It's Official Canada has adopted Nordic Model Prostitution Law
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Lily from Montreal
And I read they will make publicity for exchange of money for sex illegal..sigh,because they said that ''all women in the sex trade are victims who do not know what's good for them,and all want out..'' grrr
That is bad but not unexpected news.
But I love the quote by Henry Miller. I was a big fan of his books even as an adolescent. His books were banned in North America until the 1960's.
The next federal election cannot come too soon so we can boot out these science and sex-hating Conservatives and bring in Justin Trudeau's Liberals or Thomas Mulcair's New Democrats.
Peace. Paix, Pax.
But I love the quote by Henry Miller. I was a big fan of his books even as an adolescent. His books were banned in North America until the 1960's.
The next federal election cannot come too soon so we can boot out these science and sex-hating Conservatives and bring in Justin Trudeau's Liberals or Thomas Mulcair's New Democrats.
Peace. Paix, Pax.
If they really do go after Johns, this forum will be a prime target for police to dive into...
As for agencies, the Minister in his remarks said that the test would be whether or not the hired staff was exploiting the women. We have always been very careful not to put ourselves in an "exploitation" position but I doubt cops will see it that way. We treat this like any other business and I know we do a lot of good on many levels... but running an incall will now be almost impossible. The Chablis and cie will become very crowded I fear...
Basically, the government is acting like a child by introducing legislation they know fully well goes against the Supreme Court ruling, in essence saying "at least we'll get our way while you go back to court to overturn the new law".
I'm VERY curious to know what everyone here thinks because I feel not many JOHNs have spoken out...
As for agencies, the Minister in his remarks said that the test would be whether or not the hired staff was exploiting the women. We have always been very careful not to put ourselves in an "exploitation" position but I doubt cops will see it that way. We treat this like any other business and I know we do a lot of good on many levels... but running an incall will now be almost impossible. The Chablis and cie will become very crowded I fear...
Basically, the government is acting like a child by introducing legislation they know fully well goes against the Supreme Court ruling, in essence saying "at least we'll get our way while you go back to court to overturn the new law".
I'm VERY curious to know what everyone here thinks because I feel not many JOHNs have spoken out...
Sad day for freedom, sad day for Canada, and dad day for our taxes which will be spent on enforcing this ridiculous legislation instead of chasing down those doing human trafficking who should be the real target.
''(b) create an offence that prohibits receiving a material benefit that derived
from the commission of an offence referred to in paragraph (a);''
Am I reading that right, and does that criminalize the selling of sex? So it's not a Nordic Model at all? From my understanding of what I read it looks like full criminalization.
Combine this bill with the cyber-bullying bill and we might just as well close the internet....
Do they define anywhere what is a sexual service?
from the commission of an offence referred to in paragraph (a);''
Am I reading that right, and does that criminalize the selling of sex? So it's not a Nordic Model at all? From my understanding of what I read it looks like full criminalization.
Combine this bill with the cyber-bullying bill and we might just as well close the internet....
Do they define anywhere what is a sexual service?
I didn't read carefully enough; there is a line saying:
''286.5 (1) No person shall be prosecuted for (a) an offence under section 286.2 if the benefit is derived from the provision of their own sexual services; or (b) an offence under section 286.4 in relation to the advertisement of their own sexual services.''
So selling would be legal I guess.
Would offering your service constitute a crime in that you are inciting someone to commit a crime?
''286.5 (1) No person shall be prosecuted for (a) an offence under section 286.2 if the benefit is derived from the provision of their own sexual services; or (b) an offence under section 286.4 in relation to the advertisement of their own sexual services.''
So selling would be legal I guess.
Would offering your service constitute a crime in that you are inciting someone to commit a crime?
We need to put a face to the "Johns" and "Pimps" and "Victims" they accuse us all of being...
I know I can't do anything alone... but couldnt we possible plan a march before this law passes?
I feel powerless but I want to do wht I can to not let this happen...
I know I can't do anything alone... but couldnt we possible plan a march before this law passes?
I feel powerless but I want to do wht I can to not let this happen...
Trudeau is also in favor of the Nordic model. This is a funny picture:
http://maggiemcneill.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/say-no-to-the-nordic-model-in-canada1.png
It seems that the government wishes to punish you uppity whores* for daring to challenge their laws in court! Sniveling bullshit! Here's hoping that the new laws don't pass, or failing that get shot down immediately in court. But most of all, here's hoping that my dear old friends in Canada won't be damaged by this seemingly draconian change.
Best wishes and good luck to you all!
*I use this word with unadulterated affection, in the Maggie McNeill sense.
Best wishes and good luck to you all!
*I use this word with unadulterated affection, in the Maggie McNeill sense.
It is really up to the Stella organization and the other organizations in place that fight for the rights of sex workers to challenge this law in court. I am not very familiar with the statutory, constitutional and/or common law grounds that may serve as a basis for challenging it. In the USA, prosecutions against the owners of the adult website bigdoggie.net were successfully thrown out on various constitutional grounds (including violation of the right to a speedy trial). However since the law assumes victimization of all sex workers that assumption stands unless challenged.
Doesn't Canada have a Civil Liberties Union of some kind that Stella can hire or do they have their own counsel?
Doesn't Canada have a Civil Liberties Union of some kind that Stella can hire or do they have their own counsel?
I've read most of the whole thing, but it is hard to interpret.
Well, it will be illegal to advertise or buy ''sexual services'', but they do not define what it is. It's like saying you can't buy drugs and letting police and judges decide witch substances are illegal or not. Also they do not define what constitutes ''obtaining for consideration'' (buying).
The way I see it, so long as escorts services do not advertise sex explicitly, there's nothing they can do against agencies. I think they do not say anything about having sex with someone that you are currently paying for a different service.
I'm curious to see how it will be received by other politicians.
Well, it will be illegal to advertise or buy ''sexual services'', but they do not define what it is. It's like saying you can't buy drugs and letting police and judges decide witch substances are illegal or not. Also they do not define what constitutes ''obtaining for consideration'' (buying).
The way I see it, so long as escorts services do not advertise sex explicitly, there's nothing they can do against agencies. I think they do not say anything about having sex with someone that you are currently paying for a different service.
I'm curious to see how it will be received by other politicians.
According to Bill Clinton a blow job is not a sexual service. Get him on the bench as your judge and you are all set.
This is what I am thinking also, I have never purchased the services of a prostitute therefor this new bill will not affect me one bit if it gets passed, I only see escorts for their companionship.
C'est le plus vieux métier du monde.C'a a toujours existé,ca va toujours exister...Il n'y a aucune loi qui ne pourra jamais rien y changer!
Ca va juste se faire différemment,mais ca va se faire quand meme...De temps en temps on va entendre aux nouvelles qu'ils en ont poigné un ou deux ''salauds''...des écoeurants et blablabla puis on en entendra plus parler pour 6 mois
mais ca va continuer comme avant parce qu'on ne peut pas l'empecher.
C'est comme l'alcool,c'est comme le jeu,c'est comme la drogue,la seule option logique de n'importe quel gouvernement c'est de légaliser et controler,pas réprimer.
Qu'on s'attaque aux proxénetes et aux exploiteurs de mineurs(res) et qu'on laisse les adultes consentants en paix.
Ca va juste se faire différemment,mais ca va se faire quand meme...De temps en temps on va entendre aux nouvelles qu'ils en ont poigné un ou deux ''salauds''...des écoeurants et blablabla puis on en entendra plus parler pour 6 mois
mais ca va continuer comme avant parce qu'on ne peut pas l'empecher.
C'est comme l'alcool,c'est comme le jeu,c'est comme la drogue,la seule option logique de n'importe quel gouvernement c'est de légaliser et controler,pas réprimer.
Qu'on s'attaque aux proxénetes et aux exploiteurs de mineurs(res) et qu'on laisse les adultes consentants en paix.
I'm not an expert, but I am not sure if selling would be actually LEGAL here. There is simply an ''immunity'' provision saying that people will not be prosecuted if the crime involves their own sexual services.
I'm not sure, but this is unlikely to be a major problem. In Sweden, prostitutes refuse to testify most of the time. They don't want to lose their clients. What will be a bigger problem is that no client will be willing to testify or report cases of abuse in cases of REAL crimes.
Patron, the keywords are sexual service. They can't remove a website for advertise time in the company of a young woman in lingerie, or even erotic massages. Incalls were already illegal. They still need months of investigation to prove that sex is being sold and close a place.
Another nugget: anyone who is a real-life boyfriend or roommate of a prostitute will be considered a pimp, except if they are in a legal relationship.
I'm not really sure presently if I am well understanding this project of law (and for the moment, this is only a project... that's not yet the law... )
But it seems, at first sight, it is really much more worst that what we are used to have. What I heard on the news is not really positive to my eyes.
But it seems, at first sight, it is really much more worst that what we are used to have. What I heard on the news is not really positive to my eyes.
Mizo: the politicians will have to vote on it with a majority to pass it as a law.
I don't understand how it arrived to this; there was the invalidation of the ancient laws... because they were against the human rights, and now, that's even worst.
We will see what will be happening with all that.
I don't understand how it arrived to this; there was the invalidation of the ancient laws... because they were against the human rights, and now, that's even worst.
We will see what will be happening with all that.
Allo Maria! Ça sonne épeurant, mais dans le fond, ce n'est pas tellement différent des lois que l'on avait avant. Comment est-ce qu'ils peuvent prouver quoi que ce soit entre deux adultes consentants? Ils veulent juste essayer de garder cela le plus invisible possible. Évidemment c'est autant discriminatoire et inconstitutionnel qu'avant. Je pense que c'est la dernière lutte qui commence pour la décriminalisation finale. Quand le lion est blessé à mort, c'est là qu'il devient le plus agressif.
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