It's Official Canada has adopted Nordic Model Prostitution Law

[man77777]

Without a SP cooperating with Police, I don't see how we could be caught. My only concern is the potential rarefaction of reviews and girls = higher rates and lower quality.

We need agencies and escort reviews boards to open website from abroad. That's it..

 

[daydreamer41]

I think you guys are being seriously delusional if you think there won't be a large number of johns arrested in the first couple of years of such a law. Local LE will be given budgets for it and will be expected to make arrests. Any of the following may happen:

1. Stings for Johns. In the US LE has.been known to place ads, have false accounts on boards, etc.

2. A neighbor of yours complains you invited a sexy girl into your house and you have done so many times before the new law, and the girls stay an hour or two at most. There are under 18 year olds in your hood, the neighbor reveals.

3. Hotel gets a complaint that a middle age guy is receiving young ladies in his room. They have 2 pre-teens who saw one of the young ladies enter the room. Hotel calls police. LE finds the guy with the lady. They offer her immunity to testify against the guy.

4. Travel to Canada will be made difficult for single males traveling alone.

I hope if the law passes, it will be struck down by the Supreme Court. But don't be so casual about such a law. If they pass it, they mean to find perps, no matter how nice and upstanding all of us are otherwise.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

I think you guys are being seriously delusional if you think there won't be a large number of johns arrested in the first couple of years of such a law. Local LE will be given budgets for it and will be expected to make arrests. Any of the following may happen:

4. Travel to Canada will be made difficult for single males traveling alone.

Again I do not think this law will pass so I will continue getting a good nights sleep. Your possibilities of arrest may be correct ( those could be happening without the new law ) but can you explain #4?

 

[Siocnarf]

DD41, we might see an increase of arrest after the law is passed, but that will be almost exclusively for johns of street prostitutes. I don't think the police will increase their efforts against a form of prostitution that is almost invisible. They will continue to focus on what is most visible.

It's not against the law to bring ladies to your place. Many people do it for free almost every night. Proving that you are exchanging money for sex will be almost impossible.

The Hotels will NOT call the police. Do you think they would just give up a major source of income? Some high class hotels might become less SP-friendly, but there will be plenty of places that will remain friendly. Unless they ban every man from bringing his mistress to the hotel, there's no way they can stop escorts.

 

[daydreamer41]

Again I do not think this law will pass so I will continue getting a good nights sleep. Your possibilities of arrest may be correct ( those could be happening without the new law ) but can you explain #4?

Because in my last trip, they drilled me at both sides of the border as to what the purpose of my trip, what I will be doing, what I did, etc. I think they know there are single guy travelers who come for escorts. I had an idea they were practicing for when after the law passes, if it does. Just my guess. With a new law, I think they will screen with much more scrutiny than in the past.

 

[daydreamer41]

Both Patron and Siocnarf, I read the law on here and I can see how LE could very easily get evidence to convict a john in these situations. I know how LE thinks and operate since I have had members of my family in LE. LE has much more leverage and tools than a john does.

In the case of an escort going to a hotel room and a family complaining that they have young kids and they don't like girls going in and out of a persons hotel room, or a neighbor for instance (payback for some stupid argument):

The law has a provision where both escort and patron are both culpable if minors under 18 can be in the vicinity. This is of course a very broad circumstance. Children can be almost anywhere. But in this instance, the SP also can be arrested. Therefore, LE can use leverage over the SP and offer her immunity as she would have had if the area was free from those under 18 IF she testifies against the john. Now how many SP's would. I think some would definitely and some would think very hard, may or may not. But in the end to save their own skin, they would.

As far as deleting text messages and phone records on your phone, unless you have a paid for in cash trac phone, your phone numbers can be traced via the phone company.

Will LE go to great lengths to arrest and investigate johns? Only in the beginning year to prove to their constituents who give a damn that they didn't pass a law to pay lip service and never enforce it. I am just saying LE has the resources on their side. But I agree after a certain while, enforcing it fully will be too costly. They will only respond to complaints.

 

[man77777]

1. Stings for Johns. In the US LE has.been known to place ads, have false accounts on boards, etc.

2. A neighbor of yours complains you invited a sexy girl into your house and you have done so many times before the new law, and the girls stay an hour or two at most. There are under 18 year olds in your hood, the neighbor reveals.

3. Hotel gets a complaint that a middle age guy is receiving young ladies in his room. They have 2 pre-teens who saw one of the young ladies enter the room. Hotel calls police. LE finds the guy with the lady. They offer her immunity to testify against the guy.

4. Travel to Canada will be made difficult for single males traveling alone.

Really interesting to search the way they could caught us.

1. We almost all only see girls who have good reviews, so we can't be caught like that.

2. and 3. Hotel can be a risky place.. But at home, if you ask the girl to be clothed casually and the driver not to stop just in front of your house, no worry IMO.

4. They asked me the exact same questions you get when you were alone than those they asked me when I passed with a friend or my brother or my gf. It's just their job to ask question with a suspicious look.

Moreover, as the girls risk almost nothing, they won't get any cooperations. So IMO they will focuse on boards, MP, some agencies and street prostitutes clients...

I really wonder what will be the punishments. In France (where the law will start to be applied this fall), they talked about a first sanction of 800euros and then 1600euros fine if you reoffend. If we get caught 1time per 3years, it won't ruin us...

 

[ezekiel]

Man7777 for guys receiving at home my case is a bit more risky now... i live in a building with security guard 24/24 at the entrance and guest has to sign a visting registry ..

 

[man77777]

Damn, are you living in jail ?

 

[lustfuloasis]

The biggest challenge for agencies will most likely be the internet being Monitored. Despite the fact that you find various forms of advertisement in NYC, one cannot wonder to what extent will LE dig to find us. Craiglist's therapeutic session will be a landmine field for anyone crazy enough to step through.

The good news is we have a head start to take the necessary precautions. This industry will forever be impossible to crack. This would be the time to create proper contacts, and circles to ensure future encounters go smoothly and pleasant as always. We all face a common enemy, and there's never been a greater opportunity for us to unite. Sps, Agencies and Hobbyists alike.

 

[hungry101]

I really wonder what will be the punishments. In France (where the law will start to be applied this fall), they talked about a first sanction of 800euros and then 1600euros fine if you reoffend. If we get caught 1time per 3years, it won't ruin us...

As I said, this is a tax. Yes, overall revenue into Canada will be less and it will hurt the general population. Certainly, this will cut into the money that the young SPs can make as they go to school or find their way in the world. However, the important people such as the governmental agencies and the vice squads that are doing the important work to implement and enforce this law will demand greater budgets. These will be funded on the backs of hobbyists and agency owners who will have to buy back their freedom once they are arrested in sting operations.

And don't worry. There is no way any politically correct plan such as the Nordic Model will stop prostitution. The only thing that will be different is that there will be some high profile busts so that the politicians can ruin the lives of a few Johns and agency owners on cable news. This way they can show that they are doing their jobs. Those Johns will be extorted like citizens that are arrested for "buzzed driving" with a 0.04 BA" This is kind of like when a single water buffalo is grabbed by a crocodile at the watering hole. After that the rest of us can hobby until they need to get another water buffalo

Once the Nordic Model passes, I will wait and see what the impact is and how they implement the system I may just protest and stop coming to Canada altogether. I'll look south of the border to hobby. I hate political correctness. A progressive law like the Nordic Model, where it is not illegal to sell but only illegal to buy, stinks of political correctness. I can see how this law will resonate with academia, the political elite, and the feminists. This is anti-white male. The self loathing liberal will eat this up just as much as the religious right. Political careers will be made by backing this law. It will become a litmus test I have heard whispers among feminists in the USA. It won't stop at Canada's southern border.

Let us prey I am wrong

 

[BookerL]

The biggest challenge .

Hi all
and hi lustfuloasis
May I ask what are your credentials to analyze Canadian Criminal Code and Canadian politics?Mind to share?
Please explain the difference between theory of a law and its applications ?
Regards all
BookerL

 

[lustfuloasis]

Hi BookerL,

I'm certain there are qualified professionals who can answer your inquiries in deph.
But thank you for asking, I believe we're equally intitled to share helpful opinions.
If you have any other questions, you're welcome to pm me for my email.

 

[Siocnarf]

I think internet ads will be impossible to suppress. Monitoring the whole internet to find all the private websites would require large amount of time and personnel. I'm not even sure if I understand if sex workers are allowed to have their own advertisement website. Someone cannot do advertisement for someone else, but an escort can advertise for herself. If a server is hosting a website for an escort, is the host breaking the law? The host is not doing the advertisement, only providing a service such as they would to anyone (which is legal according to the bill). If the website explicitly states that it's for adults only, I don't think it would be breaking any law. Even a website with multiple indies, such as Ouraffair, might be legal if I am correct.

 

[BookerL]

Hi BookerL,

I'm certain there are qualified professionals who can answer your inquiries in deph.
But thank you for asking, I believe we're equally intitled to share helpful opinions.
If you have any other questions, you're welcome to pm me for my email.

Hi
And yes you are certainly entitle to post !I did not say your comment was not valide !
That was not the question!
Can you or will you answer the questions ?
Regards
BookerL

 

[Siocnarf]

These will be funded on the backs of hobbyists and agency owners who will have to buy back their freedom once they are arrested in sting operations.

I believe it will be funded by the taxpayers. The basic fines are 500$ for summary conviction and 1000$ if convicted in court. They would have to convict more than 20 000 johns, just to cover the measly 20M$ they are pledging to give for ''help''. Of course, they can also seize some properties, but that's still just small change compared to how much it would cost to enforce this law to a significant extent. And if the law goes immediately to court, even if it is still valid in the meantime, I think it will be difficult to justify pouring a lot of funding into enforcement while it's future is very uncertain.

 

[ezekiel]

here come the harpeur propaganda!

http://www.lapresse.ca/actualites/politique/politique-canadienne/201406/09/01-4774272-les-canadiens-defavorables-a-la-legalisation-de-la-prostitution-selon-harper.php

 

[prophetofdoom]

Really interesting to search the way they could caught us.

If we get caught 1time per 3years, it won't ruin us...

Not sure you are getting this or perhaps your it somehow does not apply to your particular circumstances - it is not a matter of how much it will cost financially. If you are caught, you get a police record which will come up in any background checks including those required for employment or professional assignments. Also it will come up at international border crossings and this could entail being stopped when attempting to cross into a hobby friendly country.

Moreover, as the girls risk almost nothing, they won't get any cooperations. ...

I would argue the opposite is true - since they loose nothing, they will co-operate. To withhold cooperation or in any way deal with the situation in a way that would need moderately sophisticated legal sense, she would need to hire a lawyer which costs money and will make demands on her time and psychological well being. I doubt she will bother and will rather spill everything and get done with it.

 

[prophetofdoom]

Man7777 for guys receiving at home my case is a bit more risky now... i live in a building with security guard 24/24 at the entrance and guest has to sign a visting registry ..

Perhaps if you give the guard a gift of 100 $ for St Jean and $ 200 for Christmas, he will watch your back.

 

[Siocnarf]

It's very hard to compare with other countries and make predictions for us based on their laws.

You take two different countries and apply the same laws to similar extent, you will probably get different results. In the US it's been illegal for 100 years and evolved a certain way over all that time. Same with Sweden; their social situation was very different when they got the law. They thought of themselves as the moral conscience of Europe and were freaking-out after joining the UN, fearing they would be swamped with foreign sex workers.

Here we start with our own situation and if we change the law we will evolve in our own way. If you see prohibition as a disease, diseases affect different patients in different ways. SOme get really sick and others just brush it off. So far Iceland is the worst: they banned even strip clubs and are working on banning all forms of porn.
http://maggiemcneill.wordpress.com/2012/02/16/the-course-of-a-disease/