Why Jacques Villeneuve ditched Quebec

[HornyForEver]

...Human beings do best when they stop thinking like kings and popes who preach dictatorial ethics that there are only two sides and my side is the only right side.

Most people fail to perceive all those shades of gray in real life. Dichotomy has the advantage of being simple, maybe people go for a binary view of the world out of laziness. It still suprises me to read some radical posts on merb, a board which is supposed to gather open-minded folks. But, I guess that it is hard to avoid radical thinkers wherever you go.

A final note and to put things in perspective (or at least I will try to). I had the impression when reading this thread that visitors from the south think that Montreal is Quebec and that Quebec is Montreal. This is very far from the truth. I have been living here since ages, but still whenever I visit a place outside Montreal, I live a new cultural experience. So, to add to this binary view of the world, one can safely state that there is Montreal and there is the rest of Québec. What applies to Montreal does not necessarily hold in Chibougamou and maybe not even in Longeuil!!!

 

[Doc Holliday]

A final note and to put things in perspective (or at least I will try to). I had the impression when reading this thread that visitors from the south think that Montreal is Quebec and that Quebec is Montreal. This is very far from the truth. I have been living here since ages, but still whenever I visit a place outside Montreal, I live a new cultural experience. So, to add to this binary view of the world, one can safely state that there is Montreal and there is the rest of Québec.

I truly agree. Montreal itself is not an accurate reflection of what's outside of Montreal. I once took a family member out to dinner in Montreal. He felt like home, being able to speak in the language of his chosing. He read the menu & there was both a french & an english version. The following day, i took him to Longueuil to my favorite restaurant at the time. I had lived in Longueuil many years ago & at the time did my best to say away from Montreal, preferring treking to Quebec City instead on some weekends. I loved Quebec City's culture & history. Didn't really like Montreal much due to the size of the city, the pollution, etc. Anyways, we're at this restaurant in Longueuil, and my sibbling appeared anxious. I asked him what the problem was, and he replied he felt like he was in a different world. Everyone spoke french around him, he was addressed in french, and the items on the menu were all mostly in french. Even though we could see Mtl out the restaurant's window, the entire setting off-island felt entirely different.

What applies to Montreal does not necessarily hold in Chibougamou and maybe not even in Longeuil!!!

Chibougamau. Nice little town of about 7000 habitants in northwestern Quebec where the people are very friendly. Too bad it's so damn far....

 

[man77777]

Man35, there are morons everywhere.

That's what I wrote at least 10times in this thread... Anyway...

 

[man77777]

À mon humble avis, le sujet de la langue a été instrumentalisé pour que les Marois et petits amis assouvissent leur soif de pouvoir politique.

100% agree to say that Marois and all the other morrons used language issues just to gain more power.

But it's also true that french-haters use Marois and all the separatists to spread their anti-french propaganda, by associating all the quebeckers to them.

Btw, I never had any answers, who is separatist in here except H.Mike who is 20yo ?

 

[Halloween Mike]

28 for the record... lets say closer to 30 than 20...

I doubt there is much separatist as the board is mostly english speakers, a lot from the usa or ontario too...

See i don't like Matante Pauline, i think she is a joke to the PQ and Mister Levesque is probably rolling in his tomb right now to see his PQ in her hand, yet i remain separatist. Its not the thing that matter the most in my life, im not die hard as some, but you would give me a choice... sure i go with the separate way... why not.

 

[man77777]

the board is mostly english speakers, a lot from the usa or ontario too...

IMO, there is a majority of frenchspeaker as mother tongue in here. We just use English cause we know 99% of the englishspeakers cant speak french and that a majority of frenchspeakers can speak English.

Anyway the fact we write in English on merb says a lot about the City of Montreal...

Ok so we have just one separatist (for how many members ?). A 28yo separatist who use English to speak on M(ontréal)ERB... Ok, scary bouh... Who else ?

 

[Techman]

Tell me something, Merlot...what is so wrong with my position?


I accept that some laws in regards to the French language are fine. That includes requiring the French language in a predominant position, not necessarily TWICE as large but predominant, on commercial signs. I have no problem with French language instruction being mandatory in all English schools and that everyone in a position dealing with the public should be required to be able to communicate in French and if a private company wants to do business with the public only in French, they should have the right to do so if they desire. I believe that any employee of ANY sized company should be able to have their computer software in French if they wish and the software is available in French.


I am against the banning of the apostrophe in business signage and company names. I am against the francization of company names. If someone is opening a business they have the right to call it whatever the hell they want to, they are investing their own money after all, as long as they have a French equivalent on their sign in a predominant position.


I am against legislation that forces Francophone Quebecers to educate their children in French only. I believe they should have the choice to educate their children in the language of their choice where the institutions are available, they are Quebec and Canadian citizens after all and pay their taxes like everyone else. Immigrants from English speaking countries, such as the US, should also have this choice if their children have already begun their education in English. I have no problem with requiring immigrants who speak neither French or English as their primary language to educate their children in French.


I believe that all municipal signage in the greater Montreal area, such as traffic signs, Metro informational signs, parking meters, etc... should be either bilingual or in Internationally recognized icons. I believe that all city or government employees in MONTREAL who deal with the public in any capacity, such as Metro ticket takers, bus drivers, police officers, paramedics, fire fighters, etc... should have bilingualism as a requirement for the job.


My position, Merlot, is that all citizens of Quebec and of Canada have equal rights no matter the language they speak, no matter the colour of their skin, no matter their religious beliefs or their sexual preference. They should be able to express themselves in their language of choice and should not be persecuted for that choice and their preference should not be made illegal under the law.


Equal rights for all, Merlot. Can you tell me what is wrong with that and why you find it so objectionable? Can you tell me where you consider my thinking to be narrow?

 

[Merlot]

Hello all,

...your views are totally meaningless.

For a guy you called "brainwashed" and "meaningless" you sure have given me a lot of attention, including that huge post #166 and in this fairly large post #194 after saying my opinion is worthless. Why not just drop the insult posturing.

I accept that some laws in regards to the French language are fine.

WHOA!!! You actually wrote this? Did Mazingerz hack into your computer? If you had said this before I missed it. It would have saved a lot of contentiousness.

That includes requiring the French language in a predominant position, not necessarily TWICE as large but predominant, on commercial signs. I have no problem with French language instruction being mandatory in all English schools and that everyone in a position dealing with the public should be required to be able to communicate in French and if a private company wants to do business with the public only in French, they should have the right to do so if they desire. I believe that any employee of ANY sized company should be able to have their computer software in French if they wish and the software is available in French.

DOUBLE Whoooooaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!! This is not just taking "a side". Except for some details it's the same kind of thinking, trying to be rational and considerate, you've been calling me brainwashed and meaningless for posting.

Frankly, some of this is closer to the Left (shockingly) than I would go. In my view the laws for displaying language should only be that both are required and each must be noticeable and readable. Let the businesses who want to enlarge one or the other do so but no more than double the size of the other. Both languages should be mandatory in all schools, and the regulation should written in a way that would not seem to indicate this was done because either cultural group has been disadvantaged in the past. Just keep it generically unbiased. As for any laws about computer software, companies should be wise enough to do what gives the best chance to succeed in business. If limiting anything to one language loses potential customers then the answer is clear.

Anyone in a publicly funded job who can be proven to refuse to serve any customer acting decently, never mind for reasons of cultural bias, should be fired. But in cases of cultural bias issues the overseeing government sector in charge could also be liable.

Damn...it's almost like you said..."VIVRE LES FRANCAIS". Don't worry I have no intention of exploding with attacks because of three words.

Your post has a very considerate tone. So what was all the past garbage for?

Bonne fin de semaine, :thumb:

Merlot

 

[Gentle]

See... I knew this thread it was just another excuse to crap on Quebec and Mtrl.

While Ontario is in the bowl itself while having been rescued by all Canada for its auto-industry moribond
http://www.torontosun.com/2013/02/08/ontario-job-losses-highest-in-country

and Alberta is going back in deficit despite having one of the biggest oil supply in the world.
Now you have 2 be dumb in finances !
http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/03/07/alberta-budget-2013/

No wonder they still are pouring Millions into loosing hockey teams of Epic proportions !
When it's not having politiciens on crack !

If JV was really going because of Mtrl's economy, then why not going to Vancouver ? or any other provinces who are now going back in deficit like Ontario, Alberta, etc... ?

EASY ! HE'S GOING TO ANDORRA for tax evasion ! and got 'booted' out from people in Quebec for craping on Mtrl just like some of the people who are doing the same, yet coming back to see Mtrl SPs because they can't afford to pay more for the same quality or to pay the travel expenses to get the same for less elsewhere.

BIG BABIES !

WE ARE FINALLY GETTING RID OF ALL THE CORRUPTION THE LAST FEDERALIST GOV. HAS BEEN TRYING DESPERATELY TO HIDE !
AND THE RATS ARE GOING OUT BEFORE GETTING CAUGHT !

WHAT A DEAL !!!

Canada's Debt : 1.5 Trillions
Per people : 45K
per % GDP : 86.5%
Annual change : +4%

And this is DESPITE having huge amount of ressources including all the TAR Sands.

Can you imagine a more corrupted federalist gov. ?

The a$$holes can't even deal with the problem of getting the oil out of Canada !
What a bunch of losers !

And they come to beg for Quebec's ressources telling us we should sell it the same way they do wich is basically making deficits.

YOU have to be really sh!tty at managing the economy which is reflected in all the scandals in Ottawa, Ontario, Alberta, etc...

While pointing at Quebec's corruption put in place by the same kind of people : FEDERALISTS ! who never care for this land other than when they can steal from it and it's people.

It was the same about Canada's banking system, these douche were gloating on how much Canada was doing better than the US until they got caught themselves in hiding the real situation.

IF JV wants to really say what he means then how about starting to say how crap he has been in racing since his best time in the beginning ?
Because a cat is a cat !

Unless you're always some kind of a hero after 1 win even if you failed a thousand time after !

Something, some on this board seems to think.
No wonder they still go for some dead hockey team living in the past !

 

[Atlante 007]

Si MR villeneuve quitte le pays pour aller vivre ailleurs, c'est son affaire. La seule chose qu'il doit respecter c'est de ne pas dénigrer le peuple qui l'a toujours adulé. Il a remporté le championnat des conducteurs une seule fois, car il avait la meilleure équipe et la meilleure voiture. Ensuite, on a vu ce qu'il a fait...

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

I was gonna stay out of this thread until I read gentle's comment. People are not shitting on Quebec just telling it like it is. Alberta is in a deficit because between 60 to 100 thousand people move there every year and new infastructure, schools and hospitals are needed ( Quebec does not have that problem as people are leaving ). Alberta has to give 6 billion a year to help support Quebec as they receive 8 billion a year because they can not manage to survive on their own. It is not Alberta that can not get the oil out, it is the states and BC that will not let it through without lots of cash thrown at them. And do not mention anything about politicians ( I do not like any of them no matter what province ) when you live in the most corrupt place in Canada. The only reason the PQ won was because the liberals were completely corrupt and with the people knowing that they still only barely won. This thread should be closed because it no longer has anything to do with JV leaving Quebec.

 

[Gentle]

And for those who crap on Quebec's gov. which is not the best solution.
I'd rather see Marois on the moon instead myself.

Here is where all the sh!t came from :

Quebec debt highest in Canada and climbing
Rhéal Séguin
The Globe and Mail - On the previous Federalist Gov. of Quebec.

The Quebec government is losing the battle to bring down the province’s hefty debt, with Finance Minister Monique-Jérôme Forget (Charest finance minister) acknowledging that it will continue to rise.

Quebec’s debt, according to Ministry of Finance figures, was $122.4-billion, the highest among the provinces and higher than what the government projected the previous year.

"Because of the construction of infrastructures ... that we have the responsibility to undertake, it will be necessary to carry additional debt," Ms. Forget said in the National Assembly yesterday. "What we have to do is control the debt and extend the cost over a period of time that will be equitable for the current generation and for generations to come."

NOW WE ALL KNOW WHERE THE MONEY WENT with the help of Charbonneau's comission CHAREST DIDN'T WANT FOR 2 YEARS WHEN EVERYONE BUT THE CROOKS WERE ASKING FOR IT !

"The provincial auditor has been asking the previous government for a long time to present an accurate picture of the province’s public finances and to stop disguising the reality."

But never got it !

AREN'T WE GLAD WE'RE GETTING RID OF THIS CORRUPTION ?
INCLUDING PEOPLE WHO NEVER GAVE A SH!T ABOUT THIS LAND ?

YES WE ARE !

FRANKLY I'D LIKE TO SEE LIBS BACK in the GOV. SEAT to get rid of MAROIS but AS LONG AS IT IS REALLY QUEBEC LIBS AND NOT A POLITICAL PARTY MADE ON THE SAME PATERN AS THE PREVIOUS WHICH CAME DIRECTLY FROM CHAREST AND HIS FEDERALIST OTTAWA INSPIRATION SH!T !

AS FOR JV ? EVEN HIS UNCLE STILL IS A BETTER MAN THAN HIM !

THAT'S THE OTHER JACQUES VILLENEUVE ! THE REAL ONE ! NOT SOME DUMBA$$ KID WHO COLORED HIS HAIR RAINBOW, TRIED SINGING OR KEPT ON CRAPING ON EVERYONE (including all the people who helped him) TO GET ATTENTION...

FOR THE REAL JACQUES... IT ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT RACING !

TADA !

 

[Techman]

Merlot, I guess you have not been following my posts on this subject as closely as you claim. What I posted yesterday has been my position from day one of any Quebec language discussion and has been repeated many times, probably each time one of the loonies around here claims that I'm a French hater and a Quebec hater. Unfortunately people tend to read what they want to read and ignore whatever doesn't suit their agenda.

Gentle, Oncle Jacques was, is and always will be a poor driver competing in second and third rate circuits. He has failed at each attempt to advance to the big leagues, attempts which he was only given because of who his brother was. And trying to blame all of Quebec's woes on Charest is a sad attempt to shift the blame from where it belongs, the separatist movement, to anyone else. I really love trying to use infrastructure spending as a reason for the debt problem in Quebec. If the money wasted on the constant pursuit of separatism and language xenophobia had been invested in infrastructure for the past almost 40 years instead, we wouldn't be in this shitty condition in the first place. But it's much more important to have the language Gestapo, The Apostrophe SS, going around harassing people than fixing the infrastructure.

 

[man77777]

Ontario is in the bowl itself while having been rescued by all Canada for its auto-industry moribond
http://www.torontosun.com/2013/02/08/ontario-job-losses-highest-in-country

Alberta is going back in deficit despite having one of the biggest oil supply in the world.
Now you have 2 be dumb in finances !
http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/03/07/alberta-budget-2013/

Yeap, and these guys come and want to give lesson of finance to Québec... They also dont give a shiit about frenchspeakers in their own provinces, but blame Québec not to be englishspeakers friendly enough..

The best way to deflect attention from your own defaults is probably to blame the others for having it... That's what the Scapegoats concept is all about...

 

[Techman]

The best way to deflect attention from your own defaults is probably to blame the others for having it... That's what the Scapegoats concept is all about...

And you and others like you have perfected this to an art form.

 

[man77777]

No argument in your post once again.. You're just boring Techman...

 

[Techman]

No argument was necessary. Quebec French language nuts like you always like to use how things are in the rest of Canada or elsewhere in the world to deflect responsibility for their actions here in Quebec. You did it yourself in your last post and then include the line I quoted which was actually hilarious! Hypocrisy at it's finest! :lol:

 

[Techman]

Can you show me some examples of my so called 'intolerance' that you love to claim? If there's one person who never has a valid argument, it's you. As much as I have problems with Merlot's way of thinking at times and do not always agree with him, at least he does his best to get his point across. All you can do is invent points of view that don't exist and can't even start to present an argument without going beyond the borders of Quebec which instantly invalidates it.

 

[Merlot]

Hello all,

Merlot, I guess you have not been following my posts on this subject as closely as you claim. What I posted yesterday has been my position from day one of any Quebec language discussion and has been repeated many times,

https://merb.cc/vbulletin/showthrea...-(Bill-14)/page3&highlight=vivre+les+francais

Actually, it turns out I have been paying attention. To be fair I went back and checked through your posts in at least one thread on this issue. There is absolutely nothing specific or considerate and conciliatory as your post #194 in this thread. Yes, you made some idealistic generalizations about equality, freedom, rights, etc. But your focus was on fighting back, attack, knocking down...with a significant dose of insults, and the same mischaracterization methods you blast in others. Then after all of that your post 194 is more slightly accepting of the language laws than I am. So who was not paying enough attention to our positions.

I don`t blame you for being very angry at the Separatists and their leaders. I`ve always said Separatism is a bad idea, just like my friend you called a Separatist who isn`t. I understand the impulse for Separatism and the reasons for it, but I can`t stand Marois and her ilk. Still, nearly everything in your posts in the link above is based on the Separatist threat, battling them and blasting anyone with any molecule of sympathy for any part of the language laws. Then you turn out to be partially accepting of the more reasonable and logical laws after all.

As I said in the previous thread, you were too over-wrought emotionally to articulate anything as clearly or moderately as post 194, or be fair to the people who deserved it. If there was misunderstanding you went miles to help create it, even if that misunderstanding wasn`t one-sided.

100% agree to say that Marois and all the other morrons used language issues just to gain more power.

Power is definitely an element in the methods of people like Marois, and I have no doubt that some of what she does is partially designed to divide the populace by inflaming their more emotional and irrational impulses to push those in the middle to choose sides, inevitably drawing more to her views because the hyper push back from the other side. Some on both sides have been unwitting cooperators with her methods...often all too willingly and unthinkingly. It`s really a damn shame that people here have aided Marois by falling back on thinking in stereotypes that polarize the issue more toward limiting it into two unyielding sides instead of trying to understand and find...rational sympathy and Common Ground.

http://www.amazon.com/Middle-Ground-Republics-1650-1815-American/dp/0521183448

One of my favorites read long ago.

Cheers,

Merlot

 

[Techman]

I have zero tolerance for people who try to destroy my country or those who discriminate against others for ANY reason. I would be willing to die for my country and I consider anyone who tries to destroy it to be a traitor. If someone doesn't like that, tough shit.

And yes, Merlot, I will fight back and will encourage anyone with a spine to do so as well. No one should allow anyone else to walk all over their rights under any circumstances and I am ashamed of our political leaders who allow this to happen. I consider them to be as spineless as a jellyfish.