Defending oneself in one's own home?

[Caleb]

Violence lead to more violence, right.

But in my city, the cops are:

1-Lazy

2-Very lazy

3-Most of them are 5'11" and less...sometime on a very tiny frame.

4-Cowards!


I got to call for their help at some occasions (goddamn freak neighborhood!) and it took 45minutes to 2 hours (yes, TWO!) whatever happened, to see them comming with a very bad attitude and totally annoyed for being disturbed during lunch time...sometimes making lame jokes about victims

I've NEVER seen a good attituded cop in Quebec. They protect NO ONE except for their lazy asses.

You can fight for your right...but not for material, it is pretty simple. But when you know at night, in your home, that the guy in front of you is probably searching money for it's next fix, he doesn't care about YOUR safety...and how about home invasions, done with the sole idea to rape or beat you up for a street gang admission?

Looks like the cops prefer to take picture of your dead body and fill documents instead of doing what they're supposed to do. Safer for them?

Can someone please explain why the hell cities hire VERY VERY VERY SMALL WOMEN for law enforcing???


I sleep with a WWII dark sided but blank loaded Walther PPK (fear works better and hurts no one) along with a can of pepper spray...and i sleep very well.

I know that i look angry about police but the day i'll meet a good one, i'll change my mind.

 

[breadman]

I sleep with a WWII dark sided but blank loaded Walther PPK (fear works better and hurts no one) along with a can of pepper spray...and i sleep very well.
.

Careful now, shooting off blanks in a confined space like a hallway can cause hearing loss...and you might end up getting sued by the robber.

 

[Caleb]

Careful now, shooting off blanks in a confined space like a hallway can cause hearing loss...and you might end up getting sued by the robber.

Don't bother...i'll tell the judge that the robber was already deaf BEFORE invading my house because when i told him to go, he didn't hear me.

I prefer long distance defensive weapons. Knives, baseball bat and dirty socks force you to come close to the bastards...and the closer you come, the more dangerous it becomes. They can bear knives and b-bats too, you know?

I guess that moving in a peacefull small village would be an option...instead of living dressed as an Ah-nold Schwarz and Egger caracter...

 

[EagerBeaver]

See the quote below by Kepler in the 911 thread:

When someone breaks into your home, they do not wear a uniform which says "burglar" or "rapist" or "crazed person" or "I'm on my second strike and if a witness identifies me I'm going away for life".

So, if someone breaks into your home while you're there, it is safest to assume they mean you harm. The alternative is to trust the intruder with your life.

even though he may be wearing the unknown hat of "crazed person" or "second strike and I am not going back to prison."apparently places very little value on his own life and will choose to accept a passive death long before the police arrive at his house to fetch his body, I value my life and will fight for it.

 

[Big Daddy Cool]

Violence lead to more violence, right.
But in my city, the cops are:
1-Lazy
2-Very lazy
3-Most of them are 5'11" and less...sometime on a very tiny frame.
4-Cowards!

This is so true and accurate. I will also add that the cops would rather:
1- Give out jay walking tickets.
2- Bust SWs.
3- Bust Johns.
4- Bust massage parlors because some MP offered sex for money (how life threatening that must be for our community).
5- Bother the homeless.

What's next? I know:
1- Massave arrests of the Girl Guides for bothering neighbours when they try to sell their cookiees.
2- Aressting children and their Day Camp counselers because they made too much noise on the Metro.

As far as worring about the consequenses of shooting an intruder and ending up in court for it. Choose a trial by jury as all you need is one hold out to win. I would never trust a brain dead judge as I don't give a fuck about "intruders rights". I have the right not to have my home intruded in and I protected my self so "Too Fucken Bad if Johnny Welfair Crack Head Intruder ends up in a wheelchair". Don't break into my home and then it won't be an issue.

 

[Techman]

What happens if I slice the guy in two pieces or remove his arm with my dai katana when he breaks in? The only thing I'd worry about is cleaning up the mess after-wards.

My recommendation for all those who would dial 911 is that they install one of those live voice monitored alarm systems so that someone can hear your last words 'Please don't hurt me!!!!!' when the home invader shoots or kills you.

 

[Big Daddy Cool]

For the passivis out there I was wondering something. Sence you would not want to use violence to defend your home, how about giving him a beer, a kiss and hope for the best. As a jesture of good well you can offer him your stereo set and your daughter and sing Barny songs later before shaking his hand and sending him on his way.

Ok I'm trying to find humar in this, but we should defeand our family, our selves and home regardless how much you hurt the intruder. Please keep in mind that he shouldn't be there in the first place.

ZoneAlarm, I love your story about busting his knee caps. Perhaps the next place he breaks into should have a wheelchair ramp for his escape, lol.

 

[jacep]

It is that here if you injure or kill the guy you can get sued. However if you dont exagerate (ex: stab the guy once hes already dead or down) you should be ok. If the guy has a weapon or something make sure you show it to the police then usually if theirs a pretty ovious point of entry you should also be ok assuming you have a good lawyer. The guy was suiing me for 5400$ i ended up paying 100$. But i did have the satisfaction of shattering his kneecap with a crowbar and hearing that CRACK CRICK CRACK sound so all in all yea id do it again.

I've heard of Canadian cases where the criminal is escaping and the person (victim) gets sued or arrested because the person was no longer in danger. For example, there were cases where a depanneur owner hit a thief with a baseball bat after he had run out of the store with the owner's money/cigarettes/etc and the depanneur owner was arrested. If the police determine that excessive force was used or your life was no longer in danger, you could probably be arrested in Canada.

Sounds stupid but it has and does happen where the victim gets punished by the law.

 

[Kepler]

If i`m not mistaken in Canada, LE are the only one that are allowed to discharge their gun on other civilian.

That's incorrect.

I've heard of Canadian cases where the criminal is escaping and the person (victim) gets sued or arrested because the person was no longer in danger.

Yes. When you are no longer in danger, you are no longer allowed to use force. This applies to Canada and the USA (as far as I know). If you use force when not in danger, your actions move from "self defense" to "revenge". You move from "victim" to "Aggressor". Aggressors acting out of revenge are not protected under Canadian law.

 

[vodka236]

That's incorrect.

Thanks Kepler for noting this. I rechecked...

From http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Buckner/Chapter 10.htm

Despite disavowals by police officials, the Canadian Criminal Code does include the right of citizens to use deadly force to protect themselves (sections 34, 35, and 37).

Not only do the police actively discourage self defense in general, but armed self defense is widely considered illegal.

Personally, I won't shoot a burglar unless he hold a gun in his hand.

vodka236

 

[EagerBeaver]

If you use force when not in danger, your actions move from "self defense" to "revenge". You move from "victim" to "Aggressor". Aggressors acting out of revenge are not protected under Canadian law.

Kepler,

Here is a typical Connecticut jury instruction on self defense that was approved by the Court and used in an actual Connecticut case. I believe the common law embodied in this jury instruction is the law that generally applies in most U.S. States:

"[t]he evidence in this case also raises the issue of self-defense. [When] elf-defense is raised in a case, the state must disprove the defense beyond a reasonable doubt.. . . A person is justified in using reasonable physical force upon another person to defend himself or a third person from what he reasonably believes to be the use or imminent use of physical force, and he may use such degree of force which he reasonably believes to be necessary for such purpose, except that deadly physical force may not be used unless the actor reasonably believes that such other person is using or about to use deadly physical force or inflicting or about to inflict great bodily harm."

By the ways, in every single barroom assault case I have been involved in (and I have been involved in more than a few, both civil and criminal), the defense of self defense was raised.

 

[Techman]

Actually ZA I live right here in Montreal. Born and raised. I also live not too far from where there was a home invasion less than a year ago and the person was shot by the home invader. I would take no chances if someone was to enter my home while I was there.

 

[johnmbot]

shoot first, ask ?'s later.

better to be judged by 12, than carried by 6.

 

[Techman]

Roland, a Dai katana is a longer version of the standard katana. The short sword is a wakizashi or shoto. Either one will remove an appendage quite efficiently but the longer blade is preferable.

 

[Kepler]

Connecticut jury instruction snipped

Seems like they would do in Canada. See s. 34 (2) C. Cr.: (my "translation"): "If you are the victim of an unprovoked assault and kill someone, we will forgive you if (a) you reasonably though you were going to get very badly hurt and (b) you reasonably believed that you could not do anything else to protect yourself."

The law is tougher if you initiate the assault (s. 35; ie: don't pick fights!). The law is more generous if you're trying to prevent another 9/11 (s.27.1). You are allowed to defend others (family, friends. s. 37)

You can kick ass if someone invades your house: "(s40.) Every one who is in peaceable possession of a dwelling-house, and every one lawfully assisting him or acting under his authority, is justified in using as much force as is necessary to prevent any person from forcibly breaking into or forcibly entering the dwelling-house without lawful authority." (also see s.41)

So when he runs away with my money...am I no more a victim? Should I also be an agressor if I run after him and somehow he falls down and hurts himself...because of my chase?

No. First, you are allowed to conduct a citizen's arrest in Canada (a right reaffirmed by the Supreme Court less than 5 years ago). Second, you are allowed to defend your personal property if you were in peaceable possession of it (see s. 38 to 42). But do you really want to spend time, money, stress, etc. to defend yourself in court?



(Source: http://www.canlii.org/ca/sta/c-46/ )

 

[Big Daddy Cool]

I'd rather kill the intruder this way I know for sure he will not return with revenge in mind or worse bring back reinforcements.

 

[Fat Happy Buddha]

I'm imagining a couple scenarios:

Scenario One
Techman's favourite stripper decides to sneak into his house and surprise him by waking him up with a blowjob. Techman, a light sleeper, hears the window being opened and leaps out of bed, grabs his "dai katana" and rushes at the intruder, severing her arm. Techman feels bad and promises her a long dance the next time he sees her at work.

Scenario Two
The same as above, except this time the woman--knowing the macho fantasy world we Merbites live in--has come armed with her wakisazhi. As Techman swings in the dark in an attempt to decapitate her, she leaps up, propels herself around the walls untils she jumps back onto the floor behind Techman. She puts her wakisazhi against Techman's throat and says, "You're getting rusty." Techman gets his blowjob.

 

[Techman]

FHB, actually I am quite a heavy sleeper when it comes to things such as thunder storms and such but footsteps will awaken me immediately. But no one need worry...I would never strike an unidentified target.

Besides, you never rush at an intruder, you allow them to come to you. Never make the first move, make the last.

 

[Agrippa]

Actually, Ziggy was correct.

A gate-crasher’s change of heart
Gunman bursts into party, tastes cheese and wine, gets hug, then leaves​

WASHINGTON - Police on Capitol Hill are baffled by an attempted robbery that began with a handgun put to the head of a teenager and ended in a group hug.

It started about midnight on June 16 when a group of friends was finishing a dinner of marinated steaks and jumbo shrimp on the back patio of a District of Columbia home. That's when a hooded man slid through an open gate and pointed a handgun at the head of a 14-year-old girl.

"Give me your money, or I'll start shooting," he said, according to D.C. police and witnesses.

Everyone froze, including the girl's parents. Then one guest spoke.

"We were just finishing dinner," Cristina "Cha Cha" Rowan, 43, told the man. "Why don't you have a glass of wine with us?"

The intruder had a sip of their Chateau Malescot St-Exupery and said, "Damn, that's good wine."

The girl's father, Michael Rabdau, 51, told the intruder to take the whole glass, and Rowan offered him the whole bottle.

The robber, with his hood down, took another sip and a bite of Camembert cheese. He put the gun in his sweatpants.

The story then turns even more bizarre.

"I think I may have come to the wrong house," he said before apologizing. "Can I get a hug?"

Rowan, who works at her children's school and lives in Falls Church, Va., stood up and wrapped her arms around the armed man. The four other guests followed.

"Can we have a group hug?" the man asked. The five adults complied.

The man walked away a few moments later with the crystal wine glass in hand. Nothing was stolen, and no one was hurt.

Once he was gone, the group walked into the house, locked the door and stared at each other _ speechless. Rabdau called 911, and police came to take a report and dust for fingerprints.

Police classified the case as strange but true. Investigators have not located a suspect. The witnesses thought he might have been high on drugs.

"We've had robbers that apologize and stuff but nothing where they sit down and drink wine. It definitely is strange," said Cmdr. Diane Groomes, adding that the hugs were especially unusual. "The only good thing is they would be able to identify him because they hugged him."​

Is there a problem that alcohol cannot solve?

 

[johnmbot]

Man do I miss Brooklyn

i was beginning to think you were on riker's.