Long term arrangements

[eviltmp]

Just catching to the thread and my mind is blown by some of the things and statements made here. Not going to pretend to be some authority or guru but some guys on here need a serious adjustment. Falling in love with an SP or SB is not doing yourself any favour.

As others have pointed out there is not one Sugar bowl but many, many different flavors. From scammers, to hardened cynical mercenaries, to regular working SPs, to attention seekers that will never meet anyone, to shy college girls, and a few in-between. All these have different wants and different dynamics. Just like guys have very different ways of approaching girls and how they will be successful with various groups. As you can imagine guys saying "I will provide you $xx for 1-2 hours of intimate fun" don't do well with the non-pros.

My only interest is in college girls with daddy issues that actually get excited at spending time with a fun older guy. You need to meet over coffee first to see how well you get along but my rule of thumb is whatever she needs above $100-200 per meet (multi-hours) is what she needs to hold her nose to hang out with you. The more you have to pay, the less she likes you and the less interesting the main event will be. And just to clarify, this also applies to total stunners (10/10 girls and an actual 5'11" model, girls that are getting dozens and dozens of messages). Is it time-consuming? You have no idea. Are you going to see a lot of dead-ends? Expect it. Are there true gems? Yes, a very small handful.

Seriously, if you're spending 300-400 per meet she better be a 20 y.o. 100 lbs blue eyed hotti and not some mom a few decades past her best days. But then again, what do I know? Some guys are thrilled that a girl is just talking to them.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Falling in love with an SP or SB is not doing yourself any favour.

Just curious here. To make such a statement, you must be an expert on the subject. Please share with us how you gathered your expertise?

Seriously, if you're spending 300-400 per meet she better be a 20 y.o. 100 lbs blue eyed hotti and not some mom a few decades past her best days.

Spend 300-400 on someone with very limited experience in bed? Pray tell, why? Personally, I prefer a woman who knows what she's doing with a man.

My only interest is in college girls with daddy issues that actually get excited at spending time with a fun older guy.

I sincerely hope you're kidding. Personally, I prefer well-adjusted younger women who have been around the block a few times. Ideal age 28-34. My sweetie is 32. I do agree with you however when you state, "some guys on here need a serious adjustment."

 

[EagerBeaver]

JAs others have pointed out there is not one Sugar bowl but many, many different flavors. From scammers, to hardened cynical mercenaries, to regular working SPs, to attention seekers that will never meet anyone, to shy college girls, and a few in-between. All these have different wants and different dynamics. Just like guys have very different ways of approaching girls and how they will be successful with various groups. As you can imagine guys saying "I will provide you $xx for 1-2 hours of intimate fun" don't do well with the non-pros.

My only interest is in college girls with daddy issues that actually get excited at spending time with a fun older guy. You need to meet over coffee first to see how well you get along but my rule of thumb is whatever she needs above $100-200 per meet (multi-hours) is what she needs to hold her nose to hang out with you. The more you have to pay, the less she likes you and the less interesting the main event will be. And just to clarify, this also applies to total stunners (10/10 girls and an actual 5'11" model, girls that are getting dozens and dozens of messages). Is it time-consuming? You have no idea. Are you going to see a lot of dead-ends? Expect it. Are there true gems? Yes, a very small handful.

Very good executive summary of SA. My success level on SA has been better than expected but after I got some experience and feedback from SBs on what they did not want to hear, my shtick got a whole lot better. Most of the college girl target SBs want a guy who can go out on a date, behave normally and chivalrousy, sustain an intelligent conversation on subjects other than how you want to get in her pants, buy gifts (chocolate are my go-to) and dinner at least, and have a "let's see where this goes" attitude. Most of the smart college girls on there will bluntly ask you what you are looking for. I tell them I am looking for intimacy but not right off the bat, that I want to find someone with whom I have chemistry and something in common and then see where it goes. The vast majority of women on there, unless they expressly say they want a platonic relationship only in their profile, are open to anything.

And evil is dead on when he says the cost depends on how much noseholding is necesssary. A girl who might normally ask for $500 for FS dates may settle for $300 for an extended dinner date with FS if she likes you. I actually offered a girl I was in an arrangement with $400 for an overnight in NYC, and when she accepted I was shocked. You just don't know what will happen. EVERYTHING is negotiable, you just have to be straight and honest about what you are looking for and gain trust.

 

[eviltmp]

Just curious here. To make such a statement, you must be an expert on the subject. Please share with us how you gathered your expertise?


Spend 300-400 on someone with very limited experience in bed? Pray tell, why? Personally, I prefer a woman who knows what she's doing with a man.


I sincerely hope you're kidding.

1. There are countless threads on here on guys falling for SPs and wanting to hang out outside of the rdv. Go read them for an answer. Heck, I even admit to having done it for a while with an Euphoria girl.

2. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. We're not talking about virgins here. In my experience attitude trumps all. An eager 19-20 y.o. is way, *way* better than any going-through-the-motion 30 y.o.

Tell you what, you keep doing what you're doing and I'll keep doing what I do. Happiness for everyone!

 

[djlucky7]

A bit late to the party but i'll give my 0.05 on this. I guess everyone has a different experience on SA.

For my part, I'm a 30yr good looking guy that clearly states in my profile that i'm willing to commit to a month-to-month arrangement with students that need help for their studies. Based on my profile, I get dozens of messages per week of 18-24 year old non-pros that are interested in meeting up with me. Most of these girls are okay with a 1000-1200 allowance per month(Once/twice a week), knowing that im young which would facilitate public meetings and also taking into account that sleeping with me wouldnt make them feel guilty. I have never even touched the topic of sexual encounters during our meet-and-greets but somehow we always end-up having sex either on the same night or on the second date. Most of them know that sex is expected because no-one gives you free money.

Although meet and greets & exchanging msgs takes a bunch of time, I stick to SA because of the sexual timing issue. I never had a girl from SA telling me that the time is over -- I always make sure they're reserving a day or an evening for me. If I were to spend the same amount of time with escorts, I'd probably wouldnt be able to afford a meal. Also, I noticed that a lot of these girls treat me like their boyfriend. Some of them want a lot of sex during the first 2-3 weeks, then it gradually lowers. I'm also able to fuck them at their apartments which is huge turn-on for me.

One girl that i'm not seeing anymore was a 10. When I met her, I was expecting her to ask for a 5k allowance but she was okay with what i was able to offer. She told me that I was the second person she met from SA and the first guy fucked her on the first date and ghosted after promising her 4k/month. She was a really nice girl that was trying to be instagram famous and I guess she's slowly getting there. She kept wanting to come to my condo for the downtown view and take a bunch of pictures of shit she couldnt afford. Eventually, she knew I was seeing someone else and felt I only wanted to see her for her body and sex. Being an honest person, I agreed and we never saw eachother again. At least I still have all those videos of us fucking.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

If I just want sex I will stick with escorts, no illusions, no misconceptions about what it is I am doing and what I am getting.

Me too...if I just want sex. While I was looking for more than just sex when I went on SA, I was not looking for what I ended up with, the hippie-chick of my dreams. She, I might add, has also gotten well more than she was looking for. Just two very lucky people.

2. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. We're not talking about virgins here. In my experience attitude trumps all. An eager 19-20 y.o. is way, *way* better than any going-through-the-motion 30 y.o.

An eager 19-20 year old who, most likely works part time and is still quite inexperienced in the bedroom. I've been hobbying in Montreal for better than 20 years and, yes, I have a very good idea of what I'm talking about.

1. There are countless threads on here on guys falling for SPs and wanting to hang out outside of the rdv. Go read them for an answer. Heck, I even admit to having done it for a while with an Euphoria girl.

You, in your original statement, allow for no difference between SPs and SBs. I certainly agree with you on SPs. I've been seeing my sweetie 3-4 times a week for the last two years and have travelled much of the world with her. We know each other very well.

 

[eviltmp]

Me too...if I just want sex. While I was looking for more than just sex when I went on SA, I was not looking for what I ended up with, the hippie-chick of my dreams. She, I might add, has also gotten well more than she was looking for. Just two very lucky people.

Rumple why don't you try what everyone here is dying to see: stop paying your precious angel and report back how it goes? We can't wait for that part of your story.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Rumple why don't you try what everyone here is dying to see: stop paying your precious angel and report back how it goes? We can't wait for that part of your story.

Now why would I want to do a thing like that? I've made a commitment to her and to pull a stunt like that would be deceitful and dishonest. We're both getting exactly what we want from this relationship and way more. Your comment makes me wonder if your handle isn't short for EvilTrump. I don't treat people that way.

If you had a stay-at home-wife and stopped supporting her, how long would she stick around?

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Like everyone else on here, you instinctively know the answer to my question.

I've been hearing noise like yours ever since I posted about this relationship well over a year ago. We just keep on trucking.

As for the answer to your question, nothing in this world could matter less. By the way, not only is our sex wonderful and meaningful, but it just gets better. Beyond that, I take great pleasure in knowing that my sharing my good fortune with her is making her life better as well as helping her get her practice off the ground.

 

[EagerBeaver]

There are some posts here that assume intelligent consenting adults cannot get together, negotiate an arrangement, and consummate an arrangement without one party or the other becoming overwhelmed by emotions. Wrong, it happens all the time. These posters are merely projecting their own personal reservations and insecurities upon others. An arrangement is whatever two people want it to be. It does happen that both parties to an arrangement RESPECT the privacy and private life of the other and do not need to be told that they have to do so. So, if there is a proper communication then things go just fine. To me its a real simple communication: "we see each other a few times a month and then we both go back to our own private lives." SA women actually relish being a private, secret thing in someone's life. Just as I am sure McDougal and Daniel did when Trump was fucking them.

If the emotions of one or the other become out of control, there is a simple fix: arrangement ends. It's not a divorce. Even if Rumples arrangement ends, he will not have to pay alimony or child support or be ordered by a Court to do so. Worst thing that happens is he has hurt feelings, wakes up the next day, goes on SA and finds a new lady and moves on. The man is a veteran of multiple divorces, methinks he will get over it, even if the Red Sox are also 10 games out of first by August 1.

An arrangement can be anything two people want it to be. There are some ladies on SA who will only do online relationships, usually sexy pics and videos for money. One girl in the Phillipines, who seemed quite educated and quite hot from her pics, messaged me and wanted to do a videocam show for me. When I told her I preferred an in person relationship, she said "but the Internet brings people together." Of course not in the way I wanted.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

...even if the Red Sox are also 10 games out of first by August 1.

As unlikely as that is, that might make things difficult.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Kind of comical when you think about it, is this supposed to be someone giving advice on relationships.

Um, say whaa? I've spoken a lot about my relationship here and seen a lot of comments by various clowns passing judgement on it and tossing advice about something they know nothing about, present company included, but pray tell, where have you seen me throwing advice on relationships around? Unlike some people, I know better than to talk about that about which I have no knowledge. Maybe you could learn from that.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Like STN said you don't have to have tried something to have an opinion on it.

And as I aptly pointed out, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.”
― Harlan Ellison

 

[EagerBeaver]

And as I aptly pointed out, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.”
― Harlan Ellison

STN probably has opinions on other subjects he has no experience on, like how to build an atomic bomb, how to write a law review note or comment of publishable quality, and the optimal method of committing suicide. The question is, are any of those opinions likely to be of any utility to anyone?

 

[Rainq]

This is gold... the portfolio management view of hobbying.

You should turn your model into a subscription based tech start up.

Patron for Providers. Audible Affairs. Naughty Netflix.

Fund the whole thing with ICOs.

I'll do a deck to pitch the business if Merb's interested~

Never been a fan of seeking arrangement, or in fact the "packages" offered by independents (who are often older than the average sex worker and, to me, less attractive than my favorites) that includes multi-hour companionship and food.

It is similar to the investment world. If you desire a diversified portfolio, it really no longer makes sense to put your whole portfolio with a financial guy who is charging 2 percent of the total each year. You are losing money on the cash portion that now earns 0-1 percent. That guy is worth his 2 percent for the stock and perhaps bond portion of the portfolio if he can earn you well in excess of his 2 percent fee. What is the solution? Invest and manage the cash portion yourself.

All of Montreal's highly reviewed sex workers are worth the $200 or so an hour fee, especially if you last a while, or can get it up twice in the hour. But should you really be paying a sex worker anywhere close to that, of even half that, for social interaction and mutual enjoyment of food? It is like paying the financial guy 2 percent to manage your cash.

Seeking arrangement and similar sites make their profit on the fact that a lot of women who have sex for money cannot deal with being hookers and a lot of guys purchasing sex cannot deal with being johns. You just posted on merb. Say I am a John, and you will start down a path that will save you money in comparison to your plan.

For a portion of what you allocated in your original post, you can find at least three or four regulars to see once a month, and leave a slot or two open each month for seeing someone brand new to you. You are probably bored with your wife. Seeing just one other person is not going to help that much. But you want some continuity and familiarity - you are a married man after all. So having some regulars is a good idea. Use incall for discretion, and it will save you on hotel bills and provide less paper trail. And if you use one agency that has incall, you will have a lot of discretion. One phone number or one series of texts that can easily be deleted.

I assume your wife now thinks Cook-ing is a city in China near two others she has heard of in China, Fuck-ing and Clean-ing. Identify some good restaurants with bars and eat there. Get to know the chick serving the bar and talk to her regularly. You will end up conversing with her as much as you would with the expensive independent escort during the meal portion of her package, or with the Seeking Arrangement chick who is Definitely Not A Hooker. Take off that wedding band when you enter, too. You might get laid eventually. And bring a newspaper to read. It will be nice to keep up with Sports while eating instead of listening to your wife bitch at you about things. You will save a fortune only buying food for yourself instead of for two people.

Lastly, I bet you half the guys on merb regularly participate in a half dozen Internet discussion forums on a multitude of topics, sex being only one of them. Don't underestimate the use of technology to fill the social interaction gap in your life. And if true face to face interaction is a necessity, don't ignore professional and social groups. You can enhance your professional life and perhaps help your community. Talking to the hooker, or the Seeking Arrangement girl Who Is Definitely Not a Hooker for a couple of hours after sex (in addition to talking to her in between rounds which you would do with any escort, anyway) isn't going to do either of those things.

To me, sex workers are for sex, and I truly love and appreciate them. But outside of possibly using them as guides in foreign countries, I just can't see the benefits of paying them for activities other than sex, particularly when you are on such a budget that you could realistically only see one, and she wouldn't be that impressed with your spending level, anyway.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Who gets to decide who is well informed, any opinion on that.

If I share an opinion on nuclear fission, I assure you it is not well informed as I have no experience or knowledge of the field whatsoever. If STN shares an opinion on arrangements, it is equally uninformed for the very same reason.

I don't have a beef with you Rumples in fact you are an example of someone I believe is one of the few that are happy in the SA lifestyle. ( again my opinion) .

Have you not read the information shared here by Capt Renault, Curly, and Eagerbeaver? They all report very positive experiences through SA.

You prefer to call it an arrangement which in most cases I would agree, however someone who has been with the same person for so long goes on extensive vacations and spends so much time with the same person, I would call a relationship, quite a good one it seems, hence my comment about you giving advice on relationships.

Well, the arrangement part is intact. We have the same amount of sex for the same "wealth redistribution" as before, except when traveling. We do see a lot more of each other, but we keep the arrangement part inviolable. I would no sooner take advantage of her than I would ever dream of suggesting that I should no longer assist her financially. As for advice, I offer none. I just share my own experience. (She tells me often that I spoil her and regularly expresses her appreciation.)

Getting back to opinions, look back, I quoted Mocha's post as being exactly what my opinion is also, you did not seem to have a problem with her expressing the same idea.

I haven't read her posts, a bit too wordy for my attention span, but my sense is that she's offering extended escorting sessions rather than what I'd call "arrangements."

 

[CaptRenault]

I view men's relationships with escorts and sugar babies as part of a continuum that includes men's relationships with all potential sex partners including girlfriends and wives. Let me explain by reviewing some basic information from the field of evolutionary psychology about how men and women differ greatly in how they select sex partners (see short article below).

Most permanent or temporary sexual relationships between a man and a woman, whether man and wife, boyfriend and girlfriend, prostitute and client or sugar baby and sugar daddy make sense in the context evolutionary psychology.

Almost all sexual relationships come down to men who have resources and status (or the potential to get them) exchanging those things with sexually attractive women for sex.

Admittedly it's not a very romantic way to view relationships between men and women. But it explains a lot of human behavior that we sometimes struggle to understand ("But she's not in love with you and it's not a real relationship!")

Also keep in mind that it's not necessary for men and women who are sex partners to intend to have children. The point is that over tens (hundreds?) of thousands of years our natures have evolved in such a way that men and women naturally strike various types of deals to get what evolution has determined they want from each other. It's not hard to understand.


Evolution Influences Mate Preferences: What Men And Women Really Want

Aug 8, 2015 01:03 PM
medicaldaily.com
Kristen Magaldi

Ask anyone, and they will likely tell you men and women have a very different idea of "the perfect partner." This difference, a new study from the University of Texas at Austin finds, may be rooted in evolution.

To examine how gender influences mating preferences, researchers studied 4,764 men and 5,389 women from 33 different countries and 37 different cultures. They found even in countries promoting gender equality, mating preferences still varied. Study co-author David Buss, a psychology professor, said this rejects the existing idea men and women are identical in their underlying psychology.
"The genders differ strikingly in their evolved mate preferences in some domains,” Buss explained in a press release. “The same holds true in highly sexually egalitarian cultures such as Sweden and Norway as in less egalitarian cultures such as Iran.”

When it comes down to it, researchers discovered that what we want in a mate is linked more to our gender than our individual experiences and preferences. As a result, they found that they could predict a person’s sex with 92.2 percent accuracy purely based on what they said they wanted in a significant other.

“The large overall difference between men's and women's mate preferences tells us that the sexes must have experienced dramatically different challenges in the mating domain throughout human evolution,” said Daniel Conroy, lead author and graduate researcher.

As expected, men have a tendency to look for partners who are younger and more physically attractive, while women look for older and more financially established mates, with higher social status and ambition. These eye roll-inducing gender roles may have evolved with men and women over time.

"Because women bear the cost of pregnancy and lactation, they often faced the adaptive problem of acquiring resources to produce and support offspring, while men faced adaptive problems of identifying fertile partners and sought cues to fertility and future reproductive value," Conroy-Beam said.

The study claims that this is just an example of natural selection at work, in which the sexes each face their own reproductive challenges and must adapt and find mates who will provide healthy children. If we did not evolve to favor these characteristics, the chances of perpetuating the species, so to speak, would not be as high.

This is not to say our individual preferences are meaningless. In fact, men and women still look for and value certain characteristics, like a pleasing disposition, sociability, as well as shared religious and political views. So when it comes down to it, evolution doesn't have the final say over who we choose to spend our lives with, but it is a big part of it. Basically, researchers concluded, a lot more goes into this decision than we think.

"Few decisions impact reproduction more than mate choice," Conroy-Beam said. "Mate preferences will therefore be a central target and driver of biological evolution. We have found some promising initial results, and we think this holistic approach will help answer a lot of questions in mating research in the future."

Source: Conroy-Beam D, Buss D, Pham M, et al. How sexually dimorphic are human mate preferences? Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin. 2015.

 

[minutemenX]

Orthodoxy only good in mathematics and in some real exact sciences where there is only one truth. Everywhere else including this topic it is silly as demonstrated by some people on this board. People are too different and looking for too many different things to have one universal solution. As I said, SA looks attractive to some people but it is not for everyone and not definitely for me, for example. I am too close to my family and am too mentally immersed in my work to have any desire for even “quasi” relationship. My occasional need for an uninhibited sex is the best satisfied with my ATFs. It is already enough trauma for me when they retire , god blessed them and good luck in their “civil” life

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Thanks to the very excellent lexicographer, the late (most likely) Ambrose Bierce, we have these definitions of the species:

MALE, n.
A member of the unconsidered, or negligible sex. The male of the human race is commonly known (to the female) as Mere Man. The genus has two varieties: good providers and bad providers.

BRIDE, n.
A woman with a fine prospect of happiness behind her.

BRUTE, n.
See HUSBAND.

MARRIAGE, n.
The state or condition of a community consisting of a master, a mistress and two slaves, making in all, two.

 

[rumpleforeskiin]

Okay so you have put your comments in bold, 3 people plus yourself from 28 pages.
Would you call that few or many.

I'd call that about 100% of those who have actually posted experiences, all of whom probably add up to 10 of the pages all by themselves. All the rest fall into several categories: 1) people looking to learn about the SA experience and 2) people envious of others having a good time and looking (I'd say grasping for straws.) for any means possible to denigrate said experiences.

Anyway, good luck with your lady friend.

Thanks.