Doc Holliday said:
I guarantee you that one place he is smaller is between his legs, juice does that to you.
The Joe.T Memorial FM® Yankees Suck Thread for 2009
- Thread starter rumpleforeskiin
- Start date
I guarantee you that one place he is smaller is between his legs, juice does that to you.
I caught some of the Mets-Red Sox game yesterday and it looked like Big Papi or Big Poopie as he is now being called was being thrown a steady diet of fastballs, although the Mets defensed him like he can still hit fastballs. I can recall the rapid downfalls by Dave Justice and Chili Davis at the ends of their respective careers, when they were thrown a steady diet of fastballs and could no longer hit them, in Justice's case not even being able to make contact with them. At some point Justice developed a groin injury which never seemed to heal, and at the end of the 2001 season spilling into the playoffs that year, he was striking out at an alarming rate. I think he set some kind of record for striking out in that playoffs of 2001.
Davis in his last year with the Yankees started out OK and then faded badly in the second half, and it was obvious he could not hit anyone who threw a good fastball. Ironically, that was the same season in which Davis broke up a no hitter by Pedro Martinez when he was with the Red Sox.
I think the Red Sox will give Ortiz until the All Star break to show signs of turning it around. At this point in his career, Ortiz is a DH which means designated hitter. If you are a DH who cannot hit, you have no other use to the baseball team you are playing on. If his stats stay the same and do not improve he will then be given his release. Fortunately for the Red Sox their pitching has been good enough that they have been able to absorb his lack of production.
Regarding the Blue Jays, I believe they have overachieved, but this is the best division in baseball and the Yankees, Red Sox and Rays are the 3 best teams in the AL and possibly in baseball, so what that means is the BJs may have to accept 4th place even though they have a team possibly good enough to win other divisions.
Davis in his last year with the Yankees started out OK and then faded badly in the second half, and it was obvious he could not hit anyone who threw a good fastball. Ironically, that was the same season in which Davis broke up a no hitter by Pedro Martinez when he was with the Red Sox.
I think the Red Sox will give Ortiz until the All Star break to show signs of turning it around. At this point in his career, Ortiz is a DH which means designated hitter. If you are a DH who cannot hit, you have no other use to the baseball team you are playing on. If his stats stay the same and do not improve he will then be given his release. Fortunately for the Red Sox their pitching has been good enough that they have been able to absorb his lack of production.
Regarding the Blue Jays, I believe they have overachieved, but this is the best division in baseball and the Yankees, Red Sox and Rays are the 3 best teams in the AL and possibly in baseball, so what that means is the BJs may have to accept 4th place even though they have a team possibly good enough to win other divisions.
EagerBeaver said:
Papi's decline actually reminds me more of Frank Thomas. Now retired, i believe.
EagerBeaver said:
Just as Ken Rosenthal predicted two weeks ago, baseball careers are like a book, there is a beginning, a middle and unfortunately a end, how sad.
The only stats that matter for a power hitter are home runs and slugging average. For A-Rod the numbers are 6 homers and a .604 slugging average (26 points above A-Rod's career average) in 53 at bats. For Ortiz the numbers are 1 homer and a .299 slugging average in 3 times as many at bats.
A-Rod has not been pitched to with runners on base because Matsui, hitting behind him, is slumping and Posada, who would be hitting behind him, is on the DL. I have zero concerns with A-Rod's hitting, however at 3rd base he has lacked some mobility which is likely due to coming back from a serious hip injury.
Not a good comparison.
A-Rod has not been pitched to with runners on base because Matsui, hitting behind him, is slumping and Posada, who would be hitting behind him, is on the DL. I have zero concerns with A-Rod's hitting, however at 3rd base he has lacked some mobility which is likely due to coming back from a serious hip injury.
Not a good comparison.
Well, the cream has risen to the top. Despite losing 2 of 3 to the Mets, despite Papi's continuing slump, the Boston Red Sox are in first place on Memorial Day.
Dewey Evans was in the booth covering for Jerry Remy. (For those of you who are unaware, Remy is home recovering from surgery for lung cancer.) He was pointing out a number of flaws in Papi's swing. Papi's pulling his head and opening his swing prematurely. He's trying too hard. The question of whether or not he's finished remains open; however, everything that's being said about Papi was said about Jason Varitek last year. 'Tek's done some extra work with Dave Magadan and has shortened his swing and the results have been fabulous. Varitek's OPS is 60 points higher than his career average.
Dewey Evans was in the booth covering for Jerry Remy. (For those of you who are unaware, Remy is home recovering from surgery for lung cancer.) He was pointing out a number of flaws in Papi's swing. Papi's pulling his head and opening his swing prematurely. He's trying too hard. The question of whether or not he's finished remains open; however, everything that's being said about Papi was said about Jason Varitek last year. 'Tek's done some extra work with Dave Magadan and has shortened his swing and the results have been fabulous. Varitek's OPS is 60 points higher than his career average.
I would disagree, Beav. Just like any other player, a slugger's most important stat is his OPS. Arod went into today's game with a very acceptable 1.034.EagerBeaver said:
That figure is .067 higher than his career average, which might still get him into the HOF, if he doesn't fuck things up any more. It is also much much better than his post-season OPS, which, of course, sucks.
The other problem is he's swinging at shit he'd never even think of swinging at before. No plate discipline at all.
rumpleforeskiin said:
It may be to Sabermetricians like you, Rumples, but I do not agree. OPS has come into baseball jargon due to Sabermetric theory. I do not accept all of the tenets of Sabermetric theory. To me some of it is rational and useful, but some of it isn't. Many critics of Sabermetric theory have pointed out that slugging percentage is more valid for testing the productivity of power hitters and OBP for testing the productivity all other hitters.
I have read the Sabermetric bible, "Moneyball." In that book, the child prodigy of Sabermetrician theorists was none other than current Yankee Nick Swisher, he of the high OBP and OPS, he who led the American league in pitch count per at bat. Now that I see Swisher play every day with the Yankees, let me tell you about some of the flaws of Sabermetric theory. Number 1, Swisher strikes out way too much. You may recall the Red Sox picked up another Sabermetrician's dream a few years ago - Mark Bellhorn, who proceeded to lead the AL in strikeouts with 175 while only hitting about 17 homers. While such stats may be acceptable for a lower third of the batting order hitter, it's unacceptable for someone who hits 5 or 6 in the lineup and is coming up with men on base. Swisher can face 20 pitches in an at bat, then strike out with bases loaded and 1 out. The Sabermetricians will come in their pants; meanwhile the fan watching this spectacle sees yet another rally get killed. Number 2, Swisher is weak defensively and slow running the bases. He is a platoon player at best with most major league teams, and will hopefully again be reduced to that role when the Yankees get Nady back. Nady is a much better player than Swisher is.
Sabermetricians overlook the value of making contact in baseball. Guys like Bellhorn and Swisher could never play for me, if I managed in MLB. I like guys who can make contact, hit the opposite way, move runners, sacrifice and do not consistently strike out in critical situations.
In addition, if OPS is the best stat to evaluate a hitter, then it follows that OPS allowed must be the best stat to evaluate pitchers. However, if we did that, we would have to remove Nolan Ryan from the Hall of Fame, as his OPS allowed is one of the worst ever. I will leave it to Rumples to call up Nolan and tell him that due to Sabermetric theory, he is being removed from the Hall of Fame. Here is what Ryan would likely do with Rumples:
https://www.ecoupons.com/show_image...sedge.com/Images/Product/33-63/33-63523-F.jpg
Video: http://ballhype.com/video/nolan_ryan_vs_robin_ventura_1993/ (ranked #1 pitcher retaliation of all time by ESPN)
For these and other reasons, I reject the unbridled and unmodified adoption of Sabermetric theory in evaluating players. I say to Sabermetricians, watch what these players do in evaluating them. See whether they make contact after running all those deep counts. If they don't, the stats mean shit.
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The Red Sox have announced that they'll sit Lil' Pappi in today's game against the Twins. Is this another sign that the end is near?
i think Arod's avg jumped a bit today eh? going 5-5 will do that
Merlot said:LOL,
Yes, very sad. A-Roid is now hitting under .189 after going 0-4 today with a season total of 10 hits in 53 at bats. So if Ortiz now hitting .194 after going 0-5 today with 30 hits in 154 at bats is "big poopie", then that impotent douche at New York must be A-Sad-Joke. At 2 1/2 half times the price for Ortiz, Alex is A-Travesty. But I guess this is all proof he did give up the roids after all...after he got caught of course. LOL...imagine if the rest of his career had been this honest.
Peeeeuuuuuuuuuu,
Merlot
lgna69xxx said:i think Arod's avg jumped a bit today eh? going 5-5 will do that
Now hitting .259, 7 hr, 17 RBI in 17 games
First off, Moneyball, is not the Sabermetric bible. Second off, the name of the game is runs. The best thing that ever happened this year was the injury to Nady as it allowed the Yankees to get a much, much better player, Swisher, into the lineup on a daily basis. You can move all the runners up that you want, but the name of the game is scoring runs and OPS is what leads to runs.EagerBeaver said:
This has been documented over and over again. Among the key reasons that the Red Sox have won two championships in the last five years is the hiring of Bill James. He has helped them identify top talent. While Mark Bellhorn led the league in strikeouts, his big year in 2004 helped them win games and winning games is what it's all about.
Hopefully, Brian Cashman will continue to embrace your flat earth theory of baseball and continue to lose.
By the way, Beav, Swisher is on pace to score 95 runs and knock in 88. Those are championship caliber numbers for a guy who hits seventh. And they're numbers that Xavier Nady can only dream about.
You can ramble on about all the crap that John and Suzyn drool over, but the last time I looked the team that scored the most runs was the one that wins the game. Swisher is a run producer; Nady is not.
You can ramble on about all the crap that John and Suzyn drool over, but the last time I looked the team that scored the most runs was the one that wins the game. Swisher is a run producer; Nady is not.
Doc Holliday said:The Red Sox have announced that they'll sit Lil' Pappi in today's game against the Twins. Is this another sign that the end is near?
They are thinking of renaming the Mendoza line to the Ortiz line.
rumples- Can you run by me your breakdown of Phil Hughes again.
rumpleforeskiin said:
I think you missed the irony of this metaphor. The hardcore Sabermetricans, like you, see their assertions as dogma or science rather than theory. Hence, much as the Bible denounces pagan religions, much of "Moneyball" is spent debunking traditional theories of baseball, including the use of bunts, stolen bases, sacrifices and hit and run plays to manufacture runs. To me, we are talking about theories or strategies, not religion or empirical science.
Regarding the case of Swisher, I have watched him very closely. He strikes out far too much, even for a power hitter. Part of it is that he is working deep counts where he gets set up to strike out, but part of it, a big part of it, is that he is a poor contact hitter with blind spots on a lot of pitches. I have seen him corkscrew himself into the ground many times, fooled because he did not get the pitch he was looking for. On two strikes this is totally inappropriate. His batting average is about .225 and while I can accept a low batting average where acceptable power is provided, he still strikes out way too much and I have seen him kill a number of rallies with his strikeouts. Nady is a much smarter and more instinctive hitter who makes better contact.
Swisher's positives are that he switch hits, has solid power and does run up the pitch counts. However the other Yankee hitters, notably Jeter, Damon, Teixera, A-Rod and Posada when he is in there, all drive up pitch counts and can hit with 2 strikes. With 2 strikes on Swisher, you hope he draws a full count and then a walk. You don't count on contact and the ball being hit somewhere that will advance the runners.
In terms of his tracking of balls in the outfield, he is the worst of all the Yankees outfielders. Damon at least catches what he can get to. His arm sucks and everyone runs on him, but he at least doesn't turn every ball not hit right at him into an adventure. Swisher does. He is not a full time major league player. He is a spare part, a platoon player and perhaps pinch hitter. If I was manager Nady would start in RF and I would play Swisher there selectively against righthanders, and possibly DH him on occasion. He is also useful as a pinch hitter late in games because of the pitch counts and walks drawn, so I would PH him if no runners were on base. If runners are on I would prefer Matsui up there because he is a good situational hitter.
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Right, Joe, Hughes is due for his annual breakdown any time now.Joe.t said:rumples- Can you run by me your breakdown of Phil Hughes again.
Gotta say Beav, it sure is nice to see you back making interesting, thoughtful posts, even for such a Yankee homer like you. Welcome back amigo.
Well, Beav, if you were manager, then, you'd score fewer runs and win fewer games. It's about runs, nothing but runs. Swisher produces runs, Nady does not.EagerBeaver said:
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