Yes, 12M this year, plus 45% luxury tax of the 18M AAV. The savings comes in 2014.
Winter Blues: 2012 Official Offseason Baseball Thread
- Thread starter lgna69xxx
- Start date
Neither article says anything about him arriving from Det. hurt. BTW, if Jeter or Youk had a minor pull like that, you think they'd tell Girardi about it and get pulled from the lineup.
The Jays just announced they'd optioned Ricky Romero to Class A Dunedin. He sucked all season long last year, and sucked all spring. J.A. Happ willl likely get his 5th spot in the rotation.
Maybe the Yankees will make a move for Romero. What do you think?
(He's probably considered too young for them, so i doubt they'd want him....)
Maybe the Yankees will make a move for Romero. What do you think?
(He's probably considered too young for them, so i doubt they'd want him....)
There's an article in the WSJ today about the Yankees fielding an All Star team this year: the 2006 All Star team. I'll give you the link later.
Too young. Maybe in 8-10 years.
Considering the Yankees still need help at the catcher position, maybe they could coax Pat Borders out of retirement. There's always Gregg Zaun, whom i'm sure could be lured out of the broadcast booth for the right price.....
Just happened to turn over to the Yanks spring training game from the Leafs intermission to catch the final out of yet another perfect outing from Mariano Rivera. Trust me Doc, Mo is Mo and will likely have a typical Mariano season. (as long as he doesnt try to shag any batting practice balls anymore) 
OMG,
What's relevant is that Cashman the great and all-knowing and the mighty Yankees got taken like stooges by damaged goods with a "fucked up" swing. Damn that Scott Boras is some fantastic salesman. :lol:
BTW, all of this quibbling about what Wells will cost is amusing. How things have changed when the Yankees are worried about money and their fans fight so hard to justify player value. It's all besides the point of whether he can contribute on the field.
I just heard at around 2:00 that Overbay had been cut by the Sox, and now the Yankees have picked him up already. The empire must be getting pretty desperate to leap after the Sox droppings. :nod:
In the meantime, as reported by WEEI, both Lester and Buchholz have ERAs under 1.00 so far during this spring training. Now before anyone goes on about how it's not the regular season yet, please point out your own sub 1.00 ERA pitchers under the same circumstances. :thumb:
Cheers BOYZ,
Merlot
From the Wall Street Journal this morning. Pretty funny.
If Only the Yankees Could Buy a Time Machine
By DANIEL BARBARISI
It was the year 2006, and the 2013 Yankees were at the height of their glory.
Gas was $3 a gallon, few had ever heard of predatory lending and Mike Trout was still slogging through basic algebra. For the players on the 2013 Yankees, those were the good old days.
If the Yankees' goal was to reassemble a 2006 All-Star team, then congratulations—they have succeeded. With the looming addition of Vernon Wells, whose trade to the Yankees should become official soon, and the signing of Chien-Ming Wang to a minor-league deal, the Yankees are amassing a 2006 juggernaut—seven years too late.
With Wells and Wang on board, the 2013 Yankees don't have to listen to the pundits predicting they will finish below .500, or miss the playoffs. Instead, they will be able to hang out in the clubhouse—or, these days, in the trainer's room—and reminisce about the good ol' days, when they led the league in statistics that didn't involve the age of the team (which is the oldest in baseball, naturally).
It is easy to see that the Yankees have several stars whose best years are behind them, but 2006 represents a moment in time when nearly all of these players were at their peak. Ichiro Suzuki led the majors in hits, while Travis Hafner led the American League in on-base plus slugging percentage. Wang was the AL Cy Young runner up. Alex Rodriguez and Mariano Rivera had typically stellar seasons, and Robinson Cano established himself as a star. Derek Jeter had one of the best years of his career, finishing second in the AL most-valuable player balloting to Justin Morneau.
In fact, that 2006 AL MVP race reads like a 2013 Yankee roster.
In 2006, 30 players received AL MVP votes. The Yankees, amazingly, have eight of those players on their 2013 roster. Only 24 of the 30 MVP finalists remain in the majors, meaning that the Yankees have fully a third of those players under their control.
That doesn't include Mark Teixeira, who hit .282 with 33 home runs in 2006; Andy Pettitte, who won 14 games for the Houston Astros; CC Sabathia, who put up a 3.22 ERA for the Cleveland Indians as he ramped up to his 2007 Cy Young campaign, or Kevin Youkilis and Curtis Granderson, who had strong seasons in their first years as regulars.
There are reasons for this glut of 2006 stars, of course.
The Yankees want talented players on short-term contracts, and are often able to eat some money to make it happen—as is the case with the acquisitions of Wells this spring and Ichiro Suzuki last year. They are in the business of handing out megadeals to keep big-name stars, which is why Jeter and Rodriguez are still wearing pinstripes.
They love platoon players who may have lost a step or some bat speed, but who can still do a few things well—like Hafner, who can still hit right-handed pitching. And older players like the Yankee environment, where it is the players under 30 who are the exceptions, not the graybeards.
All spring, the Yankees have taken their age—and the reminders of what they used to be—as another challenge to overcome.
"I prefer to think of us as experienced," Teixeira said.
"Age doesn't make a difference," Jeter said. "If you do well they say you're experienced. If you don't, they say it's age. It just depends on the angle of the story."
But none of that changes the fact that this is an ancient team, one of the oldest in baseball history—and one that barely raises its average age by acquiring the 34-year-old Wells.
The Yankees are bringing Wells aboard to be the full-time left fielder until Granderson returns, and then to be a bench outfielder and a right-handed DH. They will do so at a relatively modest cost, as the Angels are covering just under $30 million of the $42 million still owed Wells through 2014.
But oh, if they could have had the player he was in 2006. Wells was a force then. With the Toronto Blue Jays, he hit .303 with 40 doubles, 32 homers and 17 steals, as he finished 22nd in the aforementioned AL MVP race.
The Yankees are banking that they can still squeeze a drop of that kind of production out of him, and out of their other faded stars, in the hopes that the whole will add up to a playoff team.
If they can't? Well, they'll always have 2006.
If Only the Yankees Could Buy a Time Machine
By DANIEL BARBARISI
It was the year 2006, and the 2013 Yankees were at the height of their glory.
Gas was $3 a gallon, few had ever heard of predatory lending and Mike Trout was still slogging through basic algebra. For the players on the 2013 Yankees, those were the good old days.
If the Yankees' goal was to reassemble a 2006 All-Star team, then congratulations—they have succeeded. With the looming addition of Vernon Wells, whose trade to the Yankees should become official soon, and the signing of Chien-Ming Wang to a minor-league deal, the Yankees are amassing a 2006 juggernaut—seven years too late.
With Wells and Wang on board, the 2013 Yankees don't have to listen to the pundits predicting they will finish below .500, or miss the playoffs. Instead, they will be able to hang out in the clubhouse—or, these days, in the trainer's room—and reminisce about the good ol' days, when they led the league in statistics that didn't involve the age of the team (which is the oldest in baseball, naturally).
It is easy to see that the Yankees have several stars whose best years are behind them, but 2006 represents a moment in time when nearly all of these players were at their peak. Ichiro Suzuki led the majors in hits, while Travis Hafner led the American League in on-base plus slugging percentage. Wang was the AL Cy Young runner up. Alex Rodriguez and Mariano Rivera had typically stellar seasons, and Robinson Cano established himself as a star. Derek Jeter had one of the best years of his career, finishing second in the AL most-valuable player balloting to Justin Morneau.
In fact, that 2006 AL MVP race reads like a 2013 Yankee roster.
In 2006, 30 players received AL MVP votes. The Yankees, amazingly, have eight of those players on their 2013 roster. Only 24 of the 30 MVP finalists remain in the majors, meaning that the Yankees have fully a third of those players under their control.
That doesn't include Mark Teixeira, who hit .282 with 33 home runs in 2006; Andy Pettitte, who won 14 games for the Houston Astros; CC Sabathia, who put up a 3.22 ERA for the Cleveland Indians as he ramped up to his 2007 Cy Young campaign, or Kevin Youkilis and Curtis Granderson, who had strong seasons in their first years as regulars.
There are reasons for this glut of 2006 stars, of course.
The Yankees want talented players on short-term contracts, and are often able to eat some money to make it happen—as is the case with the acquisitions of Wells this spring and Ichiro Suzuki last year. They are in the business of handing out megadeals to keep big-name stars, which is why Jeter and Rodriguez are still wearing pinstripes.
They love platoon players who may have lost a step or some bat speed, but who can still do a few things well—like Hafner, who can still hit right-handed pitching. And older players like the Yankee environment, where it is the players under 30 who are the exceptions, not the graybeards.
All spring, the Yankees have taken their age—and the reminders of what they used to be—as another challenge to overcome.
"I prefer to think of us as experienced," Teixeira said.
"Age doesn't make a difference," Jeter said. "If you do well they say you're experienced. If you don't, they say it's age. It just depends on the angle of the story."
But none of that changes the fact that this is an ancient team, one of the oldest in baseball history—and one that barely raises its average age by acquiring the 34-year-old Wells.
The Yankees are bringing Wells aboard to be the full-time left fielder until Granderson returns, and then to be a bench outfielder and a right-handed DH. They will do so at a relatively modest cost, as the Angels are covering just under $30 million of the $42 million still owed Wells through 2014.
But oh, if they could have had the player he was in 2006. Wells was a force then. With the Toronto Blue Jays, he hit .303 with 40 doubles, 32 homers and 17 steals, as he finished 22nd in the aforementioned AL MVP race.
The Yankees are banking that they can still squeeze a drop of that kind of production out of him, and out of their other faded stars, in the hopes that the whole will add up to a playoff team.
If they can't? Well, they'll always have 2006.
Thanks for the clarification, CF. Now explain this...by the formula as you lay it out, the Yankees would be subject to a $500,000 luxury tax hit next year should they exceed the threshold. However, Mark Feinsand has reported that the Yankees will actually get a credit in 2014, without actually explaining it in a way that I can understand. Do you?
A few points:
-Mariano Rivera might still be a very good relief pitcher. However, if the Yankees can't score any runs & be leading in the 8th & 9th inning, what good will he be?
-Vernon Wells is done. Mark my words. He's a strikeout machine when he gets to hit & he's now just an average outfielder. I wouldn't even want him on my team for $1.
-Lyle Overbay's best days are long gone also. He can't hit his weight, has barely any power, but still has a very good glove at first base. But who wants a first baseman who can't hit his weight & doesn't have any power?
-When the season will start (finally!), the Yankees will have one dangerous hitter in the lineup: all-star second baseman Robinson Cano. Other than Cano, i can't see anyone hitting much. By the way, if the Yankees start the season atrociously (as i expect) and start falling way back in the standings (as i expect) come July, would they consider trading Cano to the Blue Jays? I think he'd look great at the 2nd base position, and he'd be right at home with countrymen Jose Bautista, Jose Reyes & Edwin Encarnacion, among other Dominicans in the organization. Would the Yankees agree to trade him for a package of Maicer Izturis, Colby Rasmus, Adam Lind, Josh Thole & possibly Kyle Drabek?
-Mariano Rivera might still be a very good relief pitcher. However, if the Yankees can't score any runs & be leading in the 8th & 9th inning, what good will he be?
-Vernon Wells is done. Mark my words. He's a strikeout machine when he gets to hit & he's now just an average outfielder. I wouldn't even want him on my team for $1.
-Lyle Overbay's best days are long gone also. He can't hit his weight, has barely any power, but still has a very good glove at first base. But who wants a first baseman who can't hit his weight & doesn't have any power?
-When the season will start (finally!), the Yankees will have one dangerous hitter in the lineup: all-star second baseman Robinson Cano. Other than Cano, i can't see anyone hitting much. By the way, if the Yankees start the season atrociously (as i expect) and start falling way back in the standings (as i expect) come July, would they consider trading Cano to the Blue Jays? I think he'd look great at the 2nd base position, and he'd be right at home with countrymen Jose Bautista, Jose Reyes & Edwin Encarnacion, among other Dominicans in the organization. Would the Yankees agree to trade him for a package of Maicer Izturis, Colby Rasmus, Adam Lind, Josh Thole & possibly Kyle Drabek?
From Joe's beloved Buster Olney:
1. Baltimore
2. Rays
3. Red Sox
4. Blue Jays
5. Yankees
“After wrestling with it and being around the Yankees, I’m picking them last in the division. I just think they have too many issues with that lineup. I’ve got the Red Sox third. I’ve got the Orioles first. I think they have a lot more pitching depth than we’ve been giving them credit for.”
1. Baltimore
2. Rays
3. Red Sox
4. Blue Jays
5. Yankees
“After wrestling with it and being around the Yankees, I’m picking them last in the division. I just think they have too many issues with that lineup. I’ve got the Red Sox third. I’ve got the Orioles first. I think they have a lot more pitching depth than we’ve been giving them credit for.”
Note to the Beav:
1. Brennan Boesch was totally healthy when he reported to Steinbrenner Field. He tweaked his back a few days later. His injury had nothing to do with the Bombers (lol) throwing $20 M at the corpse of Vernon Wells.
2. Guys who are fighting for the last roster spot are usually less than likely to tell the boss they've got an injury if it's something they think they can play through.
3. Despite the fact that Boesch sucks as a ballplayer, reports have it that he is likely to be in pinstripes this coming Monday. He's in the lineup today.
As for the Yankee pitching staff, Hughes can't stay healthy, Nova sucks, Phelps is a back of the rotation guy. If one of the three ancients at the top of the Yankee rotation goes down, the Bombers (lol) could just threaten last year's 93 loss level of the Sox.
1. Brennan Boesch was totally healthy when he reported to Steinbrenner Field. He tweaked his back a few days later. His injury had nothing to do with the Bombers (lol) throwing $20 M at the corpse of Vernon Wells.
2. Guys who are fighting for the last roster spot are usually less than likely to tell the boss they've got an injury if it's something they think they can play through.
3. Despite the fact that Boesch sucks as a ballplayer, reports have it that he is likely to be in pinstripes this coming Monday. He's in the lineup today.
As for the Yankee pitching staff, Hughes can't stay healthy, Nova sucks, Phelps is a back of the rotation guy. If one of the three ancients at the top of the Yankee rotation goes down, the Bombers (lol) could just threaten last year's 93 loss level of the Sox.
The Blue Jays in 4th?, not a chance in hell, I wish I knew Olney's dealer because the shit that he's on is absolutely fantastic!!!.
I agree. The Orioles in first?? What kind of hallucinogens is he on? I see the Jays taking one of the first two spots. I see the Orioles battling it it out for the 3rd spot, no better.
Hmmm,
According to many who cover sports professionally, no I won't say "analysts" since some define that term too slimly, the Jays look good on paper. But we all know that at times a lineup and pitching staff that looks very impressive in stats can be a poor chemistry mix with poor results. If the Rays add some steady power, who knows.
My best guess:
Rays vs Jays for 1st and 2nd.
Sox probably 3rd under current conditions. Very, very slim for 2nd, could fall to 4th with key injuries.
Orioles 3rd to 4th.
Yankees, they've got such a plague of current injuries I can't see 3rd at this time. If they are serious about holding the salary line, it's hard to see an effective deal being made. It's also hard to see Baltimore falling all the way down. The Yankees are old, injured, and very tight on money. They seem the most vulnerable at this time. When your second most promising healthy hitter hit below .240 last year...IT'S NOT A VERY POSITIVE PROSPECT FOR THE TEAM.
Cheers,
Merlot
PS: don't bother Iggy, .t, EB, Cher. We all know with your mode of "realism" you pick the stripers to win the the World Series by sweeping every game in the playoffs...while knitting an aircraft carrier, same as last year. :lol:
OK, my picks for the East. I'll give a range of games won. Naturally, injuries and acquisition could affect outcomes.
1. Blue Jays 85-95
2. Red Sox 82-90
3. Rays 80-90
4. Orioles 73-83
5. Yankees 68-78
1. Blue Jays 85-95
2. Red Sox 82-90
3. Rays 80-90
4. Orioles 73-83
5. Yankees 68-78
Nor would I expect you to be. Here's a little exercise for you. I'll list my reasons for optimism for my Sox and my reasons for suggesting a horrible season for the Yankees. You do the reverse: why you're optimistic for the Yankees (or at least less pessimistic than common wisdom) and why you think the Sox will falter.
The Sox:
1. Despite a horrible rash of injuries (Crawford, Lackey, Ellsbury, Middlebrooks, Ortiz, Youkilis) and offseasons for Buchholz and Lester, the Sox weren't awful last year (60-66) prior to the August 25 trade. After that, they just mailed it in to the tune of 9-27. Thanks for the leadership, Mr. V.
2. A strong starting rotation, backed up by considerable depth. While Spring stats are, for the most part meaningless, Lester (24 ip, 8 h, 2er, 4 bb 0.75 ERA, .50 whip) and Buchholz (18.2 ip, 11 h, 2 er, 5 bb 0.96 ERA, .86 whip) have shown everything that made them aces for their entire pre-2012 careers. In particular, Nieves has Buchholz working much quicker, delivering a pitch every 15 seconds, some 11 second quicker than his career number. Lackey, Dempster, and Doubront should all be competent league average pitchers in the 3-4-5 spots. (By the way, Dempsters stats in Texas were quite deceiving. While he did have a 5.09 ERA in Texas, his game log shows two starts (of twelve) where he allowed 8 runs, seven where he allowed 2 or fewer.) In addition, the 2012 Sox had 41 starts by guys named Matsuzaka, Bard, Stewart and Cook. Thanks to the Dodger trade and continued development on the farm, there is considerably more depth this year.
3. Mike Napoli will contend for the HR crown. Napoli has a career OPS of .863. You know how many Yankees have higher career OPS? Teixeira and Rodriguez.
4. Certainly Ortiz and Ellsbury are question marks. I certainly don't expect a repeat of 2011 from Ellsbury. That's why the range of 82-90 wins. And who knows what they're going to get from JBJ. For the record, I'd sacrifice the offense and deal Drew to St. Louis and let Iglesias play every day. He's a magician.
The Yankees.
1. Starting pitching. Like Ellsbury, Hughes is always a health concern and who knows what you're going to get from Nova. Andy Pettitte is 41 years old and hasn't thrown more than 129 innings since 2009. CC Sabathia is 33 and coming off elbow surgery. He threw over 235 innings every year from 2007-2011, down to 200 last year. I wouldn't be massively concerned about his effectiveness or health, but I think the days of over 200 innings are gone. Hideki Kuroda is 38 years old and threw more innings than he'd ever thrown before. No, I wouldn't be massively concerned about him either, but I do think they're going to have to step him back by 20-30 innings. David Phelps is nice depth, but he's all there is.
2. The Yankees hit 245 hr last year. 201 of them will not be on the field opening day. They've been replaced by the fragile Kevin Youkilis, the more fragile Travis Hafner, and the corpse of Vernon Wells. Really? Youkilis is a guy with NO tools who has made himself into a fine player by working hard and playing hard. Hard enough to get hurt continually. Hafner hasn't done shit for years though I expect he'll be quite productive considering that he's made for Yankee Stadium...if he can stay on the field. Curtis Granderson and Mark Teixeira, he of the five consecutive years of OPS decline, when they return will both be coming off wrist injuries. You know as well as I do how wrist injuries linger and sap power long after they've healed. That's a particular concern here since power is all these two have got.
3. Derek Jeter. If he can ever get on the field. Considering he's another year older, he's coming off a badly broken ankle, and his -15.9 UZR last year, he could be the worst defensive shortstop in history in 2013. Will management have the stones to take Mr. Icon off the field?
4. There's no offense behind the plate. You don't know who will be at first base until Teixeira returns, assuming he returns at all. Not that he's a concern, but Robinson Cano exceeded his career average OPS by 75 points in 2012 at 29; you can expect some reversal here. You really don't know who your shortstop will be until further notice. Youkilis should be at least fair as long as he's healthy, but his days of .850 are probably gone. You'll be running Wells out for at least a month and who knows what Granderson's wrist will allow on his return. The aging and declining Ichiro was a mirage last year, a product of Yankee Stadium. His road numbers after he joined the Yankees were as bad as his overall numbers in Seattle.
This is a team with precious little offense, historically bad defense on the left side of the infield, and a starting rotation that should be fine at the top as long as it holds up, not so fine at the back end. .500 is a stretch.
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