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Climate change

Sol Tee Nutz

Well-Known Member
Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
^^^^ The poor get a tax rebate ( they produce very little GHG's compared to the wealthy ) and the rich do not give a fuck. How will a tax alter climate change? Without your links and in your own words, perhaps by buying carbon credits.


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Let’s start at the beginning. Much is being made of the fact that the federal carbon tax will be revenue neutral (it won’t actually be fully revenue neutral, only 90 per cent will be rebated). And indeed, economic theory states that a carbon tax should indeed be revenue neutral. But there’s a caveat here—to offset the harm the carbon tax does to the economy, the tax revenues must be used to reduce existing distortionary taxes such as the personal income tax or the corporate income tax. Rebating the revenues as lump sum rebates eliminates the opportunity to offset the harm of the tax by reducing other distortionary taxes.

Another explicit assumption about optimal carbon taxation is that it must be emplaced in lieu of regulations—not layered on top of them. Layering a carbon tax on top of regulations makes the regulations even more economically damaging. But the Trudeau government shows no indication that it’s ready to make that trade.

In fact, the government plans to implement a “Clean Fuel Standard” that “would incent the use of a broad range of low carbon fuels, energy sources and technologies, such as electricity, hydrogen, and renewable fuels, including renewable natural gas. It would establish lifecycle carbon intensity requirements separately for liquid, gaseous and solid fuels, and would go beyond transportation fuels to include those used in industry and buildings.”

That does not sound much like a swap of a carbon tax for regulations.
 

GMA

Member
Nov 1, 2019
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Well, I'm interested reading the above posts by MattMiller and STN.
Because we cannot get the Republican controlled US Senate nor Idiot In Chief Trump to admit to Climate Change, I haven't focused on the pros and cons of the carbon tax. But it's a benefit to the US that Canada is actively trying to figure out these federal government policy solutions, so the US can get up to speed more quickly if we win the POTUS election this November. I'm hoping that the college age generation will rise up and vote, but the Republicans are actively passing laws to suppress the student vote state by state.
 

Sol Tee Nutz

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Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
The carbon tax puts Canada at a disadvantage in manufacturing and basically any exporting we do. The added costs to everyone from farmers to delivery will be passed on to the consumer, for what, trying to alter climate change. If we meet the Paris Accord agreement and it looks doubtful we would on a global scale reduce GHG's by 0.0004%, the cost does not justify the means. Even the Swedes voted that the biggest waste of 2019 taxpayers dollars was fighting climate change ( How dare they, Greta must be furious )
Taxing a country for using fossil fuels is nothing but a money grab and if you think that it will alter climate change, well I have a mint 1975 pinto to sell you for $200,000.00.

This is just the take of the GST for Alberta and BC.
Nov. 1, 2018 ·*A 2017 analysis by the Library of Parliament said that if the GST were charged on all of the revenues collected from existing carbon levies in British Columbia and Alberta it would add as much as $150 million in a year to Ottawa's coffers. That was based on those governments having a carbon tax of $30 a tonne.
Yes, nothing to do with money....right
 

Albacor

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Nov 30, 2016
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I told you since the beguinning, carbon tax is just another disguised form of money grabber from the government ! all they do is just planted a few trees with the money, that's it; the rest goes into their pockets !
and you know what? the biggest polluter in the world is not my car! it is the military ! an F-35 taking off an air craft carrier equal emission of 100 cars ! no need to mention all the tanks, missiles, and battle ships circling around the middle east ready to trike if any war ! but shuuut ! please do not spread this out, the media never mention it because the government do not want you to know that, got it ?
Every countries is increasing their military budget ! Greta please go after them ? and leave my car alone, please ? Thanks.
 

GMA

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Nov 1, 2019
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I agree with STN that a carbon tax in only one country seems logical to put it at a competitive disadvantage for international trade. That's why it was so bad when Trump got elected and pulled the US out of the Kyoto accord. It's going to take a worldwide effort, and unfortunately it doesn't seem likely to happen. It will be an uphill battle to get all the big countries to cooperate in time, even if Trump loses the election.
 

Sol Tee Nutz

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Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
Did not want to search for the post so copy and paste.
*Originally Posted by*GMA*

That's why it was so bad when Trump got elected and pulled the US out of the*Kyoto accord.

Bad luck? He saved the taxpayers billions of dollars and thousands of jobs. We here in Canada have to pay a large amount to make zero difference, Trudeau wants a seat at the UN and our economy will not get in his way.
 

Bred Sob

New Member
Jan 17, 2012
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*Originally Posted by*GMA*

That's why it was so bad when Trump got elected and pulled the US out of the*Kyoto accord.

Bad luck? He saved the taxpayers billions of dollars and thousands of jobs.

I am afraid there is some confusion here. Trump of course had nothing to do with the Kyoto accord, except maybe in the GMA universe. See the link in my post above.
 

Sol Tee Nutz

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Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
My error, meant the Paris accord. Read your link before I posted.
 

MattMiller

Member
Aug 30, 2012
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I wonder, are there any experts reading this thread who could possibly update us on the current state of the climate science?

Maybe of interest:

Syukuro Manabe & Anthony J. Broccoli: Beyond Global Warming: How Numerical Models Revealed the Secrets of Climate Change. Princeton University Press, 2020
https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Global-Warming-Numerical-Revealed/dp/0691058865
https://press.princeton.edu/books/hardcover/9780691058863/beyond-global-warming

Robert Henson: The Thinking Person's Guide to Climate Change. American Meteorological Society, 2nd edition, 2019
https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Persons-Guide-Climate-Change/dp/1944970398/

Scientists have gotten predictions of global warming right since the 1970s. Dec 4, 2019
The first systematic review finds that climate models have been remarkably accurate.
https://www.vox.com/energy-and-envi...315/climate-change-prediction-models-accurate
 

jalimon

I am addicted member
Dec 28, 2015
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I don't know where to post this question and I do not want to start a new thread.

For those who have watch the Oscar yesterday. Can you let me know what the fuck Joaquim Phoenix was rambling about??

Was his point about lgbt rights, protecting our planet, being a vegan..?? This is how I looked trying to listen to him http://i.imgflip.com/10q6t1.jpg
 

Albacor

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Nov 30, 2016
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At least Trump is honest, he said will pull out of the Paris agreement and want to show the world that he wants the USA be the leader of the whole world, not lagging behind riding horses and donkeys !
However Trudeau is an hypocrite: he signed the Paris accord even though he knew he will miss it's target and can not fulfill Canada's commitment to this accord; more over he bought the Trans mountain pipeline project and give millions to the sand oil companies in Alberta !
So tell me who is lying huh ? Greta help !
 

GMA

Member
Nov 1, 2019
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Sol Tee Nutz,
This article is a pseudo science joke, cherry picking random predictions made 50 years ago, when the environment was so toxic, the EPA was created that same year. Environmental science was barely out of the womb at that point, and computer technology similarly in its infancy. Please do yourself a favor and read the articles referenced by Matt Miller, and if you can find similar articles presenting your side, that might help you make your case.

Can you let me know what the fuck Joaquim Phoenix was rambling about?? Was his point about lgbt rights, protecting our planet, being a vegan..?? This is how I looked trying to listen to him http://i.imgflip.com/10q6t1.jpg

JP is a different type of dude lol. Lots of cringing in the audience during that speech lol

Syukuro Manabe & Anthony J. Broccoli: Beyond Global Warming: How Numerical Models Revealed the Secrets of Climate Change. Princeton
https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Global-Warming-Numerical-Revealed/dp/0691058865
https://press.princeton.edu/books/hardcover/9780691058863/beyond-global-warming
Robert Henson: The Thinking Person's Guide to Climate Change. American Meteorological Society, 2nd edition, 2019
https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Persons-Guide-Climate-Change/dp/1944970398/
Scientists have gotten predictions of global warming right since the 1970s. Dec 4, 2019
The first systematic review finds that climate models have been remarkably accurate.
https://www.vox.com/energy-and-envi...315/climate-change-prediction-models-accurate

Matt Miller, these are very interesting, well referenced articles that discuss actual scientific studies and methods. Your posts are really substantive.
 

Bred Sob

New Member
Jan 17, 2012
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0
Matt Miller, these are very interesting, well referenced articles that discuss actual scientific studies and methods. Your posts are really substantive.

Thank you for your stamp of approval, your recommendation is very valuable and very time-saving. Will definitely stay clear of these "articles" (aka as "books" to less sophisticated human beings).
 

Sol Tee Nutz

Well-Known Member
Apr 29, 2012
7,677
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113
Look behind you.
GMA... Please explain why the last 3 iceages were different from the last one a tropical equator the one before slush and the one before that soild ice, this is well before industrial man. Now explain why changing weather scares you so much.
 
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