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The border wall...

minutemenX

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2015
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No one thinks the wall will work. Mostly because it won't.
But that's fine. Just stop saying the dems used to support this. We all agree it was completely different.

Tall fences make good neighbors. So ancient Chinese was stupid building the Great Wall? It did its job for some time. The same with the Berlin wall. It did work and thus hated by Germans on both sides. The wall built between Israel and Palestinian territories reduced terror attacks by tenfold and now they are building wall on the border with Egypt to cut terrorist infiltration, contraband and human smuggling. They don’t think they are wasting money. Walls do work but only if not implemented as a half-ass measure (partially and sloppy).
 

minutemenX

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Jun 8, 2015
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There is an effective electronic tunnel detection system now developed in Israel. Flying over is out of the question as easily detected by an automatic radar. Applying the same laws to everybody, not only to US and Canadian citizens, i.e. considering illegal border crossing a serious crime with the jail term if a heavy fine can’t be paid and the prompt deportation after is the most workable. But allowing illegal immigration and worth defending it as done by some as “humanitarian act” is the travesty against our own legal system
 

Valcazar

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
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I would bet that MSNBC's coverage will be 100% false, CNN's coverage will be 75% false and FOX will get about half of it right.

That's funny. Assuming we are talking about post speech analysis, they will all be terrible. (Maybe someone wilwill have a straight up fact check, but the rest will all just be gabbleflab.)

@jeff - Dale is probably the best bet, yes.

@minutemanx - So you think the wall will reduce terror attacks? The Great Wall of China famously failed, of course. None of the walls you are talking about are thousands of miles long like the one Trump pretends he is proposing.

So what kind of crime do you think border crossing should be? (You said "serious".). Do you think overstaying a visa is the same level of crime as crossing somewhere unauthorized?
 

Sol Tee Nutz

Well-Known Member
Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
There is an effective electronic tunnel detection system now developed in Israel.

We use GPR ( Ground Penetrating Radar ) at work, is should easily pick up something the size of a tunnel, not sure how it would work with the speed of a plane but it should work ( similar system ).

Lets say the wall would cost 25 billion, spread it over 4 years so 6.25 billion a year. Instead of a trillion dollar deficit it would be 1.00625 trillion.... Does not look too bad that way.
 

Carmine Falcone

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Feb 11, 2017
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Unless those illegals become naturalized, they can't vote legally. I don't know if naturalized citizens who can vote favor Democrats or Republicans. But I've met people from El Salvador or South America who lean Republican but I've also met West Indians and African people who are clearly Democratic voters.

Your friend should have gotten a job here. But immigrants, much like native workers, exist in the two dimensions of workers of highly educated and those who are not. Even the uneducated contribute to the economy. Most of these immigrants do jobs Americans are too cool for. There is a poultry processing plant twenty minutes away from my home. It's hard to see anything but Hispanic people coming in and out. The same thing is present in agriculture too. Around 2010 during the recession, Alabama and Georgia passed bills making it harder for illegals to work on farms and both states suffered losses due to labor shortages. Interestingly, this same phenomenon happened and is happening in the UK now. Due to Brexit, the Polish immigrants who make up a significant amount of agricultural workers are now leaving the agricultural sector in a bind. I've bought gym guest passes from different gyms all over the country. Save for one gym in Colorado Springs where the cleaning staff was white, nearly every gym I've visited including those in my state are cleaned mostly by Hispanic people. The cleaning crew at Target and Walmart? Same thing.

It's important to remember this administration wants to limit all immigration, including people like your friend. Bannon and Miller hate that H1B visas are going to so many immigrants (which is what your friend was likely eligible for, unless he was sponsored for a green card by a US relative or married an American. Either way, both paths would have solved his legal status issues).
It's easy to argue limits on immigration would affect people like your friend more because he's playing by the rules. Illegal immigrants don't play by the rules. If you want to limit illegal immigration, remove the incentives for employers that benefit from cheap labor by investigating them. But be careful what you wish for, because when employers pay fair wages in agriculture and services they will pass that cost onto consumers.
 

pokerpro

Active Member
Jul 6, 2008
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Lets say the wall would cost 25 billion, spread it over 4 years so 6.25 billion a year. Instead of a trillion dollar deficit it would be 1.00625 trillion.... Does not look too bad that way.

Lets say the Democrats accepted the wall with no obstruction, 2 years ago... the wall would be built now, and border patrol officers could not see on the other side, which they say would be a great disavantage for them. They could not see what people on the Mexican side are doing or planning.
 

Sol Tee Nutz

Well-Known Member
Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
You have not kept up with the updates on Mexican planning, they do a lot of shit at night.
 

jalimon

I am addicted member
Dec 28, 2015
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bush created a fucking huge problem that cost billions to the US on false claims of massive armement by irak.

trump wants to leave his mark as well by creating his own invasion of the US.

deja vue :)
 

minutemenX

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Jun 8, 2015
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Lets say the Democrats accepted the wall with no obstruction, 2 years ago... the wall would be built now, and border patrol officers could not see on the other side, which they say would be a great disavantage for them. They could not see what people on the Mexican side are doing or planning.

Dudes, there are already infrared cameras with motion sensors all over the place on borders including US/Canada border. Why not put some on top of the fence to look on the other side?
 

hungry101

Well-Known Member
Oct 29, 2007
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I flew over the Great Wall and I did not get a chance to visit it. Other than that the largest wall I've ever seen is the Pope's wall in Vatican City. George Soros lives in a walled compound. It is interesting that the people that speak out against the racist wall are often the ones that are protected by one.

The H1-B visas are typically used to layoff Americans to hire aliens for a much lower wage. Typically, Americans are humiliated by having to train their replacements. I don't like them.
 

pokerpro

Active Member
Jul 6, 2008
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minutemenX

Because when the boarder patrol agents are driving their SUV alongside the border, they prefer to see what's going on on the other side. Hard to monitor cameras when you are driving...
 

jalimon

I am addicted member
Dec 28, 2015
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I flew over the Great Wall and I did not get a chance to visit it. Other than that the largest wall I've ever seen is the Pope's wall in Vatican City. George Soros lives in a walled compound. It is interesting that the people that speak out against the racist wall are often the ones that are protected by one.

Good point! But still even the democrats agree more needs to be done to protect illegal immigration. But a wall really?? It's a political stunt so Trump does not loose face.

The H1-B visas are typically used to layoff Americans to hire aliens for a much lower wage. Typically, Americans are humiliated by having to train their replacements. I don't like them.

This is called capitalism at it's best! It does not care who produce the goods as long as production cost are as low as possible so just a few can benefit largely.

Cheers,
 

Sol Tee Nutz

Well-Known Member
Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.
^^^^^^^ Up 2

If you have a wall with cameras why would you need the border drivers to watch the cameras, it would be done remotely. You could even eliminate some of the border drivers.
 

Valcazar

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Mar 6, 2013
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So weird people talking like the wall is a real thing.

Anyway, Trumpy downgraded it to a "steel barrier" yesterday, so I guess now it is just a long guardrail?

I guess he is really regretting not taking the wall deal last year when the Democrats said they would give him $25 billion for it.
 

Valcazar

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
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Ouch : https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1083106246792601600/
You know Trumpy can't like that. He hates people pointing out he had to crawl to his dad for money all the time.

Meanwhile, it seems he is sticking to his brilliant deal making skills of saying "give me the wall!" and then stomping his feet and crying when the mean lady says no.

Of course, if McConnell had any spine he could do something, but Mitch is good at avoiding blame while being a dick.
 

Doc Holliday

Female body inspector
Sep 27, 2003
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If Trump goes against everyone's advice (minus ass-kissing Lindsey Graham) and does declare a national emergency in order to get funding for his wall then this is the best thing to happen to democrats in the history of politics!!!

Of course his demand will be struck down by the courts. But it will create a precedent where any future democrat President will have the opportunity to do exactly the same thing and order a national emergency in regards to climate change, health care & gun control. A future President could order all fossil fuel companies to be shut down. He could force a single payer health care system onto the rest of the country. And he could implement gun control laws and possibly go as far as outlaw most guns, all 500 million of them.

Go Trump!!!!!!! :lol::lol::lol:
 

Valcazar

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
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I'd prefer national emergency powers are left out of it, personally.

At this point though, it is clear he is in "the only solution is I win" phase. Which means he can't even do a version that "saves face for both sides" or something. In his mind, it is only a win if everyone else knows you lose. He doesn't even care about the wall, physical or metaphorical, he just need to know that the Dems caved and that he can brag about making them cave. All the other damage he is doing doesn't matter to him.
 

jalimon

I am addicted member
Dec 28, 2015
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I am with you Valcazar... The end justify the means president. He is an horrible human being.

By the way do some of you follow Guzman trial? "Some cartel members have testified about using underground tunnels. But none have said they've transported drugs into the United States at unwalled sections of the border.".

The hell with Trump's tweet that a wall will protect from drug trafficker and criminel gang...

Cheers,
 

Sol Tee Nutz

Well-Known Member
Apr 29, 2012
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Look behind you.

Valcazar

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
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Trump is wrong. (And McConnell, obviously) He has wasted all that money, put people at risk, and refused to negotiate despite multiple reasonable offers.
The damage he is doing far outweighs the cost of the wall and he could end it and negotiate about the wall itself, but he would rather do the damage.
 
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