Murder in Kingston

[Merlot]

Ok lets at least wait until they are convicted then beat the living f**k out of them

Ann Coulter...is that you???

What some here fail to realize is that they are proposing actions strikingly similar to the actions they pretend to abhor.

I have to agree with this sentiment. Some of you have been doing some very impressive Torquemada impersonations. That or your dungeon kits have arrived and you can't wait to break them in. Can I try the wheel. I could use a good spin.

Happy racking,

Merlot

 

[Techman]

Merlot, if it wasn't for posts like Dee's :

IF these are truly honour killings WITHIN THEIR OWN SOCIETY then it would be improper to prosecute anyone... they acted in accordance with accepted norms of their society.

If they did this to their own people who are part of their culture we must be open minded... if they did this to ours they would be punished but in a reduced fashion... this would both pass the message of respect and that our mores have to be respected when our people are involved.

then maybe some of us wouldn't go over the top in the opposite direction. I don't really give a damn what any other society considers to be acceptable in their country. This is Canada and it is NOT acceptable here.

Dee seems to love popping in here from time to time and make his little posts designed to get everyone up in arms. I'm sure that Tony is very proud of his student.

And we should all know better that to take the bait and feed the troll.

Techman

 

[Techman]

Do you ever notice how people who are tough on crime are able to keep there cool and the ones who are soft on crime seem to get there panties in a knot, doesn't seem to make sense but oh well

People who are soft on criminals are usually the first ones to go out and buy a gun when they or someone they love happens to be the victim.

Of course, they are more likely to shoot themselves in the foot than they are to shoot the bad guy.

 

[Merlot]

Do you ever notice how people who are tough on crime are able to keep there cool and the ones who are soft on crime seem to get there panties in a knot, doesn't seem to make sense but oh well

LOL,

Please show where anyone here is soft on crime or knock off the nonsense. No has said they don't want the sort of behavior that is the subject of this thread severely punished. Only one I have noticed is against the death penalty at all. So stop being such a Rush Limbaugh/Ann Coulter and thinking every who doesn't believe in savage brutality/torture is soft on crime. Such a view makes 10-19 look exactly right about you. If you think brutality is appropriate then why are you knocking the Nazis??????

Nonsense,

Ummm...you have been reading Dee's posts haven't you?

Okay then, I'll retract the Dee reference and speak for myself. By the thought stands.

cheers,

Merlot

 

[metoo4]

... I don't really give a damn what any other society considers to be acceptable in their country. This is Canada and it is NOT acceptable here....ll know better that to take the bait and feed the troll.

Techman

Agreed. As somebody else said, they came here because there was something they didn't like where they are from so, it's for them to accept the ways things are here and, our laws are part of the package.

 

[Dr Edgar Who]

People who are soft on criminals are usually the first ones to go out and buy a gun when they or someone they love happens to be the victim.

Of course, they are more likely to shoot themselves in the foot than they are to shoot the bad guy.

Well, that just means that principle is one thing but living it is another. Just because I might want to punch someone in the face in some circumstances doesn't make it right. If I was ever so angry at someone that my desire to see them dead seemed worth the risk of going to prison then I might well murder them. I rather doubt it, but best not to piss anyone off too much... not even a pacifist.

I can, in principle, agree that some people society would be better off without (serial killers etc) but don't feel this is a decision I want to trust to anyone, including the government. In theory I sure wouldn't trust myself with such power either but if I was very pissed off, it wouldn't matter much, would it?

Just to flesh that out with examples :

1) If I was the young, "unnacceptable" boyfriend of a certain 19 year old girl who died in Kingston Mills locks, well, I am SURE I would think about it, if I felt that my experience strongly suggested that the father was responsible. I probably wouldn't do it though if I was young.

2) If I was an elderly person who had saved a satisfactory nest-egg through a lifetime of hard work and frugal saving (and not seeing escorts) and some m*ther-f*cker stole it (not that I would ever trust all of it to one person or any of it to an unregistered retard like you-know-who) then I would definitetly think about getting even. Esp. if I didn't think the justice system had punished them adequately. On top of that, at that age, I mean, you aren't going to live comfortably any more anyway.... prison might be better. You would be a folk (old-folk?) hero. If I were V. Lacroix or E. Jones, I would be very afraid.

 

[Techman]

LOL,

Please show where anyone here is soft on crime or knock off the nonsense. No has said they don't want the sort of behavior that is the subject of this thread severely punished. Only one I have noticed is against the death penalty at all. So stop being such a Rush Limbaugh/Ann Coulter and thinking every who doesn't believe in savage brutality/torture is soft on crime. Such a view makes 10-19 look exactly right about you. If you think brutality is appropriate then why are you knocking the Nazis??????

Nonsense,

Merlot

Ummm...you have been reading Dee's posts haven't you?

 

[eastender]

Barbarism

Somehow I cannot avoid the sense that posters are trying to make a "good barbarism" / "bad barbarism" distinction and they are doing it very poorly.

Leaving a society to come to another society is a decision that may reflect various reasons BUT it also reflects a basic fact that for whatever reason(s) the person(s) were not able to fit or function in the society they chose to leave. These reasons do not necessarily disappear simply by entering a new society.

 

[Techman]

This is a question for everyone posting in this thread:

If you were the father of that little girl that was kidnapped and killed recently in Ontario, what would you do if you had the chance to be alone with the couple who admittedly murdered her? Would you walk away?

If it had been my daughter, I'd tear them apart with my bare hands and damn the consequences.

Some people deserve the death penalty.

 

[Dr Edgar Who]

If it had been my daughter, I'd tear them apart with my bare hands and damn the consequences.

Some people deserve the death penalty.

I can agree with you on both points and still be against bringing back the death penalty.
There's a difference between what "feels" just and what one judges to be appropriate "theoretically" for our society.

I won't be unhappy if someone decides to put a bullet in either V. Lacroix or E. Jones but I woudn't want our justice system to have that option even for the father in the Kingston Mill's case.

Once someone is certain to be guilty of a serious crime (like premeditated murder of multiple innocent persons) then, in some cases, I can imagine the death penalty being appropriate. And I sure as hell could understand wanting them dead if I was close to any of the victims. That's not the same thing as trusting our justice system with the death penalty. Mistakes will occur, sadly perhaps all too frequently.
Wilbert Coffin was the last person executed in Canada and it was probably a mistake... oops.
http://www.chrc-ccdp.ca/en/timePortals/milestones/70mile.asp
Murder is one power I don't agree the state should have, because how many mistakes would it take for me to feel that it is intolerable?
For me that number is very close to one.

As an aside, how many people seem to feel the government can't run anything right (health care, energy) yet trust it with the death penalty?

In the Lacroix case, we know he's guilty, there's no doubt. We also strongly suspect he won't get the 20-25 years in Jail with no parole that it would take for most of us to feel he has gotten what he deserves (and that's even if he loses a criminal trial). So, if someone kills him, well, I will without a doubt be happy about it. I will feel that justice caught up with that little shit. But I still don't think we should have the death penalty.

 

[Techman]

I can agree with you on both points and still be against bringing back the death penalty.

I won't be unhappy if someone decides to put a bullet in either V. Lacroix or E. Jones but I woudn't want our justice system to have that option even for the father in the Kingston Mill's case.

I think that a more suitable punishment for Lacroix and Jones would be for them to live the next ten years of their life in a homeless shelter and on the street. If they manage to survive that long. Why put them in jail where they will have a warm bed and three meals a day paid for by our tax dollars? They aren't even worth the cost of a bullet to shoot them with.

 

[Merlot]

This is a question for everyone posting in this thread:

If you were the father of that little girl that was kidnapped and killed recently in Ontario, what would you do if you had the chance to be alone with the couple who admittedly murdered her? Would you walk away?

If it had been my daughter, I'd tear them apart with my bare hands and damn the consequences.

Some people deserve the death penalty.

Hello Techman,

This question is a bogus. It has no relation to what is the principle of civilized justice. No one could ever avoid feeling the natural animal rage that are part of every human soul when their most precious loved ones are killed so cruelly. This question could not possibly elicit a civilized response or connection to real justice if answered on impulse from the heart. It is perfectly loaded to generate only one biased answer...destroy the animals. I would feel the same way on first impulse, but if anyone thinks that is what civilized justice is, then shame on you.

Frankly, I wonder if some of you just might be posturing to show who is the coolest and most outraged, like there's some award for being the most brutal. If you feel the way you do honestly then you certainly aren't looking for justice. It's revenge. Natural, but barbaric. I don't blame people for their natural impulses, but don't be hypocritical to call it civilized or justice. Torture and brutality is barbarism ONLY!

No matter if Dee was being genuine or not, the yearning for barbarism to get satisfaction is becoming the monsters you abhor.

I will tell you one thing if i ever take up a life of crime(won't happen) and decide to start doing home invasions i will pass on Techmans house and pick places where i think they will serve me milk and cookies if they happen to be home at the time

You are being laughable. So you think I would serve you the criminal milk and cookies huh. As a criminal who thinks I am soft maybe such a criminal would like to come over and have milk and cookies with my .58 cal gun stuck up his ass and ask me why I am so damn soft. I just want to ask how this hypothetical criminal likes his milk and cookies then. That's not a threat, just an illustration. Anyone who thinks people who believe in civilized justice don't believe in defending themselves to the max doesn't have a clue.

Cheers,

Merlot

PS

BTW JJ, I know a lot of arm chair heros who like to show off their guns, boast about their toughness, and generally put out a Dirty Harry persona, but haven't the guts to face anyone on equal terms. Oh they would pull the lever on a hanging of a helpless subject, or brutalize someone at their mercy, but put them against an armed criminal or send them off to fight in battle for their country and they'd cry for their Mommy. Phonies!

 

[Mod 8]

Hello everyone,

It seems as if this thread has run it's course and is degrading into nothing but a flame war. Everyone has had their say about the current state of events in this case and I see no reason to allow this discussion to degrade any further.


This thread is now closed and I will take a closer look at it later today and there is a possibility of suspensions being handed out due to some of the intentionally misleading posts made in this discussion.

Mod 8

 

[Mod 8]

I have removed a number of posts from this thread due to their off topic, deceptive or flaming nature.

We encourage everyone to have an intelligent discussion and to share their own opinions on any topic put up for discussion, but we do not appreciate posters who post opinions that are not their own for the sole purpose of starting flame wars and causing discension on the board. This shows a great lack of respect for all members who participate in a discussion with the expectation of a respectful and honest discourse.

It is one thing to play 'devil's advocate' to stimulate a discussion. It is something else to make deceptive statements and pass them off as your own opinion just to cause problems in a thread. This is not acceptable and will result in a suspension. Everyone is welcome to make their opinion known as long as it is done in a way that is on topic and respectful to the other posters in the thread. Personal attacks and insults will not be tolerated.

I have decided to keep most of Dee's deceptive posts in this thread. I would ask that they be ignored as they do not reflect his own opinion and were simply made to stir up the thread. It is possible that they will be removed later when I have a bit more time to review this thread completely. Any new replies to these posts will be removed.

This thread is now open.

Mod 8

 

[eastender]

More Details Emerging

Seems that the eldest daughter either was married or had marriage plans that were not family approved:

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Shafia+daughter+hoped/1849258/story.html

 

[Dr Edgar Who]

Still more details : where did the money come from?

I must say one thing I wondered was how the guy had paid for a Lexus and figured he must be an engineer or something, most new immigrants couldn't afford two nice cars...

Well, check this out :

http://nodogsoranglophones.blogspot.com/2009/07/mystery-widens-into-background-of.html

Sorry about the source...not trying to offend any francophones, I only was linked to that site from a google search for "Mohammad Shafia
Profession"

I think the "flower derivative importing" business sounds like a good bet. Either that or he's a senior member or Al-Qaeda!