPORTANT! -- SP's & all : PLEASE READ

[La Femme]

Imagine...

Imagine for a minute that she's telling the truth.

Yes, some of you make good points and this story could be a scam.

BUT... What if her story is true? What if she has been abused and raped just like she described. Do you think she needs people to be doubting her and implying that she's a fraud??

Do you plan on sending her money? No? Then what is the point of trying so bad to make her look like a scam artist??

Maybe she's lying... But what if she's telling the truth? If she is, most of you should be ashamed.

 

[Anna Bijou]

Now take it the other way around. Have you thought of what your actions will mean if this turns out to be false?

What actions?
Posting it for SP's, thinking there might be some out there who need the reality check I got when reading it?

I am not saying that you should give your money! I never expected anyone to do that. I am not saying you need to believe it or are not entitled to have your own doubts. I am talking about those who went well beyond that when they themselves don't know the truth any more than any of us do. I never said not to be skeptical, I just think that some people have taken it way too far and seem to be deriving far too much pleasure from it. I don't think it's fair, I don't think it's appropriate whether on a discussion board or not. There have been quite a few people on all boards that have been quite capable of expressing doubt and skepticism in a dignified, respectful and unoffensive manner.


I'm sorry but whether it is true or not, I will not feel any different than I do now about some of the cheap unnecessary comments that have been made on all the boards. To me, it's unacceptable.

Did I take it a face value? Yes. It is in my nature to trust something like this. Sometimes it may be a fault, but not always. Those were my actions. If it is proven untrue, I will be one of those fooled. But please do not make me responsible for some of the blame, because I did not, and have not once made any attempt at putting my name on the line to back up the story. I simply do not know any more than any of you. What I am livid about is the way some have chosen their words and this in no way makes me responsible for part of the blame should this not be true. Those are 2 separate issues.



I offered to help on Perb as I thought someone should if everyone was going to start doing on their own. In the end, just as I posted I received a PM from Isabelle (not just addressed to me) volunteering to do it herself. I wasn't able to get back on any boards until today (my dog badly scratched the cornea in one of my eyes on Friday - up until that post, I had been typing with one finger and using my other hand to hold my eye shut... had to lie down and woke up unable to open either eyes until this morning when the freak show was full blown.) I wasn't about to strain my eye again to read the full inquisition, but did send Isabelle a PM telling her my eye situation, that I'd be glad to help if she needed anything but that unfortunately I could not be counted on for next couple of days at least, given that I have no idea when my eye will be back to normal.

So sorry, yes perhaps I am swearing more than I should but this kind of nonsense isn't what I felt like dealing with this weekend on top of being in pain and having to spend 24hrs stuck in bed because I couldn't open my eyes! And trust me, had I known this is what the situation would turn into, I would soooo not have bothered posting it!


And I am very sorry - but the damage that could be caused to this girl if this is true is unbelievable. I mean it, you are all entitled to have doubts, no one is denying that. But those who chose to callously act out and speak out those doubts should truly be ashamed - whether this is true or not, because the bottom line is that at this time, we don't know. And it is not in any way acceptable to treat her this way when we simply do not know. Period.

The contributors are answering you: considering the consequences, getting the facts straight is a more proper way to deal with this on a public forum.

And this is what you consider getting the facts straight? How is that? No one has the facts straight?! Just a bunch of assumptions, accusations with no one to answer them! Getting the facts straight is the last thing any of this has accomplished.

And if the story is true --- is answering all of this really her priority right now?

Common wisdom. I am not saying that it should not be put on a forum like this one. Just talking for myself here: if i did put a story like this one on a public forum, I would certainly try to get a few facts straight before.

That depends. If I were to post it asking for money or support.. maybe. But I posted it for a completely different purpose.

No offense but I've seen lots of outrageous comments get support and be taken farther than can be imagined on message boards, so please excuse me if the term common wisdom means very little to me when it comes to an anonymous board. The most impressive displays on common thinking I've ever witnessed are the speed at which a story (not this one) can be twisted around and a mob go after a member, while one by one everyone get in on it.. I was looking for a term for it but couldn't find it.. I definitely do not put that much trust into what comes out of any given discussion on a board like this one. I don't care much for this mob mentality.

Knowing which members comments I trust, even if I don't share the same opinion -- is about as far as it goes. It's too easy for most people to jump on the bandwagon and just go with what everyone else is saying. It's also too easy for some to compensate for whatever shortcomings or frustration they may feel in their own lives, by being mean spirited and attacking others to release stress.

I do not think common wisdom means anything when it comes to Anonymous boards! But I do think common decency should mean something.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Mlle Bijou-

When someone is looking for money based on a story that is full of holes, the Board membership has every right to question it, and I quite frankly find your posts to be scary. You want to trust what every person in the world tells you, that is your prerogative to do so, but don't criticize others for asking questions when the alternative is to sit back and have their intelligence severely insulted.

You and the other female posters keep coming back to this being all about disrespect for a rape victim. Stop talking about the possibility of a rape for just a second. If anyone puts up a story on this Board which does not make sense, whether that story is about a client being robbed by an SP, or an SP being raped, it should be questioned.

Mlle Bijou, what if I posted a bullshit story that I met you for a $1000 dinner date and you came to my hotel room, took my money, left to go pay the taxi and never came back? What if the story was long and full of holes? Would you want readers to question the story or would you want them to blindly accept it because my handle is in red, like yours? In fact there have been stories like this about SPs robbing clients. Some of them were true, some were not. Such a story could potentially ruin you. I would expect if I put up a post and a story full of holes, if ANYONE did, the board members could, would and should question it. We cannot allow shilling by anyone for any cause when it is may be based on bullshit and not on facts. This is the Internet, and that is how this anonymous Board has to work.

What your posts are basically saying is "forget about all of the obvious questions, you boys. This is a rape victim and rape victims should never have their story questioned. We don't need to know the answers to those questions, even if there aren't any. We just need to give Nadia money. We'll worry about everything else later." That's what your postings say to me.

It seems clear that Nadia was the victim of violence but how that violence occurred, and whether it was perhaps by her own BF, is seriously in dispute. You have not in any of your posts addressed some aspects of her story which are clearly bullshit, you have not addressed how she added other details when questioned (a minor being involved) and you have married yourself to this story for better or worse, which I frankly question your judgment in doing so (there are other ways you could have helped). You may be well intentioned but you should not criticize those who expect reasonable answers to screamingly obvious questions.

 

[CaptRenault]

...it could very well be true...

...If this turns out to be 100% for sure proven true...

...If this is true...

...If this turned out to be untrue... ...

...If you look hard enough, you can find flaws in any story whether it is true or not...

...Either way, whether this is proven to be true or not...

...Whether this is true or not...

...if this turns out to be true?...

...There's nothing good about this being true or not.

...I am not saying you need to believe it or are not...

...I'm sorry but whether it is true or not...

...If it is proven untrue

...I simply do not know any more than any of you...

...if this is true is unbelievable...

...whether this is true or not...

...at this time, we don't know.

...And if the story is true...

It sounds like you're now more doubtful of the story than we are.

 

[La Femme]

I will not talk about the case here. I'll talk about this post. It is an almost perfect exemple of mind manipulation.

Twice the word imagine at the beginning. The message is simple: put your gards down, set your mind to follow me for a fews moments.

"Yes, some of you make goods points...". The message is simple: hey, be confident, I'm not attacking you all the way, you have good points.

"What if" is the follow up of "imagine".

Then comes THE question : does she need peoples doult? Who would answer no to that? It's a one possible answer type of question. Typical of mind manipulation. By the way, the answer is the same whether the story is true or not.

If you don't plan to send money, why argue? The flaw is too big here. The reason I wrote "almost" perfect case of mind manipulation.

The ending is much better: if true, you should be ashamed. Guilt: the very basic fondations on which you built mind manipulation.

Now La Femme, I encourage you to write, using EXACTLY the same format, a post starting like this:

Imagine...

Imagine for a minute that she's not telling the truth.

Why would I try to manipulate anyone? Oh, right! I must be part of the scam...

I did imagine that it could be untrue. If it is and I am wrong to believe her, what are the consequences? Nothing, except that I'll feel like a fool. Big deal.

But if I don't believe her and claim that she must be lying, I could hurt someone who is very fragile right now. If you don't care about that possibility, fine. I do.

 

[sybaritic]

MODS: Time for me to leave this Board

An important reminder that the danger is real, even if sometimes it's easy to forget or think it won't happen...... it does.
Maybe a different city, still the same community, same risks... We're all in the same boat.

Be safe everyone.

Thanks.

Let's see. Mlle Bijou comes home in a spirit a good will and good faith--misguided or not--offers a cautionary tale by referring to a story of purported rape in her community. She is immediately lambasted as "alarmist" and foolish. The purported victim's story is dissected by a bunch of genius detectives who know nothing about the person involved or the situation.

My take: 1) yes, it is a good idea to be careful; 2) if the purported victim was really brutalized she certainly doesn't deserve any of these accusations and does deserved our sympathy; 3) if the story is concocted for whatever reason the victim already has plenty of problems and deserves our pity; 4) in either case it's still a good idea to be careful.

It seems that many of you have nothing better to do than run down the less fortunate. THAT is truly pathetic.

 

[EagerBeaver]

have ANY of you called the VPD yourself?
Why not?t76

You need a case number to do that. You have criticized us for daring to ask about a case number. When you call the police to discuss a matter they usually ask you for a case number and any conversation that anyone would have with the Vancouver PD would not be a very intelligent or accurate one without that info.

Someone on PERB posted that Nadia has a case number. If you have the case number, you call up the cops, read her posts, ask the cops if that info is in any police report with that case number, and you have your answer. However if you read those PERB posts nobody should be calling the police or asking for a case number. We should shut up and accept what we are told. This makes me sick to my stomach. I have sympathy for Nadia that she was the victim of violence but I don't have sympathy if she is attempting to transform her misfortune into a capitalist venture which is exactly what it seems like she has done. I find that disgusting and despicable. If her story turns out to be false and it turns out her BF beat her, t76 will you reimburse the people who gave her money under false pretenses? When they post to complain should I PM them and tell them you will give them refunds?