French Canadian !

[EagerBeaver]

IMO, all these have nothing to do with protecting this or that, its just revenge time (Understandably) because
of what happened in the past, thats it.

I agree with this and looking at the issue objectively and rationally from the standpoint of the outsider who does not favor any one culture or language over another, it (Bill 101) is xenophobic, ethnocentric and divisive. There is no other way I can see it except that, if you remove emotion from the equation.

Regarding Amazon, they will likely seek and receive an exemption from Bill 101 as a condition of headquartering in Montreal. Then Coderre will have to sell that position to his electorate which he probably will because of the jobs it will create, which will mostly go to younger foreigners who are recent college grads. In case nobody has looked lately at the college demographics in Montreal, tons of students from Asia and Middle East countries who speak French worse than I do, but they will have a college diploma in the computer information systems. Their parents own the real estate in Montreal in which they are living. So who has ownership of this situation?

What many of you do not understand is that big companies like this do not give a shit about local laws, they create their own laws. I have had some cases in CT with Chase and Chase doesn't care about obeying Connecticut law, but rather they will adhere to their own company policy and regulations even if they happen to clash with Connecticut law. Amazon will have the same attitude and will tell Coderre Bill 101 does not get enforced against us or we go elsewhere, dude. It's that simple. And Amazon holds the power, not Coderre. Coderre will get the votes of every person who gets a job at the Montreal Amazon location if he makes it happen. Add up those votes and Coderre will not lose.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

HM has Quebec values and for the most part it is easy to obtain. You can not say the Montreal is the norm for a Quebec lifestyle, every small town is basically French with little English, Chinese, Italian, East Indian. There are the eastern townships Richmond, Sherbrook areas where there is English but that is about it.
Go to Drummondville, no east indian cab drivers, no visible minorities are in sight, my guess it there are less than 25 in the entire town, same goes for any town around there, bill 101 does keep the kids from going to English schools and manybparents I know do not agree with it, they would lobe to send their kids to an English school just for the future benefits.

 

[jalimon]

As a proud french Quebecker myself I do agree with you completely Cruiser.

And yes it is a fact that much more company (especially the goods and service oriented one) would have offices in montreal if not for Bill 101. Why do you think Toronto grew so much since Bill 101 came into place!

Luckily on the technology side, where everything is pretty much done in English, Bill 101 did not stop all major company to invest heavily in Montreal. But that said I know for a fact that they do not respect the law much. And they are not bothered too much. Heavy paying jobs keeps people quiet

Cheers,

 

[jalimon]

If someone is stupid enough to put up English only signs in a store in Sherbrooke what is the harm in that, he will go out of business within weeks. No need for language police, that is just ridiculous, sign being half the size etc.. It would be really funny if it was a joke.

This is the only place I do not agree with you. From a touristic and even business point of view we need to make sure we keep a french touch to our province. Making sure all signs of commerce are in French is a very good way to do it. This is an easy way to keep our unity. To make sure people realize where in Montreal, not in Boston or Toronto. And if there was no law 75% of commerce of Montreal would be displayed in English only... Sad but true.

In the employees politics of Tremblant ski resort the #1 policy is "Say hello in French". You can be suspended if you are caught welcoming someone in English. Got to give a high five to the dude that decided this would be politics number 1. And when this was decided Tremblant was owned by a Vancouver based company. They had clearly understood that the French atmosphere was number key to the success of the resort. They got it right!

Cheers,

 

[BigBrowser]

I don't think this thread will ever end! Hahaha...
Thank you Brittany

 

[EagerBeaver]

For Brittany this thread must be like an unexpected pregnancy and childbirth, but she has to love her child, and I am sure she does.:kiss:

 

[BigBrowser]

Well, I would like to say that I don't always agree with what's been said in this thread and most of the time I am not cognisant enough to even dare an opinion - specifically when it comes to potato salad.
But I am very happy that we all are polite and diplomatic enough to have a very interesting conversation where everyone is able to respectfully express their opinion.
Thank you guys, thank you merb!

 

[VictoriaJolie]

That was going to be my question Vicky- what thoughts of yours were reinforced? That Benjamin Franklin would have been a top poster if MERB existed in 1777? I think Franklin's MERB handle would have been "Stoveman". Or did the thread reinforce that Germans should always make their own potato salads as self-suffficient Germans and never should let IGA do the job? Or that the Soviet Union suffered horribly in World War II but also imposed tremendous suffering on other countries?

Sure absolutely lol
Let's just says that i don't scream out loud that i am french canadian...Make your own conclusions

EagerBeaver you are welcome to ask specific questions if you wish to find out

 

[westwoody]

As far as I know, electric razors were available technology in the 1970s.

Crude technology.

I had a Remington, the one with the owner in the TV commercials. Basically just ripped your hairs out.

 

[westwoody]

In the employees politics of Tremblant ski resort the #1 policy is "Say hello in French". You can be suspended if you are caught welcoming someone in English. Got to give a high five to the dude that decided this would be politics number 1. And when this was decided Tremblant was owned by a Vancouver based company.

Probably due to the language police. Saying "Hello" might get the company fined.

 

[CLOUD 500]

Jalimon,
What I disagree with is doing it by force of law, how does that agree with freedom of choice, freedom of expression, which I believe should be a fundemental right in every Democracy.
Should we be Democratic only when it serves our personal viewpoint?

The separatist xenophobes do not care about freedom or rights so long as all other languages are eradicated and currently only English threatens the dominance of French over all other languages so they keep on attacking English. Halloween Mike's post was quiet xenophobic. He was quiet clear "Speak French or hit the 401".

 

[CLOUD 500]

HM has Quebec values and for the most part it is easy to obtain. You can not say the Montreal is the norm for a Quebec lifestyle, every small town is basically French with little English, Chinese, Italian, East Indian. There are the eastern townships Richmond, Sherbrook areas where there is English but that is about it.
manybparents I know do not agree with it, they would lobe to send their kids to an English school just for the future benefits.

Yep that is the point and Halloween Mike does not care. His views are similar to the xenophobes. Their actions and beliefs is in line with wanting French to dominate all other languages and the only way to do that is to enforce it on every citizen one of the tools is restricting the kids of allophones and francophones from going to English schools. The goal is to slowly shut down every English school one by one in order to completely eradicate English. All that talk about preservation is all lies to justify their agenda to enforce French. The PQ has been selling lies for years.

 

[jalimon]

Probably due to the language police. Saying "Hello" might get the company fined.

No the case at all, I know for a fact. The policy came from the highest executive in Vancouver.

Never heard of such language police by the way, have you?

Cheers,

 

[CLOUD 500]

I am very proud of my french roots because despite multiple tries to assimilate us, we are still there, and Bill 101 is one of those tool that help us in that regard. You mention Canada as 2 official language, but i am pretty sure (unless my history teacher was wrong) that Quebec has only one offiicial language and it take priority over the "2 officials of Canada"

Bill 101 made French the official language of Quebec but it had a draconian way to implement it. They can make it official without having to enforce it. I guess you do not understand the meaning of freedom and democracy or you only choose where it is convenient to you. But you should read up on communism in the Soviet Union and of course Fascism in Nazi Germany. Quebecs way to enforce French has many similarities to communism and fascism. I also do not think you understand that the original intent of Bill 101 was. I suggest you also to read up on the history of it. In short the Bill was designed to create a peace and to give the citizens the right to be served in French, to use French at work, and to make it the official languages of business in Quebec. But the seperatist xenophobes are using it in a way to enforce French and to eradicate all other languages. That was not the purpose for the bill neither was it intended to be used this way. The PQ has been selling lies for years and lied to the people to make them believe that it was about preservation when in reality it was about dominance.

It may just Montreal for now, but i don't want to see that happen to other cities.

I may be old school minded being a french separatiste for some peoples, but its important for me. I think as i grew up and saw how we where saw by both americans and english canadians has just re-inforced my views. I know its not all of them, but on xbox live back in the days before party chats (where you can lock voice chat to your friends only) we would often speak to each others in french in the game's chat and the thing peoples said to us... both americans and english canadians... that was very disgusting.

Many of those video game nerds are obnoxious. They say a lot of stupid stuff behind a keyboard. Having said that Quebec does have a reputation. Many people are familiar with Quebec draconian approach to enforce French. As Sol Tee Nutz stated the majority of Quebec is French with the exception of Montreal. But you know Montreal is a distinct city within Quebec just as Quebec is a distinct province within Canada. A business can choose to offer whatever language they wish. This is freedom and the free market. But why would a business serve in a language where there is no demand for it? Would any sensible business that is there to make profits will serve in English only in Sherbrooke? They would shut down. If a business choose to serve in English first it is their right and second that is because there is enough demand for the business to remain profitable therefore they deserve to survive. Let the public decide what language they want to use. If they all choose English then so be it. The government should keep their nose out of other peoples business. They got no business enforcing language. And one last thing I can see you have old school separatist thinking. That is xenophobic and is not good. The PQ are toxic.

I know xbox live is a toxic environement especially with the "hide behind your screen" type, but link this to the old days where french peoples where considered like lesser citizens and i guess it tilt my knob...

So you think two wrongs make a right?? I have to say usually your posts are very well written and very true and informative but these latest posts of yours are no good. There is a lot of negativity in this.

 

[stiffrod422]

Brittany, just do like I do. If I am the one selling a service, I speak the language of the client. If I am the client, I insist to be served in the language of my choice. If not I leave and spend my money elsewhere. I think that there should be stickers on business doors that say "Ici on sert les clients en Anglais et Francais.


Stiff

 

[gugu]

Regarding Amazon, they will likely seek and receive an exemption from Bill 101 as a condition of headquartering in Montreal. .

They will unlikely seek an exemption because the probability of them getting it is 0. They will instead get reassurance from some consultants who will tell them how to get around some aspects of the law. You seam to think that Amazon should be free to do whatever they want and, if necessary, implement an english work environment. They are not. And by the way, this province has specific laws on working relations, including the freedom to form a union and illegality of hiring scabs. They will not be able to go around that either. Considering their poor way to deal with their employees, I think they are more afraid of that.

Bill 101 is non négociable. It has brought a peaceful environnement and, paradoxically, lessen the the urge for independence. All federal parties know that. No provincial party would touch it. The liberal party is elected because it gets more than 80% of ethic minorities. But that does not suffice. They need a solid basis of the french vote. Inside their party these people defend law 101 very hard. There is no way Amazone will get any exemption, and rightly so in my opinion.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Gugu,

It's not what I think, it's what I have seen. What experience do you have with large corporations being asked to comply with local state or provincial laws? Large American companies do what they want, and just as Chase does so will Amazon. Some times they get caught like Wells Fargo, and fined. Why do you think Wells Fargo got fined? Their sales practices were blatantly illegal and their customers were defrauded and their privacy was violated. That happened because of internal company policy. Amazon only wants to know what they can do to insure a profit and further their company objectives. If local legal compliance cuts into their profit it's their call to pay some politicians to look the other fucking way. Money talks and bullshit legal compliance walks. I see it all the time. There are legal ways to bribe and I see that all the time as well. Amazon has lots of money and your regulators have lots of pockets. Sounds like a marriage could happen.

 

[Sol Tee Nutz]

Edmonton is also courting Amazon, claim they will do what is necessary to lock them up.

 

[EagerBeaver]

STN,

That's just it. The city which spreads its butt cheeks widest gets the Amazon penis. Gugu doesn't seem to understand that Montreal isn't bidding against itself.

 

[gugu]

EB, it's kind of funny because, in the last few years, when they purchased the (all but one or two) pretty big engeneering companies founded in Québec, the american owners have implement normative practices that were never seen before and that ended precisely the corruption denounced during the Commission Charbonneau. Not only bad things come from your country even if corruption is kind of built in in the american political financing system. It's very different here as is the canadian banking system. If large engineering corporations, in which it is almost impossible to work without speaking english, with zero public help are willing to buy Québec companies and increase the number of employees they hire here, there is no reason why Amazon face a linguistic problem.

I'm not defending Montreal is this competition. Cities do not always get good deals in the negotiations with private firms. I'm not open to Amazon at any conditions. Montreal will be competing on the same grounds as the other cities. The availibility of work force, including english speaking, is certainly not an issue for Montreal. It's going to be fought over the amount of capital, services and fiscal arrangements the cities, states and provincial governments are ready to shove in.