Election 2012: Will History repeat itself? Union National splits vote, PQ wins power.

[Techman]

Merlot...we no longer live in the same world we did two hundred or one hundred or even 25 years ago. Statements from the past no longer apply. Today we live in a connected world where immigrants can easily remain in contact with friends and family they left behind. These ties ensure that they don't lose their culture and they will never assimilate into the Quebecois culture. And the fact is that no matter how much they try, they will never be considered to be part of that culture by language and Quebecois hardliners. Recent comments support my point of view. You seem to love reading articles dealing with the past, here's something more recent for you to read...

http://nodogsoranglophones.blogspot.ca/
http://nodogsoranglophones.blogspot.ca/2011/01/quebec-ethnics-destroy-separatist-dream.html

EB, yes I believe that many of the current and past leaders of the separatist movement such as Pauline Marois, Bernard Landry, Jacques Parizeau, the aforementioned Mayor Jean Tremblay of Saguenay, and many, many others would have felt right at home in the Germany of 1933. Rene Levesque would be ashamed of what his party has become.

And I'm not claiming that these kind of people represent the feelings of Quebecers as a whole. They certainly do not. But they are expert in sowing fear in people who do not know any better that their culture is in danger of vanishing when no such danger exists. Even Jean Charest is a fear monger, trying to scare Anglos and Allos into voting for him by saying the vote for any other party works out to a vote for the PQ.

In the period 1981-1986 anglophones' emigration out of Quebec is lower then in the period 1971-1976. I will admit however that as we advanced in time the population of scared anglophones shrank, lessening the potential for emigration.

gugu, people started leaving in droves after the PQ first came to power. By the time the referendum had passed, most of those who were planning to leave, and had the ability to leave, had already gone. And for your information, they weren't all anglos. But what they had in common is that they had the financial means to leave. You also have to understand that many of those who did leave were some of the most educated people in Quebec with the most earning potential. Not only did we lose those who left, we also lost the families they would go on to have and everything that goes along with that. And it hasn't stopped yet, people are still leaving and it increases every time some crap starts to happen here like the Reasonable Accomodation hearings or the possibility of a PQ government being re-elected along with the referndum threat that comes along with it.

http://www.immigration.ca/news-oct07-emigration.asp

 

[sapman99]

EB, yes I believe that many of the current and past leaders of the separatist movement such as Pauline Marois, Bernard Landry, Jacques Parizeau, the aforementioned Mayor Jean Tremblay of Saguenay, and many, many others would have felt right at home in the Germany of 1933.

There you go again using Nazi analogies. I am not in the least a fan of any of the people you mention, I despise all of them to varying degrees in fact. But you have a talent to try to kill what you call extremism with more extremism of your own.

35 years of Bill 101, and a number of majority Liberal governments in the interval. If the bill survived this long it must be because the people support it. The Gazette, the Globe and Mail and the National Post all give it a wide berth unless some yahoo wants to fool with it... Only trash media like the Sun chain of newspapers (owned by Québecor ) and CJAD (owned by Astral of Montréal :help capitalize on it.

Techman, you always say that things that either happened in the past or that are taking place in other venues than Québec are not meaningful in this debate. That is called glossing over facts. Globalization matters in this case. The past (English oligarchs in league with the already in-place French Seigneurs and the Church to keep the Canadien peasants down) matters. The fact that there is nowhere else in North America left for a viable French-speaking community (not talking about a village here) except Québec matters.

A lot of what of what you bring up is a witch hunt. And a little akin to fighting windmills.

 

[Merlot]

Hello all,

we no longer live in the same world we did two hundred or one hundred or even 25 years ago.

The past makes the present. Where would your views be without the reasons why they developed. So it goes for cultures and nations.

Today we live in a connected world where immigrants can easily remain in contact with friends and family they left behind. These ties ensure that they don't lose their culture and they will never assimilate into the Quebecois culture.

This is contradictory to what you have said in previous arguments. You've stated to the effect that French culture in Quebec is in decline and that the French are only trying to forestall the inevitable assimilation. Doesn't that conflict with your point above. If immigrants (or any specific culture) "will never assimilate" then all of your previous rationales that the French will eventually be absorbed, that they should just accept the reality of natural change are false. When you suggest that ethnic purists never accept outsiders then you justify fighting back fighting back or facing oblivion. If assimilation is impossible as you suggest then Law 101 cannot be the cultural boogie man you suggest it is. Your economic arguments are far more realistic and genuine in my opinion.

Some assimilation is inevitable over time. In a country where immigrant populations ran from 8-14% of the total population every decade from 1850-1940 the U. S. has successfully assimilated 90,000,000 immigrants by 1940 into modern American culture despite often being considered social outcasts or persecuted by xenophobes/racists for hundreds of years.

Even in China where hardcore cultural and political xenophobes control or try to control everything, they are still assimilating disapproved or banned political and cultural ideas despite the most minimum access by foreign influences in one of the purest mono-ethnic populations in the world.

And the fact is that no matter how much they try, they will never be considered to be part of that culture by language and Quebecois hardliners. Recent comments support my point of view. You seem to love reading articles dealing with the past, here's something more recent for you to read...

I'm happy to see that you are referring to Separatists as "hardliners" rather than caricaturizing them so harshly as EB suggested. Your links only show what we all know exists, always has and will, and one side is no different than the other. Such prejudice, bias, and/or extremism cannot be eliminated, but despite all of their efforts history shows that even under the most favorable controlling and manipulative conditions they are influential but futile overall in the end.

EB, yes I believe that many of the current and past leaders of the separatist movement such as Pauline Marois, Bernard Landry, Jacques Parizeau, the aforementioned Mayor Jean Tremblay of Saguenay, and many, many others would have felt right at home in the Germany of 1933. Rene Levesque would be ashamed of what his party has become.

Is there any rational explanation why you never characterize the English who thought the same way about the French and used the same basic methods with the same Nazi-esque labels? Too long ago?

A lot of what of what you bring up is a witch hunt. And a little akin to fighting windmills.

As I wrote previously, there's been some poor wholesale caricaturization that cannot possibly represent anything but the smallest segment of Separatists. To say that has been unfair and unrealistic is being gentle. I wouldn't object if someone said this element exists and is a real threat, but to suggest anyone who may consider or favor Separatism are all this way...is too extreme.

Cheers,

Merlot

 

[gugu]

These ties ensure that they don't lose their culture and they will never assimilate into the Quebecois culture.

How often shall we have to repeat it to you? The PQ, Option nationale, Québec solidaire, the CAQ and the liberals, none of these parties are talking about assimilation. Immigrants are seen as an asset, not only economically but culturally. We expect that they enrich our society, not that they submit to it. There is no difference between the parties, except for some small minorities in all of them wishing for pure assimilation.

 

[sapman99]

Techman and Godwin

By using the search tool, I was able to find that Techman has already invoked the ghost of Nazis past twice in other language related threads, and garnered a warning from Mod 11 in doing so.

The comparisons he makes don't have a leg to stand on and are only meant to provoke acrimony, not informed debate.

 

[sapman99]

The somewhat recent past

Ok, so here is one that is not so old: Donald Gordon was in a controversy in 1962 when he said that no French-Canadian was competent enough to be vice-president of the Canadian National Railway.

Bill 101 was enacted a scant 15 years after that.

 

[Techman]

There you go again using Nazi analogies. I am not in the least a fan of any of the people you mention, I despise all of them to varying degrees in fact. But you have a talent to try to kill what you call extremism with more extremism of your own.

35 years of Bill 101, and a number of majority Liberal governments in the interval. If the bill survived this long it must be because the people support it. The Gazette, the Globe and Mail and the National Post all give it a wide berth unless some yahoo wants to fool with it... Only trash media like the Sun chain of newspapers (owned by Québecor ) and CJAD (owned by Astral of Montréal :help capitalize on it.

Techman, you always say that things that either happened in the past or that are taking place in other venues than Québec are not meaningful in this debate. That is called glossing over facts. Globalization matters in this case. The past (English oligarchs in league with the already in-place French Seigneurs and the Church to keep the Canadien peasants down) matters. The fact that there is nowhere else in North America left for a viable French-speaking community (not talking about a village here) except Québec matters.

A lot of what of what you bring up is a witch hunt. And a little akin to fighting windmills.

Cultures and languages that are supported by the people of that culture will survive. If they don't, that's their own fault. I don't give a damn about what happened in decades or centuries past. I don't live in the past, I live in the now and want to move into the future. People are supposed to learn from the past and not repeat the same mistaked. They aren't supposed to use the past as an excuse to perpetrate the same treatment on others just because it was done to them. That is the mark of a small people, a people who are not able to grow and move on to better things. I am tired of that same old argument...they did it to us so now we can do it to them. That's bullshit.

As for my opinion of Parizeau, Marois and company, that is my opinion. I believe they are racist bigots. They have proven it many times by their actions and their words.

And you know something? Considering some of the racist comments being made by politicians in this province,

How often shall we have to repeat it to you? The PQ, Option nationale, Québec solidaire, the CAQ and the liberals, none of these parties are talking about assimilation. Immigrants are seen as an asset, not only economically but culturally. We expect that they enrich our society, not that they submit to it. There is no difference between the parties, except for some small minorities in all of them wishing for pure assimilation.

But they have to submit to our language and forgo all others. They cannot educate their children in the language of their choice. That seems like submission to me. As for assimilation, have you forgotten the Bouchard-Taylor commission on 'reasonable accomodation'?


Merlot, I don't remember the French language ever being subjugated by law to second place. I do not ever remember laws forcing the French to work in English. I am not and never have suggested that the French population of Quebec should be assimilated. I believe that any society should be allowed to find it's own level naturally. I don't believe in laws that force people to give up their own language and identity. This constant state of threatened separation in Quebec has led to nothing but stagnation. It has affected not only Quebec, but Canada as a whole. It is time for it to end. The French language is not in danger in Quebec, the Quebecois culture is not in danger. Montreal could become a fully bilingual city, immigrants as well as the French population could educate their children in the language of their choice and the French language and culture will still survive in Quebec.

But as I've said before and will repeat now, this has absolutely nothing to do with survival, it has to do with dominance and power. No matter the status of Montreal, Quebec will still be a French province and the Quebecois culture will still exist.

And the separatists should be wary of achieving their goal of separation. If you want to destroy the Quebecois culture, that would be the fastest way to do it. In a separate country they could not retain laws that would discriminate against a minority. Language laws would fall and the French fact and culture of Quebec would be in more danger of extinction that it will ever be as part of Canada.

 

[Techman]

Ok, so here is one that is not so old: Donald Gordon was in a controversy in 1962 when he said that no French-Canadian was competent enough to be vice-president of the Canadian National Railway.

Bill 101 was enacted a scant 15 years after that.

Were you around at that time? Maybe he was stating a fact and there was no French-Canadian who was competent enough to do that job at the time. I'm sure there were probably a lot of people of both languages who lacked the requirements. I don't know about you, but when I look for an employee I don't look at their language or background, I look at their qualifications for the job. Unfortunately here in Quebec, competency has to take a backseat to what language the applicant speaks.

I'm pretty sure that there's a long list of qualified doctors, nurses and other professionals who have immigrated to Quebec but are working outside of their profession today because they can't pass a French language test.

 

[sapman99]

Were you around at that time? Maybe he was stating a fact and there was no French-Canadian who was competent enough to do that job at the time.

Unfortunately here in Quebec, competency has to take a backseat to what language the applicant speaks.

(Sound of the Gong Show Gong)

He was saying NO French-Canadian was competent enough to fill ANY of the VP positions. He was not referring to applicants, but to the population.

In Browns' case, your statement that competency took a backseat to language is amply demonstrated.

In Ontario, no doctor would be granted the right to practice if he-she was not fluent in English.

Mr. Browns' family send their regards.

Being an apologist for this type of gross conduct hardly makes you a credible mouthpiece for the "Kill 101" movement. Reading your comment fortifies my conviction that this bill is necessary.

 

[Techman]

You really don't get sarcasm do you? By the way, I really don't give a damn about what some businessman said in 1962. It's amazing how you try to use this statement to counter all the racist comments being made TODAY by Quebec politicians. Let me spell it out for you in big letters so you will understand...

I don't care what happened decades ago. There is no excuse for racism and bigotry in today's society. Stop trying to use the past to justify anything that is going on in today's society. Get over it, grow up and move into this century.

 

[gugu]

But they have to submit to our language and forgo all others.

Wrong. They can educate their kids in whatever language they want. There is absolutely nothing encouraging people not to keep the native language of their parents.

As for assimilation, have you forgotten the Bouchard-Taylor commission on 'reasonable accomodation'?

No I have not. And they despise the idea of assimilation just as I do.

The French language is not in danger in Quebec, the Quebecois culture is not in danger.

Thanks to law 101 as previous law 22. Whether you like it or not, giving the choice of immigrants to choose the schooling language of their kids and letting employers impose the working language would have signed the death of french in Quebec within less then 60 years.

 

[Techman]

Wrong. They can educate their kids in whatever language they want. There is absolutely nothing encouraging people not to keep the native language of their parents.

WRONG! Immigrants cannot send their children to English public schools. And if Marois has her way, that will be extended to private schools as well as CEGEP.

Thanks to law 101 as previous law 22. Whether you like it or not, giving the choice of immigrants to choose the schooling language of their kids and letting employers impose the working language would have signed the death of french in Quebec within less then 60 years.

You just contradicted your first point in your third. Besides the fact that your point is incorrect. French may have fallen behind in business in Montreal but it would still exist and thrive in the rest of Quebec. It would also still have been very strong in Montreal homes if parents taught their culture to their children. As I said...it has nothing to do with survival, it has to do with dominance and I am still waiting for one of you to admit that fact.

 

[EagerBeaver]

I don't really understand how any immigrant child can be denied the opportunity to learn the language of Shakespeare if that is what the parents want. I also don't understand how such policies will encourage immigration from countries that are not French speaking.

Honestly, while I am not Canadian and did not grow up in Quebec and do not have enough information to form well thought out opinions on any of these issues, I also struggle to understand theses issues. I understand the need to preserve French language and culture but I look at a map and see Quebec or the lower two thirds of Quebec surrounded by English speaking lands on all sides. Is this going to change?

In Switzerland people speak primarily German, French and Italian, many citizens speak all 3, and none of those three cultures is attempted to be shoved down anyone's throat. I just don't understand why the Swiss model cannot work elsewhere. I don't get it. It especially does not compute that Quebec cannot function as a bilingual society in our increasingly mobile society where people and businesses move around and do not have the time or the money to uproot their linguistic traditions. This seems to me to be a huge problem or obstacle in attracting business enterprises to Quebec.

 

[sapman99]

On survival and dominance

Its' all relative. Given Québecs' slice of territory and population in North America, and the heavy reliance the whole of North America is giving to immigration to augment the population, not keeping 101 which is making it possible to have a French majority here (ok, domination, as you wish lol) would shortly result in French being a minority in this province. And that would only be the beginning of the slide.

I said and I repeat: this is a choice. A great majority of the population is evidently for it. And this is here, now, in real time. Welcome to it.

Oh, and you were talking about skills over language before. Language IS a skill. I do not mind at all any legitimate posting that asks for English.

 

[Techman]

It's a choice? Really? I don't remember being asked if I was in favour of the language laws. In fact, hundreds of French families have gone to court to try and win the right to educate their children in English and were refused so I guess it wasn't their choice either. I cannot imagine any intelligent individual choosing to have their own rights limited by law. How about we have a referendum on it? I'd settle for one on just the language of education clause with a very simple, straight forward question such as "Do you want the freedom to educate your children in the language of your choice?" Let's see how many people vote no to that one.

And once again I will point out that having a majority of the population speaking French because they have no choice is nothing but an illusion and does absolutely nothing to protect the Quebecois CULTURE. Everyone deserves to have freedom of choice. From the food they eat, to the movies they watch, to the religion they follow, to the profession they choose, to the life partner they choose, and yes, even what language THEY choose to educate their children in. No one and certainly no government should ever have the right to take any of those choices away from anyone. I believe that people will not abandon the French language even given this choice and that the result would be a more happy and profitable society for everyone.

But then there would be no threat of separation, no sword, to hold over Canada's throat.

 

[sapman99]

Some very good points to start a constructive discussion here

I don't really understand how any immigrant child can be denied the opportunity to learn the language of Shakespeare if that is what the parents want.

Honestly, while I am not Canadian and did not grow up in Quebec and do not have enough information to form well thought out opinions on any of these issues, I also struggle to understand theses issues. I understand the need to preserve French language and culture but I look at a map and see Quebec or the lower two thirds of Quebec surrounded by English speaking lands on all sides. Is this going to change?

In Switzerland people speak primarily German, French and Italian, many citizens speak all 3, and none of those three cultures is attempted to be shoved down anyone's throat. I just don't understand why the Swiss model cannot work elsewhere. I don't get it. It especially does not compute that Quebec cannot function as a bilingual society in our increasingly mobile society where people and businesses move around and do not have the time or the money to uproot their linguistic traditions. This seems to me to be a huge problem or obstacle in attracting business enterprises to Quebec.

Mods: I quoted most of the post because I want to address each point that is quoted.

EB, I commend you for posting this. You ask valid questions, and admit lacking some background into this. I will answer to the best of my abilities.

Education of immigrants in English is not automatic in many countries/jurisdictions, at least not on public funds. When demographics showed that Québec would lose its' French majority status if "affirmative action" was not taken, the language laws were enacted.

You are bang on with the geography. A picture is worth a thousand words. So you either protect French or wait until its' just another ethnic language while most affairs are conducted in English for the sake of efficiency.

The Swiss analogy is not a bad idea but does not work on two levels:

1. Look at the map: The UK is far away, the only "concentrated English" mass over there. And its' "only" 62 million. In QC, the English surround us and are more like 325 million.
2. There are a number of 1st-language English people in Switzerland. I do not see where on the Web it says that English is a publicly funded official language. They surely must have a great many of their citizens who speak it as a second language as is becoming a norm is most of Europe (and here in QC). I believe their sign laws are different as well. Here is some info.

Québec has public education facilities for its' English population from grade school all the way up to some of the best universities in Canada. The same goes for all provincial public services.

What has changed is that now (since 1977) if you come in from outside Canada, you are directed to the French system. Tough, but immigration is in any case a privilege. There are many other destinations. We are limiting our pool of immigrants that way, but the people coming are either already speaking speaking French or want to learn it, and that is good. I wouldn't be surprised if many of them also spoke English prior to arrival and that is a good thing too. English is a valuable skill anywhere in the world these days.

The only time I went to English school was in adult education classes in Toronto. In Québec, the only excuse not to learn English almost by osmosis is not wanting to. I am rather satisfied with my "English as a second language" skills.

The next thing is that Québec is not a closed society, regardless how some want to paint it. Fluency in English is a recognized and valuable skill in work, for good reasons.

I have very little patience for anyone being rude in commerce if asked service in English, and I have not witnessed this here. In some areas of town the people plain don't speak English but they will still try to help you out. That is their loss and most will learn in time. English, even not as an "official" language here, is everywhere. And that is a good thing :nod:.

 

[Merlot]

I don't care what happened decades ago. There is no excuse for racism and bigotry in today's society. Stop trying to use the past to justify anything that is going on in today's society. Get over it, grow up and move into this century.[/SIZE]

Techman,

This is mischaracterization. It wasn't about justifying Law 101 by citing the past. I and others have tried to understand the law's existence by examining the motivations that created it. Everyone has said the law is flawed and elements are unfair. Those most approving views cite only it's necessary protective elements, not the abusive elements which those writing on this board reject. No one has excused racism or racist policies.

I also never suggested you said anything about wanting the French culture to decline. But you have been very unsympathetic to the French side of the issue saying basically, so what if it happens, while in contrast you show a great deal of sympathy for everyone else and hurling a lot of hyperbole (some of it just gross) in their defense.

As for racism and bigotry, there's one person who has been caricaturizing Separatists and their sympathizers very narrowly and in very ugly terms...and it's not the supporters of Law 101. Don't forget that members here battled against the kind of xenophobic members that were here and were happy to see them banned.

While Law 101 is probably the most polarizing focus of the entire cultural issue today you have seemed totally unwilling to recognize any responsibility for the English part in this whole issue. While the law seems to point the finger at the French as the ones exasperating the tensions through this law you don't get a law like this from nothing, without causes from the other side.

I think most of us agree there are some very ugly elements in this law that should never have even been considered much less passed. But to say the basic goal of the law to protect French culture is unnecessary is denying the obvious fact that there had to be conditions to cause the motivations to pass it, and the continued majority support of the population must be coming from a continued reason. Your own hyper opposition and willingness to characterize Law 101 supporters in those ugly terms basically as...racists ...abundantly shows that the problem of understanding and the poor prospect of compromise comes from both sides. If the opposition to Law 101 feels like you with your previous allusions to the desire/conspiracy for a ..."French" ..."white" ..."Catholic" ..."pure Quebecois society", then the problems are being caused by both sides.

In Switzerland people speak primarily German, French and Italian, many citizens speak all 3, and none of those three cultures is attempted to be shoved down anyone's throat. I just don't understand why the Swiss model cannot work elsewhere.

Very true, and an excellent example. The difference in Quebec is there wasn't a balanced effort to respect each culture. The history I posted previously shows attempts to dominate even if specific laws did not exist against the French language. So there is continued antipathy instead the tradition of balance, respect, and trust the Swiss have built. Some fail to understand the importance of history and tradition through functional application. It's the same reason why some formerly Communist countries have had trouble applying Democracy. The American colonies had experience with Democratic processes from the start, even under the British. The Russians had little or no experience and were thrust into it suddenly with consequences they are still working out. Now in Montreal we have a swing in bias because of a past lacking mutual respect and trust. No surprise.

Cheers,

Merlot

 

[Techman]

Very nice party line response. You should be a politician. You still fail to address the lack of freedom of choice of education of the native French populace of Quebec. You also fail to mention the fact that due to these limitations the English public school system in Quebec is vanishing at a rapid pace. Less students permitted to enroll leads to justification to cut funding. This is exacerbated by the number of English Quebecers who choose to educate their children in the French system which, while a valiant effort ot give their children a head start in the world, will prevent their children from having the choice to educate their own children in English in Quebec.

You also neglected to mention that anyone coming to Quebec from the rest of Canada also loses their choice to educate their children in English.

And not everyone who comes to Quebec does so with the idea of living in a French society. Some come here due to business necessity, being transferred here. Even if they are here for a short period of time, they must educate their children in French. So an American businessman coming here for a year will have his unilingual English child forced to make his way through a year of school being unable to understand the language of instruction. There are no exceptions permitted.

Education of immigrants in English is not automatic in many countries/jurisdictions, at least not on public funds

Could you give me an example of another country, which has public school system in English paid by taxpayer money, or a public school system in any language for that matter, that has laws preventing choice of language of education? Just one will be enough. Obviously it would not be expected to have the ability to educate a child in any particular language if those public institutions do not exist. Although you would probably have an easier chance sending your child to an English school in Japan that you would here in Quebec.

 

[Techman]

As for racism and bigotry, there's one person who has been caricaturizing Separatists and their sympathizers very narrowly and in very ugly terms...and it's not the supporters of Law 101. Don't forget that members here battled against the kind of xenophobic members that were here and were happy to see them banned.

Have you even bothered to read anything I have linked to? I don't have to characterize them as bigots and racists, they are doing a good enough job of it themselves. You have the Mayor of Saguenay with his bigotted comments about a Parti Quebecois candidate. You have Pauline Marois herself with her plans to increase language laws and even extend them to apply to students who attend CEGEP, students who I might remind you are not children, but legal adults. She also has plans to create a fund to prevent foreign takeovers of Quebec owned businesses, using the Quebec Pension fund as a financial base.

Get your head out of the sand and stop sitting on the fence. That's the problem here - so many people have been straddling the fence for so long that their balls have attrophied and they can't stand up for one side or the other if their life depended on it. A language and culture has to survive on it's own merits. If it can't do that, then it will vanish. I think the French language and culture here is strong enough to do that without discriminatory laws. And the removal of those laws will open our society to business and investment and it will grow strong and healthy. As it is now, it's on artificial life support.

 

[Merlot]

Get your head out of the sand and stop sitting on the fence.

Techman,

You mean you want me to adopt an extreme perspective like you!!!

I did you the respect of reading it, as I indicated. I also accepted the fact that they are extreme and xenophobes.

I just have no idea why anyone with your intelligence insists these extremists represent everyone sympathetic with the Separatist side. I'm sympathetic in the way of trying to understand, but I don't like the people in your links and I'm against Separation. SO...there you go! I have said this in other threads.

One problem is you and those you detest picked sides long ago and refuse to consider any validity in the opposition argument might exist. What's the difference between you and them on that point???

I've been the victim of Affirmative Action quotas, and being disadvantaged for jobs because I don't speak Spanish or Portuguese. Quebec isn't the only place with shifting cultural biases. I'm just not as angry about it as some.

Cheers,

Merlot

PS: Done